My dreams of being a vet are dashed....

[kitty613]

Okay, I'll try to keep this as short as I can...
I am a non-traditional student (previous teacher) who racked up almost $79,000 in student loans (from gov't) for my undergrad and masters degree.
I began my science preq's awhile back, only to find out that now ALL of my undergrad funds are now depleted. I still have another 1 1/2 yrs left and I would need roughly $20k in funds to finish(and this is my state school).
I could get a personal loan for $20k for undergrad, but here lies another problem....
Still with me??
If I were to take out a personal loan for undergrad, I still only have $57,000 left in grad loans for vet school and I would need to also take out a crap load of personal loans for this too. The cheapest school is my in-state school, Cornell, which is roughly 21k a year. I would have enough money to go for 2 years, but then would need to take out a personal loan for the remaining two years? And what about living expenses? I have bills of my own. I would need an addit. 10k a year to survive! And who says I would even get into Cornell?!! Most of the out of state schools are roughly 30-38k per year!

I applaud those of you who are still with me. You rock!
So, in total I would need ...
Personal loan to finish undergrad- 20k
Personal loan to finish vet school-42k-85k (depending on if it is an out of state school or not).
Personal loans of roughly 40k for my own bills/expenses for the four years.

The Grand Total......

100-150k in personal loans
136,000 in school (gov't) loans
(These 2 types of loans cannot be consolidated BTW)

Seriously, is it worth it? I don't want to rely on scholarships, although I know they can be a godsend. It just seems way to much for me to handle. I've always wanted to be a vet, but I can't fathom this amount of debt.

I feel like my dreams are dashed.... :cry:

If anyone has any words of wisdom, or thoughts they can contribute I would most appreciate it. Thank you for listening for so long. You guys are awesome!

-Kitty613

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[SnowyRox]

I don't think you're calculating your loans correctly. You can get enough gov't loans for 4 years of vet school.

But regardless of the lender, you're going to owe a $%&load of money. Maybe consider working for a while and then reconsidering vet school? There were applicants at my interview who were 30 or 40.

ETA: Re-read your (long) post and saw that you're already a qualified teacher. In that case, I would 100% work for several years at the highest paying job that I could find to pay off your undergrad loans. Or, if you work for a private school they might be willing to help pay for your remaining pre-reqs.

 

[kitty613]

I'm already 34 years old! By the way, I talked to a loan counselor who caculated all my loans with me yesterday.

 

[StartingoverVet]

I'm already 34 years old! By the way, I talked to a loan counselor who caculated all my loans with me yesterday.

She is wrong.

Everyone who applies gets govt loans to cover their tuition, fees, and living expenses at vet school. I have never heard of any exception.

Also, you should look at some of the threads discussing this... most importantly research IBR, income based repayment.

With all your debt, IBR will probably be the way to go, just make sure you understand it.


edit: Age is really irrelevant. here in my mind

 

[kitty613]

Wait a minute. I think you're right. The loan counselor did not take into account that I would be considered a "health professional" and instead of the max of 136k limit in school loans available, we would be eligible for $224k, right?

 

[NStarz]

Wait a minute. I think you're right. The loan counselor did not take into account that I would be considered a "health professional" and instead of the max of 136k limit in school loans available, we would be eligible for $224k, right?

You are eligible up to the cost of attendance at whatever school you attend.

 

[kitty613]

Seriously? Wow. Then I have NO idea where this 'loan counselor' was getting her information. I was going to have a heart attack!

 

[StartingoverVet]

From Penn's financial aid manual (for example) 224k is only the limit for direct loans, direct loan+ will cover the balance you need for for living expenses etc.

Direct Loan Program (Subsidized & Unsubsidized)
As a Penn Veterinary student you may borrow up to $40,500 each academic year through the Direct Loan Program, up to an
aggregate of $224,000. Up to $8,500 of your Direct Loan each year may be subsidized, and this amount is based on your financial
need. These loans have a fixed 6.8% interest rate, there is a fee of .5%.
Direct Graduate PLUS Loan*

As a Penn Veterinary student you may also borrow up to your cost-of-attendance budget less any aid, (e.g., Direct Loans, Perkins
Loans, school department awards), through the unsubsidized Direct Grad PLUS Loan Program. The Direct PLUS Loan allows you
to borrow your expected student and/or parent contribution. These loans have fixed interest rates of 7.9% and origination fees of
2.5%. If you are eligible, you should borrow the maximum Direct Loan first because it has more favorable rates and benefits.

 

[orcagirl]

I think that subsidized graduate loans are going away this coming school year. I've heard that from two different schools.

 

[New Foundland]

Not everybody who wants to be an astronaut can achieve their dreams either

 

[GellaBella]

I'd also like to point out that Cornell, despite being your current in state school, is by no means the cheapest vet school in the country.

I think that if you are serious about doing this you might want to consider looking for jobs in states that have very cheap in state tuition (NCSU springs to mind...I think their in state tuition is somewhere around $13k/year..there are others as well). if you can get a job in a state with cheap instate tuition you can gain residency in a year.

If that is not feasible, there are schools (not many, you'll have to do your research) that allow you to gain residency after starting vet school and being there for 1 year...so you would pay out of state tuition for one year and then in state tuition for the remaining 3.

If I were you, I'd look into option 1 (moving to a state with a cheap in state school) and go from there. You can really save yourself tons of money that way

Good luck!

 

[sawbone]

I'm already 34 years old!

I'm going to be 35 next month, and I'm not even the oldest person in my class. Those 12+ extra years I have on my classmates is full of experiences that will make me an awesome vet. I'll bet you can say the same.

 

[SnowyRox]

Only unsubsidized loans will be available for your vet school education. I thought that was already in effect this year?

Your biggest concern (being 34) would be how many years you are willing to work to pay off that massive debt. If you graduate by 40, then you only have 25 years to work and try to pay off that massive debt load if you want to retire by 65. Are you okay with being broke when you're old? Or do you have plans on how to save up money so that you can live comfortably during your life?

Vet med has the worst debt:income ratio of any profession. And you're entering with debt already accumulated.... so you want to make sure to carefully think about what you're doing. It's not a risk-free profession, so you want insurance in case you're unable to work for some reason.

And what area of vet med do you want to go into? Large animal is tough on your body and many LA vets have to tone down their work by the time they hit 50.

 

[orcagirl]

I'd also like to point out that Cornell, despite being your current in state school, is by no means the cheapest vet school in the country.

I think that if you are serious about doing this you might want to consider looking for jobs in states that have very cheap in state tuition (NCSU springs to mind...I think their in state tuition is somewhere around $13k/year..there are others as well). if you can get a job in a state with cheap instate tuition you can gain residency in a year.

If that is not feasible, there are schools (not many, you'll have to do your research) that allow you to gain residency after starting vet school and being there for 1 year...so you would pay out of state tuition for one year and then in state tuition for the remaining 3.

If I were you, I'd look into option 1 (moving to a state with a cheap in state school) and go from there. You can really save yourself tons of money that way

Good luck!

You can actually gain residency at NCSU after your first year. It works out to less 100K for tuition that way, I think.

 

[StartingoverVet]

I think that subsidized graduate loans are going away this coming school year. I've heard that from two different schools.

That is a small part of the loans. Just means you will get more unsubsidized. So your interest accrues right away, (bad) but your overall loans you can get won't change (neutral).

 

[StartingoverVet]

Only unsubsidized loans will be available for your vet school education. I thought that was already in effect this year?

Your biggest concern (being 34) would be how many years you are willing to work to pay off that massive debt. If you graduate by 40, then you only have 25 years to work and try to pay off that massive debt load if you want to retire by 65. Are you okay with being broke when you're old? Or do you have plans on how to save up money so that you can live comfortably during your life?

Vet med has the worst debt:income ratio of any profession. And you're entering with debt already accumulated.... so you want to make sure to carefully think about what you're doing. It's not a risk-free profession, so you want insurance in case you're unable to work for some reason.

And what area of vet med do you want to go into? Large animal is tough on your body and many LA vets have to tone down their work by the time they hit 50.

So if she goes IBR, she would have loan forgiveness after 20 years like anyone else. And legislation is out there to make that tax deductible. If Obama is re-elected that probably passes (but who the hell knows).

65 is not mandatory retirement so why even use the number (it will probably be 70 or 72 in 20-25 years for SS reasons).. Plus a lot of companies in vet med have retirement plans now. Planning for it is smart, but I wouldn't let that be my deciding factor.

 

[StartingoverVet]

Not everybody who wants to be an astronaut can achieve their dreams either

And giving up because you can't find your way to bus stop wouldn't be a good reason to end the pursuit either.

This sarcastic post is not helpful.

If you can't respond with something helpful, positive or negative, then don't bother to post.

 

[New Foundland]

And giving up because you can't find your way to bus stop wouldn't be a good reason to end the pursuit either.

This sarcastic post is not helpful.

If you can't respond with something helpful, positive or negative, then don't bother to post.

I intended for it to be helpful, sarcasm aside.
Not everyone gets to be what they want and do what they want, and i think we owe it to people to be honest with them and not blindly encourage them to do something just because they dream of it.
Kitty is in a tough spot and I don't think it's worth it to break her own back financially when she has a very good and rewarding career already in motion.

Silly me thinking that a quarter million dollars of debt is a lot..

 

[laitmanvet]

I intended for it to be helpful, sarcasm aside.
Not everyone gets to be what they want and do what they want, and i think we owe it to people to be honest with them and not blindly encourage them to do something just because they dream of it.
Kitty is in a tough spot and I don't think it's worth it to break her own back financially when she has a very good and rewarding career already in motion.

Silly me thinking that a quarter million dollars of debt is a lot..

I didn't read a lot of the above posts in depth, so sorry if I repeat something, but $225k is a TON of debt. In fact, its an irresponsible amount of debt. Unless you marry wealthy, win the lottery, or somehow come into a great sum of money, you will be in debt for the rest of your life. Veterinarians don't make that much.

I think people put a lot of weight on "its my dream and I have to follow it." Its great to have a passion and its great to be able to do what you love, but when you have to work until you're 75 to be able to retire even moderately comfortably, you're going to wish you had a career which didn't put you in so much debt. Just think about it. If you start making payments when you're 40 and want to finish with those payments at 70, thats over $8300 per year not including interest.

I realize a lot of people are going to disagree with me on this, but I just find it unbelievable that hardly anyone commented on the astronomical sum of this person's debt and the fact that he/she won't start paying it off until 40!

 

[that redhead]

I came into vet school with zero debt and will be finishing with $210k before interest. I'm paying living expenses out of pocket. If you add your current debt to four years of IS tuition, that's only $163k of debt tuition only - still far less that I'll be facing. I'm 24.

In the end, it's a personal choice. If you can stomach the idea of that much in loans graduating around the age of 40, go for it. People do it and I'm not saying you shouldn't, only look before you leap. I'm not a big ~*~ follow your dreams! *~* type of person but that's just me. If I were you and had a career I enjoyed and was able to make a living at, I'd probably just stick with it. But again, personal choice.

 

[StartingoverVet]

I intended for it to be helpful, sarcasm aside.
Not everyone gets to be what they want and do what they want, and i think we owe it to people to be honest with them and not blindly encourage them to do something just because they dream of it.
Kitty is in a tough spot and I don't think it's worth it to break her own back financially when she has a very good and rewarding career already in motion.

Silly me thinking that a quarter million dollars of debt is a lot..

Those are fair points.

 

[PharmDoner]

I'm not a Vet Student but I too recently was looking at max Healthcare Professional loan amounts for 4 years as a Pharm Student and with the GradPlus stuff it is indeed $224,000. I am pretty sure that the interest kicks in right away too. And yes, it is a lot of debt, but I have heard of forgiveness programs that if you work at a certain locations for 10 consecutive years, regardless of the amount you make, the remaining debt is forgiven. Maybe that is only for Pharmacy though... but it may be worth looking into. Good Luck!

 

[PetPony]

I'm not a Vet Student but I too recently was looking at max Healthcare Professional loan amounts for 4 years as a Pharm Student and with the GradPlus stuff it is indeed $224,000. I am pretty sure that the interest kicks in right away too. And yes, it is a lot of debt, but I have heard of forgiveness programs that if you work at a certain locations for 10 consecutive years, regardless of the amount you make, the remaining debt is forgiven. Maybe that is only for Pharmacy though... but it may be worth looking into. Good Luck!

I heard those forgiveness programs require you too work where no other vets work. And the reason other vets don't work there usually is because there are not enough clients to support a vet in that area..

 

[NStarz]

I heard those forgiveness programs require you too work where no other vets work. And the reason other vets don't work there usually is because there are not enough clients to support a vet in that area..

You can also work in the non-proft sector (ie shelters) so that gives you a few more options.

 

[PetPony]

I know this might be a stupid question, but would you get paid doing that or how exactly does that non-profit work? Would the govt pay you?

 

[NStarz]

I know this might be a stupid question, but would you get paid doing that or how exactly does that non-profit work? Would the govt pay you?

The entity itself would pay you (albeit at a lower salary then say a private practice). So if you worked for an animal shelter, you would be on salary and the government thinks you're working in a needed field and they forgive your loan faster.

 

[PetPony]

So why is it called non-profit?

 

[wildcatj]

So why is it called non-profit?

Non profit just means that no one is making money in the end. There is enough money to cover the salaries of employees and the cost of whatever service you're providing, but there isn't a business owner who gets to make money off of it. For example: I work for a non-profit wildlife rehab center, we are run almost entirely off of private donations (occasionally a few grants). Any money we make goes towards staff salaries, animal care, fundraisers, etc. We can save whatever we have in excess (if we have anything) but it's not going into anyone's pocket, it stays within the business and can only be used for business expenses. And obviously to be considered a nonprofit you have to be performing some sort of public service or what not.

 

[libster06]

I intended for it to be helpful, sarcasm aside.
Not everyone gets to be what they want and do what they want, and i think we owe it to people to be honest with them and not blindly encourage them to do something just because they dream of it.
Kitty is in a tough spot and I don't think it's worth it to break her own back financially when she has a very good and rewarding career already in motion.

Silly me thinking that a quarter million dollars of debt is a lot..

.::cue Rolling Stones song::.

 

[Prncssbuttercup]

Ok, a former pre-vet turned pre-med student chiming in...

I'm starting school this summer, just before I turn 36. I know it is harder to pay loans as a veterinarian, but if this is your dream would you rather be 70 and look back and say you gave up or be 70 and know you saved many lives, and be satisfied?? For the record, I won't make money again until I'm 40, and I won't be making a professional salary until I'm 43. Then I get to basically work forever!

Fwiw, any public sector jobs can have loan payoff in 10yrs. So, if you were a vet for the government at the USDA or something, they'll pay off your loans in 10yrs... http://studentaid.ed.gov/PORTALSWebApp/students/english/PSF.jsp

Best of luck, and best wishes to you

 

[New Foundland]

So if you can make your debt disappear as opposed to actually paying it off yourself, then it's worth it, is what i hear people saying..

can't tell whether that is encouraging, or discouraging..

 

[kitty613]

Your biggest concern (being 34) would be how many years you are willing towork to pay off that massive debt. If you graduate by 40, then you only have 25years to work and try to pay off that massive debt load if you want to retireby 65. Are you okay with being broke when you're old?

Gosh, now I really feel old. Jeesh! By the way, isn't the average debt around 150-225k anyway?What's the difference with me graduating at 40 yrs old vs. 30 yrs old?

And what area of vet med do you want to go into?Large animal is tough on your body and many LA vets have to tone down theirwork by the time they hit 50.

Once again, I'm not sure how old you are SnowyRox but there are a lot of"older" people that are very physically fit-even at 50yrs old. As for myself, I did 3 triathlons and 2 marathons last year and I'm not stopping anytime soon. So there!

 

[SnowyRox]

Once again, I'm not sure how old you are SnowyRox but there are a lot of"older" people that are very physically fit-even at 50yrs old. As for myself, I did 3 triathlons and 2 marathons last year and I'm not stopping anytime soon. So there!

Nothing to do with being physically fit... but the longer you're in practice, the more times you're likely to get kicked and beaten around by critters. Even the best LA vets get the crap beaten out of them occasionally.

And, incidentally, the Ironman winners are generally around 30-40. Endurance athletes peak way later than sprinters.

 

[animals2x2]

You go kitty613! I am 45 yo, and if I get in this cycle...well you can do the math. My only hope this cycle is Western which means that I will have a debt of 300k or more. The way I look at it is that anything I earn above and beyond what I have in the past will more than cover my payments, and I will be a lot happier.

What is with all the age discrimination on here? I know plenty of us old people that are more physically capable than most young people...myself included.

Go for your dreams!

 

[twelvetigers]

The issue definitely has nothing to do with the quality of vet you would be. 35, 25, 55 - all totally capable ages for being the world's best veterinarian.

However, $200k debt at 25 = 40 years to pay it off.
$200k at 45 = 20 years to pay it off.

These two make for very different money situations by the time you retire.

 

[libster06]

By the way, isn't the average debt around 150-225k anyway?What's the difference with me graduating at 40 yrs old vs. 30 yrs old?

The issue definitely has nothing to do with the quality of vet you would be. 35, 25, 55 - all totally capable ages for being the world's best veterinarian.

However, $200k debt at 25 = 40 years to pay it off.
$200k at 45 = 20 years to pay it off.

These two make for very different money situations by the time you retire.

Exactly. It's something to think about. That's all people are saying.

What is with all the age discrimination on here? I know plenty of us old people that are more physically capable than most young people...myself included.

Age discrimination??? No one's discriminating by simply pointing out that the difference in time allotted to pay back an "average debt around 150-225k" is a legitimate factor to consider and base your future on. Not worried that you'll possibly be working til you keel over? Cool. Some people are.

I also don't really get the whole "physically capable" comment.