Navy Docs/HPSP: "On Call in Hell"?

[350011]

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Ran across this book "On Call in Hell" by CDR Richard Jadick at a local Borders and wondered if anyone has read it? If so, does it provide any insight? Is it a decent read in the first place? Just trying to figure out if it's worth picking up as it is written by an operational Navy doctor and, if the number of copies on the shelf are an indication, must be projected as a seller...

 

[elderjack21]

Ran across this book "On Call in Hell" by CDR Richard Jadick at a local Borders and wondered if anyone has read it? If so, does it provide any insight? Is it a decent read in the first place? Just trying to figure out if it's worth picking up as it is written by an operational Navy doctor and, if the number of copies on the shelf are an indication, must be projected as a seller...

Time magazine did a big article about the book and Dr. Jadick back in 2006. I didn't read the book, but the article was a good read. The cover was the best "HERO MD" with him holding his bronze star like he was a saint or a priest. He is a DO and defintely a hero.

I don't think his story reflects the experiences had by your normal military doctor, but things could turn out that way for anyone who joins I suppose.

 

[Founder]

I read his book and it is pretty good. It has basically nothing negative about the military in it, really. It takes of his actions and those of his unit during Fallujah. I think the book really gives a feeling of "Wow, those guys are dedicated/heroes". It is definitely not a "normal" experience from what I gather from the experiences presented here. It doesn't glamorize military medicine, in my opinion, but it does present a message of idealism I think.

I also was able to hear him in person speak of his experiences.

It is definitely worth picking up.

 

[Spec Ops Doc]

I thought it was a very good read. He has an interesting story to tell and served his country with honor.
This is not the typical experience of a surgeon in Iraq. He was in some of the thickest fighting and was very far forward.

I have one piece of cautionary advice. In this book Dr Jadick goes gets permission to clear buildings with some of the marine "door kickers." Even for docs that are deployed forward this is outside the role a physician normally plays. A doc can get into trouble by doing things that are outside their mission and sphere of training.

Overall, it was a good book. I enjoyed reading about a doctor that bravely cared for his troops.

 

[elderjack21]

My former GMO residents tell me that this is not uncommon at all in Marine GMO billets, and in at least one case, it was required by the CO.

I wouldn't be shocked if the battalion doc was invited (or encouraged) to participate in this type of training for the sake of being part of the team and understanding what the rest of the unit is going through...but it isn't realistic or sensible (from the perspective of an infantryman) to have your doc kicking in doors. A Soldier/Marine would only want the guys who are trained to do this day in day out with them in those types of situations. It just isn't safe to bring someone that isn't along for those types of rides.

 

[DredPiratRobrts]

I just bought it. Amazon is selling it for only $5.99 IN HARDCOVER!

http://www.amazon.com/Call-Hell-Doctors-Iraq-Story/dp/B000RWD3GY/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1207706895&sr=8-1

 

[FutureNavyFP]

I just bought it. Amazon is selling it for only $5.99 IN HARDCOVER!

http://www.amazon.com/Call-Hell-Doc...bs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1207706895&sr=8-1

On that amazon link there is another book that looks interesting called "A Doctor Looks at War: My Year in Iraq" by Michael C. Hodges. This is about an army doctor so I can't imagine how exciting it is. 😉 I don't know that much about it but it looks like the doc was an HPSP guy. Has anyone read it?

http://www.amazon.com/Doctor-Looks-...65943/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_b/103-2192290-3691054

 

[backrow]

I personally thought the book was not good at all. It just read like a third grade level rambling. It felt disjointed and the only part I actually liked was when he would talk about some of the Marines. I just thought it was a "hey look at what I did" type thing and him trying to create some buzz about this "wonderful" idea of his about far forward medicine. How about just letting the corpsman do their jobs and not putting the GMO in a position he shouldn't be in.

Sorry, not impressed.

 

[ArmyDocDude]

I read it, and I thought it was a good book. I agree with the statement that this does not represent a typical experience. A lot of the book is dedicated to his idea of a forward aid station very close to battle. From the way he talks about it in the book, this is not how it is normally done, because of the safety aspects, insofar as what you can call safe in a battle zone. I thought it was good in general. It gave you a good first hand experience of much of what the military has to offer.

 

[Dirge]

I knew Jadick at Camp Lejeune. I would say that he was not the prototypical medical officer. Plus, he was a prior Marine. Nevertheless, his actions did not surprise me.

 

[Candlemaker]

I liked "On Call in Hell." I thought it was a good book and a good story to tell. I'm biased as a former Marine though.

"A Doctor Looks at War" I thought not so good. Its a journal like book with a bunch of whining about missing his wife and family, bad coffee, using nasty crappers, poor food, down time, and the like. While those things may not be nice, its not good reading over and over and they seem to be the military way. Parts of were informative, but I could have done without it.

 

[backrow]

Okay, there was a bit of discussion of this book on the USUHS thread, so to keep that one on topic I'm posting my response over here.
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Not to get the [usuhs]thread that far off topic, but y'all really thought this was a good book? The story is interesting yes; however, I thought it was poorly written and more of a "look at what I did" book then what he stated at one point which was to "tell the story of some of the patients." I found the stories of the patients to be the only redeeming part of the book.

One of the jobs of the GMO is to definately man the BAS; however, there is a point to how far forward you need a doctor. Some can argue that by having him where he was he in fact hurt care because of instead of completely skipping his level of care and going directly to level II or III they had to flow through him first. In many cases with the current conflict people are being flown/moved directly from point of injury to a very high level of care if needed, completely skipping the intermediate steps. This is different than in the past when people almost always made the step-wise progression.

I think he probably does have some good insight and would be great to sit around the table to debate ideas with; however, he could have done exponentially more harm than help if something had gone wrong and they were left without a doctor anywhere nearby. (I guess you could make this argument for putting a doc anywhere though).

 

[i want out]

...but it isn't realistic or sensible (from the perspective of an infantryman)

Since when has the military been realistic or sensible?

i want out (of IRR)

 

[mslall]

He went where he was ordered to go. I don't think it's particularly fair to blame him for the decisions of his commanding officer.

If i remember correctly he had to convince the commander of the marines he was with to let him go so far forward. In fact I think he was actually the 2nd highest ranking officer in the battalion. And, unlike most of medical officers who get deployed he volunteered for this deployment.

 

[manucelt]

If i remember correctly he had to convince the commander of the marines he was with to let him go so far forward. In fact I think he was actually the 2nd highest ranking officer in the battalion. And, unlike most of medical officers who get deployed he volunteered for this deployment.

The fact that he was the 2nd highest ranking officer in the battalion really isn't very significant. There are times especially in PROFIS positions where a battalion surgeon can be of equivalent rank or even outrank the battalion commander. This doesn't give them any more authority than if they were an O-3 in the same position, they still have follow the orders of the commander (and usually the S3 and XO).

Its also important to keep in mind that every force health protection plan is mission specific. Is it generally a good idea to send your only MD out in an ambulance, certainly not. In this specific case was it, I'd say it probably was. He was there, he convinced his commander it was the best thing to do to protect the unit, its pretty poor form to claim it was a stupid plan. I'd take the position that you should commend him for going the extra step to care for his soldiers even if you disagree with his decisions.

 

[mslall]

The fact that he was the 2nd highest ranking officer in the battalion really isn't very significant. There are times especially in PROFIS positions where a battalion surgeon can be of equivalent rank or even outrank the battalion commander. This doesn't give them any more authority than if they were an O-3 in the same position, they still have follow the orders of the commander (and usually the S3 and XO).

point taken, i didn't understand that and it definitely makes sense.

Its also important to keep in mind that every force health protection plan is mission specific. Is it generally a good idea to send your only MD out in an ambulance, certainly not. In this specific case was it, I'd say it probably was. He was there, he convinced his commander it was the best thing to do to protect the unit, its pretty poor form to claim it was a stupid plan. I'd take the position that you should commend him for going the extra step to care for his soldiers even if you disagree with his decisions.

I don't think anyone was saying it was a categorically stupid plan. I was just pointing out that he developed the plan and convinced his commander where he needed to be, which is, what generally seems to be, the opposite of how a deployment or force health protection plan works. Generally the pattern seems to be, 1) get told you're deploying, 2)Deploy, 3)go where you're told while you're there. Just clarifying that he told his commander where he should go and what he needed to make it happen.

In the situation the plan worked so if it was a 'stupid' plan or a brilliant plan doesn't really matter. Pragmatically they got their job done and maybe he and his men saved some lives that maybe wouldn't have been saved if he weren't there. Backrow was just pointing out that had something happened to him he would have not only left his men without a battalion surgeon, but forced some other battalion surgeon to fill in. Maybe thats not how it would work, thats only an assumption.

I definitely agree with an above post about simply having him there from a leadership perspective probably helped, but is there anything that he could do in the field that a well-trained corpsman or medic couldn't do (not meant to be rhetorical, actually wondering)?

 

[AF M4]

I definitely agree with an above post about simply having him there from a leadership perspective probably helped, but is there anything that he could do in the field that a well-trained corpsman or medic couldn't do (not meant to be rhetorical, actually wondering)?

Not really. This doc's bravery is certainly not in question, but there is the old saw about only being brave when one has to be. Here he's a highly trained asset who specializes in saving lives with a scalpel, not kicking down doors. How many soldiers' lives can a good surgeon save? Sure it's fun and makes great PR to be the hoo-rah type, but you also have to weigh this against your responsibility of being the doc.

The line can ask for a lot of things, but they also usually take your recommendations seriously. For instance, they may call and ask/demand that you have an ambulance on the runway for all in-flight emergencies. Their thought is that they want medical there ASAP for problems. Good thought. But when you point out that if the plane is indeed becoming an uncontrollable falling and flaming ball of death steaming into the runway, it's best not to have your medical personnel as well as the vehicle responsible for transporting the injured to the hospital in the direct path of the crash. Kinda the same thing compared to the guy in the book.