NECC potential criminal prosecution

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This is a high profile story. AGs office will be all up in it. USDA is running a criminal investigation.
 
I called my daughter on her cell an woke her up to ask to make coffee and bring to me in my bed. Was that wrong?
 
Cool she's grinding coffee beans.
Parents...get ur teens a cellphone
 
I'd be impressed if you had her making you a french press. My wife has neither learned how to make me a french press nor an espresso but she will throw a k-cup in for me if I'm out of coffee or feeling lazy
 
I take my coffee seriously ....

But simple.... same krupps ... 19 years young.

Same mug...no soap.
 
Holy....7, 000 pots....42, 000 cups. !!!!!

That's a lot of brewing.
 
Its Z said:
I called my daughter on her cell an woke her up to ask to make coffee and bring to me in my bed. Was that wrong?
Click to expand...

Yes, it is wrong.

You should have texted her. Or should have tweeted the request on her twitter account, or posted on her wall on facebook asking for coffee, or post a picture of a caffeine deprived man and directions on how to make coffee on her tumblr account, or make your request via instagram

I would have suggested instant messanging (AIM, ICQ, Yahoo Message, Windows Messaging) but that's so 90s/00s
 
None of that would have waken her up. Good ole phone ring.
 
Its Z said:
None of that would have waken her up. Good ole phone ring.
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If she set up her phone like most people, then "notification" is set up, so that any update to her numerous online accounts would ring, flash, vibrate, etc.

And what's a phone ring? Is that the dots and dash that you hear when Samuel Morse tried to communicate with his friend cross country via the old telegraph wires?
 
No smart phone. No update or nothing. Just a cell phone with texting.
 
How do you guys think this will affect the overall view on compounding pharmacy/ that industry in general? I've heard they are really cracking down hard now, visiting a bunch of facilities and writing them up for minor infractions that the news is portraying as more than the infractions really are (not the NECC one, obviously that is not being overplayed).
 
rxelle said:
How do you guys think this will affect the overall view on compounding pharmacy/ that industry in general? I've heard they are really cracking down hard now, visiting a bunch of facilities and writing them up for minor infractions that the news is portraying as more than the infractions really are (not the NECC one, obviously that is not being overplayed).
Click to expand...

NECC got away with what it did for so long, by bribing, er I mean making appropriate financial contributions to certain organizations.

My jaded prediction....the FDA & states orgs will want to assure the public that they are going to "do something" to fix the problem. So they will be coming down very hard for small infractions from small compounders, who can't afford to make large enough appropriate contributions. Large compounders who can afford to make appropriate contributions will still get warning letters for major infractions. The public will see the crack down on the small violators and sleep securely at night believing their government is taking all precautions to protect them from bird flu & meningitis. Several years later when a new NECC-like scandel breaks, everyone will be shaking their heads wondering how it could have possibly happened.
 
rxelle said:
How do you guys think this will affect the overall view on compounding pharmacy/ that industry in general? I've heard they are really cracking down hard now, visiting a bunch of facilities and writing them up for minor infractions that the news is portraying as more than the infractions really are (not the NECC one, obviously that is not being overplayed).
Click to expand...

They sure were under the radar about 10 years ago when the Joseph Courtney thing was exposed. If you don't know, he was a compounding/home infusion pharmacist in Kansas City who was exposed when the amount of drugs he ordered did not correspond with what he was billing insurance companies, and it turned out that in many cases, he dispensed bags made with NS or D5 and no excipient ingredients. 😱 Nurses often questioned him because he did a lot of oncology work and as we know, many of those drugs have very distinctive colors, and he explained that the drugs had been reformulated and were now clear. 😕 Patients were also delighted that they seemed to have no side effects from their treatment, either (which didn't work and we now know why).

The person who bought the business destroyed all the stock and started over from scratch, and called all the news stations to cover the story. One Kansas City TV station broadcasted the whole thing, live.
 
rph3664 said:
They sure were under the radar about 10 years ago when the Joseph Courtney thing was exposed. If you don't know, he was a compounding/home infusion pharmacist in Kansas City who was exposed when the amount of drugs he ordered did not correspond with what he was billing insurance companies, and it turned out that in many cases, he dispensed bags made with NS or D5 and no excipient ingredients. 😱 Nurses often questioned him because he did a lot of oncology work and as we know, many of those drugs have very distinctive colors, and he explained that the drugs had been reformulated and were now clear. 😕 Patients were also delighted that they seemed to have no side effects from their treatment, either (which didn't work and we now know why).

The person who bought the business destroyed all the stock and started over from scratch, and called all the news stations to cover the story. One Kansas City TV station broadcasted the whole thing, live.
Click to expand...

It was Robert Courtney and a slightyly different situation. He was a greedy SOB who diluted cancer drugs for profit.

NECC are sloppy greedy SOBs who killed people because of a lack of control and oversite over their operation.

In the end people were harmed or killed because of greedy people without any morals or ethics. Robert Courtney was seen as one greedy individual and not a system failure or problem. NECC is seen as a system failure and a problem. This is what we call a sentinel event. The FDA and the State Boards of Pharmacy are going to come down hard. This is the end of big mass compounders like NECC. You will still be able to get your magic mouthwash at Walgreens. You will not be able to get your crazy 8 ingredient ketamine combo topical pian cream from a pharmacy 3 states away. Not the end of compounding but close.
 
MountainPharmD said:
It was Robert Courtney and a slightyly different situation. He was a greedy SOB who diluted cancer drugs for profit.

NECC are sloppy greedy SOBs who killed people because of a lack of control and oversite over their operation.

In the end people were harmed or killed because of greedy people without any morals or ethics. Robert Courtney was seen as one greedy individual and not a system failure or problem. NECC is seen as a system failure and a problem. This is what we call a sentinel event. The FDA and the State Boards of Pharmacy are going to come down hard. This is the end of big mass compounders like NECC. You will still be able to get your magic mouthwash at Walgreens. You will not be able to get your crazy 8 ingredient ketamine combo topical pian cream from a pharmacy 3 states away. Not the end of compounding but close.
Click to expand...

We do those crazy pain creams, but we dont mail it 3 states away. maybe 3 streets away.
 
Look this is real simple:

Many of these places are NOT compounding they are manufacturing. If you compound and follow all appropriate rules and regulations, you will be fine. If you look carefully, NECC was not compounding, they were manufacturers.
 
It's not how far you mail it that counts. It's do you have a distinct prescription from a prescriber for each order you fill. You also cannot advertise specific formulas to doctors. That's when you cross the line from compounding to manufacturing.
 
Yep, NECC wasn't compounding. They were manufacturing. Big difference.

Compounding is a specific Rx from a specific doctor for a specific patient. In this state, we are also allowed to make "reasonable" quantities of compounded drugs in advance if we know the demand is there. For instance, if we have 10 patients on Miracle Rectal Rejuvenating Cream from Dr. Smith, we can make it in a batch monthly to be ready when those prescriptions/refills come in. We keep a very small stock of commonly ordered compounded medications ready for our regular patients. That's it. We aren't making 40,000 doses and shipping it to 40 states like NECC.
 
Old Timer said:
Look this is real simple:

Many of these places are NOT compounding they are manufacturing. If you compound and follow all appropriate rules and regulations, you will be fine. If you look carefully, NECC was not compounding, they were manufacturers.
Click to expand...

👍

I know of a few compounders in our area that make huge batches of products especially testosterone. We are not interested in that at all. We have a clean room, but we are interested in making a decent living, modest, and not getting huge accounts and manufacturing. We had this in mind even before this meningitis breakout.
 
I've always wondered how these 'compounding pharmacies' are even allowed to operate large scale manufacturing activities like this. So what were the state board of pharmacy and inspectors doing?? Turning a blind eye? Afraid of shutting the place down and losing jobs? Too busy fining pharmacists for not doing CEs??
 
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