Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by first4evernfla, Apr 7, 2007.
Officially, AMCAS has a section on the application that asks you to explain any proabtionary action that was taken against, whether academic or disciplinary, regardless of whether it appears on your transcript. So yes, you are technically required to divulge this info.
I don't know what to tell you. On one hand, my future school is starting to press about us submitting our personal background checks, and they said that if anything comes up on it, it shouldn't be a problem, unless you didn't tell them about it priorly. He was talking about minor offenses, of course...I'm not sure anyone with felonies on their records would get accepted.
However, if yours was just handled by your school and they said it wasn't on your records at all....I don't really know.
Ultimately it's up to you. But like GreenShirt said, AMCAS requires you to report ANY institutional action that was taken against you, whether it's reported or not. The way I see it, it basically comes down to which one will let you sleep better at night. That said, I've heard of many students get accepted into medical school with alcohol violations. Here's just one of the threads I've found talking about institutional actions/alcohol violations. http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=293988&highlight=institutional+action+alcohol
I know this probably isn't what you want to hear, but I think you have to tell them, especially if there is a section on the AMCAS that specifically asks about institutional action. If you don't put anything down then you are being dishonest and if, for some reason, the truth were to come out your acceptances could probably be revoked. I also seem to remember hearing that if you lie and the school finds out later (after you are in school) they could dismiss you because of it.
You should really ask your pre-med advisor about this because as bad as telling schools straight out, its worse if you get caught in a lie.
Also, not to be harsh, but you are the one who chose to drink the alcohol and I'm sure you realized at the time that there could be consequences to that action and unfortunately you got caught, so now there are. Man up to your mistakes. Wanting to get out of telling them on a technicality seems pretty immature to me.
If it's not on your transcript and nobody is going to bother checking up on you, it never happened.
I have also heard that some schools may require a dean's certification of your disciplinary record when you submit the secondary. I think WashU is one of the schools. Also, if your undergrad school has a medical school, I'm sure that they are privy to your records as well.
You are obligated to report it in the section called "institutional action". Failure to report it could cause you to be accused of falsifying your AMCAS application.
Speaking for just one school, I've never seen an alcohol violation, parking ticket or unauthorized use of a coffee pot result in an application being spiked (lying, cheating and stealing are another story).
Just report what happened. I'd be more worried about the MCAT.
If it helps, I listed an institutional action on my app. and it never came up during interviews. They probably don't care, inless its for something serious like cheating or assualt.
I would NOT report it if I were you, especially if they were expunged off your transcript. Ask your dean just to make sure, but technically this is not institutional action, since no action was taken. You were given probation only right? Thats pretty much considered a warning. Were you suspended?
I wouldn't worry, even if do report it, it won't really hurt you.
Also, do a search and you'll find many past threads on this topic. That should be helpful.
You need to figure out whether or not you are an alcoholic. Two alcohol offenses is a huge red flag at your age. So slow down and get some counseling and evalutations and try to determine if you are an addict. If you are an addict, then get help. If you get this problem under control, you can still be a doctor but 2 alcohol offenses indicates to me that you have serious problems. Don't let this get worse. Good luck.
pretty sure i dont have a problem...the first one no drinking involved just in area with alcohol...thanks everyone for the advice...keep it coming
LizzyM, if you're still around...searun brought up a good point. I know you said that having an alcohol violation at your school wasn't a deal breaker, but what about having two alcohol violations?
Personally, if I were on an adcom... I wouldn't be so worried about why you were drinking... I would be more worried about why you were dumb enough to get caught. Just tell them how u got caught and what uve done to correct it in the future. Plus... I really don't think they will be surprised to see a football player getting in trouble for drinking
(Let the flaming begin)
I wouldn't sweat it. If it's not on your transcript, then I would not bring attention to it. Your school is there to help you, not to rat you out and ruin your future. As for manning up, well, getting drunk a few times is not the end of the world. I never had to disclose my demerits and tardies when I applied to college. As for matters involving city, state, or federal law enforcement, then you must disclose any convictions. I guess this matter is not entirely black and white, though I personally have no moral dilemmas about not disclosing an alcohol violation I got from my college or university. I will go back and read the fine print on AMCAS, however. It will NOT be on your criminal background check in case you are wondering.
My experience has been that they can see past at least one such infraction. Take from it what you will.
Schools seem pretty realistic about these things.
Alright, AMCAS is pretty clear about it. If you're not sure, then ask your school. Each school may say something different, so don't listen to our advice. Go right to the source. No matter what you decide to do, don't worry about it hurting your chances because I truly believe that schools know that we are only human, even the SDNers. Just make sure the rest of your application demonstrates that this is not going to be a recurring problem in the future.
I had an alcohol violation, not on transcript, reported it on amcas and didn't really have a problem with admissions.
unfortunately that really sucks that you have two violations. from my anecdotal research one is kinda blown off, two raises an eyebrow, more than that is kind of an app killer.
option a, if you want to go the ethical route fess up, explain clearly, demonstrate regret/maturity all in 3-4sent then move on. after that its out of your hands. it will probably result in some lack of sleep until you get interviews/acc.
option b is to lie, which will probably secure you a medical spot in the admissions season. but many arguably many more sleepless nights wondering whether it was really "expunged" w/regards to a background check and the fear that your medical license could be revoked post graduation (highly unlikely but unfortunately still screws with your mind).
weighing the two i would most likely go with a. tough decision, i know it blows why the hell can't we drink at 18.
For whatever it is worth, I agree.
I... do I.. no. nono.
I don't want to know.
Let me be the first to suggest that you are a huge huge liar.
Option A: Relate a non-documented incident, and don't go to med school.
Option B: Don't relate a non-documented incident, and go to med school.
But yeah, you'd take (A). We get it, you're a wonderful, moral, special person, just like your mom said. Be quiet already.
To the OP: Learn to STFU. Figure out if this is documented anywhere (transcripts, comittee letter, etc). If not, be quiet and become an MD. If so, write your little letter and try to explain your way out of it.
down boy, pull head out of posterior orfice before typing.
option a was not implying getting rejected from med school, more that it was implying dealing with the fallout.
whether or not you get in is based on someone else's judgement.
check with your pre-med adviser, only he/she has a complete understanding of exactly what that type of violation means at your school, as well as what the AAMC requirements are. Even more, he/she will best be able to tell you how to explain/spin the violation.
Obviously if you don't have to tell them than you shouldn't. However, if you were supposed to tell them and you don't and they find out, you'll be in much deeper trouble. In fact, at a few schools I was informed that you could even be expelled from the school at any time for any lies on your application. So . . . it's not worth screwing up, you're on the hook for 4 years for it.
Plus, it's only an alcohol violation. Especially if it was Frosh year you can chalk it up to growing up and explained that you've learned from your mistakes. I mean, we all drank underage, the only difference is you got caught.
I am one of those fools with two alcohol related institutional actions, both freshman year within 2 months of each other. They were both dumb mistakes, and I was intoxicated during neither, but still fear adcoms might mistake me for a boozer. Does any one know if it is ok to have a RA send a letter discussing the events and my growth in maturity?
I had a friend who failed a course because he did not site references properly in an essay and she was accused of plagiarism. He ended up passing the course but had a notation on his transcript which is now gone. He did not put it on the AMCAS application. mind you he was not able to apply to WashU. And he was from a Canadian university. He's at Duke right now.