Need your opinion

[EETTOMD]

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Hello everyone,
I have been lurking in the forums for quite a long time and have posted now and then. Well, I am an electrical engineer (finished BS and MS) and working full time. I am 27 and plan to start medical school by the time I am 33/34. For some reason, it felt maybe once I started working I will feel self content with the job. However, sitting in a cubicle day after day, the only thought that runs through my mind is about finishing my pre-reqs,MCAT and just go for it. My wife ( a pharmacist) is very supportive and encourages me with this goal of mine. So I need some opinion from you guys regarding a few things that crossed my mind

i. I realize that I will be in debt ( a lot of debt). However, when I think of financial planning especially for my kids education (when I do have them), will it be feasible to help them through college without too much struggle and still be able to afford a decent living?

ii. How difficult will it be to pay back the student loans?

iii. In regard to pre-reqs, by the time I will apply, it will have been almost 9-10 years since I have graduated from college. Even if I do start taking the pre-reqs (will be bio and orgo, I have the rest) now, is there a high chance I will have repeat physics, gen chem etc ?

iv. The place where I am residing now, only option to take any class part-time is at a CC, which I guess is frowned upon. I can take classes at Harvard Extenstion school, but it will be 1.5 hr commute for me each way after work and I can't start there before next fall. However, I might be able to take classes in summer 2012 at the CC. If I am taking the risk, putting in the effort to make it, it would be really sad if classes at a CC will eventually crush all of it. Taking class at the CC and HES will have similar cost, however, the 1.5 hr commute means less time with family. I realize sacrifices are in order, but I am trying to understand is CC that much underrated?

That is all for now. Thank you for your opinions. I really appreciate it. Best of luck to all non-trads out there. In the words of Steve Jobs, " Stay hungry, stay foolish"
🙂

 

[Autarkeia]

I. It depends on your definition of "decent living". You'll have plenty of money to live, raise your children, and pay back what you owe. But of course, poor decision-making could bankrupt you.

II. See I.

III. For some schools, the chance of repeating is 100%, for others, 0%. Talk to the schools.

IV. Bite the bullet and take it at the school with the greatest reputation you can. Unfortunately, this means most CCs are out. That said, what I would do is take the first class of a series at Harvard Extension and then the rest at the CC. That way, I've demonstrated I can cut it without killing myself with an ungodly commute. There are much better ways to spend your time than commuting for all the classes.

 

[EETTOMD]

Thanks Autarkeia for the your reply. By decent living I mean, like a 3 bedroom house/condo with a porch in a safe area, be able to take a vacation with the family, eat out from time to time etc.

When you say series of classes, are you suggesting that I take all the classes, including the ones I have completed for my EE degree, at HES?
Or take the more demanding ones at HES (like orgo, biochem, cell bio and the likes?)

Thanks again. Much appreciated.

I. It depends on your definition of "decent living". You'll have plenty of money to live, raise your children, and pay back what you owe. But of course, poor decision-making could bankrupt you.

II. See I.

III. For some schools, the chance of repeating is 100%, for others, 0%. Talk to the schools.

IV. Bite the bullet and take it at the school with the greatest reputation you can. Unfortunately, this means most CCs are out. That said, what I would do is take the first class of a series at Harvard Extension and then the rest at the CC. That way, I've demonstrated I can cut it without killing myself with an ungodly commute. There are much better ways to spend your time than commuting for all the classes.

 

[Autarkeia]

It all depends. Will your wife continue working when you have children? If so, you'll be more than able to live well. If not, you'll struggle like the rest of the middle class, but you will be middle class. And as an MD, you'll qualify for loans you can't possibly afford, so the house is no problem. You'll figure the rest out as the time comes. Really, the debt is not much of an issue. It's what medical professionals complain about to outsiders because it's the only thing outsiders can understand.

And what I meant by the series is the A-B-C (or I-II-III) sequence. So, Ochem A at Harvard, and then B at CC. Same for Bio (and Gen Chem and Physics if you do repeat them) Unless you get less than an A at Harvard. Then don't take the second at CC as that would look very bad. Added incentive to do well, no? You're just trying to show that you can still handle the rigors of academic study. The MCAT is where you show your grasp on content, and CC courses are more than sufficient preparation for that. Remember, Adcoms are made up of people too, and they will understand "the commute was too long and I figured my time would be better spent getting clinical experience."

 

[EETTOMD]

Thanks again Autarkeia. I need some more advice on fixing my timeline for finishing the remaining pre-reqs, taking the MCAT and applying. Ideally I would like to have completed the pre-reqs along with biochem, cell bio and possible A&P before I start med school.
However, to finish all those classes part time, take the MCAT and apply within the next 2 years would not be practical in my case. So here are my concerns/ideas

i. Should I attempt to finish the remaining pre-reqs (bio and ochem) asap, prepare for the mcat and get the ball rolling?

ii. Will classes like biochem, cell bio be essential for a good score on the MCAT?

iii. Which of the aforementioned and other classes will provide a solid foundation for starting med school? And do I need to complete them before I apply or complete them by the time I start?

iv. As Autarkeia mentioned in the previous post, for example, if I take bio I @ Harvard Extension, get an A and bio 2 at a CC, will that be a bad idea? This will help me in reducing the 1.5 hr commute to HES and spend more time with family and get volunteering done.
If it wasn't frowned upon, I would have taken the remaining pre reqs at a CC but doing this as a non trad, I would like to maximize my chances , so I guess I would have to bear the 1.5 hr commute each way.

v. Last but not least, I have some student loans which I am in the process of paying off, so I can't really leave my job and also, leaving now would mean I forgo my 401k and pension.

So please help me in determining a time line. Autarkeia and opinion from anyone else would be appreciated. Thanks a lot.

It all depends. Will your wife continue working when you have children? If so, you'll be more than able to live well. If not, you'll struggle like the rest of the middle class, but you will be middle class. And as an MD, you'll qualify for loans you can't possibly afford, so the house is no problem. You'll figure the rest out as the time comes. Really, the debt is not much of an issue. It's what medical professionals complain about to outsiders because it's the only thing outsiders can understand.

And what I meant by the series is the A-B-C (or I-II-III) sequence. So, Ochem A at Harvard, and then B at CC. Same for Bio (and Gen Chem and Physics if you do repeat them) Unless you get less than an A at Harvard. Then don't take the second at CC as that would look very bad. Added incentive to do well, no? You're just trying to show that you can still handle the rigors of academic study. The MCAT is where you show your grasp on content, and CC courses are more than sufficient preparation for that. Remember, Adcoms are made up of people too, and they will understand "the commute was too long and I figured my time would be better spent getting clinical experience."

 

[Autarkeia]

I. Yes.

II. They are completely non-essential and are a very inefficient way of preparing for the MCAT. Incidentally, so are The Berkeley Review books.

III. I do not know about MA, but most schools only require one year of the basics (with lab). Some require a bit more. Where I'm from, an additional bio is usually required. Very few schools require more than that. The basics plus biochem will qualify you for the vast majority of medical schools. I don't see why you would take more classes than that unless you need to repair your GPA. If you don't need GPA repair, all you'll really do is jeopardize your GPA and lose time you could spend with your family or volunteering.

IV. I'm far more certain about my answers to I through III than I am about this one, so I'm glad you're checking on this suggestion.

V. I'm not sure what the question is.

FYI, if you just take the real pre-reqs and get the volunteering/clinical work in, you'll definitely be able to apply after this next cycle. I highly recommend starting volunteer work in a clinical setting now though.

 

[UpwardTrend]

You say that a CC is your only option. Please elaborate. If you're in Boston I'm sure there are other schools to attend. Is it an evening campus that you're in need of? You could mix and match whatever you could find at 4+ year schools by taking courses as non-degree seeking.

 

[Autarkeia]

You say that a CC is your only option. Please elaborate. If you're in Boston I'm sure there are other schools to attend. Is it an evening campus that you're in need of? You could mix and match whatever you could find at 4+ year schools by taking courses as non-degree seeking.

I take it he's about 90 miles outside Boston. Wait...no...15. Boston traffic...

 

[UpwardTrend]

TBR books are highly recommended all over the 30+ MCAT study habits thread.

II. They are completely non-essential and are a very inefficient way of preparing for the MCAT. Incidentally, so are The Berkeley Review books.

 

[Autarkeia]

I have some for sale if anyone wants them, but I'd rather sell them to neurotic undergrads who are going to waste time anyway than older students who have better uses for their time. I did the first physics chapter and realized it is way too deep on the content. You should not be seeing i-hats and dot products in MCAT review. The same goes for the other books. Not only is such content review pointless, but it's pretty counter-productive.

Edit: I am not exaggerating here--TBR books are as thick as the corresponding subject's textbooks. In what sense is that "review" or strategy for what is largely a reading/thinking test?

Double Edit: I believe the 30+ MCAT thread is where people also recommend improving verbal by reading the Economist and WSJ. That is poor advice. Read the Economist and WSJ for personal growth; work LSAT problems for improving verbal.

 

[EETTOMD]

Hey UpwardTrend. Thanks for your input. I used to live in Boston and now live about 80 miles from it. In my area, the available postbac programs are all at private schools save one. The private ones are just way too expensive and I am yet to find out details about the public 4 year uni. From what I have found out so far, they do not usually offer night time classes.

CC is the only option if I am willing to forgo the 3 hour round trip to boston 3-4 times a week after working 10 hour days.

Thanks again. Any advice would be appreciated.

You say that a CC is your only option. Please elaborate. If you're in Boston I'm sure there are other schools to attend. Is it an evening campus that you're in need of? You could mix and match whatever you could find at 4+ year schools by taking courses as non-degree seeking.

 

[UpwardTrend]

Is that a typo, or are you really going to wait 6-7 years to start medical school?

Hello everyone,
I have been lurking in the forums for quite a long time and have posted now and then. Well, I am an electrical engineer (finished BS and MS) and working full time. I am 27 and plan to start medical school by the time I am 33/34.
🙂

Most non-trads are trying not to postpone matriculation. If you're trying to do this process quickly I would imagine you could scale down on living expenses and live on one (pharmacist) salary for a year while you attend a daytime post-bacc and quit work. A cost-benefit analysis usually points toward getting into school ASAP. Also, that is awesome your wife is a pharmacist and I'm sure she can help you get some clinical exposure through colleagues.

 

[mauberley]

You should not be seeing i-hats and dot products in MCAT review.

:cry:

All depends on your level of understanding going into it...if you have a math background, then vector notation is rather natural for learning physics.

 

[Autarkeia]

:cry:

All depends on your level of understanding going into it...if you have a math background, then vector notation is rather natural for learning physics.

True, but first, you're presumably not learning physics for the MCAT, and second, you only need to know MCAT physics. Taking the vector example, at most, the MCAT requires a conceptual understanding of vector addition as head-to-toe. Beyond that, it will either make the trigonometry extremely simple or give you the information needed to convert the vectors into a "scalar". This is just one example of the largely useless information covered by TBR.

I just cannot imagine a situation in which such review is useful for MCAT preparation. Take your person with a background in mathematics. If you say "velocity is a vector" to them, they already know what that means for vector addition. If they've forgotten, walking them through it again is no less a waste of their time than it is anyone else's. Multiply this by every concept covered in TBR (including those that will never grace an actual test) and that is a lot of unnecessary time spent on content review.

When I took the GRE, the verbal section was still heavily dependent on vocabulary. I memorized a list approaching a thousand words. A full appreciation of the words would have required learning their connotations, but all the GRE required was learning a five word "general meaning". Similarly, TBR is like learning all the connotations instead of focusing on the test. Personally, I thought that focusing on the MCAT was probably the best way to study for the MCAT.

And this doesn't begin to touch on how TBR can damage performance. If someone chooses to use TBR, so be it, but I would advise that person make sure they're taking the time to learn the actual test. By and large, what kills MCAT scores is not gaps in knowledge, but reasoning errors.

 

[Autarkeia]

Oh, and lest you think I'm just being argumentative, I owe a very relaxed MCAT season to advice I received that contradicted to the prevailing thought here at SDN. I'm just paying it forward...

 

[EETTOMD]

6-7 years based on my understanding that i would need to finish additional classes on top of pre-reqs. I would have had to do that on a part time basis and with my location, doing multiple classes a semester would be difficult. however, it seems like I may be able to finish the remaining pre reqs earlier.
Is it frowned upon if I take biochem or the likes at a CC? i guess I will have to sacrifice my time w/ family to finish the pre reqs but something tells me it will all be worth it.

thanks again.

Is that a typo, or are you really going to wait 6-7 years to start medical school?



Most non-trads are trying not to postpone matriculation. If you're trying to do this process quickly I would imagine you could scale down on living expenses and live on one (pharmacist) salary for a year while you attend a daytime post-bacc and quit work. A cost-benefit analysis usually points toward getting into school ASAP. Also, that is awesome your wife is a pharmacist and I'm sure she can help you get some clinical exposure through colleagues.

 

[mauberley]

Oh, and lest you think I'm just being argumentative, I owe a very relaxed MCAT season to advice I received that contradicted to the prevailing thought here at SDN. I'm just paying it forward...

I have no problems here. 🙂 I think it's a useful discussion that, sadly, will be forgotten in the mists of not-knowing-how-to-use-search-functions. 😉 I'm not familiar with TBR (I used a Kaplan large-ass review book and my textbooks), so I'm coming from a more philosophical point of view, anyway. If you've seen material before, I would think that preparing for a test on said material is probably most efficient when it's presented in the form you initially learned it in, hence my previous statement. As you said, though, you need to translate that further into the form seen on the test, so maybe TBR bridges that gap.

I highly believe that everyone has to find what works for themselves -- if TBR works for a lot of people, great, but it won't work for everyone (as you obviously know 🙂).

 

[ChE04]

II. They are completely non-essential and are a very inefficient way of preparing for the MCAT. Incidentally, so are The Berkeley Review books.

I would also tend to disagree with these statements. While I agree that TBR teaches a bit beyond the MCAT, I don't think that the point of the books are to learn all the nitty gritty details, nor do I think they went over the top with it. Rather, the additional information is there as background to better set up each topic. For example, instead of just telling you to remember that X happens when Y occurs, they explain why X happens when Y occurs. To each their own, though. I suppose as an engineer, I have a habit of asking "why?" whenever I learn things. I did find TBR's bio pretty weak.

I would also disagree that cell bio, etc are useless when preparing for the MCAT. As a bio instructor for The Princeton Review, I found that students who had exposure to these subjects (especially physiology) prior to starting their review tended to do much better.

Come to think of it, I really think reading NYT and WSJ helped me improve on verbal... We are just disagreeing on everything MCAT related here! Perhaps we can agree that the MCAT is a pain in the ass hoop to jump through? 🙂

 

[UpwardTrend]

Oh, and lest you think I'm just being argumentative, I owe a very relaxed MCAT season to advice I received that contradicted to the prevailing thought here at SDN. I'm just paying it forward...

Thanks for the input. It's great to hear feedback from mature adults around this forum. I guess I got caught up in the other pre-med threads for MCAT studies. I do hope to be as efficient as possible with my reviewing. I planned on only buying PS TBR books. I already have all the EK materials (4 subjects, 1001, 101 verbal, audio osmosis). I guess I'll try without TBR first and I'll reasess after I begin weekly Saturday morning practice CBT's.

To the OP, I'm still wondering why your timeline would be over 2 years. You have a BS (and more) so you just need the 8 pre-reqs. Your physics may carry over from your previous degree which would leave you with 6. Two pre-reqs every 16 weeks and one over the summer 8 week session should take around 1.5 years to complete. This would leave you plenty of time to study for the MCAT and still take less than 2 years. I wouldn't worry about Biochem or Genetics until your application is already in. These can be done during your gap year if the med school you're interested in even requires them. After you get some clinical exposure you may want to rethink continuing your current job.
I'm sure you're just overlooking evening programs closer to your area. I live in a much less populated area and I found an evening campus that offers 8 week courses that are perfect for getting in 2 lectures with labs every 16 weeks. Is this place near you? http://www.baystate.edu/ They have campuses in Boston or Middleborough, MA. I found another evening campus in Salem. Surely there is something between a community college and Harvard that is within a reasonable distance.

 

[EETTOMD]

Hey UpwardTrend! Thanks for your help. I actually need 2 pre-reqs (bio and ochem) as I have completed the rest during my undergrad. My undergrad gpa in EE was 3.7.

I have been looking for programs in the area where evening classes will be a possibility. There are two private colleges which offers a mixture of day and night classes, but they are just way too expensive. I have emailed the state universities close to me, and waiting to hear back from them. So if it is not positive news from them, then it is either CC or commute to HES for me.

As someone mentioned, taking classes like biochem, physiology for example does give you a big boost when it comes to the MCAT. However, I am just not confident it will be feasible as I will be very much crunched for time. I will get started with the volunteering for now and see how things unfold in the coming months.

Thanks again. I really appreciate it.

Btw, the colleges you mentioned are far away from me. If I am going there, I might just as well go to HES.

Thanks for the input. It's great to hear feedback from mature adults around this forum. I guess I got caught up in the other pre-med threads for MCAT studies. I do hope to be as efficient as possible with my reviewing. I planned on only buying PS TBR books. I already have all the EK materials (4 subjects, 1001, 101 verbal, audio osmosis). I guess I'll try without TBR first and I'll reasess after I begin weekly Saturday morning practice CBT's.

To the OP, I'm still wondering why your timeline would be over 2 years. You have a BS (and more) so you just need the 8 pre-reqs. Your physics may carry over from your previous degree which would leave you with 6. Two pre-reqs every 16 weeks and one over the summer 8 week session should take around 1.5 years to complete. This would leave you plenty of time to study for the MCAT and still take less than 2 years. I wouldn't worry about Biochem or Genetics until your application is already in. These can be done during your gap year if the med school you're interested in even requires them. After you get some clinical exposure you may want to rethink continuing your current job.
I'm sure you're just overlooking evening programs closer to your area. I live in a much less populated area and I found an evening campus that offers 8 week courses that are perfect for getting in 2 lectures with labs every 16 weeks. Is this place near you? http://www.baystate.edu/ They have campuses in Boston or Middleborough, MA. I found another evening campus in Salem. Surely there is something between a community college and Harvard that is within a reasonable distance.

 

[mauberley]

In your situation, I'd suggest not worrying about biochem or physio as actual classes. I suspect what's covered in a bio class will be more than adequate for the MCAT. Biochem isn't yet required at a plurality of schools (to my knowledge), and I think you can achieve the same effect with respect to MCAT prep simply by going into more depth on metabolic pathways (glycolysis, TCA, ETC) on your own. Same thing with physio--I never had a formal class in physiology, but a quick and dirty review of physiological systems on your own should give you enough of a foundation/context to help with the MCAT.

 

[Autarkeia]

I suppose as an engineer, I have a habit of asking "why?" whenever I learn things.

Trust me, my background is in the ultimate "why?" field. I'd rather not say what as it would not take much to connect the dots to my app, but I hear you. I don't understand anything until I get the deeper connections, and my approach to MCAT would never fly for someone who only asked "what do I need to know?" But, as you point out, different strokes for different folks.

Oh, and I would never say cell bio, physio, etc., are useless for the MCAT--just non-essential. Certainly, the more you know, the better off you are, but it's a matter of diminishing returns. I believe MCAT content review has a point where the returns begin rapidly tailing off. I also believe as non-trads, most off us have obligations that require us to be particularly aware of the returns we're getting on our time. That's what lies behind my counsel.

However, I must insist that EK's approach to verbal makes the others look like garbage. It is an excellent application of the principles of Adler's How to Read a Book.

 

[Autarkeia]

I highly believe that everyone has to find what works for themselves -- if TBR works for a lot of people, great, but it won't work for everyone (as you obviously know 🙂).

I agree. I'm probably just expressing my frustration with getting all stressed out myself by what I read elsewhere. Thank heavens someone knew me well enough to rescue me. I personally recommend EK, but yours sounds good too since it's not TBR. 😉 Yeah, I have strong feelings on this. 😛

I also just broke my no-emoticons rule. Why do they have to be so useful? 😡 Darn it. Now I can't stop.

 

[UpwardTrend]

Trust me, my background is in the ultimate "why?" field. I'd rather not say what as it would not take much to connect the dots to my app, but I hear you. I don't understand anything until I get the deeper connections, and my approach to MCAT would never fly for someone who only asked "what do I need to know?" But, as you point out, different strokes for different folks.

However, I must insist that EK's approach to verbal makes the others look like garbage. It is an excellent application of the principles of Adler's How to Read a Book.

Good to hear about EK verbal. Once you go through the 101 whats the next best resource for verbal?

 

[Autarkeia]

Good to hear about EK verbal. Once you go through the 101 whats the next best resource for verbal?

If you're looking for practice, any other standardized test's reading comp section is good, though GRE and LSAT are best. GMAT, not so much.

If you're looking for a fleshing out of the best approach to verbal, then do read Adler's How to Read a Book. Some of it will not apply, but it will be enormously helpful. Once through Adler, then consider reading things like WSJ and The Economist.

I'll have to dig through the attic, but if I recall correctly, one of the GRE review books was also very helpful. I'll get back to you on that.

 

[mcdtheta]

i.I realize that I will be in debt ( a lot of debt). However, when I think of financial planning especially for my kids education (when I do have them), will it be feasible to help them through college without too much struggle and still be able to afford a decent living?

ii. How difficult will it be to pay back the student loans?

I have done a lot of research on financing my medical education. I recently left my long time job (401k + bonuses etc) for a job at a hospital so I could make my class schedules work to complete my studies. Even though I am making considerably less now than I would be - I will have the time to devote to my studies and still pay my bills (single gal here). I had to do some juggling on which things I absolutely needed (gas, electric bills) and ones I didn't (netflix, cable etc) - but I am ok.

Additionally, there are a lot of resources online to help you understand the financing of a medical education and what repayment is going to look like. Research scholarships and look at schools you may be interested in to see what the average student debt looks like for graduating students.

I also found the AMCAS website and their FIRST Financial Toolkit to be very useful. It talked about what debt looks like and repayment as well as a few programs that can alter the amount of interest paid as well as forgiveness programs based on specialty.

Follow your heart!

 

[EETTOMD]

Thanks everyone for your help. I have finally found a 4 year university which offers the evening pre-req classes, and is a bit shorter commute (45 mins as opposed to 1.5 hrs). However, this is a state university and not HES, and I do not know if that should be a concern. It is listed in the AMCAS site as one of the schools providing a post-bac program.

However, will it matter where I finished the pre-reqs from? It seems like a decent university (Worcester State University.)

Also, some of the volunteering opportunities entail work at reception desk or gift shop etc. I do not see how this sort of volunteering may help me. Do I need to find specific volunteer opportunities targeted towards hands on experience? If so, can you please provide some examples?

Thanks again. I really appreciate it.

I have done a lot of research on financing my medical education. I recently left my long time job (401k + bonuses etc) for a job at a hospital so I could make my class schedules work to complete my studies. Even though I am making considerably less now than I would be - I will have the time to devote to my studies and still pay my bills (single gal here). I had to do some juggling on which things I absolutely needed (gas, electric bills) and ones I didn't (netflix, cable etc) - but I am ok.

Additionally, there are a lot of resources online to help you understand the financing of a medical education and what repayment is going to look like. Research scholarships and look at schools you may be interested in to see what the average student debt looks like for graduating students.

I also found the AMCAS website and their FIRST Financial Toolkit to be very useful. It talked about what debt looks like and repayment as well as a few programs that can alter the amount of interest paid as well as forgiveness programs based on specialty.

Follow your heart!

 

[UpwardTrend]

Thats good to hear. I knew you would find something. Any 4+ year University will do and I wouldn't sweat the fact that its not Harvard🙂 Since you're not in a huge hurry you may just want to do one course per semester along with a new EC and your full time job. I looked at their catalog and they have Bio 101 for Spring. Find out when they offer the courses you need so you can schedule them without any gaps. I noticed they only have O-Chem II in the Spring which probably means they offer O-Chem I in the fall. You would want Bio 102 this summer then. Taking your courses: Spring 2012, Summer 2012, Fall 2012, Spring 2013 would mean you could apply Summer 2013. If its too late to apply to Worcester as a regular student for a Spring class then look into non-degree seeking option.

As far as the volunteering goes, I would go in and talk to the volunteer coordinator at a local hospital and let them know your story. Sometimes they can relate to you as an older non-trad. I did this at the local VA hospital and they put me right into pt contact gigs. If that doesn't work then I would look into the local county or city low income family health clinic. If you absolutely can't get pt contact volunteering then still volunteer somewhere and try to get plenty of shadowing ASAP. I would think your wife could get you some help in this area. The school you're going to may have some contacts for clinical volunteering since they sometimes include this added benefit during formal post bacc programs.
One last bit of advice, when you take the courses, don't just take them to get A's. You need to master the material so you can retain it for the MCAT.

 

[Autarkeia]

Hospice is also a great place to volunteer for patient contact, though you'll still need other opportunities to observe physician-patient interactions.

 

[theseeker4]

Hospice is also a great place to volunteer for patient contact, though you'll still need other opportunities to observe physician-patient interactions.

I would not rely on volunteering to observe patient-physician interactions. Volunteering should include patient contact (you can smell the patients) but usually involves feeding patients, getting them books, pillows, blankets, etc. Shadowing is the opportunity to actually see what the doctors do, unless you are lucky in your volunteering and have the ability to shadow while volunteering. Don't expect the chance to observe procedures or doctor-patient interactions while volunteering; speak to doctors about shadowing opportunities for that.

 

[EETTOMD]

Thanks UpwardTrend and everyone for the advice. I need to ask you guys one more thing. Although I have had gen chem in my undergrad, it's been a while. I feel confident about brining myself upto speed on the theoretical material. however, I am wondering if it would be such a good idea to jump into ochem without a lab refresher? If I do decide to do gen chem. 2 for example, will it be okay to just take this class at a CC along with a lab? I have A's in all my other pre-reqs ( ones that I have completed that is) except gen chem 2 where I have a B. i
It was a bad semester in terms of classes for me, however, I did comeback and finish the next two semesters with 4.0 with 15+ credit hours load .

As always, thank you. I hope I will be as successful as you guys here. It's hard at times to think that I will be leaving a stable career and make such a big bet on myself. Sometimes, I just feel guilty at the thought of putting my wife through such hard times, mentally and financially. Most of the time it just feels foolish, and at the same time this exact feeling makes me think I am doing the right thing.

Btw, are any of you guys applying to DO schools? They are all so expensive!!

Thats good to hear. I knew you would find
something. Any 4+ year University will do and I wouldn't sweat the fact that its not Harvard🙂 Since you're not in a huge hurry you may just want to do one course per semester along with a new EC and your full time job. I looked at their catalog and they have Bio 101 for Spring. Find out when they offer the courses you need so you can schedule them without any gaps. I noticed they only have O-Chem II in the Spring which probably means they offer O-Chem I in the fall. You would want Bio 102 this summer then. Taking your courses: Spring 2012, Summer 2012, Fall 2012, Spring 2013 would mean you could apply Summer 2013. If its too late to apply to Worcester as a regular student for a Spring class then look into non-degree seeking option.

As far as the volunteering goes, I would go in and talk to the volunteer coordinator at a local hospital and let them know your story. Sometimes they can relate to you as an older non-trad. I did this at the local VA hospital and they put me right into pt contact gigs. If that doesn't work then I would look into the local county or city low income family health clinic. If you absolutely can't get pt contact volunteering then still volunteer somewhere and try to get plenty of shadowing ASAP. I would think your wife could get you some help in this area. The school you're going to may have some contacts for clinical volunteering since they sometimes include this added benefit during formal post bacc programs.
One last bit of advice, when you take the courses, don't just take them to get A's. You need to master the material so you can retain it for the MCAT.

 

[mauberley]

Thanks UpwardTrend and everyone for the advice. I need to ask you guys one more thing. Although I have had gen chem in my undergrad, it's been a while. I feel confident about brining myself upto speed on the theoretical material. however, I am wondering if it would be such a good idea to jump into ochem without a lab refresher?

My experience: I had a span of about 10 years between gen chem/pchem and ochem. I considered retaking, but decided not to waste a year to do it. I think it worked out for me. (I had a B in gen chem and an A in pchem.) If you've seen the basic chem material before and were at least comfortable with it, a refresher is enough to allow you to at least survive organic chemistry. With respect to lab skills, if you're assigned a decent lab manual, it should be enough to get you going. Hopefully, you'll also have a lab partner that's competent, helpful, and patient. 🙂

 

[dmf2682]

My experience: I had a span of about 10 years between gen chem/pchem and ochem. I considered retaking, but decided not to waste a year to do it. I think it worked out for me. (I had a B in gen chem and an A in pchem.) If you've seen the basic chem material before and were at least comfortable with it, a refresher is enough to allow you to at least survive organic chemistry. With respect to lab skills, if you're assigned a decent lab manual, it should be enough to get you going. Hopefully, you'll also have a lab partner that's competent, helpful, and patient. 🙂

This. It's been ten years since General chem and I'm in organic now. Lecture is easy, pulling a 99 average going into the second midterm tomorrow. Lab is going ok too, a high B or low A. Surprisingly most of my points lost were in stuff I look for granted in engineering, like not showing my work on % yield calculations or not explicitly labeling my temperatures units (I used the degree symbol but didn't specify Celsius). Little things, but you'll do fine. Enjoy the ride!

 

[EETTOMD]

Thanks dmf2682 and mauberly. Are you concerned that some schools might accept pre-reqs that are not semi- recent? That is actually one of my worries.

Also, for review purposes I was thing of getting the BR gen chem book and text book ( for reference). Same for physics. Any thoughts/opinions on this?

Thanks a bunch.

This. It's been ten years since General chem and I'm in organic now. Lecture is easy, pulling a 99 average going into the second midterm tomorrow. Lab is going ok too, a high B or low A. Surprisingly most of my points lost were in stuff I look for granted in engineering, like not showing my work on % yield calculations or not explicitly labeling my temperatures units (I used the degree symbol but didn't specify Celsius). Little things, but you'll do fine. Enjoy the ride!

 

[mauberley]

Thanks dmf2682 and mauberly. Are you concerned that some schools might accept pre-reqs that are not semi- recent? That is actually one of my worries.

It wasn't an issue when I contacted various schools I was interested in. I think there is probably an issue if all of your prereqs are old, but if you've taken recent science courses then you're okay.

As far as review books, flip through some and pick the one that you feel explains things the best to you.