Neuropsychiatry/ behavioral neurology

[Healthinfo104]

So I had posted another threat similar to this but had some additional and different questions.

I see that behavioral neurology and neuropsychiatry are lumped together into on subspecialty. Fellows may come from various primary training pathways (neurolpgy, psychiatry or both) but in the end after the fellowship they all taketh same certifying exam and are in the same subspecialty.

Due to this, I read that they are interchangeable and can call themselves either a Neuropsychiatrist or behavioral neurologist despite of they were originally trained in neurology or psychiatry.

With that said, can a behavioral neurologist/ neuropsychiatrist with primary training in neurology, staff a psychiatric unit?

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[splik]

No

 

[hamstergang]

With that said, can a behavioral neurologist/ neuropsychiatrist with primary training in neurology, staff a psychiatric unit?

How is this different than your prior question?

It then stated that behavioral neurologists with the psychiatric training that they receive in these fellowships are able to handle and treat primary psychiatric disorders or symptoms that present to them... is that true?

 

[Healthinfo104]

How is this different than your prior question?

I didn't ask the scope of what each can do and where they can practice before?

 

[slappy]

In the future, just stick to one thread for all your questions about one subject: Neuropsychiatry?

 

[Healthinfo104]

In the future, just stick to one thread for all your questions about one subject: Neuropsychiatry?

I was actually trying to search for you! I liked your reply on the post you put in the thread u linked.

So you were saying that one can choose to identify as a behavioral neurologist or Neuropsychiatrist depending on their preferencex regardless of if their primary training prior to fellowship was in neurology or psychiatry.

So with that said, can a Neuropsychiatrist fellow with original training in neurology, can they staff a psychiatric unit in a hospital and/or treat primary psychiatric disorders?

 

[slappy]

I was actually trying to search for you! I liked your reply on the post you put in the thread u linked.

So you were saying that one can choose to identify as a behavioral neurologist or Neuropsychiatrist depending on their preferencex regardless of if their primary training prior to fellowship was in neurology or psychiatry.

So with that said, can a Neuropsychiatrist fellow with original training in neurology, can they staff a psychiatric unit in a hospital and/or treat primary psychiatric disorders?

As splik has mentioned above, the answer is no.

 

[Healthinfo104]

As splik has mentioned above, the answer is no.

So then what can they staff?

 

[st2205]

So then what can they staff?

Things related to neurology and then specifically neuropsychiatry / behavioral neurology issues.

A better, but more extreme, analogy would be both anesthesia and PM&R both doing a pain medicine fellowship. A pain trained physiatrist won't be running a SICU just as a pain trained anesthesiologist won't be running a rehab floor. I get that there's a confusion because the title of "neuropsychiatrist" applying to a neurologist, but this limits to "neuropsychiatry" and is not inclusive of "psychiatry" (i.e. the fellowship isn't giving them experience managing acute inpatient psychiatry [schizophrenia, mania, SI, etc.]). Similarly, a pediatric cardiologist isn't a general adult cardiologist and doesn't cath adults or manage CHF in a 65 year old, despite probably having more familiarity with some of the principles than a host of other physicians.

 

[clausewitz2]

OP, someone has also been posting essentially this question repeatedly to the Neurology forum in the same time you have been making these posts here. There is also someone on reddit who keeps posting to r/psychiatry with these repetitive questions in the same time frame. I think everyone's been really consistent in telling you that if you want to work with schizophrenic patients on a regular basis you are going to need psychiatric training.

Do you think if you keep asking in slightly different ways the answer is going to be different?

 

[WisNeuro]

Maybe it's a naïve AI program trying to learn and rewrite its recursive code.

 

[Healthinfo104]

OP, someone has also been posting essentially this question repeatedly to the Neurology forum in the same time you have been making these posts here. There is also someone on reddit who keeps posting to r/psychiatry with these repetitive questions in the same time frame. I think everyone's been really consistent in telling you that if you want to work with schizophrenic patients on a regular basis you are going to need psychiatric training.
Do you think if you keep asking in slightly different ways the answer is going to be different?

No all I am trying to ask in one straightforward answer and nobody can answer it in a direct way.

It's states on the curriculum set forth by the United Counsel for Neurologic subspecialties for the Behavioral Neurology/ Neuropsychiatry fellowship that one of the key areas of training INCLUDES the diagnosis and management of primary psychiatric disorders including schizophrenia, mood disorders, bipolar... etc.

The board and curriculum states that this training is provided to treat primary psychiatric disorders, but then people are saying that they cannot.

Where's is the discrpency is all I am trying to ask? Why does the board state one thing but people are saying another? Is it an error created in the curriculum?

Ps. I ask out of curriosity... I am not trying to be a neurologist treating schizophrenia as some have suggested.

 

[st2205]

No all I am trying to ask in one straightforward answer and nobody can answer it in a direct way.

It's states on the curriculum set forth by the United Counsel for Neurologic subspecialties for the Behavioral Neurology/ Neuropsychiatry fellowship that one of the key areas of training INCLUDES the diagnosis and management of primary psychiatric disorders including schizophrenia, mood disorders, bipolar... etc.

The board and curriculum states that this training is provided to treat primary psychiatric disorders, but then people are saying that they cannot.

Where's is the discrpency is all I am trying to ask? Why does the board state one thing but people are saying another? Is it an error created in the curriculum?

Ps. I ask out of curriosity... I am not trying to be a neurologist treating schizophrenia as some have suggested.

Guidelines/objectives can be interpreted in a vast majority of ways. I'd forget what it says and look at what the curriculum actually is. Unless you're spending a large majority of your time managing inpatient general psychiatry day-to-day, you won't have enough exposure for competence. Part of the curriculum is no doubt being able to have an understanding of primary psychiatric disorders and their treatment, but actually doing that is another story.

By definition, you could say an MS2 course in psychiatry, a 3rd year psychiatry rotation, or even a family practice residency would provide training to "treat primary psychiatric disorders."

As a physician, I'm trained to treat diabetes. I understand how to diagnos it. I understand how to treat it. But longitudinal management of it is something I honestly don't have real experience with, despite it being relatively simple and straight forward in many cases. In reality, I'm not qualified at all outside of simple workup or acute stabilizing management inpatient until I can pass it off to the right person (someone with more experience).

 

[Healthinfo104]

Guidelines/objectives can be interpreted in a vast majority of ways. I'd forget what it says and look at what the curriculum actually is. Unless you're spending a large majority of your time managing inpatient general psychiatry day-to-day, you won't have enough exposure for competence. Part of the curriculum is no doubt being able to have an understanding of primary psychiatric disorders and their treatment, but actually doing that is another story.

By definition, you could say an MS2 course in psychiatry, a 3rd year psychiatry rotation, or even a family practice residency would provide training to "treat primary psychiatric disorders."

As a physician, I'm trained to treat diabetes. I understand how to diagnos it. I understand how to treat it. But longitudinal management of it is something I honestly don't have real experience with, despite it being relatively simple and straight forward in many cases. In reality, I'm not qualified at all outside of simple workup or acute stabilizing management inpatient until I can pass it off to the right person (someone with more experience).

Well the curriculum does have them spend a large amount of time doing rounds on a general and gero psychiatric floor.

But regardless. I understand what you are saying. They might have the basic training and knowledge to handle the bread and butter cases of like anxiety for instance that might present to their office, but with management of something more severe or complex like schizophrenia, then a psychiatrist is definitely needed.