New Pharm School in Southern California :(

Started by SMDoc
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wucool33 said:
Lol how did u even find this sentence out of all the essays in this thread? Can you find everything with ur name mentioned somewhere?
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I love my name. Yes, I spot my name everywhere. 😉
 
Good lord! California Health Sciences University, West Coast University, and American University of Health Sciences just scared the **** out of me.

The ITT techs of pharmacy school that people have been joking about on this forum are REAL. 😱

If ACPE and AACP do not do anything then we're in deep trouble because as people have already pointed out, the NAPLEX is a joke.
 
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eagles22 said:
A C means exactly that you only mastered 70% of the material. You got 70% of the questions right. You knew 70% of the answers. And then you end up remembering even less of it after the class ends. Tell me you know any basic science better now than you did right after taking the course.

I just think you're tainted by your situation (which is very unique) with regards to grades as you are clearly an exception. I couldn't find anything about the PCAT, but it seems that the MCAT (and undergrad GPA) is quite a good predictor of med school success (this is not apples to oranges). http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16186610.

Again, find me someone who says I would prefer the C student to the A student. No one wants the student who is just satisfactory. They want the best. Grades are good predictor of success in treating people since you need knowledge (which is measured by grades) to treat patients. On average, the better performing student will make the better practitioner, and I don't see how you can continue to argue that is a wrong assertion.
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Exactly! Only an idiot would claim if they owned a company and needed to hire 10 people, they would not pick ten of the smartest applicants from the best schools. Of course maybe only 8/10 would pan out and 2 would suck like crap, but try arguing it the other way.

People dont realize that the exceptionally great students who do poorly based on whatever situation but become great in their careers and the super smart nerds who just are good at studying and become the worst workers are FEW and uncommon.

You need to realize that gpa is a pretty good indicator of other things as well, like how well you balance your workload, how well you adapt to differnet classes, how you manage your time, priorities, your effort, etc,etc,etc. Someone with a great gpa shows me they are prob pretty good at those things majority of the time. For all you prepharms that go someone with a 2.0 can be better, it might be true 5% of the time, but for all i care, i will not let anyone with low scores in. I am not going to risk putting out 95 crap pharmacists to find that 5 few exceptions to the rule.
 
The problem is I'm hiring two and don't have the benefit of playing the odds over 10 or 20 hires by picking GPA alone.

That and I'm looking for institutional fit, I'm still not convinced you can distill that down to a few characteristics on an initial screen.

This could be a purely academic discussion though, we had enough applicants with stellar GPA's that would satisfy both fit/personality + academic prowess. We still invited a few with less outstanding GPA's but it's a function of who is out there now.

And I don't care anymore about what academia does and who gets in or not, if schools graduate **** candidates, I'll just have to work harder to screen them out.
 
SMDoc said:
Good lord! California Health Sciences University, West Coast University, and American University of Health Sciences just scared the **** out of me.

The ITT techs of pharmacy school that people have been joking about on this forum are REAL. 😱

If ACPE and AACP do not do anything then we're in deep trouble because as people have already pointed out, the NAPLEX is a joke.
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Everything changed in 2008. Demand < supply in 2010. It has gotten a lot worse in 2012. Just think what is going to happen a year or two from now. Don't expect the ACPE or AACP to do anything. Financially, it benefits them when a new pharmacy school open.
 
^^ I hear the UCSF dean complained that the ACPE doesn't even enforce its own rules and policies
 
confettiflyer said:
Those requirements would apply to old schools as well (example: IPPE)
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Yes, I know. I'm sure the well established schools have the resources to meet the more stringent requirements... But it might deter new schools from opening. If they REALLY wanted to curb new schools from opening, I'm sure they can figure something out...
 
wucool33 said:
Yes, I know. I'm sure the well established schools have the resources to meet the more stringent requirements... But it might deter new schools from opening. If they REALLY wanted to curb new schools from opening, I'm sure they can figure something out...
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No...not that easy. It's actually a pain in the ass sometimes. The curriculum is already packed as it is.

The only way that new schools would "REALLY" be deterred is with a paucity of rotation sites and considering many new, private schools pay sites, they'll manage somehow anyway.
 
wucool33 said:
Yes, I know. I'm sure the well established schools have the resources to meet the more stringent requirements... But it might deter new schools from opening. If they REALLY wanted to curb new schools from opening, I'm sure they can figure something out...
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I cited IPPE as an example of programmatic changes that were not handled well by many established schools of pharmacy.
 
Sparda29 said:
I've noticed the more established schools in the area doing IPPEs by sending students to a site once a week. How the **** is someone gonna learn coming in once a week?
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I've seen the following for all programs:

1) send a student once a week during the school year
2) send a student for one week straight during vacation
3) go tell a student to go find a pharmacy to volunteer in and report back your hours, no effort by the school to place the student.

I don't think IPPE is really for "learning" anything, it's more exposure and familiarity. I don't expect any of my IPPE students to retain much except maybe that ADC's exist, this is what an IV hood looks like, and be kind to your technicians.
 
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confettiflyer said:
I've seen the following for all programs:

1) send a student once a week during the school year
2) send a student for one week straight during vacation
3) go tell a student to go find a pharmacy to volunteer in and report back your hours, no effort by the school to place the student.

I don't think IPPE is really for "learning" anything, it's more exposure and familiarity. I don't expect any of my IPPE students to retain much except maybe that ADC's exist, this is what an IV hood looks like, and be kind to your technicians.
Click to expand...

My school did 4 weeks for us during IPPEs.
 
confettiflyer said:
I cited IPPE as an example of programmatic changes that were not handled well by many established schools of pharmacy.
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The school that I attended for the first two years (established school) had something called EPPE (Early Pharmacy Practice Experience) that was one month after P1 year. With the new requirement for IPPE, they now require a month after P1 and a month after P2. One is community and one is hospital.

The school where I graduated (new school) also has two IPPEs that are 4 or 5 weeks each (one community and one hospital). They are pretty structured learning experiences with syllabi and outcomes and everything.
 
glory4england said:
I was browsing the West Coast University website, got to their tuition section...

21K per SEMESTER, 169K for four years. That's before interest and living expenses. HOLY CRAP 😱😱😱
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plus additional fees, books, registration, health insurance, etc. In addition, tuition is likely to go up every year. With easy access to federal student loan money, I am sure they won't have trouble finding students. Hell, some people borrowed 200+ K just to attend culinary school!
 
Unfortunately, i think that just got pre-candidate status this month; that's why pharmcas is adding them to their application service? I dont know yet until the meeting minutes get release
 
BMBiology said:
Unfortunately, i think that just got pre-candidate status this month; that's why pharmcas is adding them to their application service? I dont know yet until the meeting minutes get release
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All4MyDaughter said:
Not sure. Their web site still says they don't have precandidate.
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They don't have precandidate yet- likely they were approved for a spring semester precandidate site visit by ACPE at their winter meeting this month. (Just speculating; ACPE board minutes often take one month to get posted...but PharmCAS doesn't allow schools to use their service unless they have been approved for a site visit) If they get approved for precandidate at the June summer meeting, they can enroll students in the fall. If they don't get approved at the June meeting, they can't open in the fall.

Applicants would be rolling the dice- schools that fail to get precandidate status at the summer ACPE meeting approval have no immediate recourse. Recently, Midway and St. Joseph's took deposits expecting a summer ACPE precandidate approval, and then had to tell those students 'not this year' when ACPE denied them. St. Joseph eventually opened [but a year late], and Midway, well...not so good.
 
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American University of Health Sciences will not be getting accredited any time soon,

Chapman, however, is going to take off like a rocket.
 
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