newborn work-ups

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WilcoWorld

Senior Member
20+ Year Member
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30 day old kid comes in for "vomiting and not sleeping".

This child dropped his sats on the 1st day of life and spent a week on antibiotics, but never had a fever and cultures were negative. Has been fine for the last 3 weeks, but last night he spit up "a lot of milk" about 30 minutes after a feed (no forceful retching), had a single loose stool, and then wouldn't sleep last night. Today the child is taking PO well, sleeping quietly, and has had a normal bowel movement. Exam is totally normal and the kid is taking PO well in your ED.

What, if any, work-up would you do?
 
was the baby full term or preterm? Did he have to be hospitalized for those antibiotics?
 
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Color of the vomit and color of the stools? Any cyanosis? If green vomit, then upper GI series and eval for malro/volvulus. If stools not white and kid not jaundiced, I'm fine with not doing much. Agree that the kid may end up getting put on zantac/EES, but I don't see this as an ED issue and probably wouldn't shoot films in the ED unless his belly is distended.
 
what about a U/S for pyloric stenosis--doesn't sound like a classic story and it's been a few years since I saw a bunch on my peds surgery month, but I thought they usually present around week 4-6
 
30 day old kid comes in for "vomiting and not sleeping".

This child dropped his sats on the 1st day of life and spent a week on antibiotics, but never had a fever and cultures were negative. Has been fine for the last 3 weeks, but last night he spit up "a lot of milk" about 30 minutes after a feed (no forceful retching), had a single loose stool, and then wouldn't sleep last night. Today the child is taking PO well, sleeping quietly, and has had a normal bowel movement. Exam is totally normal and the kid is taking PO well in your ED.

What, if any, work-up would you do?

Speaking as a parent (and an adult oncologist who has happily ceded nearly all medical decision-making regarding our child to my decidedly non-medical artist spouse), sounds like a crappy night with a GI bug. If we had gone to the ED every time the above happened to us, our (healthy, happy) 3 yo would have spent more time in the hospital than a sickle cell CFer with ALL.

The "work up" should have included a call to the pediatrician's advice nurse and ended there. Bummer that it wound up in your lap.
 
what about a U/S for pyloric stenosis--doesn't sound like a classic story and it's been a few years since I saw a bunch on my peds surgery month, but I thought they usually present around week 4-6

Certainly worth thinking about, and you're right about the time frame, but the story doesn't fit well. Unfortunately the term 'projectile vomiting' has made it into the public vocab, so it seems every kid you see has it. I generally ask if it looks like the Exorcist vomiting. :meanie:
Either way what you generally see is a kid who forcefully vomits pretty close after a feed, then is quite hungry again. It's also usually a baby with poor weight gain and electrolyte abnormalities, though that's only if it's been going on for a while. So I'd ask what this kid's birth weight was, and see what his weight is now. Sometimes, if there's a question, I'll check a BMP (you want a straight stick, not a heel stick), but this single episode of vomiting probably wouldn't make me get an u/s.

Could it be an early presentation of PS? Possibly, so you need to make sure they follow up with their PCP or come back if the vomiting gets worse, more frequent, that sort of thing. Even if you did the u/s now, it wouldn't show up.

If we had gone to the ED every time the above happened to us, our (healthy, happy) 3 yo would have spent more time in the hospital than a sickle cell CFer with ALL.

The "work up" should have included a call to the pediatrician's advice nurse and ended there. Bummer that it wound up in your lap.

:clap: Welcome to my world.

That said, I pretty much never chalk vomiting up to a 'GI bug' in this age group. There are too many other things you have to prove they don't have (malro, obstruction, hirsprung, sepsis, pyelo). Plus, your typical bugs would probably warrant admission for a 30 day old given how quickly they can dehydrate and run into problems.

The most likely explanation is reflux though at least with the available history. Child abuse should always be on the radar too if the kid is irritable/fussy. Cardiac stuff can also cause vomiting, so you'd want to make sure the kid isn't sweating or turning blue during feeds or tiring out during his feeds.

Some people worry about an ALTE (acute life threatening event) and whether this represents an ALTE and if it does, how much you are obligated to do. I hate ALTEs and it's a very subjective call. Usually 'stopped breathing and turned blue' is the phrase I looked for to admit them, but even then I have a hard time believing most of the stories I get (he stopped breathing for 5 full minutes! I was going to start CPR!). If that's the case
you should at least consider a sepsis evaluation, though it's probably overkill.

Anyway, that's probably way more than anyone wanted to hear. I'd be curious if there's more to the story. What did you do, Wilco?
 
Tolerate PO, ensure good follow-up, low threshold for return.

So easy in EM to be caught up in the "it could be...", but once you've considered the entireity of the differential, considered the pretest probability from the history, the change in likelihood based on your assessment, and determined everything to be considered just doesn't have the supporting evidence at this time....you've done what any reasonable physician would do and chance of a bad outcome is low, and can be mitigated with <24 hour follow-up.
 
No fever, no scary spit colors, no workup. 2-3 day followup.
Anticipatory guidance for parents.
Guessing this is child 1 for that family.
 
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30 day old kids don't sleep. That's not a symptom in this age group!

But I have a pretty low threshold for working up neonates. I might do the x-ray, but not expect much. Certainly close follow-up is warranted. Of course, it all assumes the kid looks good, has reliable parents, etc.
 
The emesis "looked like milk", and although the parents described it as vomiting, they denied any forceful contraction of the abdominal muscles. The kid had "greenish brown" stool. No abdominal mass/guarding/enlargement on exam. No hernias. No murmurs. Clear lungs with a good O2 sat and respiratory rate. Pink skin with cap refill < 2 seconds.

The kid took multiple 3 oz feeds between arrival and discharge with no further vomiting, and the parents reported that by their estimation he was back to normal.

I did a UA which was normal aside from trace blood (likely from the catheterization), and which had no growth when I checked today.

So yeah, I considered malro, pyloric stenosis, pyelo, abuse, incarcerated hernia, pneumonia, etc, but there were just no findings.

The problem here is that we get frightened by the age. In some cases this is appropriate. But when a family brings someone in because they perceive something to be wrong, but it's actually a normal finding (like a 30 day old spitting up and not sleeping through the night), many of us feel stuck doing a whole lot of testing that isn't good for anyone. I know that some of my colleagues would lab-up, culture, LP, antibiose and admit this patient, and sometimes I have too. That's why my kids won't be allowed anywhere near an ER until they're 3 months or older.:meanie:
 
I generally have an all-or-nothing approach to the wee ones. In this case, it sounds like a "nothing."

I like the "how much milk are we talking" question. Mom then says "all of it." I ask how many ounces, carefully measure out said amount, and pour it on the floor. Invariably, mom gasps and says "oh no, nothing like that."

Gaining weight, back to normal, nothing bilious, kid "looks good" then no worries, and no workup.

Pyloric stenosis generally builds up slowly. The last case I saw, the kiddo was definitely underweight, and projectile vomited all over the US tech and the US machine. She was a little young and female, but had a classic story AND an olive. (But the kid was only 5 kg)

I have a similar approach to ALTE - convince me that it really happened, and we do the whole nine yards. If the story doesn't fit, then reassure, touch base with peds (when possible) and f/u as outpt.
 
As an until recently general pediatrician, I saw tons of these in my office. I always made a full inquiry about the feeds. Frequently, the kiddo would be taking 6+ ounces in a feed! Of course, they usualy weight about 13 pounds, too.

Other than that, I agree with the benign neglect approach, especially if there is access to follow-up.

Ed
 
I like the "how much milk are we talking" question. Mom then says "all of it." I ask how many ounces, carefully measure out said amount, and pour it on the floor. Invariably, mom gasps and says "oh no, nothing like that."

I like this approach, although I would bet the nurses and housekeeping staff are not so fond of it :laugh:
 
As an until recently general pediatrician, I saw tons of these in my office. I always made a full inquiry about the feeds. Frequently, the kiddo would be taking 6+ ounces in a feed! Of course, they usualy weight about 13 pounds, too.

Other than that, I agree with the benign neglect approach, especially if there is access to follow-up.

Ed

I was always a fan of putting the bottle next to the kid's stomach to illustrate that the laws of physics prevent 8 oz of fluid from staying in a neonate/young infant's stomach. Of course, the vomiting secondary to overfeeding was always treated at home with more feeding.
 
I generally have an all-or-nothing approach to the wee ones. In this case, it sounds like a "nothing."

I like the "how much milk are we talking" question. Mom then says "all of it." I ask how many ounces, carefully measure out said amount, and pour it on the floor. Invariably, mom gasps and says "oh no, nothing like that."

Gaining weight, back to normal, nothing bilious, kid "looks good" then no worries, and no workup.

Pyloric stenosis generally builds up slowly. The last case I saw, the kiddo was definitely underweight, and projectile vomited all over the US tech and the US machine. She was a little young and female, but had a classic story AND an olive. (But the kid was only 5 kg)

I have a similar approach to ALTE - convince me that it really happened, and we do the whole nine yards. If the story doesn't fit, then reassure, touch base with peds (when possible) and f/u as outpt.

Please forgive my ignorance, but what do you mean by the kid had an olive? I assume that is some PE finding, but I know so little I owe knowledge.
 
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(I didn't read all of the above so forgive me if this is repititious)...

...it also matters if this is a 15 year old mothers first child, versus a 34 year old with 5 other kids who state "this has never happened before with my other children"...

A mother with previous child rearing experience should be taken very seriously if she notes "something is wrong".