Nights vs Days

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Backpack234

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I've got the opportunity to work 100% day shift in my shop. 12 hour shifts so swapping between 7am and 7pm start times has messed with me a bit. I noticed that the day after a string of nights is pretty much a lost day and my family would definitely prefer if I was on a regular schedule. However, nights are nights. There's usually 2-4 hours in a night shift where not much is going on whereas on days it picks up to 3-4 per hour in the last few hours of your shifts.

Feels like:
Days = Harder work, easier non-work life
Nights = Easier work, harder non-work life

Which would you choose?
 
Pretty much the same control I have now and equal with everyone else in the group. Randomized on a computerized shift scheduler (like shiftadmin) with day off preferences, days in a row preferences, etc. I would just be all days or all nights.
 
Backpack234 said:
I've got the opportunity to work 100% day shift in my shop. 12 hour shifts so swapping between 7am and 7pm start times has messed with me a bit. I noticed that the day after a string of nights is pretty much a lost day and my family would definitely prefer if I was on a regular schedule. However, nights are nights. There's usually 2-4 hours in a night shift where not much is going on whereas on days it picks up to 3-4 per hour in the last few hours of your shifts.

Feels like:
Days = Harder work, easier non-work life
Nights = Easier work, harder non-work life

Which would you choose?
Click to expand...
Days. The added work of a day shift at my shop in no way compares to the damage that working a night shift does to every other part of my life
 
Nights. But I'm a weirdo when it comes to this. I switched to days for a few months and its nearly killed me. I literally can't cope with how loud and chaotic the ED is around me, it kills my attention span which was minimal to begin with. I get a headache every shift, and feel so much more tired. Never, ever, ever again will I switch from night shifts. I only have a few more days left to go before I get back to my all night schedule and I'm counting down the days.
 
gamerEMdoc said:
Nights. But I'm a weirdo when it comes to this. I switched to days for a few months and its nearly killed me. I literally can't cope with how loud and chaotic the ED is around me, it kills my attention span which was minimal to begin with. I get a headache every shift, and feel so much more tired. Never, ever, ever again will I switch from night shifts. I only have a few more days left to go before I get back to my all night schedule and I'm counting down the days.
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This. Even if department is somewhat busy at night... It's just quieter.
 
GonnaBeADoc2222 said:
This. Even if department is somewhat busy at night... It's just quieter.
Click to expand...

I wish it were quieter at my shop during the night. Unfortunately, EVS insists on driving around some zomboni type machine that cleans the floors. The thing is so noisy I can hardly hear myself think and they do it every single night. Ugh!
 
Backpack234 said:
I've got the opportunity to work 100% day shift in my shop. 12 hour shifts so swapping between 7am and 7pm start times has messed with me a bit. I noticed that the day after a string of nights is pretty much a lost day and my family would definitely prefer if I was on a regular schedule. However, nights are nights. There's usually 2-4 hours in a night shift where not much is going on whereas on days it picks up to 3-4 per hour in the last few hours of your shifts.

Feels like:
Days = Harder work, easier non-work life
Nights = Easier work, harder non-work life

Which would you choose?
Click to expand...

Is this really a question? You would probably have to triple my pay to get me to work all nights. If you have the option to get rid of your nights I would accept it quickly before that option disappears.
 
Yeah, I would jump at all days.
I think it is better for non-work life, mental health, and long-term physical health.
Also, review the many threads on this forum that have posters dreaming of all days.
You have that chance!
Live the dream!
HH
 
Seriously is this even a question unless there is a huge pay differential? All days for the win.
 
Days all day considering your personal circumstances. However, I second everyone who likes nights for the quietness and slower pace. The night docs at my shop get a differential AND preferential schedule so it’s a pretty good deal by me. If you get just one of those I think it’s a wash and if none then clearly the days have it.
 
Backpack234 said:
I've got the opportunity to work 100% day shift in my shop. 12 hour shifts so swapping between 7am and 7pm start times has messed with me a bit. I noticed that the day after a string of nights is pretty much a lost day and my family would definitely prefer if I was on a regular schedule. However, nights are nights. There's usually 2-4 hours in a night shift where not much is going on whereas on days it picks up to 3-4 per hour in the last few hours of your shifts.

Feels like:
Days = Harder work, easier non-work life
Nights = Easier work, harder non-work life

Which would you choose?
Click to expand...
Days, because one's "non-work life" is more important than their work life. Furthermore, nights will cause severe fatigue to bleed into every waking moment of one's "non-work life." Being on days will not. If I could have been assured a days-only job for the rest of my career, I never would have left the day to day practice of general EM.
 
Agree with everyone else that I'd definitely take days unless there's a fat night differential (enough to substantially reduce your total hours).

My main site has an interesting phenomenon--nights are usually busier than days. This is cause we go down to single coverage from 2-6 am without as large a drop in patient volume (we probably avg 2-2.5 pph during the day and 2.5 to 3.5 pph at night). This occasionally leads to some absolutely hellish shifts. Anyone else experience anything similar?
 
Nights made a lot more sense to me before having kids. I was a nocturnist for 5 years. Wife also in medicine, also works many nights. We had a great run doing nights together before kiddos arrived. More control of our schedules, better pay, fun work environment. Lots of free time together outside of work.

Working nights with kids at home made me feel tired in a whole new way (and aged me a few years). Planning to exit the nocturnist life here shortly and looking very forward to it. To the OP, go days. Unless you have a spouse who also has similar scheduling, it's not worth it in my mind no matter the financial or work benefits. You will always want to be on friends'/family schedules during off days. Switching circadian rhythm weekly gets so very old...
 
Thanks for the replies everyone. I guess a bit more information:
Right now, I can get 3-4 hours of downtime on a night shift. 0 hours of down time on a day shift.
Also, my SO will be starting 7 on 7 off with only 2 weeks of nights per year so I would be off schedule with her every night shift.
I also really drag ass post-nights and it's not so much fun watching netflix until 3am trying to get back on a day schedule.

I figured making a choice between all days and all nights would be beneficial to prevent the health risks (and the drag ass day) while I can and I'm grateful to be at a shop where that can happen. I definitely come home more stressed out after a day shift compared to a night shift where I catch up on narcos, but it sounds like that stress is worth it compared to the alternative.
 
Backpack234 said:
Thanks for the replies everyone. I guess a bit more information:
Right now, I can get 3-4 hours of downtime on a night shift. 0 hours of down time on a day shift.
Also, my SO will be starting 7 on 7 off with only 2 weeks of nights per year so I would be off schedule with her every night shift.
I also really drag ass post-nights and it's not so much fun watching netflix until 3am trying to get back on a day schedule.

I figured making a choice between all days and all nights would be beneficial to prevent the health risks (and the drag ass day) while I can and I'm grateful to be at a shop where that can happen. I definitely come home more stressed out after a day shift compared to a night shift where I catch up on narcos, but it sounds like that stress is worth it compared to the alternative.
Click to expand...
You can go to bed at a normal time flipping back to days. Just follow the standard sleep hygiene tips. Make sure you don't sleep all day your flip back day. Get some kind of exercise no more than 2-3 hours before bed. Maybe take 15-20 mg melatonin.
 
turkeyjerky said:
Agree with everyone else that I'd definitely take days unless there's a fat night differential (enough to substantially reduce your total hours).

My main site has an interesting phenomenon--nights are usually busier than days. This is cause we go down to single coverage from 2-6 am without as large a drop in patient volume (we probably avg 2-2.5 pph during the day and 2.5 to 3.5 pph at night). This occasionally leads to some absolutely hellish shifts. Anyone else experience anything similar?
Click to expand...

This!!

My nights at one ER I worked at sucked because it was single provider from 1-630a and they kept coming. You had an NP/PA with you but they only saw level 3,4,5 and had to tell you about all their patients so they actually didn’t help much. People would say, “nights tend to be slower”, and I’d look at them like “uh...where?”.
For a normal volume ER ~60000k volume, nights are not really slower because you’re the only provider and have to basically clean up the ER if the 7p doc isn’t feeling like picking up the slack.
 
How many nights per month do people end up working when you don’t have dedicated nocturnists?
 
3-4 of my 14-15 shifts are night shifts. As TMR stated, it’s the percentage of the scheduled shifts that nights make up. For me that’s between 25% and 33%
 
Hercules said:
3-4 of my 14-15 shifts are night shifts. As TMR stated, it’s the percentage of the scheduled shifts that nights make up. For me that’s between 25% and 33%
Click to expand...

Does that end up getting pretty exhausting? 3-4 shifts a month doesn’t SOUND too bad but what does it end up feeling like in real life?
 
kumatie said:
I did all nights for 2 years, mostly for the money to pay off loans. I got to pick my own schedule and life was great...for about 8months-1year

After About 8 months. I started noticing changes. It’s hard to explain but I felt like I was hung over, but all the time. Almost like I was on some sort of drug that made me chronically mentally not present. My attention span was ****, I started to get terrible panic attacks for no f’n reason. I had no emotion Reservoir.
I was scared out of my mind, I didn’t know if I was depressed, burned out, or what. I saw my doc and had a million dollar work up, every lab you can think of, CT, MRI’s, you name it. I was hypertensive, diabetic, and having episode of atrial fibrillation multiple times a week. Keep in mind I was 30 years old and ran and lifted weights 3 times/week. With no previous medical problems.
He thought I was depressed and started me on a Ssri. I didn’t necessarily agree with that because nothing else was wrong with my life, I loved my job and my family life was perfect, and no history of depression, anxiety, etc.

I stopped doing nights and 2 months later, all those the problems previously listed above vanished. I am 100 percent convince all of this was caused by working nights.

That was 7 years ago. I have been absolutely fine since then and continue to enjoy a career in EM.

Doing nights is bioligical and mental hell...for some. Some people can do it just fine..even thrive in it, others, like me absolutely can’t.

My advice, don’t take working all nights lightly, if you wanna try, go ahead. Just be careful.
Click to expand...

Just an M2 stumbling in to the thread (at ~4am) to vent that this is what day shift does to me. Being forced into a daytime schedule for medical school has been a biological and mental hell, as you so nicely stated.

Yes yes I am just a student but I am 33 and was a nocturnal correctional officer and then a nocturnal registered nurse before medical school. Even further back then that, I dropped out of high school because it was too early in the morning (my parents would force me out of bed eventually, so I would grab 2 towels and go to the bathroom. I would turn on the shower like I was getting ready, then lay one towel out and roll one up like a pillow and go back to sleep). Yes I know that sounds insane, but it’s just how I’m wired. I also know zero people here care but this is something I just feel so strongly about I had to share.

TLDR: there are people like me who feel like dayshift is hell on earth the way the majority feel about nightshift.
 
sunshinefl said:
Just an M2 stumbling in to the thread (at ~4am) to vent that this is what day shift does to me. Being forced into a daytime schedule for medical school has been a biological and mental hell, as you so nicely stated.

Yes yes I am just a student but I am 33 and was a nocturnal correctional officer and then a nocturnal registered nurse before medical school. Even further back then that, I dropped out of high school because it was too early in the morning (my parents would force me out of bed eventually, so I would grab 2 towels and go to the bathroom. I would turn on the shower like I was getting ready, then lay one towel out and roll one up like a pillow and go back to sleep). Yes I know that sounds insane, but it’s just how I’m wired. I also know zero people here care but this is something I just feel so strongly about I had to share.

TLDR: there are people like me who feel like dayshift is hell on earth the way the majority feel about nightshift.
Click to expand...

"When are you willing to sign a contract?"...every ED medical director
 
I work nights - but do it 10 hour shifts 7 on 7 off (RPh in ED) - plus 320 hours vacation in addition to about 25% shift dif. - it is a sweet gig I actually only work 21 weeks a year - I walk into the hospital 70 less days and 390 less hours a year than my day shift counterparts - far more money, more time with family, and more time to travel, and less BS of dealing with mgmt. I love it - some people gate it - just depends how well you can sleep
 
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I just got up at the crack of dawn for the early morning shift. I hate it. I’d much rather trade days for exclusive nights or swing shifts. There’s a certain joy to sleeping in. Waking up at 5:00 AM just triggers PTSD from all the ICU rotations in residency. Either way, I think there’s something to be said for having a regular schedule. We have two nocturnists and I do about one night shift a month. It’s single coverage and as a new grad, it’s terrifying.
 
scummie said:
Either way, I think there’s something to be said for having a regular schedule. We have two nocturnists and I do about one night shift a month. I
Click to expand...
from my experience having a regular schedule is the deal maker - I don't necessarily care when I work, but bouncing back and forth kills my body
 
Some of our night docs pick their nights. Sun, Mon, Tue. They get paid more. Have a predictable schedule. They don't have to attend our meetings. I would consider it if I didn't have to drive far.
 
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