No Support or Motivation

[milk95]

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Hello! I think I'm a nontraditional student; maybe I'm not, I don't know.

So I transferred to a four year school in August after completing an early college high school type of program where I received a diploma and associate's degree in art (don't ask). My gpa currently after transferring is a whooping 2.52, and I have no idea how to bring it up whatsoever. I'm awful at chemistry and math, retaking precalc 1 now and currently one point away from a C in gen chem II lecture, and it makes me wonder how I'll even survive the upper level courses and o-chem next semester.

But what sucks the most is how I don't really have support here. My friends make jokes about me becoming a physician, because I tend to get distracted easily and I'm clumsy and my grades aren't stellar and I still have to count on my fingers. My chemistry tutor doubts my chances of getting into med school and I'm pretty certain my advisor does too. It's like I want to keep trying, but I'm starting to doubt myself too and I'm losing motivation the more I study and try. Does anyone have any advice? Any harsh words to kick myself in gear and do better?

 

[Ad2b]

The will to do better comes from within, not us.

That said, no matter you choose to do, get a handle on the distractibility.

 

[Eccesignum]

Coming from an arts background isn't a handicap (I came from theatre originally). But you sound like you may have a lot of other things going on right now.

If it's going to take "harsh words" to push you into medicine then perhaps the problem is that medicine isn't right for you at this time in your life. Not everyone goes straight from college to medical school -- obviously, look at everyone in this particular forum. Perhaps what you need to do right now is back off the science, finish college with things that interest you right now and maintain a good GPA (which will be critical later), then revisit medicine after a few years doing something you actually enjoy. You might find in a few years that you still want to be a physician, in which case re-evaluate your ability to focus and what deficiencies you have. Or you may decide at that future point that medicine wasn't what you wanted at all, and that was what was causing the motivation problems.

 

[milk95]

I don't know how to quote things, since I just made this account last week and I'm still new with the controls. So hopefully me replying like this is fine.

The thing is is that I enjoy science - not chemistry or anything related to plants or animals, but I have taken an interest in neuroscience and neurological disorders, etc. Unfortunately, my school doesn't offer classes related to what I'm interested in, so I'm pretty much stuck taking classes I'm not too keen on and I research the, for a lack of a better word, 'stuff' I enjoy in my free time. Maybe I just need to broaden my horizons and find more topics I'm interested in, or else these next 4+ years won't be pretty. I can't imagine pursuing anything other than medicine.

Thank you both for your advice! It's always nice/helpful to hear other people's opinions.

 

[H2Oman]

Hello! I think I'm a nontraditional student; maybe I'm not, I don't know.

My chemistry tutor doubts my chances of getting into med school and I'm pretty certain my advisor does too. It's like I want to keep trying, but I'm starting to doubt myself too and I'm losing motivation the more I study and try. Does anyone have any advice? Any harsh words to kick myself in gear and do better?

The question you need to be asking is why do your tutor and adviser doubt your chance of getting in? Is it scholastic ability/aptitude or is it diligence, discipline, and perseverance? I was denied entrance from high school into a large state school where I often heard people joke that all you needed was a pulse to get in. I wrote a petition for entrance and was accepted only to drop out after 2 years of ditching class. 10 years later I'm in school again acing classes I found insurmountable before.

My poor grades earlier in life weren't because I was dumb or incapable. They were a mixture of apathy, not understanding that hard work is how good grades are achieved, and a complete lack of social support structure. To that last point, I didn't know it at the time, but I had miserable, abusive people around me and didn't realize how intelligent or capable I was/am. There's people being real with you about your limits and there's people who are dinguses. Don't confuse the two.

 

[Goro]

Get new friends, for one.

You'll find some very altruistic people here for advice and support.

 

[DrMikeP]

Sounds like there might be some esteem and self doubt issues. You should consider speaking with a counselor or even better Psychologist and figure out what the motivation/learning issue is that is holding you back. It might be immaturity, a learning issue, or maybe you might be well suited for a career as a pt care tech. Only you and likely with the help of a pro can figure that out. There may even be something that can be fixed that will help you. Then, you will have your med school answer. A small investment in yourself can make for a much easier future.

Best of luck

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[QofQuimica]

Goro's answer is a little glib, but all kidding aside, it's totally fair to ask yourself what you have in common with these so-called friends of yours.

And the first thing you need is an attitude adjustment. I mean, no one bursts out of the womb understanding chemistry and math. You have to work at it. I went from failing my first freshman physics exam to earning a PhD in chemistry, including straight As in a yearlong sequence of physical chemistry. Did I suddenly get smarter or learn all that stuff by wishing? Of course not. The ability to learn math and physics and chemistry was there all along. I just had to change my study methods, put in more effort, and have enough courage to get up and try again.

In general, anything that is worth doing in life is going to be something that requires you to work hard at it. That includes medical school. You honestly don't need to be a genius to get into or through medical school. The material is learnable even by someone with a dead average IQ. But you do need to be willing to work very hard. If you are willing to do that, then I suggest you start by talking to people who have accomplished the goals you want to accomplish. Find the kid who's making straight As in your chem class, and ask them what they do to study. Go to your prof's office hours and ask for help.

Second, you should commit yourself to studying chemistry and math for at least an hour EACH, every single day, and not including class time. Physical sciences and math can only be learned by doing a lot of problems, so start doing extra problems. Also, go online and watch math and chemistry videos from sites like MITOpenCourseware or Khan Academy. Get a second textbook to use for cross-reference (and for more practice problems); sometimes different authors can explain topics in another way that makes more sense to you.

Third, if your advisor doesn't support you, then change advisors. If your friends don't support you, then drop them. Life is tough enough even under the best of circumstances. Don't make it even tougher by surrounding yourself with people who stab your back instead of having your back.

 

[Ad2b]

The material is learnable even by someone with a dead average IQ. But you do need to be willing to work very hard.

you gave me hope 🙂 thank you!

 

[QofQuimica]

you gave me hope 🙂 thank you!

I would argue that many people, including many doctors, greatly overestimate how brilliant the average doctor is.

 

[Citron]

I don't know how to quote things, since I just made this account last week and I'm still new with the controls. So hopefully me replying like this is fine.

The thing is is that I enjoy science - not chemistry or anything related to plants or animals, but I have taken an interest in neuroscience and neurological disorders, etc. Unfortunately, my school doesn't offer classes related to what I'm interested in, so I'm pretty much stuck taking classes I'm not too keen on and I research the, for a lack of a better word, 'stuff' I enjoy in my free time. Maybe I just need to broaden my horizons and find more topics I'm interested in, or else these next 4+ years won't be pretty. I can't imagine pursuing anything other than medicine.

Thank you both for your advice! It's always nice/helpful to hear other people's opinions.

When I read your message above, I think I need to respectfully disagree with you. Working hard in classes you don't like is part of being an adult. Being an adult, being a doc, you need to have work ethics and being able to handle things that need to be done. Ask premeds here on SDN, how many of them didn't like Calculus or anything math-related but still managed to get A? When you do clinical volunteer, when you go to med schools, when you do clinical years, often you will have to do things you don't find interesting or relevant, but it's a part of the deal. The best way to handle is find at least one thing you can learn from such endeavors.
Someone here on SDN once said that "Med schools are not Make-a-Wish foundation", and I agree. Not every one who wants to get in can get in, so do your best academically, yet be realistic enough to think of back-up plans. Even the best surgeons walk into an OR with plan A and B/C/D, etc.

Also, don't blame the school's curriculum because when you applied to colleges, you should have been able to do your due diligence by looking at the course catalog/degree requirements online to see what they had to offer. There's also ratemyprofessor.com to read reviews about professors and tips to get As. As the last resort, I'd recommend that you take a semester off or maybe transfer to a different college that is a better fit.
Friends or so called friends who laugh at you for telling them your passion, they're not true friends. You may need to socialize outside of school, e.g. volunteer at a soup kitchen or hospice, you'll meet altruistic people who are like minded and don't judge you if you don't appear to fit the typical mold of a future doc...

This is too long I guess. Bottom line, you need 2 things: 1) Time management: allocate more time for classes you struggle in while still leaving some to learn things you're passionate about, because that'd keep you going, 2) Surround yourself with the right people.

 

[DrMikeP]

When I read your message above, I think I need to respectfully disagree with you. Working hard in classes you don't like is part of being an adult. Being an adult, being a doc, you need to have work ethics and being able to handle things that need to be done. Ask premeds here on SDN, how many of them didn't like Calculus or anything math-related but still managed to get A? When you do clinical volunteer, when you go to med schools, when you do clinical years, often you will have to do things you don't find interesting or relevant, but it's a part of the deal. The best way to handle is find at least one thing you can learn from such endeavors.
Someone here on SDN once said that "Med schools are not Make-a-Wish foundation", and I agree. Not every one who wants to get in can get in, so do your best academically, yet be realistic enough to think of back-up plans. Even the best surgeons walk into an OR with plan A and B/C/D, etc.

Also, don't blame the school's curriculum because when you applied to colleges, you should have been able to do your due diligence by looking at the course catalog/degree requirements online to see what they had to offer. There's also ratemyprofessor.com to read reviews about professors and tips to get As. As the last resort, I'd recommend that you take a semester off or maybe transfer to a different college that is a better fit.
Friends or so called friends who laugh at you for telling them your passion, they're not true friends. You may need to socialize outside of school, e.g. volunteer at a soup kitchen or hospice, you'll meet altruistic people who are like minded and don't judge you if you don't appear to fit the typical mold of a future doc...

This is too long I guess. Bottom line, you need 2 things: 1) Time management: allocate more time for classes you struggle in while still leaving some to learn things you're passionate about, because that'd keep you going, 2) Surround yourself with the right people.

I agree, when I was in my late teens and very early 20s I made As in classes I liked because I put in the effort. I thought if I didn't like it that it sucked and I didn't care or want to put the time in. That gave me some bad grades early in college. I lacked the maturity to see the bigger picture.

When I returned in my 30s I gave up the idea of blaming it on not liking something and put the same effort into everything.. That earned me a 3.98 GPA through a bachelor's, masters, and doctorate and got me As in some of the most boring classes in the world, which set me up for med school..

In med life there will be a ton of uninteresting things you must learn and deal with... Like HIPAA, insurance billing, network paperwork, cpt codes, hchaps, credentials, 100 repeated lessons in blood borne pathogens, etc all as boring as reading a dictionary from cover to cover but all part of being a doctor.

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[milk95]

Working hard in classes you don't like is part of being an adult. Being an adult, being a doc, you need to have work ethics and being able to handle things that need to be done.

I agree, when I was in my late teens and very early 20s I made As in classes I liked because I put in the effort. I thought if I didn't like it that it sucked and I didn't care or want to put the time in. That gave me some bad grades early in college. I lacked the maturity to see the bigger picture.

That's really true. I'm still pretty immature in that sense, since I tend to slack off a little more in terms of studying for topics I'm not interested in. I also tend to prioritize courses, which I'm sure isn't too fantastic of a thing to do. Like I study more for chemistry versus pre-calc, etc. I spent most of high school and the years at my community college not exactly studying (except for A&P), so I'm still trying to learn how to study effectively too so I'll remember and apply concepts I've learned and shove them in my long-term memory. Hopefully, I'll get a grasp on this sooner than later - I can't afford to keep making C's on everything. That's also affecting my motivation, considering I do try my best but I continue making low grades. I just need to continue researching study skills and see what works.

Thank you all for your advice and words of wisdom c: I really needed this, especially as the semester is coming to an end.

 

[Astharia]

OP, I'm sorry this is happening to you. I can relate to that feeling; in high school I dated a mentally abusive guy who destroyed my self-confidence, and others' perspective of me as well. I told my new (Couple years later) husband about wanting to be a physician a few times and immediately pushed the idea aside myself. A few years later and a couple of kids later I still wanted to do it, so when my husband got out of the military and finished his degree I went back to school. It took me years to get over that low self-esteem feeling, and a lot of therapy between me and my husband (our communication is amazing). My parents had even tried very hard to steer me away from that path, and still tried even after my first successful year back at my CC. I ended up getting my AA from a CC with a 3.64 GPA before going to my four-year university. I graduate next fall, and although there was an adjustment period when I got to the harder science courses, I figured it out and have done well, although my GPA will be kind of low compared to others because I do have 3 kids at home. As far as your weaknesses of math and chemistry... I would take Qs advice to heart 100%. You don't have to be amazing at those to be a great doctor, hell I wouldn't even expect you to have to be good at them, but to understand the basics enough to do your job. But for the most part, you just need to prove that you can work hard enough to get a good grade, whether you learn the material or not. My subject that'd be similar to your vices would be physics. I struggled in Physics I very hard... I did terrible on exams, 30%-40% consistently, and terrible on homework. I just didn't understand the material, even though I was great at math, physics had me at a loss. THIS semester I'm in Physics II and my first exam was a 30%... I thought it was going to be physics I all over again. And then I changed my strategy and have gotten an 88% and 93% on my last exams, with hopefully an A in the class after some extra credit and good lab scores. My point is, try different study techniques and find people to help you... I know I've spent more time in the physics help the week of the exam than I have at home with my kids. Let me know if there's anything else I can do to help, or just message me if you need to vent or talk... good luck to you.

 

[Astharia]

Hopefully, I'll get a grasp on this sooner than later - I can't afford to keep making C's on everything. That's also affecting my motivation, considering I do try my best but I continue making low grades. I just need to continue researching study skills and see what works.

Also, I'd like to point something out; something that took me 3 years of college and 1 year of actual harder (CC was cake with basically no science classes) college to figure out... Make sure you pay attention to your time and studying, and in-class activities. I've opted to take a lot of teaching type ECs and one thing that I always tell the students (and try very hard to make sure of myself) is to put the electronic devices away while studying. All of them. Don't take notes on your laptop, you'll pop open a new browsing window when they cover a topic you already know, or if the professor goes on a tangent about her kids. I also found myself opening my phone and scrolling when I didn't understand the topic in class. I often told myself "I'll study it later" and it never came or I didn't understand it later by just study/reading. It's very easy to do; be mindful and make a rule for yourself to follow. I started to find myself ACCIDENTALLY paying attention if I dozed off or got bored and wanted to check my devices. Studying habits are important too, as a non trad I studied with some younger students once in a while and they always brought their phone out in the middle of studying to do other stuff, and then realizing that 2 hours passed and they only got about 40 minutes of studying in. This habit actually didn't affect me since when I study... I study with a 5 minute break every hour or so, but it bothered me greatly when I was studying with other people so I assume that most people in college have this problem as well.

 

[milk95]

I often told myself "I'll study it later" and it never came or I didn't understand it later by just study/reading. It's very easy to do; be mindful and make a rule for yourself to follow.

I've found that I do that so much, as well as the whole scrolling on phone deal. It's like I can't focus for more than three seconds on a particular topic, which, obviously, renders my ability to obtain the information and remember it. I'll definitely start by putting all of my devices away when studying; I have a Chrome app that blocks websites, but I'll end up playing pinball or something. So going cold turkey would be best and putting everything away would be best.

 

[DrMikeP]

I've found that I do that so much, as well as the whole scrolling on phone deal. It's like I can't focus for more than three seconds on a particular topic, which, obviously, renders my ability to obtain the information and remember it. I'll definitely start by putting all of my devices away when studying; I have a Chrome app that blocks websites, but I'll end up playing pinball or something. So going cold turkey would be best and putting everything away would be best.

You might consider seeing a psychologist to evaluate if there is an issue. If there isn't then he/she could help you learn strategies to improve studying and concentration.

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