Non-retail pharmacy manager pros/cons?

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lymmys

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Hi SDN members,
I have a couple opportunities to apply for manager position in oncology infusion center and rehabilitation hospital. I couldn't find the thread but sometime ago there were a few experienced SDN members discussed the pros and cons of being a manager. I've worked in inpatient and outpatient settings so I fully understand politics play an important role being in management positions. Besides playing politics, I would love to hear from veterans what do you think about being in mid-senior position? I would also appreciate if you can share any experience working at rehabilitation hospital, it's a setting that I'm not familiar with.
Thank you in advance for your time.

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Hi SDN members,
I have a couple opportunities to apply for manager position in oncology infusion center and rehabilitation hospital. I couldn't find the thread but sometime ago there were a few experienced SDN members discussed the pros and cons of being a manager. I've worked in inpatient and outpatient settings so I fully understand politics play an important role being in management positions. Besides playing politics, I would love to hear from veterans what do you think about being in mid-senior position? I would also appreciate if you can share any experience working at rehabilitation hospital, it's a setting that I'm not familiar with.
Thank you in advance for your time.

If you take it, just remember you are a multiplier of your team. Your job is to bring out the genius in others, and elevate their game.

Pros:
-Likely easier work/less stress at a rehab hospital than an acute hospital

Cons:
-Oncology infusion center -> Hazardous drug compounding. USP 800 is a nightmare...if they don't already have a good program or designated person for USP 800 compliance leading the program then it will be some work to get that up to regulatory compliance.
 
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@PharmDBro2017 Thank you so much for your input. What is your take on being in management position vs. staff pharmacist in general? I'm in my late 30s and always feel like I want to experience all at least once. I think some of the veterans have talked about after years being in both staff ("easy" position for lack of a better term) and management position, they would pick "easy" or "boring" one any day. The infusion center is a non-profit and the rehab is for profit. Although nothing is guaranteed, I'm 3.5 years away from applying for the PSLF staying with the non profit organization. Am I silly to even consider counting on the potential PSLF staying with a non profit place?
 
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@PharmDBro2017 Thank you so much for your input. What is your take on being in management position vs. staff pharmacist in general? I'm in my late 30s and always feel like I want to experience all at least once. I think some of the veterans have talked about after years being in both staff ("easy" position for lack of a better term) and management position, they would pick "easy" or "boring" one any day. The infusion center is a non-profit and the rehab is for profit. Although nothing is guaranteed, I'm 3.5 years away from applying for the PSLF staying with the non profit organization. Am I silly to even consider counting on the potential PSLF staying with a non profit place?

Not silly at all; I'd encourage you to pursue PSLF if you are eligible. I'm a similar age to you and I don't like being normal or doing what others find to be the norm. I'd hate myself if I took the "easy" position and coasted for 30 years into retirement. I'd rather take a challenge, learn new skill sets and continue personal growth, learn how to be a leader and manage people, etc. You never know where that will lead you - maybe you'll be offered a COO position one day or move into a CEO role and have an opportunity to 2x-3x+ your pharmd salary.
 
Just make sure your MLI policy is up to date in addition to your PLI.
Are there specific items you would suggest to look into in both?


Not silly at all; I'd encourage you to pursue PSLF if you are eligible. I'm a similar age to you and I don't like being normal or doing what others find to be the norm. I'd hate myself if I took the "easy" position and coasted for 30 years into retirement. I'd rather take a challenge, learn new skill sets and continue personal growth, learn how to be a leader and manage people, etc. You never know where that will lead you - maybe you'll be offered a COO position one day or move into a CEO role and have an opportunity to 2x-3x+ your pharmd salary.

I think I'm going to go for it, I would hate to have the "what if..." conversation with myself 10-20 years from now. The unstable economy concerns me a bit when I think about changing job. But again, nothing is guaranteed... How is your management/leadership journey so far? Any regrets or major challenges?

What would you choose:
Job 1
- Non-profit oncology infusion center
- 3 years away from applying for potential PSLF

Job 2
- For profit small rehab hospital
- Pay 30-40K more than Job 1

Both places open M-F 8-5
 
I would stay with the non-profit employer for another 3.5 years. Do you have any kid?
I have a 3YO. I didn’t know if it’s worth it considering the PSLF is so shaky and counting on the government just doesn’t seem like a sound plan
 
200k, I'd say 100% to commit to the PSLF job. If you are keeping up with your documentation and the requirements, PSLF is not shaky in the least.
 
MOHELA just updated today so officially I have 2.5 years and not 3.5 years left. Now there's more incentive to stay with non-profit seems like
 
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I have a 3YO. I didn’t know if it’s worth it considering the PSLF is so shaky and counting on the government just doesn’t seem like a sound plan
I think the PSLF will not go away in the near future (especially when the economy is not good). A true leader will likely work more than 40hr/week. I would remain as staff RPh and spend more time with my toddler. Leadership opportunities will always be there but your kid only grow up once.
 
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I think the PSLF will not go away in the near future (especially when the economy is not good). A true leader will likely work more than 40hr/week. I would remain as staff RPh and spend more time with my toddler. Leadership opportunities will always be there but your kid only grow up once.
A True leader will work more than 40hr/week. WTH?lol
 
My advice, now in the pharmacy biz for 37+ years. Started out with Home Infusion, quickly moved up to pharmacy manager, regional Director of Pharmacy Operations (in my late 20's). A great deal of responsibility, staffing, P & L budgeting, endless meetings. Always in conflict with Nursing and DME/Resp. Directors. Funny/sad how I was the only "director" who had to staff in his department. The others would only sit behind a desk. I had staff pharmacist who made more than me with OT, and on-call pay! Highly recommend management, until I don't! Agreed with corporate to step down and just staff. That didn't last long, the new director was real paranoid of my hanging around.
PIC and pharmacy manager at an Oncology Infusion Center. 5am-1pm, Monday-Friday, no weekends or holidays. Worked for a large Oncology Practice. Managed my patients at home and at the hospital. A great deal of autonomy and job satisfaction with the ability to direct patient care and have the doctors back me up with orders and therapy goals. The best job I have ever had, and I have had 9. You still have to deal with nursing, always seem to be on opposing sides.
To summarize:
Financially, never enough of a bump from staffing, to be worthwhile.
Middle management; you get squeezed from the top down, and from the bottom up.
As a career Pharmacist, you are expected to move up, into management at some point.
Your primary goals are conflict resolution, endless meetings, and accreditation readiness. Oh yes, patient care, down at the very bottom.
A whole lot of uncompensated stress and OT.
Very little actual power to affect any change.
Ongoing responsibility, beyond "office hours". Anytime, nights, weekends, even if infusion center is open M-F.

Let me guess, the "Rehab. Hospital" is Encompass Rehab Hospital, with 140 locations? I work there, Part-time. I always tell my pharmacy manager, and the staff pharmacist (both from Walmart), it's so cute that you call yourself a "Hospital". I am their only resource for clinical hospital information. That is a sweet management job, if you get it.

Bottom line: After a few management stints, I have stayed in my lane as a "staff pharmacist" for the past 20 years. Managed to make a very good income, working OT, and second jobs. Thinking, one should be able to do that until retirement, if one works hard and does a good job.
WRONG, you actually age out of "staffing". I was "let go" of my last hospital job, because I was old, making too much money (after 7 years of great performance reviews. Two older pharmacists were pushed out before me. I did Covid/travel Pharmacist for a couple of years. I was actively looking for a hospital staff job for those two years. It was exceedingly difficult, even with a five page resume, and 35 years experience.
I was competing with new grads, willing to take half of my hourly pay. Very lucky to land a staffing job with a major hospital system, willing to pay for my experience.
 
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Hello. Oncology rph checking in here who just got all loans discharged through PSLF ($300k).

Go for the infusion center job. I’m also biased, but financially that’s your best bet. USP 800 is a pain and if the existing program sucks, it’s gonna be a lot of work, but it’s rewarding. Also is it a 340b site and will you have compliance responsibilities? Another PITA.

It’s work, but it’s not pointless work, you’ll love the job and you’ll love your patients. Probably a big reason why so enjoy the work. Goodluck!
 
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My advice, now in the pharmacy biz for 37+ years. Started out with Home Infusion, quickly moved up to pharmacy manager, regional Director of Pharmacy Operations (in my late 20's). A great deal of responsibility, staffing, P & L budgeting, endless meetings. Always in conflict with Nursing and DME/Resp. Directors. Funny/sad how I was the only "director" who had to staff in his department. The others would only sit behind a desk. I had staff pharmacist who made more than me with OT, and on-call pay! Highly recommend management, until I don't! Agreed with corporate to step down and just staff. That didn't last long, the new director was real paranoid of my hanging around.
PIC and pharmacy manager at an Oncology Infusion Center. 5am-1pm, Monday-Friday, no weekends or holidays. Worked for a large Oncology Practice. Managed my patients at home and at the hospital. A great deal of autonomy and job satisfaction with the ability to direct patient care and have the doctors back me up with orders and therapy goals. The best job I have ever had, and I have had 9. You still have to deal with nursing, always seem to be on opposing sides.
To summarize:
Financially, never enough of a bump from staffing, to be worthwhile.
Middle management; you get squeezed from the top down, and from the bottom up.
As a career Pharmacist, you are expected to move up, into management at some point.
Your primary goals are conflict resolution, endless meetings, and accreditation readiness. Oh yes, patient care, down at the very bottom.
A whole lot of uncompensated stress and OT.
Very little actual power to affect any change.
Ongoing responsibility, beyond "office hours". Anytime, nights, weekends, even if infusion center is open M-F.

Let me guess, the "Rehab. Hospital" is Encompass Rehab Hospital, with 140 locations? I work there, Part-time. I always tell my pharmacy manager, and the staff pharmacist (both from Walmart), it's so cute that you call yourself a "Hospital". I am their only resource for clinical hospital information. That is a sweet management job, if you get it.

Bottom line: After a few management stints, I have stayed in my lane as a "staff pharmacist" for the past 20 years. Managed to make a very good income, working OT, and second jobs. Thinking, one should be able to do that until retirement, if one works hard and does a good job.
WRONG, you actually age out of "staffing". I was "let go" of my last hospital job, because I was old, making too much money (after 7 years of great performance reviews. Two older pharmacists were pushed out before me. I did Covid/travel Pharmacist for a couple of years. I was actively looking for a hospital staff job for those two years. It was exceedingly difficult, even with a five page resume, and 35 years experience.
I was competing with new grads, willing to take half of my hourly pay. Very lucky to land a staffing job with a major hospital system, willing to pay for my experience.

Was that staffing job a union job?
 
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