Nontraditional Student(24) Need Advice Please

[PreMedMainah]

I would like to say that I love this forum. I have been reading for a while and have finally decided to go to med school. I would love any input and advice on my past and my chances of getting in. So here it goes.

I dropped out of high school and got my GED.
I few years later I went to community college and did EXTREMELY poorly. (Enrolled for 4 semesters with 4 classes each and only completed 3 classes.)
I have had many jobs and never found ANYTHING that I liked and because of that I never applied myself and was late, no call no show, fired, quit, ect.
Had a child and finally got my act together and enrolled in community college again(business major) and did well for a full year. 3.3GPA(4.0 second semester)
Transfered to my state University this semester and decided to earn both a b.s. in business and biology. I am doing both because of all the Med school Pre-reqs. I am determined to do very well and keep a GPA above 3.6-3.7 here.
I never took the SAT or ACT.
I am interviewing for a volunteer spot at my local hospital in the next couple weeks and I am in the process of some shadowing soon as well.
I am currently a sophomore and I would love to attend Boston U, UMass, and Tufts. I am truly in love with Tufts and the Maine track. I am a Maine resident, college in Maine, GED in Maine. I am planning to apply to the Tufts Maine Track early assurance program next year. So I need to get most of my pre reqs done by spring of next year. Anyway, that is about it. I have taken the long way, but I am finally here. I honestly think that all these mishaps and mistakes have made me more well rounded, experienced, and I can really say that I want this. What do you guys think?

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[gyngyn]

It would be easier to see where you stand if you were to calculate your gpa and Sgpa for both AMCAS and AACOMAS.
There is a stickey at the top of the WAMC page for convenience.

 

[PreMedMainah]

It would be easier to see where you stand if you were to calculate your gpa and Sgpa for both AMCAS and AACOMAS.
There is a stickey at the top of the WAMC page for convenience.

I cannot do this because this is my first semester at my 4 year University. I do not have a GPA yet and I did not take any sciences classes this semester either. I am planning on taking them next semester and going forward.

I am basically asking if with great grades, great mcat, and great EC's. Is it realistic to get in to the schools i've listed? Will my past and my mistakes hurt me significantly?

 

[gyngyn]

I cannot do this because this is my first semester at my 4 year University. I do not have a GPA yet and I did not take any sciences classes this semester either. I am planning on taking them next semester and going forward.

I am basically asking if with great grades, great mcat, and great EC's. Is it realistic to get in to the schools i've listed? Will my past and my mistakes hurt me significantly?

Every class taken since high school is included in your gpa, not just grades from a 4 year University.
Given what you have told us, it is likely that you may need some serious damage control.
Thus, the advice we might give will vary depending on your gpa as calculated by AACOMAS or AMCAS.

 

[PreMedMainah]

Every class taken since high school is included in your gpa, not just grades from a 4 year University.
Given what you have told us, it is likely that you may need some serious damage control.
Thus, the advice we might give will vary depending on your gpa as calculated by AACOMAS or AMCAS.

I just calculated all undergraduate grades using a GPA calculator, excluding two remedial math classes that I received an F in, because they were not going to be used in my gpa at that institution. If i finish this semester how I plan to than I will have a undergrad cumulative gpa of 2.5. I seriously hope this is not what happens. I am now freaking out. I knew they would see my transcript from that school but I thought they would only use my gpa from my current institution. I will have a SERIOUS upward trend but I don't understand how that is fair to use those grades. I wasn't ready for college at that time in my life. Thank you gyngyn for your help.

 

[gyngyn]

I just calculated all undergraduate grades using a GPA calculator, excluding two remedial math classes that I received an F in, because they were not going to be used in my gpa at that institution. If i finish this semester how I plan to than I will have a undergrad cumulative gpa of 2.5. I seriously hope this is not what happens. I am now freaking out. I knew they would see my transcript from that school but I thought they would only use my gpa from my current institution. I will have a SERIOUS upward trend but I don't understand how that is fair to use those grades. I wasn't ready for college at that time in my life. Thank you gyngyn for your help.

Sadly, even if they are not used in your school's gpa calculation, AMCAS will still include them.
If there is any chance that you had a good reason for a retroactive withdrawal this would be a good time to investigate the school policy.
This might be a good time to look into AACOMAS grade replacement policy also.

 

[PreMedMainah]

Sadly, even if they are not used in your school's gpa calculation, AMCAS will still include them.
If there is any chance that you had a good reason for a retroactive withdrawal this would be a good time to investigate the school policy.
This might be a good time to look into AACOMAS grade replacement policy also.

I essentially had a gpa of 1.5 at the first cc. 3.2 at the second, and I plan to have above a 3.7- 3.8 at university. This is what I thought they would see. But adding all them up would significantly drop the cGPA I probably would be lucky to see a 3.2 cGPA with all grades from all institutions. I just looked up the AACOMAS policy and I don't think I can do that because the first CC I attended was in Oklahoma and I am now in Maine. I can take the corresponding classes at my university but because they are not the same class from the same institution I don't think that would work. e.g. into to psychology at first CC would be different to psychology 1 at University. Any other help or information would be very helpful.

 

[gyngyn]

I essentially had a gpa of 1.5 at the first cc. 3.2 at the second, and I plan to have above a 3.7- 3.8 at university. This is what I thought they would see. But adding all them up would significantly drop the cGPA I probably would be lucky to see a 3.2 cGPA with all grades from all institutions. I just looked up the AACOMAS policy and I don't think I can do that because the first CC I attended was in Oklahoma and I am now in Maine. I can take the corresponding classes at my university but because they are not the same class from the same institution I don't think that would work. e.g. into to psychology at first CC would be different to psychology 1 at University. Any other help or information would be very helpful.

You don't have to attend the same school. The course doesn't even need to have the same name. I believe the salient points are that the units are the same and the course description is substantially the same. Given the large number of very low grades that have accrued to your account, DO school will be the most likely successful path to physician-hood. It will take a very long time to bring your gpa up to an acceptable MD range given our method of calculating gpa and our generally higher acceptable range of scores (plus we include those math F's in your science gpa).

 

[PreMedMainah]

Thank you for your help. I will assume at the moment that I could earn a 3.2-3.3 cGPA overall and I think its possible to earn a 3.8- 3.9 sGPA because I haven't taken any science courses yet. With that and a 37 + MCAT and great EC's would I even have a chance at MD schools at all? I have the benefit of Tufts Maine track bias for Maine. I do have UNECOM in Maine as well which is very biased for Maine.

 

[Mad Jack]

Thank you for your help. I will assume at the moment that I could earn a 3.2-3.3 cGPA overall and I think its possible to earn a 3.8- 3.9 sGPA because I haven't taken any science courses yet. With that and a 37 + MCAT and great EC's would I even have a chance at MD schools at all? I have the benefit of Tufts Maine track bias for Maine. I do have UNECOM in Maine as well which is very biased for Maine.

One does not simply plan on having a 37+ MCAT.

If you have a cumulative GPA of 3.2 and an MCAT of 30+ UNECOM will probably take you. Tufts might or might not be a long shot- you have to keep in mind you're up against some seriously stiff competition in the MD world and they could take any number of other people that have not only a higher GPA than 3.2, but also have no history of failure. Unless you have some significant ECs in addition to a high MCAT, you'll be on the low end of the admission spectrum.

 

[gyngyn]

Thank you for your help. I will assume at the moment that I could earn a 3.2-3.3 cGPA overall and I think its possible to earn a 3.8- 3.9 sGPA because I haven't taken any science courses yet. With that and a 37 + MCAT and great EC's would I even have a chance at MD schools at all? I have the benefit of Tufts Maine track bias for Maine. I do have UNECOM in Maine as well which is very biased for Maine.

Long ago I abandoned speculating on speculation.
Your best bet is to do what you can to retroactively withdraw from the classes in which you earned an F, identify classes in your new school that will replace the ones in which you earned a C or worse. Get A's from now on (or as close as you can). Don't take the MCAT until you are scoring better than you need to achieve a reachable goal.

 

[PreMedMainah]

Long ago I abandoned speculating on speculation.
Your best bet is to do what you can to retroactively withdraw from the classes in which you earned an F, identify classes in your new school that will replace the ones in which you earned a C or worse. Get A's from now on (or as close as you can). Don't take the MCAT until you are scoring better than you need to achieve a reachable goal.

How does one retroactively withdraw from a class that they received an F in? I had received 3 F's at the first CC back in 2009-2010. Since then my lowest grade has been a C. I will try to do as you have suggested but my fear is that DO school is not going to fit with my career goals. I would like to be an orthopedic surgeon. I know plans change and typically most don't REALLY know until 3rd or 4th year of med school. Again, thank you your help. This information has really helped and I am glad that I didn't have to find this stuff out after already applying or close to it.

 

[ciestar]

One does not simply plan on having a 37+ MCAT.

If you have a cumulative GPA of 3.2 and an MCAT of 30+ UNECOM will probably take you. Tufts might or might not be a long shot- you have to keep in mind you're up against some seriously stiff competition in the MD world and they could take any number of other people that have not only a higher GPA than 3.2, but also have no history of failure. Unless you have some significant ECs in addition to a high MCAT, you'll be on the low end of the admission spectrum.

After January, a 37 MCAT is no longer attainable, period. (based on what I've read on how they're changing the scoring)

 

[PreMedMainah]

Yes, I know the changes to the MCAT. I meant to say the equivalent of a 37. I think 160 or something close would be the equivalent.

 

[PreMedMainah]

One does not simply plan on having a 37+ MCAT.

If you have a cumulative GPA of 3.2 and an MCAT of 30+ UNECOM will probably take you. Tufts might or might not be a long shot- you have to keep in mind you're up against some seriously stiff competition in the MD world and they could take any number of other people that have not only a higher GPA than 3.2, but also have no history of failure. Unless you have some significant ECs in addition to a high MCAT, you'll be on the low end of the admission spectrum.

Thank you for this. I will do my best. I am going to apply to the Tufts Maine Track Early Assurance program for the hell of it and hope that the upward trend, EC's, and Maine bias get me in. Other than that, my only option will be UNECOM as I have a family and the wife is not really willing to relocate anywhere other than ME, MA, NH, or VT.

 

[gyngyn]

How does one retroactively withdraw from a class that they received an F in? I had received 3 F's at the first CC back in 2009-2010. Since then my lowest grade has been a C. I will try to do as you have suggested but my fear is that DO school is not going to fit with my career goals. I would like to be an orthopedic surgeon. I know plans change and typically most don't REALLY know until 3rd or 4th year of med school. Again, thank you your help. This information has really helped and I am glad that I didn't have to find this stuff out after already applying or close to it.

It would have a tremendously positive impact on your ability to reach your new goals if your old school would consider your petition for retroactive withdrawal. You are correct that it may not be possible, but these grades are a major impediment to your success. As it stands you have three options: get them withdrawn; failing that, re-take them for an A and apply DO or continue getting A's and hope that you can accrue enough units to overcome them in your AMCAS average. This may entail a post bac or an extra year.
About 20% of MD applicants with Step 1 scores of 240 or better (very,very good scores) did not match in Ortho this year. It it ok to have lofty goals, but your first goal has to be getting into medical school, any US medical school (MD or DO).

Btw, DO's actually have an advantage for ortho since they have developed a significant number of ortho residencies and are very likely to have a preference for their own grads, even though there will be a combined match by the time you reach that point in your career....

 

[jordan789]

I would just like to add that I think you are getting a little ahead of yourself by thinking about schools and the type of doctor you want to be. Take all the premed courses and the mcat and see where you stand. One step at a time. Listen to gyngyn.

 

[PreMedMainah]

It would have a tremendously positive impact on your ability to reach your new goals if your old school would consider your petition for retroactive withdrawal. You are correct that it may not be possible, but these grades are a major impediment to your success. As it stands you have three options: get them withdrawn; failing that, re-take them for an A and apply DO or continue getting A's and hope that you can accrue enough units to overcome them in your AMCAS average. This may entail a post bac or an extra year.
About 20% of MD applicants with Step 1 scores of 240 or better (very,very good scores) did not match in Ortho this year. It it ok to have lofty goals, but your first goal has to be getting into medical school, any US medical school (MD or DO).

Btw, DO's actually have an advantage for ortho since they have developed a significant number of ortho residencies and are very likely to have a preference for their own grads, even though there will be a combined match by the time you reach that point in your career....

I just did another GPA calculation assuming I am able to do a retroactive withdrawal and make extremely good grades from now on. I will have around a 3.5 cGPA and 3.8-3.9 sGPA. I also did another one with both retroactive withdrawal and retaking two class and that boosted me up to a 3.6 cGPA. So I guess I won't be as bad as I thought. I will call tomorrow to start the process of retroactive withdrawal, if at all possible. Thank you for your advice and support on this matter.

 

[PreMedMainah]

Thank you to all that gave input on this. I will have an uphill road ahead of me but I know I can do this. Nothing in life worth having comes easy.

 

[PreMedMainah]

Update: I called the school where I received the F's and they informed me that they do not have a retroactive withdrawal policy. I guess I will have to just retake some of those classes for the AACOMAS. I also have the added benefit of doing a dual degree in that I will have to take 150 cr hours instead of 120. This will give me more classes to make up for the low GPA.

 

[gyngyn]

Update: I called the school where I received the F's and they informed me that they do not have a retroactive withdrawal policy. I guess I will have to just retake some of those classes for the AACOMAS. I also have the added benefit of doing a dual degree in that I will have to take 150 cr hours instead of 120. This will give me more classes to make up for the low GPA.

It was worth a try. If you have a good reason for your failure to withdraw, you might take your case to the dean. Tell him how you've turned your life around...throw yourself on the mercy of the court. It would save a lot of heartache. The people who answer the phone have nothing to lose by telling you no. The dean might be sympathetic (if you share your situation and take responsibility for your youthful mistakes).

 

[PreMedMainah]

It was worth a try. If you have a good reason for your failure to withdraw, you might take your case to the dean. Tell him how you've turned your life around...throw yourself on the mercy of the court. It would save a lot of heartache. The people who answer the phone have nothing to lose by telling you no. The dean might be sympathetic (if you share your situation and take responsibility for your youthful mistakes).

I will try that as well. If all else fails I should have a pretty good chance at UNECOM. I will definitely try my hardest for a great MCAT score, and great EC's. Time will tell. I just have to stay focused and level headed. Thanks.