NSU-COM rotation roundup!

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munchymanRX

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I was wondering if any current or past M3's/M4's could weigh in on some of the experiences at NSUs 3rd year sites. We have meetings set up to discuss the different available sites, but they don't give a whole lot of useful info, and it'd be good to get an insider perspective, especially considering the school has a habit of disseminating incomplete facts.

I know that there have been other threads on this through the years, but for the most part the answers seem to come from M1s and M2s quoting the student handbook or website. It'd be great to hear from you, and really helpful to any other nova students prowling around these forums.

Thanks in advance!
 
bumpage, because this is important stuff! NSU alum are of course welcome too!

ILikeFood? Kuba? Where are you guys?
 
I rotated through the MTS track and though it was pretty good. You spend three months on Medicine with the Allopathic IM program and 2 with the surgery program and 1 on ER as a 4th year. The rest of my rotations were spread out mostly through Miami and a few back at Nova in the clinics there. The advantage of MTS over OTS to me was that there is more time spent with attendings in smaller groups and there are student specific academic events with the UM students that the OTS people don't participate in either. Call is also Q4 in MTS vs Q3 in OTS (calls are not overnight, students just stay usually until around 7-11PM depending on how busy it is and go home and come back in the AM). Also compared to the OTS people I think I had less traveling to do than they did as some of them woud up getting placed all over for rotations (Weston, Ft. Lauderdale, South Miami, etc) where many of the MTS people got to stay closer to Miami for most of their rotations. I wound up living in a pretty convienent spot so most of my drives were less than 20 minutes ( I lived 12 min north of Mount Sinai) with the exception of 1 month were I had to drive to Kendall and 2 were I had to come back to the Nova clinics. I thought my experience was pretty good and while you might get more freedom at some of the other hospitals, you don't usually get so over worked were you have virtually no free/study time like at some of the other places during their inpatient months.
 
Thanks for the response! Anyone else out there want to weigh in? I know we have that dinner at the end of the week, but every little bit of info helps!
 
Largo Med was a decent place to be. They have a bunch of residencies based out of there and almost every resident I have worked with was good to great. The rotations range from hard work to super chill. The attendings for the most part are good, I didn't work with any who were malignant. Whether you are male or female try to do Urology with Dr Lombard for your surgery elective he is a blast to work with, teaches, and lets you do a lot in the OR if you want, plus it is good hrs for a surgery rotation. The med ed staff are really friendly helpful and responsive. You get free food via a card while you are there which is a nice perk. Most of my rotations were at the hospital or within 15 mins of the hospital. They have a consistently difficult time placing males with an obgyn. Some people were sent back to Fort Lauderdale for it, but were given free housing for the month. Peds hospital is the only other rotation that requires a decent drive, that is done in Tampa my commute took me anywhere between 40 mins to 1.5 hrs each way depending on traffic. I was told students don't do overnight shifts at largo which I found to be simply not true. They switched to a hospitalist system this year for IM so it could be different but for the one month of inpt IM I did there I worked about two weeks overnight, then on ER about half my shifts were nights. Overall I did not feel overworked or sleep deprived for most of the year, it was a fairly benign third year as far as medical school goes. I saw a lot of pathology I got to do some procedures and was overall pretty happy. I hope this helps.
 
Thanks for the reviews so far!! Any review of memorial regional or Southampton in NY?
 
Thanks for the reviews so far!! Any review of memorial regional or Southampton in NY?

There's actually a ton of feedback about the OOS sites in the Clinical Education office on the 4th floor. There's a huge binder full of student feedback sitting on a file cabinet behind Debbie's (not the redheaded one) desk. They're putting another one together for last year's class, but it won't be ready until after we've had our track day. The latest one we have access to is 2011.

Surprisingly, nothing's been redacted. I read some pretty vulgar and negative things about some of the sites from past students.
 
There's actually a ton of feedback about the OOS sites in the Clinical Education office on the 4th floor. There's a huge binder full of student feedback sitting on a file cabinet behind Debbie's (not the redheaded one) desk. They're putting another one together for last year's class, but it won't be ready until after we've had our track day. The latest one we have access to is 2011.

Surprisingly, nothing's been redacted. I read some pretty vulgar and negative things about some of the sites from past students.

It would be great if we can get these reviews from different schools as pre meds

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I'd scan it and post it online if I could, but I'm fairly certain they wouldn't let me, it being confidential and all.


Anyone else want to weigh in?
 
Bumping, if anyone else has any feedback?
 
Lee memorial system is pretty good. i would say that the case volume in fort myers is lower than broward or miami by far. but all the preceptors are really willing to teach. so basically you have to read on your own to fill in the gaps, is the bottom line. you will have a good amount of free time.

this setup may be good for someone, like myself, who was trying to work on a relationship/was pretty burnt out after the first two years.

also, if you know you want a competitive specialty (urology/ent/etc.) and will use the time to shadow, fort myers is your place.

i also hated fort lauderdale with a fiery passion, and couldn't have lived there another year. fort myers is a very live-able alternative for the last two years of your education.
 
Lee memorial system is pretty good. i would say that the case volume in fort myers is lower than broward or miami by far. but all the preceptors are really willing to teach. so basically you have to read on your own to fill in the gaps, is the bottom line. you will have a good amount of free time.

this setup may be good for someone, like myself, who was trying to work on a relationship/was pretty burnt out after the first two years.

also, if you know you want a competitive specialty (urology/ent/etc.) and will use the time to shadow, fort myers is your place.

i also hated fort lauderdale with a fiery passion, and couldn't have lived there another year. fort myers is a very live-able alternative for the last two years of your education.

what didn't you like about Fort Lauderdale

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what didn't you like about Fort Lauderdale

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I'm just a small town kind of guy. Also, I had to study ALOT the first two years to do OK. So I really didn't get to enjoy a whole lot of the cool stuff there was to be had. So I was just kind of left w/ all the congestion and jerks who live there day to day, and none of the sweet beaches or bars. haha
 
Hey current NSU student... Can any of you comment on Larkins Community Hospital? I think they just started this year and they seem to have a lot of NSU affiliated AOA residencies.

Is this a good place to do your 3rd year rotations since it's a teaching hospital?
 
Bump.

Can anyone comment on the Orlando rotation sites?
 
Avoid Larkin if you can. Horribly run. Too many residents and students. Not enough patients. People do know what they are doing a lot of the times, though some residents are very good. They have a TON of residency positions which IMO will either phase out or will get cut back on a lot of the positions. They are also planning on opening up their own osteopathic school nearby which baffles me. The place is TINY and down the street from a South Miami hospital; you can literally see the ER entrance from the front of Larkin ER. If the patient coming isn't from an ALF, nursing home, jail, of Baker acted, they are most likely looking for pain meds.

The upside: In the end though, even if this is your core, you only spend about 4 months there anyways. They will send you everywhere. I have ID's for every hospital in the area except for Mt Sinai (all the way north to University Hospital as well). You get to see a lot of other hospital systems but, if you want to get to know residents and a program well this is not the best place to go since so little time is spent there and everywhere else.
 
Good to know that about Larkin. Can someone comment on Largo?
 
I rotated through Palmetto General Hospital in Hialeah as a student
Advantages:
1. Lots of ICU. The second floor is essentially one huge ICU and Cath lab.
2. As a tie-in to #1, lots of pathology.
3. There are some extremely talented residents there
4. There is food during didactics
5. If you are an attractive woman rotating through the hospital, you will have the best experience ever, i.e. the CT surgeon will be more apt to let you scrub in and hold the heart.

Disadvantages
1. For me, the Spanish language. It's 99.9% Spanish speaking population there. This has unfortunately heavily biased me as a resident. I really have to bite my tongue when I come across a Hispanic patient now, because as a student I came across men and women alike who cried like children at the smallest injuries.
2. Evidence based medicine is not practiced here. Defensive medicine is. A lot of the imaging and labs ordered were completely unnecessary. There were comprehensive labs ordered daily on the most benign patients in the hospital.
3. As a tie-in to #3, save for one attending in the ER, who is the only board-certified ER physician I am aware of down there, they essentially admit anyone and everyone who comes through the doors. Why, because the ER docs are incompetent. I remember seeing a patient on the hospital floor admitted for post-herpetic neuralgia, another for the flu
4. The IM docs on the floors are very knowledgeable, but otherwise they are temperamental and careless people. It was a common sight to see an "attending" throwing a fit in plain sight of patients and hospital staff. Residents were chewed out for ridiculous reasons. I was chewed out as a third year student by an attending for allowing a patient to be discharged who maybe shouldn't have.
5. They were careless because they kept a daily census of 50-80 people per service and relied on the medical students and residents to see the patients and write the notes. There were patients there who would see the attending once every 1-2 days. In retrospect, this meant that the system there was a gold mine for these physicians, and from what I understand the hospitalists were pulling upward $500,000-$700,000 a year there because of it.
6. The DME has been there since the early 90s, and has no influence there because he is disabled and has not practiced medicine in years. He is essentially a hospital employee, whereas the hospitalists and IM specialists bring in millions for the hospital. Therefore a lot of threatening takes place when, for example, a Cardiologist service does not have the number of students or residents they want.
7. This may have changed, but the didactics had a heavy bent toward Cardiology. Like 80-90% of the lectures there were Cardiology.
 
2. Evidence based medicine is not practiced here. Defensive medicine is. A lot of the imaging and labs ordered were completely unnecessary. There were comprehensive labs ordered daily on the most benign patients in the hospital.

I have heard this from many south florida attendings. Its a brutally litigious environment. Ive seen lawyers come into the ER with paper cuts and the sniffles just to pass their card around to patients. I'm only an M1 so I don't know a lot about this stuff but it seems like the physician groups settle cases out of court at light speed, and they develop a reputation for being quick n' easy out-of-court targets. I've met attendings who had several cases settled without their knowledge of even a complaint being filed.

you only need to listen to the radio for five minutes to hear an ad for a personal injury lawyer. You call them and tell them your complaint, they give you 10k, they settle your case and pick up the other 100k for themselves.
 
I rotated through Palmetto General Hospital in Hialeah as a student
Advantages:
1. Lots of ICU. The second floor is essentially one huge ICU and Cath lab.
2. As a tie-in to #1, lots of pathology.
3. There are some extremely talented residents there
4. There is food during didactics
5. If you are an attractive woman rotating through the hospital, you will have the best experience ever, i.e. the CT surgeon will be more apt to let you scrub in and hold the heart.

Disadvantages
1. For me, the Spanish language. It's 99.9% Spanish speaking population there. This has unfortunately heavily biased me as a resident. I really have to bite my tongue when I come across a Hispanic patient now, because as a student I came across men and women alike who cried like children at the smallest injuries.
2. Evidence based medicine is not practiced here. Defensive medicine is. A lot of the imaging and labs ordered were completely unnecessary. There were comprehensive labs ordered daily on the most benign patients in the hospital.
3. As a tie-in to #3, save for one attending in the ER, who is the only board-certified ER physician I am aware of down there, they essentially admit anyone and everyone who comes through the doors. Why, because the ER docs are incompetent. I remember seeing a patient on the hospital floor admitted for post-herpetic neuralgia, another for the flu
4. The IM docs on the floors are very knowledgeable, but otherwise they are temperamental and careless people. It was a common sight to see an "attending" throwing a fit in plain sight of patients and hospital staff. Residents were chewed out for ridiculous reasons. I was chewed out as a third year student by an attending for allowing a patient to be discharged who maybe shouldn't have.
5. They were careless because they kept a daily census of 50-80 people per service and relied on the medical students and residents to see the patients and write the notes. There were patients there who would see the attending once every 1-2 days. In retrospect, this meant that the system there was a gold mine for these physicians, and from what I understand the hospitalists were pulling upward $500,000-$700,000 a year there because of it.
6. The DME has been there since the early 90s, and has no influence there because he is disabled and has not practiced medicine in years. He is essentially a hospital employee, whereas the hospitalists and IM specialists bring in millions for the hospital. Therefore a lot of threatening takes place when, for example, a Cardiologist service does not have the number of students or residents they want.
7. This may have changed, but the didactics had a heavy bent toward Cardiology. Like 80-90% of the lectures there were Cardiology.


I rotated here too and I think I have a pretty good idea who your IM attending was. I will say except for that one, the rest are excellent, teach a lot and are pretty nice. When did you rotate there? They did split up the biggest service so the census never came close to 80. I had friends that rotated at Broward and were like, "Oh, we only get to see 5 patients because we're capped." Dumbest thing ever. While yes, it sucks getting there before 5 AM and having to see anywhere from 8-15 patients in a day, you will learn a lot and see a lot. In the end though, it is South Florida. You may spend an entire day without a patient who speaks English that was admitted because of the fear of a potential lawsuit. On the other hand, I am glad I rotated here because of the pathology and Spanish. All depends on what you want out and your future career goals.
 
I rotated here too and I think I have a pretty good idea who your IM attending was. I will say except for that one, the rest are excellent, teach a lot and are pretty nice. When did you rotate there? They did split up the biggest service so the census never came close to 80. I had friends that rotated at Broward and were like, "Oh, we only get to see 5 patients because we're capped." Dumbest thing ever. While yes, it sucks getting there before 5 AM and having to see anywhere from 8-15 patients in a day, you will learn a lot and see a lot. In the end though, it is South Florida. You may spend an entire day without a patient who speaks English that was admitted because of the fear of a potential lawsuit. On the other hand, I am glad I rotated here because of the pathology and Spanish. All depends on what you want out and your future career goals.

Yes, seeing a lot of pathology is great, but the other half, like properly working them up is something that takes just as much time and will cost the patients less if done correctly. This can't be seen at Palmetto where every excuse to image or order tests is made. What's the point of seeing a whole bunch of path when the Assessment and Plan is based on how many times the attending has been sued? Quoting one of the chief residents at Palmetto, "I think of how it's actually done, and then I do it the Palmetto way." The difference in training at the more academic programs I rotated at as a 4th year was astounding. And caps are actually in place to benefit the student/resident. Instead of running around trying to get everything done you have the time to work everything up the right way. I had the same load as you as a 3rd year student and barely had any idea of what I was doing until I started reading and found out that a lot of what they did there was bull****. I rotated at several hospitals 4th year and have never seen another hospitalist consult infectious disease to manage a UTI, something they do regularly at Palmetto. Or consult pulmonology to manage asthma. Or consult cardiology to manage a-fib. What about endocrine for diabetes? It's a joke there, let's not pretend otherwise.
 
All I'm saying is, if I'm ever in S.Florida again, need to go to a hospital, and hear its Palmetto, I'm going to ask the ambulance to leave me on the side of the road because I have just as much chance of surviving that than a hospitalization there.
 
I rotated through the MTS track and though it was pretty good. You spend three months on Medicine with the Allopathic IM program and 2 with the surgery program and 1 on ER as a 4th year. The rest of my rotations were spread out mostly through Miami and a few back at Nova in the clinics there. The advantage of MTS over OTS to me was that there is more time spent with attendings in smaller groups and there are student specific academic events with the UM students that the OTS people don't participate in either. Call is also Q4 in MTS vs Q3 in OTS (calls are not overnight, students just stay usually until around 7-11PM depending on how busy it is and go home and come back in the AM). Also compared to the OTS people I think I had less traveling to do than they did as some of them woud up getting placed all over for rotations (Weston, Ft. Lauderdale, South Miami, etc) where many of the MTS people got to stay closer to Miami for most of their rotations. I wound up living in a pretty convienent spot so most of my drives were less than 20 minutes ( I lived 12 min north of Mount Sinai) with the exception of 1 month were I had to drive to Kendall and 2 were I had to come back to the Nova clinics. I thought my experience was pretty good and while you might get more freedom at some of the other hospitals, you don't usually get so over worked were you have virtually no free/study time like at some of the other places during their inpatient months.

What are MTS and OTS?
 
They are the allopathic and osteopathic tracks at mt.sinai. Only difference is you rotate with allopathic IM service and will usually have another MS3 from UM on your service with you and you do surgery with the surgery residency at the hospital. OTS rotates with osteopathic IM service and does surgery elsewhere.
 
All I'm saying is, if I'm ever in S.Florida again, need to go to a hospital, and hear its Palmetto, I'm going to ask the ambulance to leave me on the side of the road because I have just as much chance of surviving that than a hospitalization there.

There was a running joke among the residents that if they were ever in an accident, they would have chest tattoos that said, "Send to Baptist."
 
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