Observations of a recent grad

[jwk]

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I disagree. Even if you are fellowship trained (and I am) the market is still really bad. All you have to do is look at gasworks to know that there are no jobs out there. Many of the locum jobs are drying up. Even when you call the recruiters, most of them have hardly anything. Most of the academic centers are in hiring freezes. I am not even going to talk about the private practice market. I am not being doom and gloom. I am talking about reality here.

Always room at the top end of the ladder according to my sources. If you are well-trained, learn the latest technology and techniques, stay ahead in the field, there will always be a place to work in this field. Time changes everything. 1995 was the nadir. Jobs were tight in 93-94 but people still got them. Many ran away from anesthesia for fear of no jobs (or not their perfect job) but then it really opened up again. If you want to do it and you're good, nothing can stand in your way. Time will heal the discrepancies. Future is what you make of it...

It is indeed cyclical - it always has been. In the early 90's, newly-minted anesthesiologists were taking jobs as "associates" with no partner track offered whatsoever. A few years later, they were partners anyway. Certainly prime locations or premier practices may indeed be full, or simply much more selective. That's cyclical as well. Supply and demand boys and girls, supply and demand. Who knows what Obama will bring? Obviously there will be change, but who knows what that change will be? People still need medical care and someone to provide it. People won't consider providing that care or entering into the profession at all if they can't be compensated at a reasonable level to support a practice with overhead (including malpractice premiums) as well as the educational costs involved with getting there in the first place.

And please - if you depend on gasworks as your guide, you deserve what you get. The same with recruiters. Old school job searching is still the rule and the best way to get your foot in the door - get a nice resume and cover letter made up, send it, follow up. Where do you send it? Anywhere and everywhere you want - copies and stamps are CHEAP. If you're too lazy to do some legwork for your own career, why would a group want to consider you? I know that's the way my group looks at it for both anesthesiologists and anesthetists. Recruiters need not call. No ads in gaswork. Have the initiative to do it yourself. The guy who's too busy but still gets it done will get the job before someone who's too busy and tries to let someone else do it for him.

 

[cchoukal]

I'm doing a fellowship next year but all my classmates got the jobs they wanted in cities like chicago, seattle, and san francisco (technically east bay, for the haters). I mean, maybe it IS tightening but places ARE still hiring.

 

[foxtrot]

And please - if you depend on gasworks as your guide, you deserve what you get. The same with recruiters. Old school job searching is still the rule and the best way to get your foot in the door - get a nice resume and cover letter made up, send it, follow up. Where do you send it? Anywhere and everywhere you want - copies and stamps are CHEAP. If you're too lazy to do some legwork for your own career, why would a group want to consider you? I know that's the way my group looks at it for both anesthesiologists and anesthetists. Recruiters need not call. No ads in gaswork. Have the initiative to do it yourself. The guy who's too busy but still gets it done will get the job before someone who's too busy and tries to let someone else do it for him.[/QUOTE]

I agree that if you depend on gasworks and recruiters to find you a job then you may not get the best deal. But the way the market is right now, many private groups are putting a freeze on hiring. This comes from someone who has sent out close to 50 cv's and cover letters. But when you don't have any luck with the cold calling sometimes you have to goto gasworks and recruiters. I certainly doesn't mean you are "lazy" or don't have any "initiative" if you use these services. It just means you you are exhausting all options. Hell, even many academic centers are in a hiring freeze. Obviously you don't understand what its like to owe over $100k in student loans that are coming due with the possibility of having to do locum jobs to pay your bills (oh wait, those jobs are drying up also). It really burns me up when high paid private practice guys scoff at new grads and assume they are lazy or don't have an initiative when they complain about the current job market. It is easy to assume people are apathetic and just aren't working hard enough when you have a job and are hauling in more than $250k a year. How soon we forget what it is like to be a struggling new grad or resident.

 

[bigdan]

...he's not a high paid anesthesiologist

 

[jwk]

...he's not a high paid anesthesiologist

Never claimed to be. However, after doing this almost 30 years, I've seen these cycles a few times, and this is a time when it is getting tighter, at least in some places.

I stand by my opinions about gasworks and recruiters. Both may be OK resources in some cases - but LOTS of groups don't use either one. You won't find those jobs without calling or writing. At least gasworks is free - but recruiters get a huge fee which some groups will never pay anyway, but even ones that might have paid in the past might be thinking twice about coughing up $25-50k in this economic climate.

 

[Southpaw]

...he's not a high paid anesthesiologist

He's had more than enough experience in this field to see it change several times over. Your comment wasn't needed and definitely uncalled for...

 

[Noyac]

I think you guys are taking JWK out of context and at the same time saying the same things round about.

I am a high paid anesthesiologist. I understand what JWK is saying and I understand what the rest of you are saying. My group is hiring and will be hiring next year as well, as far as I can see. But when a recruiter calls me, I initially have reservations about that candidate. It comes from past experience and is admittedly unfair. I delete emails from recruiters everyday. I want someone that does the work themselves. How can a recruiter tell me the quality of an applicant? How many of you using a recruiter have ever met that recruiter? Have you ever heard a recruiter say "Dr. X was in the middle of his class and his scores are average, etc?" No, they always exaggerate. Now I have to do the leg work for the candidate, which I will do anyway since I want the best candidate. The candidate we offered a position to last week cold called us, came in here and stomped the interview, and continued to check back with us as we interviewed others.

I also don't think Bigdan was being antagonistic with his comment either. Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[2win]

I think you guys are taking JWK out of context and at the same time saying the same things round about.

I am a high paid anesthesiologist. I understand what JWK is saying and I understand what the rest of you are saying. My group is hiring and will be hiring next year as well, as far as I can see. But when a recruiter calls me, I initially have reservations about that candidate. It comes from past experience and is admittedly unfair. I delete emails from recruiters everyday. I want someone that does the work themselves. How can a recruiter tell me the quality of an applicant? How many of you using a recruiter have ever met that recruiter? Have you ever heard a recruiter say "Dr. X was in the middle of his class and his scores are average, etc?" No, they always exaggerate. Now I have to do the leg work for the candidate, which I will do anyway since I want the best candidate. The candidate we offered a position to last week cold called us, came in here and stomped the interview, and continued to check back with us as we interviewed others.

I also don't think Bigdan was being antagonistic with his comment either. Maybe I'm wrong.

Noyac - please let me understand. "I am a high paid anesthesiologist" - means that you are paid as you deserve - right? I mean that the quality of services provided it is paid at the appropriate value.
2win

 

[Noyac]

Noyac - please let me understand. "I am a high paid anesthesiologist" - means that you are paid as you deserve - right? I mean that the quality of services provided it is paid at the appropriate value.
2win

Sort of.
When I say "high paid", I mean in relation to the general population. As far as being paid at the appropriate value, well that is debatable. We have the MGMA values to determine that and right now we are under those but we are also in negotiations.

 

[bigdan]

He's had more than enough experience in this field to see it change several times over. Your comment wasn't needed and definitely uncalled for...

😕 Were you bothered by "high paid" or by "anesthesiologist"?

...I was more referring to the exactly what jwk clarified right after I posted - he's been in the trenches for a long time and has seen the ebb and flow, and that gives him pertinent frame of reference and perspective. Or at least I'm assuming so based on the past posts of his that I've read over the years.

It was meant to refute the (incorrect) assumption that jwk was some overpaid chump that was trying harass those that are having a tough time with the job market now.

I'll try to be clearer next time for those that require more explanation, and I apologize to jwk if I inadverently offended him.

dc

 

[Southpaw]

It was meant to refute the (incorrect) assumption that jwk was some overpaid chump that was trying harass those that are having a tough time with the job market now.

Sorry bro, I thought your statement was antagonistic towards jwk and you were taking a shot at him. I was obviously wrong and I apologize.

 

[jwk]

😕 Were you bothered by "high paid" or by "anesthesiologist"?

...I was more referring to the exactly what jwk clarified right after I posted - he's been in the trenches for a long time and has seen the ebb and flow, and that gives him pertinent frame of reference and perspective. Or at least I'm assuming so based on the past posts of his that I've read over the years.

It was meant to refute the (incorrect) assumption that jwk was some overpaid chump that was trying harass those that are having a tough time with the job market now.

I'll try to be clearer next time for those that require more explanation, and I apologize to jwk if I inadverently offended him.

dc

No offense taken 🙂 When I need abuse, I go to the CRNA websites and aggravate ChrisA and his buddies. 😀