on having to defend D.O. decision

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irishlaydi

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Why oh why must people STILL insist that when someone decides to pursue D.O. school it is because they gave up on M.D. or weren't good enough. EVen when I tell them why I chose D.O. instead if M.D., very good reasons might I add, and nothing related to scores or grades! I am just tired of myself and other D.O. applicants I know being "accused" of this. Does anyone have any advice or good replies to give next time I am asked this question??? (besides what I normally say about Osteopathic med and why i like it)... This is NOT meant to cause controversy, I just really wanted some advice on what to say next time... 🙄
 
Well, I just say that I chose DO because the school was 30 minutes by my house. That was more appealing to me then living 4 years on the other side of the country for the MD.

I guess you have to find what works for you.
 
I ignore them for one important reason: the only people who will have the preconceived notion that DO is an alternative to MD (and let's not kid ourselves, in many instances this is the case) are pretentious premeds who will never be convinced anyways. Ignore them.

So far all I have encountered is, "What's a DO?". A few minutes of explaining and they walk away a little more knowledgeable.
 
The only flak I've ever encountered - aside from friendly prodding from a couple friends - has been from this one premed at my college. He's a jackass... So much so that no matter what the topic is, I could care less about his opinion. (but it's ok, I scored WAYYYYY better than him on the MCAT - so HAHA jackass)

Everyone else either doesn't care about the difference or see's DO's as equal.

Like JKD said, the most common "problem" I encounter is confusion about what a DO is. Once it's explained, people just don't care anymore.
 
I have only heard good things about the care people have received from DO's.
 
When people ask me why I went DO, I usually just say "Well, I'm just not that smart.... or motivated... or good looking..."

But I play Halo like the devil himself.
 
i was wondering what it's like working in a large hospital setting where there's 1 DO working alongside 99% MDs. (or would this not apply since most are in primary care/private office settings?) or in any event, how are DOs are perceived among the medical community in general (with the majority practicing as allopathic physicians).

im premed and for some reason the DO philosophy appeals to me more. plus i hear there is much more support at DO schools for their medical students from faculty, staff, administration, blah. i'm still contemplating whether i should apply straight to DO and only DO or do both MD and DO (can they find out if you apply to both?) any advice is appreciated. thanks
 
San_Juan_Sun said:
When people ask me why I went DO, I usually just say "Well, I'm just not that smart.... or motivated... or good looking..."

But I play Halo like the devil himself.


im amused. seriously though. i work for the school of med at my school and there must be like ONE ridiculously good looking MD out of the many, many, old and ugly ones.
 
speakmemory said:
i work for the school of med at my school and there must be like ONE ridiculously good looking MD out of the many, many, old and ugly ones.

Everyone likes to hear good things about themselves, so lay it on thick (especially as a DO). Flattery will get you a long ways in this world.

But trickery and playing Halo 16 hours a day gets you even further.
 
When people give me crap about about it, i just reply that its ok, i will only bleed them if they are really sick.

And then i generally talk about the best way to shrink heads and eat babies.
 
i just tell them "damn right i didn't have the grades or scores to go M.D.- so effing what?" i give them what they want to hear, and they shut up quickly. sitting there trying to defend yourself to some insecure a$$hat takes up precious energy and brainpower that can be applied elsewhere, like the celiac trunk.

(the same can be said about writing a post on SDN)

like they say: "never argue with a fool...."
 
that dr. jack said:
i just tell them "damn right i didn't have the grades or scores to go M.D.- so effing what?" i give them what they want to hear, and they shut up quickly.

👍 I like it!
 
speakmemory said:
i was wondering what it's like working in a large hospital setting where there's 1 DO working alongside 99% MDs. (or would this not apply since most are in primary care/private office settings?) or in any event, how are DOs are perceived among the medical community in general (with the majority practicing as allopathic physicians).

I work in a very large hospital, not sure the actual number of docs, but there are many and I am almost 100% certain that there is not 1 DO on campus (currently).

1 MD told me flat out that I should think long and hard about that decision. Others preferred the "I don't know enough about them" way of saying no comment. I have been around long enough to know that honeymoons are short...people care more about whether you can be counted on to make the right call, get the job done, and be accountable for your actions. If you don't have this...then what do you have? A degree with very little credibility, no referrals, and zero opportunities. Works as well as for MDs and DOs as it does for corporate managers and financiers.
 
Why should you have to defend your decision at all? If it's just an acquaintance and they won't accept the reasons you give, just say, "It is my decision to make, and I feel no need to justify it to you." I haven't had this experience with DO school, but there are some choices I've made that relative strangers have questioned, and maybe I started to try to defend myself, but I shouldn't have had to answer to them at all, and you shouldn't either.
 
I pretty much ignore most ppl...if they press the issue I will attempt to explain my decision.

In general, everyone is going to argue with me on one of my two medical decisions regardless of how perfect my motivation is for pursuing both of them: Air Force and DO...Either they disagree with the armed services, or they disagree with DO, or both. I will attempt to explain if they seem genuinely interested, or if they don't I just say that I have never regreted a decision I have made and I thus don't plan to start now.
 
Just hang this picture up in your room/office/workspace next to your acceptance letter. 😉 I find combating prejuidice with absurdity to be a good tactic.

Funking-Giblet.jpg
 
you guys are great! thanks for the humor and the advice. much appreciated. 😀
 
the other day a nurse at the hospital i work at referred to DOs as "doctor of osteopathetic". let em talk. money bets that he never had what it took to even consider becoming a DO. you cant spend the rest of your lofe defending you decisions. let them talk. only you know of the hard work you put in.
 
irishlaydi said:
Why oh why must people STILL insist that when someone decides to pursue D.O. school it is because they gave up on M.D. or weren't good enough. EVen when I tell them why I chose D.O. instead if M.D., very good reasons might I add, and nothing related to scores or grades! I am just tired of myself and other D.O. applicants I know being "accused" of this. Does anyone have any advice or good replies to give next time I am asked this question??? (besides what I normally say about Osteopathic med and why i like it)... This is NOT meant to cause controversy, I just really wanted some advice on what to say next time... 🙄

Heck if the shoe fits the foot, so be it. I succinctly tell people the reasons I choose DO over MD, then they can believe what the Hell they want. Doesn't matter anyways. If they don't believe you, it just goes to show you how ignorant they really are, and personally I try not to associate myself with closed minded, ignorant folks. 👎
 
jtorres said:
the other day a nurse at the hospital i work at referred to DOs as "doctor of osteopathetic". let em talk. money bets that he never had what it took to even consider becoming a DO. you cant spend the rest of your lofe defending you decisions. let them talk. only you know of the hard work you put in.

money bets that you never had what it took to even consider becoming an MD 🙄
 
At my school, which is primarily full of education majors, just the mention of the thought that some student from amongst them is a premed, will ellicit a tremondous reaction. "Oh MY GOD!!! WOW!!!" I never have to go on and mention DO or MD. They could care less.....
 
Enkedu said:
money bets that you never had what it took to even consider becoming an MD 🙄

to whom are you referring???


😕
 
i argue with my premed freinds about it constantly, I'm not sure if i want to go DO or MD, but i still see DO as equivalent. They constantly give me the DO=Dropout, their the 4.0 premed types =o.
 
🙄 Maybe they should take a look at the USNews rankings of the 2 OK schools.

BTW: there are tons of OSU-COM students who turned down slots at OUHSC. I know that lots of OU students turned down OSU slots, but it's clear that OSU is not the "dropout" school.
 
DrMom said:
🙄 Maybe they should take a look at the USNews rankings of the 2 OK schools.

BTW: there are tons of OSU-COM students who turned down slots at OUHSC. I know that lots of OU students turned down OSU slots, but it's clear that OSU is not the "dropout" school.

Yea. But it's a state school. It ain't the same.
😀

In-state tuition = sexy.
 
Who cares if people laugh at you for doing DO. No point arguing with a fool. You know that you are becoming an excellent profession. He who laughs last laughs best. Just work hard and you will reap rewards. No one will say anything to you and instead be envious of you when you become a great doctor and afford that huge mansion and Mercedes BEnz sitting in your driveway. DO or MD, you are called a doctor. Not many people in this world, have the title of doctor. That ***** that laughed at you 10 years ago, is probably only a "Mr" .
 
Fermata said:
Yea. But it's a state school. It ain't the same.
😀

In-state tuition = sexy.


Yes, but in Abe's situation the other students are comparing OU (MD) and OSU (DO)...both state schools with very similar tuitions.
 
DrMom said:
Yes, but in Abe's situation the other students are comparing OU (MD) and OSU (DO)...both state schools with very similar tuitions.

Indeed. You can also liken this situation to TCOM and WVSOM.

If there were more state DO schools then the public would probably stand a better chance of knowing what the heck a DO is.
 
that dr. jack said:
i just tell them "damn right i didn't have the grades or scores to go M.D.- so effing what?" i give them what they want to hear, and they shut up quickly. sitting there trying to defend yourself to some insecure a$$hat takes up precious energy and brainpower that can be applied elsewhere, like the celiac trunk.
👍

It would suck having to explain a DO to everyone. I have some experience with this issue and this is my realization. I, myself, see a DO in the same light as I do an MD when Igo to doctors, but as a professional, I'd very much rather be an MD.
 
me's a bit curious if MD's and DO's take da same board exams.
 
boyakashawagwan said:
me's a bit curious if MD's and DO's take da same board exams.

They can but they don't necessarily have to as the Osteopathic physicians have their own specialty boards.

Check out these Osteopathic physicians, some are certified by the Board certified by the American Osteopathic Board and others by the American Board (Allopathic)

http://www.newmanrh.org/physicians.htm

Same goes for the COMLEX (Osteopathic) and USMLE (allopathic)
 
Sense said:
Well, I just say that I chose DO because the school was 30 minutes by my house. That was more appealing to me then living 4 years on the other side of the country for the MD.

That's why my wife decided to go MD instead of DO.
 
I recently graduated from Michigan State College of Osteopathic Medicine. This debate over whether to become an MD or a DO is not as significant as you would think. You should base your decision on location, personal preference (personal interactions with current students and staff), and philosophy. For instance, MSUCOM has devoted itself to serving the community and building upon the philosophy of mentorship throughout our training. Incoming students are given peer mentors to "usher" them through the initial adjustments of medical school.

In the end, if you are a smart, hard-working medical student you're going to get a good residency MD or DO affiliated. As a strong DO student I was highly esteemed for my clinical abilities and knowledge base at two reputable MD emergency medicine residencies (Regions in St. Paul and Spectrum Health in Grand Rapids, MI). Sure, if you go to a "Ivy League" MD med school you'll have better name recognition, but most MD med schools do not have an automatic name affiliation with suspected educational quality.

Just starting my first year out of medical school, I could not be prouder of being a physician. I am proud to be a DO! In the end, the nurses, patients, and fellow physicians respect you for the quality of your work and reputation with people not by the initials behind your name.

P.S. In many ways, DO students are very competitive since their clinical rotations seem to demand more clinical performance earlier than MD counterparts...this seems true in my limited comparison with students from other schools.


Matt Flannigan, D.O.


P.S. If you do well on the COMLEX (osteopathic boards) you'll still be competitive for MD residencies, regardless of whether you decide to take the USMLE. COMLEX tends to be highly clinically based.
 
docflanny said:
I recently graduated from Michigan State College of Osteopathic Medicine. This debate over whether to become an MD or a DO is not as significant as you would think. You should base your decision on location, personal preference (personal interactions with current students and staff), and philosophy.

In the end, if you are a smart, hard-working medical student you're going to get a good residency MD or DO affiliated.

👍 👍 👍
 
big ups to da words of wisdom...especially to docflanny. you wouldn't happen to know the Flannigans of Frankfort, IL??

Me undastand that it depends on the doc whether she want to take the COMLEX or USMLE. So, it's my choice, correct?

respek
 
You know what take both, Or just crush the USMLE. What can an MD say if you score higher tan they do on their exam. Just Remember the cheif resident at MCV neurology is a DO.
 
Me like what da Big Bill says...I's to make sure to crush eferyone on da boards...No really...beat eferyone on da heads during da test day.

BOYAKASHA!
 
Big Bill said:
You know what take both, Or just crush the USMLE. What can an MD say if you score higher tan they do on their exam. Just Remember the cheif resident at MCV neurology is a DO.
Not quite. It is a new AACOM mandate that ALL DO candidates take and pass the COMLEX boards--USMLE alone won't suffice. If you don't do this, you don't graduate.
 
Big Bill said:
You know what take both, Or just crush the USMLE. What can an MD say if you score higher tan they do on their exam
Not quite. It is a new AACOM mandate that ALL DO candidates take and pass the COMLEX boards--USMLE alone won't suffice. If you don't do this, you don't graduate.
 
boyakashawagwan said:
big ups to da words of wisdom...especially to docflanny. you wouldn't happen to know the Flannigans of Frankfort, IL??

Me undastand that it depends on the doc whether she want to take the COMLEX or USMLE. So, it's my choice, correct?

respek

Are you trying to type in Patois? Because you sound like Jar Jar Binks (not a good thing).

And by the way, all DO students have to take the COMLEX, but can choose to take the USMLE if they want to be more competitive for allopathic residencies. Zeen?
 
Honestly, I have several friends who are MD in addition to my only sibling. You could say that I have been surrounded by MD's my entire life. Not once has any of my family told me to my face that DO was inferior. In fact, quite the opposite has occured. Nearly every friend and family member that is an MD have reacted like this: "Oh, you are a DO. Man, we have several DO's in our department. Or my attending or chief resident was a DO." It's always been positive. My sister and I are very close and we have a sibling rivalry so we aren't afraid be blunt with one another. Her reaction was the most interesting. She told me that when she was a pre-med, she was concerned about me going to a DO school because she had not heard good things about it. However, she told that she quickly changed her mind upon starting at her MD school because her mentor was a DO and so many of the residents she met with were DO's. Now, it's not even an issue with her and she always tells me to apply to a tough residency at her school. When I reply by saying it could be tough for me to match there because I'm a DO; she says that's not even an issue these days.

What I have learned is that only a few groups of people have bad things to say about DO's. Most of them are pre-meds or parents of aspiring pre-meds. Usually, it's the parent of a pre-med who is an MD that doesn't want his or her child to go DO because that MD grew up in the old school environment when there was a significant stigma associated with being a DO. The pre-meds just exacerbate the situation by exaggerating speculation and spreading these "urban legends" about how a particular DO never got into a certain program etc. Very few actual physicians and especially newly graduated physicians have anything bad to say about DO's.

Ultimately, your residency and connections count more than anything else. If a DO does his residency at the Cleveland Clinic and competes with an MD from an unknown program, the DO will win hands down. Or if you did your residency at a certain hospital and you wanted to pursue a fellowship with that affiliated hospital, you will have a leg on the competition from other programs even if they are MD's.

The bottom line is that the DO stigma is a lot of hype and it's perpetuated by pre-meds. Actual medical students particularly 3rd and 4th year med students have no issues with DO's.
 
I couldn't agree more with Daelroy. I must admit it's very easy to get suckered into the belief that there is a lot of stigmas still about being a DO, but it really doesn't exist like urban legend would describe. Enough said.

Matt Flannigan D.O.
Sparrow Hospital
Lansing, MI
 
Yes, thanks for the replies. Just wanted a general consensus of how people felt regarding the MD/DO thing. I've also been surrounded by MD's most of my life and thus far have been met with nothing but respect.

And San Juan...it's Ali G, not jar jar. A little humor never hurts...even if it's not your brand.
 
most people that dogs DOs, from what ive seen, have no knowledge about medicine, the medical culture of america, or anything related. The last guy i heard actually scowl at my choice for a DO school was a grad student at an ENGLISH program.
 
boyakashawagwan said:
And San Juan...it's Ali G, not jar jar. A little humor never hurts...even if it's not your brand.

wikkidd.....
 
jtorres said:
the other day a nurse at the hospital i work at referred to DOs as "doctor of osteopathetic". let em talk. money bets that he never had what it took to even consider becoming a DO. you cant spend the rest of your lofe defending you decisions. let them talk. only you know of the hard work you put in.


that's a badass term! forget the old favorite "osteoquack"- now i'm gonna put "doctor of osteopathetic" on my business cards instead.
 
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