On The Question of: Shall the Debt Be Repayed?

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WingZeroMD

WingZeroMD

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I started this thread in another Sub-Thread but the Moderate suggested that I make My own Thread. Voila. This is what I am doing.

I hypothesize that Unmatched Medical Students should have their Debt Forgiven no questions asked. If a Bank/Lender/School/Government gives a student money to hopefully get that back money with interest by securing a high paying job in medicine, but the student never ends up securing the job, how should the student be forced to pay back?

If Student matches, secures said job everybody wins. The Student is happy, the bank is happy the School is happy, The Lender is happy
But now if the student loses: the thought of sharing the loss is balked at? The students loses but the banks STILL expect to win.

No
If the Everybody Wins Everybody win, If the Student Loses, Everybody else Has to Lose too. Sound Fair To Me?
 
WingZeroMD said:
I started this thread in another Sub-Thread but the Moderate suggested that I make My own Thread. Voila. This is what I am doing.

I hypothesize that Unmatched Medical Students should have their Debt Forgiven no questions asked. If a Bank/Lender/School/Government gives a student money to hopefully get that back money with interest by securing a high paying job in medicine, but the student never ends up securing the job, how should the student be forced to pay back?

If Student matches, secures said job everybody wins. The Student is happy, the bank is happy the School is happy, The Lender is happy
But now if the student loses: the thought of sharing the loss is balked at? The students loses but the banks STILL expect to win.

No
If the Everybody Wins Everybody win, If the Student Loses, Everybody else Has to Lose too. Sound Fair To Me?
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Smells of entitlement. Should everyone who can't get a job out of grad school or even UG have their debts forgiven?

Your success in life is on you. No one forced you to go to med school.

Also, there are reasons why people don't match.
 
WingZeroMD said:
I started this thread in another Sub-Thread but the Moderate suggested that I make My own Thread. Voila. This is what I am doing.

I hypothesize that Unmatched Medical Students should have their Debt Forgiven no questions asked. If a Bank/Lender/School/Government gives a student money to hopefully get that back money with interest by securing a high paying job in medicine, but the student never ends up securing the job, how should the student be forced to pay back?

If Student matches, secures said job everybody wins. The Student is happy, the bank is happy the School is happy, The Lender is happy
But now if the student loses: the thought of sharing the loss is balked at? The students loses but the banks STILL expect to win.

No
If the Everybody Wins Everybody win, If the Student Loses, Everybody else Has to Lose too. Sound Fair To Me?
Click to expand...
I don't think it's fair, when the student takes out the loan nobody guaranteed them a job. The should keep up their end of the deal, that's what's fair IMO.
 
I'm all for personal responsibility. We all signed on to these loans. But something needs to change, and soon. It obviously can't keep going on like this.

I'm not sure student loan forgiveness ever gets passed, especially for grad loans, but something needs to happen. It is crippling an entire generation, and for young doctors/residents it makes it very difficult to start a family. We already put life on hold to get through med school, and then throw on the debt on top. It's sad that people put off having kids or getting married. It's also sad that people pursue specialties not because it's their passion but because it's almost dumb to choose low paying specialties with the debt you get just going through school.

I know this was a little rant, but I just wish older attendings/school faculty/ etc empathized a little more with the situation. At the end of the day society needs "suckers" like us to sign up for these loans so that society can actually have doctors.

just my 2 cents. I'm pessimistic on anything ever happening with these loans via the federal government. dems control presidency, senate, and house, and they likely can't even pass 10k forgiveness because the senate is stubborn. If it doesn't happen these 2 years (before the dems lose the senate/house in 2022) then it will likely not happen for another decade or ever until it literally cripples the whole economy. then maybe they'll do something.
 
Gardenea said:
I don't think it's fair, when the student takes out the loan nobody guaranteed them a job. The should keep up their end of the deal, that's what's fair IMO.
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They Took out the money with the implicit understanding they could earn an income commensurate to a loan of that amount. We are NOT talking about 20K or 15K or 25K little Angel investments here folks. We are talking about amounts of a Quarter freaking Million Dollars, $300K and above. At that point, thats a bet. Will the "Repay The Loan Truthers" be saying the same things when an Unmatched Creighton Students owes Half a Million? Mind you this debt is dischargeable.

One SDN'er said well Matching is not Guaranteed.. Will fine then.. I understand that. Well then in that case getting the money back is not guaranteed either, No?


Nobody has an issue when the Student is able pay back the loan. When the Student win (ie secures the job), its all dandy. Not peep from the "Payback Truthers," The system or logic is not questioned then?

But the Powers that be want to set up a game whereby THEY WIN, regardless of the fact if the Student Wins or not? What Kind of Blood Clot game is that??
 
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I’m still going with my GME analogy...

If the diagnosis is a bad investment...

The only cure is... 💎🙌

But no seriously, its not the bank's fault (nor the government's) you couldn't make it. They are just playing the odds on a ROI. Actually, its your fault and the schools fault for having either 1) not given you adequate resources/training or 2) making a bad investment in you as well. The bank is just the middle person in the transaction. Really what you need to fix is the ballooning cost of education since the education system will financially be rewarded irrespective of your personal success (or lack thereof).... so have at it.
 
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If I give you money as an expert stock picker. I can reasonably sure that you are pick stocks and good faith to the best of your ability, but the stock crashes to zero, in what world can I expect your money back? If GME went to the Moon and started being valued like BRK-A (200K$+/share) you'd have NO ISSUES with the deal then I'd assume?

But now if the Stock prices crashes to Zero now I wanna start huffing and puffing? Whats up with that? It does not make sense to me? If SDN's are gonna say "Matching is No Guarantee" ( A sentiment I 100% agree with by they way) If you throw your money to the tune of Quarter million on an unsure thing, a thing with no guarantees as the SDN'er said" Why are you expect to get you money back?

Make it Make Sense
 
WingZeroMD said:
If I give you money as an expert stock picker. I can reasonably sure that you are pick stocks and good faith to the best of your ability, but the stock crashes to zero, in what world can I expect your money back? If GME went to the Moon and started being valued like BRK-A (200K$+/share) you'd have NO ISSUES with the deal then I'd assume?

But now if the Stock prices crashes to Zero now I wanna start huffing and puffing? Whats up with that? It does not make sense to me? If SDN's are gonna say "Matching is No Guarantee" ( A sentiment I 100% agree with by they way) If you throw your money to the tune of Quarter million on an unsure thing, a thing with no guarantees as the SDN'er said" Why are you expect to get you money back?

Make it Make Sense
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I'm not picking the stock, you're picking the stock. I'm just the broker who is allowing you to options trade cause hey, freedom of choice.

Sometimes you eat the bear... sometimes the bear eats you.... so find a bear you have a better chance against.
342b6w5upmh01.jpg
 
WingZeroMD said:
We are talking about amounts of a Quarter freaking Million Dollars, $300K and above.
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The student decided to take out a loan to pursue the dreams of becoming a doctor, nobody forced them to take out a loan. (Although I agree it's very sad when someone has to pay such a large chunk of money when they have no job to support paying it back)
WingZeroMD said:
Nobody has an issue when the Student is able pay back the loan.
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Because the student is paying back the money they loaned, why should the student get borrow/loan money and never pay it back. It's not fair to the lender.
 
WingZeroMD said:
What is fair in setting up a game where by regardless of my outcome, you come out on top anyways? What kind of fairness is that?
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I don't understand.... In exchange for a large sum of money, someone else is funding your expensive education. Once you take out that loan you understand all else that follows it. But because you (likely no fault of your own) couldn't find a job, you don't want to pay. That isn't very responsible and the lender shouldn't be forced to just deal with it.
 
WingZeroMD said:
What is fair in setting up a game where by regardless of my outcome, you come out on top anyways? What kind of fairness is that?
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WingZeroMD said:
Is there an iteration of the game whereby somehow the banks/schools/lenders Lose? Just asking?
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You seem like the type of guy that would go to a casino, lose all your money then complain it's rigged and demand your money back. If you don't like the risk, don't play.
 
WingZeroMD said:
What is fair in setting up a game where by regardless of my outcome, you come out on top anyways? What kind of fairness is that?
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The lender giving a 22 year old $300-400,000 dollars without any significant credit history. That's the risk they take.
 
WingZeroMD said:
Is there an iteration of the game whereby somehow the banks/schools/lenders Lose? Just asking?
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Yes, when you don’t pay back what you borrowed, the lender loses. And if the school graduates no successes, then it has no future student payors and it loses.
 
WingZeroMD said:
Is there an iteration of the game whereby somehow the banks/schools/lenders Lose? Just asking?
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The debt is forgiven if the borrower dies, PSLF, or enters one of the other income based repayment options and makes a certain number of payments. I'm sure there are other ways the debt can be forgiven.
 
The lender does not lose. If loans of students who don't match get forgiven, interest rates just raise from 6% to 9%.

I understand the "not having any boots" rebuttal to the pull yourself up by your bootstraps argument, but honestly, I would argue anyone holding a ticket to a job that can pay, at minimum, around 7x the average national salary if you want it to has a pretty nice pair of boots. Once you get into med school it's your bag to fumble.

I understand wanting to protect those who are in that position, but that is a very privileged group if only solely because of the nature of the opportunity they've been given.
 
WingZeroMD said:
I started this thread in another Sub-Thread but the Moderate suggested that I make My own Thread. Voila. This is what I am doing.

I hypothesize that Unmatched Medical Students should have their Debt Forgiven no questions asked. If a Bank/Lender/School/Government gives a student money to hopefully get that back money with interest by securing a high paying job in medicine, but the student never ends up securing the job, how should the student be forced to pay back?

If Student matches, secures said job everybody wins. The Student is happy, the bank is happy the School is happy, The Lender is happy
But now if the student loses: the thought of sharing the loss is balked at? The students loses but the banks STILL expect to win.

No
If the Everybody Wins Everybody win, If the Student Loses, Everybody else Has to Lose too. Sound Fair To Me?
Click to expand...
The lender is not your investment partner. They lend you money with clear terms. They also lend money to undergrad English majors at private universities who have no hope of a high paying job... why should med students be any different. If you wanted the bank to take on that much risk in lending you money, they’ll need a much higher return on their investment to account for the few who don’t make it through...

we have a broken system. The cost shouldn’t be this high. The match process should be better etc etc. having the lender eat the cost is hardly fair. Maybe the school should refund the money since they didn’t use that money to educate the student anyhow.
 
beattheprocess said:
You seem like the type of guy that would go to a casino, lose all your money then complain it's rigged and demand your money back. If you don't like the risk, don't play.
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Just Like @SurfingDoctor said.

If I am a very good gambler, and you give me a quarter million to go gamble (to preseumably make more money) and I lose all the money, how are you gonna ask me for the money back? I tried in good faith to win money. I didn't and the money is gone. We both Lose. Periodt.
If I turned the 250K into 400K, would you complain then? My guess is no?
 
WingZeroMD said:
Just Like @SurfingDoctor said.

If I am a very good gambler, and you give me a quarter million to go gamble (to preseumably make more money) and I lose all the money, how are you gonna ask me for the money back? I tried in good faith to win money. I didn't and the money is gone. We both Lose. Periodt.
If I turned the 250K into 400K, would you complain then? My guess is no?
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If he gives you the money to gamble, and you sign papers/a contract agreeing that you'd have to pay him back regardless of the outcome, then aren't you obligated to do so? They wouldn't be complaining because they wouldn't've lost money.
 
WingZeroMD said:
Just Like @SurfingDoctor said.

If I am a very good gambler, and you give me a quarter million to go gamble (to preseumably make more money) and I lose all the money, how are you gonna ask me for the money back? I tried in good faith to win money. I didn't and the money is gone. We both Lose. Periodt.
If I turned the 250K into 400K, would you complain then? My guess is no?
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Is that an even remotely realistic scenario?

The lender doesn't lend you money on the hopes that you make a ton of money and pay them back a huge profit. They get the same loan principle plus interest whether you become a pediatrician or neurosurgeon.

I do think their should be some student loan reform. Why the government gets to loan its citizens money at 7% interest is beyond me. It should be much lower.
 
WingZeroMD said:
If I am a very good gambler, and you give me a quarter million to go gamble (to preseumably make more money) and I lose all the money, how are you gonna ask me for the money back?
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Because you took my money and agreed to pay it back. Me giving you money is predicated on the fact that I would get my money back. If I knew I was effectively getting scammed I would not given you the money.
WingZeroMD said:
I tried in good faith to win money. I didn't and the money is gone. We both Lose. Periodt.
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No, you lost with my money. I didn't do anything because I'm not your business partner.
Also please never use "periodt" again
WingZeroMD said:
If I turned the 250K into 400K, would you complain then? My guess is no?
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No because I would be expecting the 250k back either way. I would just expect the 250k (and interest if applicable), not the 150k you earned in profit.
 
If I don’t match, can I survive? The nice thing about federal loans is yes, I can survive. I can do income-based repayment for the rest of my life and do just fine. I can die with north of a million dollars in student loans as I make tiny minimum monthly payments on my loans that don’t even cover my interest, and still have a decent quality of life in the meantime. Running an income-based repayment calculator, if I had a $25k/year job as a single person, I’d only need to pay $78/month on my loans. I could afford that - I’ve lived on less than $25k/year before. It sucks but it’s doable in some regions of the country.

It’s a whole different story if you took out private loans. There are very few jobs other than medicine where you’re going to make the money to pay back thousands of dollars per month, so if you don’t match, you’re going to be in really hot water with a private loan. And that is *absolutely* something you should really think about before taking a loan like that.

Any major life decision, especially regarding finances, should be weighed very carefully before you do it. Student debt is especially risky IMO. If you buy an expensive house or car, you can sell it or the bank can repossess it if you lose your income source and have your debt erased. You can’t exactly chop your knowledge out of your brain and sell it to get your debt forgiven.

If you are just taking out hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt on a whim without thinking about how you would handle the consequences if it doesn’t work out, I’m not too sorry if it backfires on you tbh. I personally would not have gone to medical school if I’d had to take out private loans to be here because I don’t have that level of risk tolerance.
 
Medical education is expensive, but it is also one of the most surefire ways to have a successful career. If I told investors that they could multiply their money many times over their lives for the price of 250K-300K with a 90+% certainty, they would probably take it. This is not like picking stocks where 99.9% of what happens is out of the individual's control. The only control he has is whether to be involved or not. That is not how school and training work. One has a lot more control.

There should always be someone who does not make the cut in anything right? There is no reason to have standards if not. I'm not signing up to be cared for by a physician who barely squeaked by merely because it feels bad if he does not make it.

A better way to approach this would be bankruptcy law reform with regards to student loans, not outright forgiveness for someone who bet on himself and failed.
 
And Tell me what bank is giving a 22 year old even 1/5th of that money without some implicit understanding that he is going to pay it back? Yes for all of you contract truthers "sHe siGNed thE cONTract," would that Deal whereby the Bank Wins regardless be acceptable if the amount was Half Million? what about 600K? The underlying fundamentals of the agreement has changed if the student doesn't match. Sorry Bank/School/Lender:

We L

Someone mentioned fair. Not one time did I mention fair I puposely left that out but since @Gardenea brought it up, lets go there. If a school loan is debt, it should be able to be discharged right? Article 1 gives congress the Power to hear All Bankruptcies right? Well how is it fair that in the 70's the laws were changed so that student debt could not be discharged? If they think they need it then with the annual rise in tuition, it is definitely needed now. Is it availaible? No is that "fair? No

See There was a time that lending money to a potential medical student was almost a guaranteed thing. He was certainly going to get a residency and he was certainly going to pay back the money. NO ONE COMPLAINED THEN

But now things have happened to erode the rigor of that implication? not by any faulty of the lowly student I add. It's not as safe now AND the cost has gone up. ALOT. TO THE TUNE OF A QUARTER MILLION DOLLARS (I've seen 350K at Georgetown).
So Now we have a situation where the underlying assumption have eroded, the student can't pay but he still has to participate in this scheme where the Bank Wins anyway, and you think banging his head about some contract is gonna help the matter and get your money back..🤔🤔? and Why on earth would a Bank/Lender/School give a 23yo a QUARTER MILLION DOLLARS without some iron clad guarantee? Sound tad dumb to me. I'm not giving no 23yo that kinna money without some guarantees. If its a business that some will fail, then it is what it is. After all, I gave a freakin' 23 yo with no credit history or no history of successful entrepreneurship a 250K.

That's a no for me.

Its Crazy to see Physicians in here not even try and engage in at least some self preservation. You only say that cause the laws and guns are on your side, for now. Laws are written on paper and that paper can be torn to shreds and re-written. And those guns can be turned on you as well. You will not be saved going on like this.

For me there is no "fair" in this. T Its ok to say "pay because we will have the US Marshals kick in your door" I accept that. But soon that day may change
 
WingZeroMD said:
I started this thread in another Sub-Thread but the Moderate suggested that I make My own Thread. Voila. This is what I am doing.

I hypothesize that Unmatched Medical Students should have their Debt Forgiven no questions asked. If a Bank/Lender/School/Government gives a student money to hopefully get that back money with interest by securing a high paying job in medicine, but the student never ends up securing the job, how should the student be forced to pay back?

If Student matches, secures said job everybody wins. The Student is happy, the bank is happy the School is happy, The Lender is happy
But now if the student loses: the thought of sharing the loss is balked at? The students loses but the banks STILL expect to win.

No
If the Everybody Wins Everybody win, If the Student Loses, Everybody else Has to Lose too. Sound Fair To Me?
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Just move to a different country, pick up a different passport, then drop the US passport. Problem solved.
 
The issue is tuition... it's just a terrible system when becoming a physician, a profession that society NEEDS, requires individuals to take on mortgage-levels of debt with very little recourse in how to pay that back. This is why PSLF is necessary imo - at least you can maybe get some sort of 501(c)3 job and have it wiped no matter how badly you were screwed. The reality is that if tuition levels weren't so obscene we wouldn't really need to be having this conversation. I think it's a mistake to accept the astronomical levels of debt and think about what we can do after that for people who go unmatched
 
The bank isn't "winning", they are getting the money back that you borrowed.

A loan, as defined by the oxford dictionary is "a thing that is borrowed, especially a sum of money that is expected to be paid back with interest."

It is not "money expected to be paid back IF your plan goes as you want it to".

This argument is extremely illogical. This is like saying, "I got a mortgage for a $500k home but I couldn't keep my job (due to poor performance) so I am going to need the bank to take the hit on this one."

The only logical point you could be making would have to do with the cost of tuition itself. Arguing someone shouldn't have to pay back a loan because they failed to successfully match is silly.
 
You take out a loan on the condition that you will pay back the loan, it's that simple really. It's not the lender's fault you did not match. There are reasons people do not match. It is a probably a problem with their application, not some systemic injustice. I had to take medical leave during medical school and had no problem matching into residency and fellowship despite having to answer "yes my education was interrupted" on both applications. I wasn't applying to Derm/Ortho/Plastics or anything, you have to realistically gauge what you are competitive for.
 
WingZeroMD said:
I started this thread in another Sub-Thread but the Moderate suggested that I make My own Thread. Voila. This is what I am doing.

I hypothesize that Unmatched Medical Students should have their Debt Forgiven no questions asked. If a Bank/Lender/School/Government gives a student money to hopefully get that back money with interest by securing a high paying job in medicine, but the student never ends up securing the job, how should the student be forced to pay back?

If Student matches, secures said job everybody wins. The Student is happy, the bank is happy the School is happy, The Lender is happy
But now if the student loses: the thought of sharing the loss is balked at? The students loses but the banks STILL expect to win.

No
If the Everybody Wins Everybody win, If the Student Loses, Everybody else Has to Lose too. Sound Fair To Me?
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You could use a course in money and banking. The prerequisite courses are generally the entire freshman econ sequence.

The banks don't invest in medical students. If they invested in medical students and were willing to get stiffed occasionally, they would bargain for an equity interest in physician earnings over a period of time. Instead they just lend students money and expect to get it paid back with interest. Furthermore, the banks aren't lending out bank money. They lend the money owned by their depositors. If the banks can't collect on their loans, they go under and the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (ultimately tax payers) and the banks' depositors get hammered. One of the chronic problems in developing countries is that banks will not lend in those countries because the courts in those countries will not enforce the terms of loans.

I have argued vociferously on this website that many medical students are grossly overcharged for their education. The dean of the NYU medical school, Robert Grossman, stated in an interview that most medical school tuition is diverted to support unproductive faculty. Furthermore, if LECOM can charge its students $33,000 per year for tuition with virtually zero charitable support and state funding, why are other medical schools charging $70,000? Don't blame the banks. Blame the schools.

For what its worth, I sympathize with medical school graduates that went unmatched. It should be noted, however, that the total residency slots leading to board certification in the NRMP match, ophthalmology match, military match, urology match, integrated plastics match and the out of match programs in NYC greatly exceed the number of Americans graduating from medical school. If an American med school graduate has no red flags and is realistic about his/her prospects in the match, that person will match.
 
If a lender reads your post, the interest rate automatically doubles for anyone who agrees with it. That is a high-risk attitude as they’re already looking for a way out of the consequences of their bad decisions. If someone is accepted to Med school, they can match. I know, I know. “There aren’t enough residencies for everyone.” Knowing this, Med students should be saying “Someone is not matching and that someone is not me! I will match if I have to study 9 days per week, 36 hours per day while mowing the PD’s lawn every Saturday morning.” Even if someone fails to match, jobs paying over $100k won’t be hard to find with an MD after your name. You took the money. You promised to pay it back. Pay it back. If the terms are unfair, don’t take the loan. Saving that kind of money on a normal salary is possible.
 
What are even the semantics of being "unmatched"? Is it after one cycle? Two? Five years? What's to stop a med student with some savvy tax lawyer parents from applying to specialties they're not competitive for, getting that loan forgiven, and then re-applying to a different specialty? If it's more than one unsuccessful cycle, what happens during those off-years? Does the interest accumulate? Do your payments freeze? Does some bored of out their mind bureaucrat review your app to make sure you're trying hard enough to Match? Does the bank/government get to harass you into a different specialty?

I sympathize with unmatched med students. It's got to absolutely hurt to not Match after working so hard after so many years. And med school tuition is really ridiculously high and there are many issues associated with that as well as the number of residency spots. But the idea of me going to a bank and asking for a cool loan of $300k to invest in a business venture, and then not expecting to pay it back if I fail, is just baffling.
 
acstylin said:
If a lender reads your post, the interest rate automatically doubles for anyone who agrees with it. That is a high-risk attitude as they’re already looking for a way out of the consequences of their bad decisions. If someone is accepted to Med school, they can match. I know, I know. “There aren’t enough residencies for everyone.” Knowing this, Med students should be saying “Someone is not matching and that someone is not me! I will match if I have to study 9 days per week, 36 hours per day while mowing the PD’s lawn every Saturday morning.” Even if someone fails to match, jobs paying over $100k won’t be hard to find with an MD after your name. You took the money. You promised to pay it back. Pay it back. If the terms are unfair, don’t take the loan. Saving that kind of money on a normal salary is possible.
Click to expand...

if the government didn't charge an arm and a leg for interest that would also be immensely helpful
 
jambro said:
Uh huh... and tuition used to be a lot less... and graduate student loans USED to be subsidized like undergrad... and when you compare them to a place like Australia it's significantly higher.
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Yes, tuition used to be lower... so maybe try to figure that out why that is ballooning instead of blaming interest rates which are on a downward trend.
 
SurfingDoctor said:
Yes, tuition used to be lower... so maybe try to figure that out why that is ballooning instead of blaming interest rates which are on a downward trend.
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The reality is that forcing med schools (especially private ones) to lower their tuition rates would be extremely difficult; on the other hand, interest rates and the policies behind federal loans can have a meaningful impact on how much debt a student owes by the time they're able to start paying it off. I personally think Australia has a good system
 
WingZeroMD said:
If I give you money as an expert stock picker. I can reasonably sure that you are pick stocks and good faith to the best of your ability, but the stock crashes to zero, in what world can I expect your money back? If GME went to the Moon and started being valued like BRK-A (200K$+/share) you'd have NO ISSUES with the deal then I'd assume?

But now if the Stock prices crashes to Zero now I wanna start huffing and puffing? Whats up with that? It does not make sense to me? If SDN's are gonna say "Matching is No Guarantee" ( A sentiment I 100% agree with by they way) If you throw your money to the tune of Quarter million on an unsure thing, a thing with no guarantees as the SDN'er said" Why are you expect to get you money back?

Make it Make Sense
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You do realize that if you get what you want - the banks are just going to not loan money to students "at risk" of not matching - DOs, FMGs, low tier MD schools. Maybe URMs since they might not have gotten in on their own merits. Not sure your solution is going to help you long term.

EDIT: Good god, no Im not saying the URM stuff is true. Im just saying that the solution being proposed is going to result in some disastrous aftereffects you aren't considering.
 
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Matthew9Thirtyfive said:
Being lower than they used to be doesn’t preclude them from still being too high. There’s no reason the government should be charging 6% interest.
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I mean, they could charge less to recoup the money. To offset that, they could lower the reimbursements on residency salaries. Seems fair.

Alternatively, they could get out of it all together, let the banks charge you whatever and let residencies adopt whatever model they like. Also fair.
 
WingZeroMD said:
I started this thread in another Sub-Thread but the Moderate suggested that I make My own Thread. Voila. This is what I am doing.

I hypothesize that Unmatched Medical Students should have their Debt Forgiven no questions asked. If a Bank/Lender/School/Government gives a student money to hopefully get that back money with interest by securing a high paying job in medicine, but the student never ends up securing the job, how should the student be forced to pay back?

If Student matches, secures said job everybody wins. The Student is happy, the bank is happy the School is happy, The Lender is happy
But now if the student loses: the thought of sharing the loss is balked at? The students loses but the banks STILL expect to win.

No
If the Everybody Wins Everybody win, If the Student Loses, Everybody else Has to Lose too. Sound Fair To Me?
Click to expand...
The classic mentality of this generation: I mess up but it’s not my fault and someone else should fix it!
Few points:
1) no one forced you to go to Med school
2) you knew the risk that you may not match despite board scores
3) when you sign the loan contract it’s between you and lender. How is it my problem or the tax payers that you didn’t match
4) how does “everyone lose”?
It is this mentality of “someone else pay/fix it” that is royally f*cking up the world and undermining any notion of “responsibility” anyone has.
 
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