Online Undergrad and then Med School

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nonya

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With out starting a fire storm of replies.....I am currently in a online school for my BS degree. Has anyone here gone from online college to medical school?
Thank You

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I can think of no reputable allopathic school that would consider an applicant that never set foot in a classroom during undergrad. If you want to go to medical school, apply to a real school.
 
With out starting a fire storm of replies.....I am currently in a online school for my BS degree. Has anyone here gone from online college to medical school?
Thank You

I tend to agree with the above poster. While some people get away with an online course or two offered by a reputable brick and mortar school, I've yet to see anyone in med school who did a substantial part of their college degree online. Maybe a decade or two from now that will be common, but it's simply not done today.
 
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How are you doing your Biology and Chem labs online?

While I'm sure that adcomms won't give a rat's tush about English or History classes online, I suspect that they're going to want to know in detail how you pulled off the science pre-reqs.

I have combined CLEPs, online courses and brick&mortar classes through the core crap, but I'm doing all my higher-levels in a real classroom, even if it's only taught by a TA.

I can't speak for the med schools though, and you may find out that having an online degree through an accredited school is just fine.


Shan:luck:
 
I am earning my BS in IT in an online school. I am in in military so it limits my time as to going to a "real" school right. After I posted I called UT and Texas A&M. They both told me they'd accept online labs and pre-reqs. I will get these knocked out in due time though.
 
I am active duty as well. I have taken all of my pre-reqs at a community college and have completed my AS. I am thinking of enrolling in Touro which is an online BA program. I don't know WHY any medical school wouldn't accept an applicant with a degree from an Acredited US UNIVERSTIY! that is the key ensure your online school is acredited.
 
Whereas there may be no hard and fast restriction against online courses, remember that med school is competitive. It would look funny to have any classes online, and as a result, you might be giving the ADCOMS a reason to throw your application in the circular filing cabinet. I agree with flopotomist-labs need to be done in a brick and mortar, and why not get the classes there as well. 1 or 2 non-BCPM may be taken at a non-4 year (this includes CC) but try not to do any more so your application gets serious consideration.
 
I am earning my BS in IT in an online school. I am in in military so it limits my time as to going to a "real" school right. After I posted I called UT and Texas A&M. They both told me they'd accept online labs and pre-reqs. I will get these knocked out in due time though.
You should thank god that you're in Texas then. Most schools flat out will not accept online degrees, even if they are offered from accredited universities. I researched the acceptance of online education for medical school, law school and business school (for academic reasons, not personal).

Disclosure: I worked in online education, assisting universities with converting classroom courses to online offerings, for years. I'm a proponent of online education.

Due to my job background, I had a bit of online education in my application. I contacted schools I was applying to (which were many: 37) and every one said they'd accept "some" online education in my application. Also, every medical school I contacted said that they would not accept online learning for prerequisites.

OP- Before committing to this path, contact medical schools that you're interested in attending and specifically ask if they will accept a) an entirely online degree and b) online prerequisites. Ask them and get responses in writing. Do not assume that because a school doesn't list prohibitions to online learning that they will accept classes.

I was accepted to UC Davis, who have a requirement of an upper division science class (no lab). When they found out that my biochem class was online, they said I had to retake it in a classroom setting prior to matriculation. This was in April before a July start date.

I realize that being in the military makes things challenging. If you get a posting you'll be at long enough, try taking community college classes. After you've reached AA status, see about extension classes. Anything other than online. Worst case scenario, wait until after your service is finished and then pursue classroom education.

Glad to hear you heard good news from UT and A&M, but if you aren't accepted there, you could find yourself SOL. Repeating a class for me was a nightmare. I can't imagine repeating a degree.
 
I don't know WHY any medical school wouldn't accept an applicant with a degree from an Acredited US UNIVERSTIY! that is the key ensure your online school is acredited.
It's not an accreditation issue, it's an online learning. Med schools are conservative institutions. They have been slow to move to online technology. They are not accepting.

If you apply to med schools with an online degree, you will limit yourself to a small handful of schools that will even consider your app. And even amongst those, there is a good chance there would still be prejudice against the fact that your learning is online, which will reduce your chances more.

Bad, bad juju...
 
I think UT-System med schools and A&M are more likely to accept online courses because both parent universities offer online classes. Mind you, UT doesn't offer pre-reqs online and A&M doesn't offer many science-based classes online (with exception of a few sprinklings of undergrad math courses and whole boatload of graduate math and stat classes for their online grad degree). But nonetheless, both UT and A&M seem to be on the forefront of major institutions offering online classes. Hell, even Johns Hopkins has an online MPH program.

But still, one should follow what notdeadyet suggested and get the response from each medical school in writing. That is the safest option.
 
I agree with most regarding online degrees; however, I would doubt it being an issue regarding a few online classes (English, Math, other liberal art classes, etc.).

Furthermore, I don't understand how med schools can tell if you had online classes or not. I've taken an English class online, economic classes, and a history class. I've looked at my official transcripts and nothing indicates these classes were taken in an online environment.

It would be a bit more obvious if someone earned their degree through University of Phoenix, Western Governors University, etc.
 
While I do agree greatly with most of the above post somethings we must keep in mind. We are NON-Traditional applicants so may not have access to on campus courses because we are I don't know over seas or going to war, defending our country.

I would think most med school will not except online pre-reqs unless its english or something. Not sure but as the previous post said check.

2nd not all med schools require a BA/BS just 90 credit hours or 3 years to include pre-reqs. After that you can apply....so having a BA online or not would just make your application more competitive (but almost 100% of applicants do).

I am not sure your position in the military but if you are a medic or Hospital Corpsman as I am you have a TON of ACE (American Council on Education) credits on your SMART transcript that the majority of people don't have which are medically related. If you have gone to war (or several times like most of us) I tend to think that where you got your BA from is somewhat irrelivant with ALL of your real life experience.

Again I agree that Pre-reqs should be done in the classroom. Check the MSAR which tells exact requirements as well as check the Medical school your interested in and see what they require. More than you would think only require 90 credits but most require BA/BS....

Don't mean to come off wrong on this I know how hard it is being active duty(as I am) to reach the goal of being a Doctor (09) don't let anyone tell you that it can't be done or how to do it.......(unless of course the are on the adcom)

Good luck!!!👍
 
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2nd not all med schools require a BA/BS just 90 credit hours or 3 years to include pre-reqs. After that you can apply....so having a BA online or not would just make your application more competitive (but almost 100% of applicants do).

.....

Again I agree that Pre-reqs should be done in the classroom. Check the MSAR which tells exact requirements as well as check the Medical school your interested in and see what they require. More than you would think only require 90 credits but most require BA/BS....


The reason med schools sometimes do not require a BA/BS is:

1. For those seven year direct from undergrad people. For those programs, one must only do well in the undergrad program to be accepted.

2. For EXCEPTIONAL students who, under really special circumstances did not finish their undergrad degree but the school want them to matriculate there anyways.

However....

DO NOT GO THINKING YOU CAN GET INTO MED SCHOOL WITHOUT AN UNDERGRAD DEGREE UNLESS YOU ARE IN A SPECIAL PROGRAM.

The fact that close to 100% of students in many med schools DO have a bachelors should indicate to you that most med schools will NOT accept anything less.



As for the online thing....yeah, try to avoid that as much as possible. I can't imagine how you'd get a good handling on the lab portion if you do everything online....and while it's true that one does not need to be a good lab tech to do med school (god knows, I'd be screwed :laugh:), it would be hard for people to believe you can do chem or bio lab when you've never stepped inside of one.

Med school is fairly competitive as it is and the online programs will put you at a disadvantage. Adcoms are conservative by nature and they will not look on the online experience as cutting edge. The best thing to do is to make sure your prereqs are done in a traditional setting.
 
Just be careful doing this. While it may be true that a VERY small handful of US med schools may accept online credit, the vast majority don't. And you need to apply widely and broadly (everyone does).

Too risky, IMHO.

What's the rush? Why not do labs and other important pre-reqs in a regular classroom when your tour is over?
 
Which schools are there that accept online learning? I am pursuing my BS online and I am also doing all of my prereq's at the local university. I have a full time career that wont allow attending university on campus full time. I'm taking leave from work during the day as it is just to get to the science and lab classes.

I understand the opinion that a school would be reluctant to accept online credit and I partially agree. Where is the information that you are validating this with? I have spoken with the "pre-med" advisor at my local university and he did not seem to think that an online degree would be a hinderance, given my current circumstance (I am a cop and my degree is in criminal justice).

Thoughts?
 
For those entertaining thoughts of doing the online BA, I'd just recommend contacting a sample of schools you're interested in and ask them a) will they accept it and b) if they do, will your degree be viewed as second rate (and therefore possibly make you a non-competitive applicant).
 
Also, even if the school tells you officially (even in writing) that they accept online credits, keep in mind that the admission officers/committees might not. They could easily reject your application (due to online courses/degrees) and have other excuses to officially tell you other than your online credentials (such as there were 10,000 applicants for 150 seats).

Medical school admission is very competitive and schools are looking for the best applicants. It is not a checklist of "90 credit hours check, finish pre-reqs check -> offer admission". You are competing against people who have stellar academic records from established brick&mortor schools for limited interview slots and even more limited admission slots.

Don't go about the process thinking "what can I do to satisfy the requirements" but "what can I do to best improve my chances at admission".

Online schools or educations, especially in the conservative world of medicine, are not as respected as the "traditional" methods. That does not mean that anyone who does online education will not be accepted ... I am sure you will find a few med students/doctors who did do part of their undergraduate education online. But they may have been admitted despite their online education (other qualities that impressed adcoms).

Getting into medical school is competitive and is an uphill battle (and the incline is steeper for nontraditionals). You want to optimize your chance of admission. While it may be easier to get an online degree (or do an online science course) ... think of your long-term goal.
 
Furthermore, I don't understand how med schools can tell if you had online classes or not. I've taken an English class online, economic classes, and a history class. I've looked at my official transcripts and nothing indicates these classes were taken in an online environment.

This actually raises an interesting point. I have a couple of online classes to my name as well (taken through my university over summer terms) and I haven't seen anything on my official transcript that would indicate that they were online courses.

As this poster stated, if courses were taken through Univ. of Phoenix, etc then it would be obvious. However, if the courses were taken through a "regular" university that also offered some online learning (many/most do these days), I'm not sure how they'd know.

Still, here's a thought for the OP. A few years back I considered doing a complete online degree and just prereqs at the CC but I knew this would be frowned upon. So I gave up my career, went to a "regular" university, and started working full time nights/weekends making less money (I'm married with kids) and made the necessary sacrifices until I could get my EMT and get into the medical field. It was HARD but I think it's going to pay off big time. I'm not saying this to ring my own bell, but just to tell you that I've been there as many others have and I know you can do it too if you're willing to make the sacrifices to put yourself in the best position possible for your career in medicine. But regardless of what you do, best of luck to you and wishes for much success!!
 
Medical school admission is very competitive and schools are looking for the best applicants. It is not a checklist of "90 credit hours check, finish pre-reqs check -> offer admission". You are competing against people who have stellar academic records from established brick&mortor schools for limited interview slots and even more limited admission slots.

Don't go about the process thinking "what can I do to satisfy the requirements" but "what can I do to best improve my chances at admission".

Very true. Every time I hear of people who say that med schools don't even require a BS/BA and only require 90 credits etc, I get the impression that person did not understand the reality of med school acceptances. Medical school is not like college where as long as you have all the minimal requirements, they will let you in. They will be looking for the BEST applicant and being conservative in nature, they won't go for the new snazzy online way of learning.

Anyway, to the OP, I forgot to mention that some of the newer DO schools may be more open to nontraditional ways of education such as online education. They typically seem more welcoming of nontrads and may be more accepting of nontraditionals' need to work in the daytime. You may want to check it out in the DO forums.
 
Its pretty annoying when people who have never attended online classes assume they are not "real" classes. I have attended both and have come to the conclusion that online classes are actually much harder then the traditional classroom classes. You actually have to be self disciplined and motivated enough to learn the material without have a teacher right there to hold your hand.
Also since it is online there isn't alot of test taking where you can cram the night before so that you can pass the test and then forget everything on it the next day. You have to write many many papers and in the process you learn alot more.
As far as labs go, I know some schools have online labs which I don't think would be acceptable, but sometimes you can do your labs seperate in an actual classroom.
 
I tend to agree with both points of veiw here. Online classes are hard. Every time I have a question I have to do the reasearch to figure out the answer. We also write A LOT of papers. I didn't really think much of all the writting until my sister started her masters degree. I write about as much as she does....

That being said, I can see how traditional medical schools would shy away from online programs. They are fairly new and medicine is one of the oldest arts. Also I think that there is a stigma attached to online learning that makes it feel sub par.

So what do you guys think... Give up my career and go to school full time or continue on my current path ( Online undergrad and in class prereq's)?
 
So what do you guys think... Give up my career and go to school full time or continue on my current path ( Online undergrad and in class prereq's)?
Ask yourself this: how serious are you about becoming a doctor?

This is the non-trad forum, so most of us gave up careers to pursue medicine. You have to to go to medical school. Trying to eek out another couple of years of working to save the hassle of going back to school is penny wise/pound foolish.

Doing an online undergrad degree will seriously hamper your ability to get in to medical school. Med school is compeititve enough to get accepted. Pursuing an alternative degree option that will find your application in the wastebasket at most schools is a bad idea.
 
Ask yourself this: how serious are you about becoming a doctor?

This is the non-trad forum, so most of us gave up careers to pursue medicine. You have to to go to medical school. Trying to eek out another couple of years of working to save the hassle of going back to school is penny wise/pound foolish.

Doing an online undergrad degree will seriously hamper your ability to get in to medical school. Med school is compeititve enough to get accepted. Pursuing an alternative degree option that will find your application in the wastebasket at most schools is a bad idea.

I think you answered the OP's question more than adequately. You even did research on the topic. It staggers me how people will ask for information and when they get an answer different than they had hoped, lash out at the person giving the answer.
 
I don't think that adcoms necessarily view online courses as 'easier,' so to say - but as less competetive. Depending on where you took those online courses of course. If you have taken the courses at a traditional university, than as mentioned it isn't indicated on the transcript and they won't view them any differently. Most likely in that case you've also taken regular classes as well, I believe most traditional universities wouldn't necessarily have all of the coursework available in online format. But however, if you have taken them at a school such as the University of Pheonix etc. then, although I agree that they can be just as hard in terms of workload, they will not be as competetive in terms of grading, and the average student that you will be competing against will generally be a full time working adult and not your typical gunner premed. Thus you should be able to pull off a higher overall GPA, as most of those adults have other priorities, making it easier for a premed to produce work that is superior.

Personally, I have taken online courses and my girlfriend as a matter of fact recieved her BS from U of Phoenix. Although she was quite busy writing numerous papers for her classes, the competition that is typical at a traditional university was non existent. She had group papers in EVERY class, which in some classes like Algebra didn't seem to make any sense to me at all. But after observing her courses I soon learned that she consistently had trouble getting her groups to even participate, let alone compete for grades. And the students that did contribute contributed useless work, she was constantly doing their work for them as she was interested in pursuing graduate work else where and worried about her GPA. We soon came to the conclusion that the school enforces these mandatory group projects, were every member of the group gets the same grade, so that the few students that do work can carry the students that don't. This way the school still recieves the tuition from the students that don't as long as they do the minimal individual assignments. You can clearly see that the motivation for most students at online schools is purely to get a degree, this does not make it difficult for the few that actually make their GPA a priority to get good grades, which is not true for most traditional brick and mortar schools. We've all experienced those courses full of premed students all competing for that A.

This is why I think med schools frown on an online education, they don't have a method to truly evaluate how you would compete with other students in a competetive medical school environment. Thus they would be more in the dark and unsure how to predict how well you would do at that particular school, unless you had other substantial things in your app to show them that. I don't think they would think it was less work etc., after all if your online school is accredited then you've done the work in some way or another.

Its pretty annoying when people who have never attended online classes assume they are not "real" classes. I have attended both and have come to the conclusion that online classes are actually much harder then the traditional classroom classes. You actually have to be self disciplined and motivated enough to learn the material without have a teacher right there to hold your hand.
Also since it is online there isn't alot of test taking where you can cram the night before so that you can pass the test and then forget everything on it the next day. You have to write many many papers and in the process you learn alot more.
As far as labs go, I know some schools have online labs which I don't think would be acceptable, but sometimes you can do your labs seperate in an actual classroom.
 
Also, even if the school tells you officially (even in writing) that they accept online credits, keep in mind that the admission officers/committees might not. They could easily reject your application (due to online courses/degrees) and have other excuses to officially tell you other than your online credentials (such as there were 10,000 applicants for 150 seats).

Or bear in mind that even if adcoms accept online courses for credit, they might not really accept those courses, if you know what I mean. 🙁
 
Again, like MANY have posted, medical school admissions is NOT about "just" doing the minimum, it is about making YOURSELF STAND OUT among THOUSANDS of applicants. I get the feeling that many folks are not getting the full picture of just how competitive it is to get into medical school. Applicants have stellar GPA (upwards of 3.7) with 99% of the coursework undertaken in regular (not online) classes from 4 year accredited schools, phenomenal MCAT, stellar LOR, tons of research with publications, leadership, volunteering, etc....so again YOU are competing against thousands of extremely competitive applicants, so ask yourself this..."IF YOU WERE an adcom, who would you rank higher?" to get accepted? this is simple folks.
 
efex101 how I do agree with your picture perfect premed did every check in the box ie research, stellar gpa/mcat.......HOW diverse is Med school really. WHY do you think it is that the average gpa is lets say 3.6-3.8 if everyone in med school did everything the same.......

So you have JOE STELLAR that mommy and daddy paid for everything and they didn't have to work to pay for food housing books etc. and he pulls of a 3.8 gpa 35mcat......

Here is my thought on this if you read a ps from someone that is in the gpa/mcat range(regaurdless if online or not) what makes this person different or what makes them stand out.....How about the fact that he had to work 40-60 hours a week just to feed his family or the fact that he deployed to Iraq 2 times so OUR family could sleep safe at night......AND he still pulled out a 3.5 gpa and a 30 mcat.....

TO ME mix a bit of both of these 2 types of students and we will have a very motivated class of students....

If they are all JOE STELLAR then WOW maybe I need to change my career choice.
 
Here is my thought on this if you read a ps from someone that is in the gpa/mcat range(regaurdless if online or not) what makes this person different or what makes them stand out.....How about the fact that he had to work 40-60 hours a week just to feed his family or the fact that he deployed to Iraq 2 times so OUR family could sleep safe at night......AND he still pulled out a 3.5 gpa and a 30 mcat.....

I agree.

I've always contended it was the fact that I was an engineering major and worked 40 hours/week throughout all 4 years of college, that made up for my less-than-spectacular GPA.
 
See, the issue is that the majority of applicants are NOT individuals that mommy/daddy paid for everything and just breezed through pre-med without effort....
Applicants for the most part ARE individuals that juggled multiple activities while working/taking care of families/etc and still pulled stellar grades/MCAT. The applicant pool is HUGE and very very competitive hence the emphasis in making YOUR application stand out.
 
BTW, I am myself prior-military with an active duty husband and two kiddos....I am now at the end of my medical school stint and see what is coming around (as far as applications go). So I am NOT pulling any of what I stated out of thin air.
 
A large part of the reluctance of adcoms to accept online coursework is likely to be an issue of lack of familiarity. You are talking about a group of people, most of whom have no experience whatsoever with taking or teaching online courses. So, let's say Adcom A is trying to evaluate your app. Your MCAT and LORs are acceptable, and they see you have an online degree from a program they're not familiar with. So, they're not sure how to compare you with other applicants who have attended traditional schools. Why do you think they would take the chance on you when there are literally ten or more perfectly acceptable applicants for *every* seat in *every* medical school in the country?

I went to an accredited, American brick and mortar school, where I took live classes with other students and performed experiments done in real labs. Nearly all of my college narrative evals, particularly in my chemistry and organic classes, were absolutely stellar. Based on my test scores, I would have had pretty close to straight As if my college had offered grades, and I had excellent grad school grades, SAT scores, GRE scores, and MCAT scores. However, some screening medical schools were *still* not willing to even grant me a secondary, which I can only assume is due to the fact that I had no UG GPA, grades, or credit hours.

I have to agree with the post by notdeadyet--if you're a "late bloomer," and you've made up your mind to go to medical school, now is not the time to start telling the medical schools on what terms you're willing to complete their "fuddy-duddy" requirements. In the beginning of the app season at least, this is their market, not yours. You need them, but they don't need you. No medical school will care if you never grace their mailbox with your app, and they're looking for reasons to eliminate you early on so that they can get a more manageable pool of people to pull interviewees from. It's one thing if you already have a nontraditional app; then you have to make do as best as you can. But to go into the process *planning* to give yourself a potential academic record handicap? It sure doesn't make sense to me.
 
Q said it very well.
It's best to try to "conform" to what the admissions committee is looking for.
If you know your goal is to go to medical school, you will be a more competitve applicant if you attend a traditional school.

It's not about them accepting your degree, it is your job to make your application stand out so that you get accepted.
 
However, some screening medical schools were *still* not willing to even grant me a secondary, which I can only assume is due to the fact that I had no UG GPA, grades, or credit hours.
As an old UC Santa Cruz grad, I hear you on the no grade thing. Ah well. Nice post, btw...
 
With out starting a fire storm of replies.....I am currently in a online school for my BS degree. Has anyone here gone from online college to medical school?
Thank You


Yes!

Let me know if you need any help
 
How about if you have taken classes on ground at a online school like Phoenix University, I'm getting my bachelors from there but I've never taken an online class...
 
Mile,

University of Phoenix is not considered a good school. Sorry. With a good GPA and a good MCAT it is probably possible to get into med school. But going to University of Phoenix is not the best choice. You might consider transferring to another school to finish your degree and any pre-reqs. Its up to you of course, but it would probably increase your chances.
 
I agree with Q, law2doc
and the others.
It would be best not to go for an entirely online degree, if possible. It would be better to do at least your prerequisites at a brick and mortar school, and preferably a good college or university with a track record of getting students into medical school.
 
Ok, how about this scenario? In my undergrad and in an informal postbac in the mid 1990s (not sure if we even called it that back then), I completed 1 year of physics, 2/3 of a year of general chem, proficiency exam credit for 1 year gen chem lab, 1/3 year gen chem lab, 1/3 year ochem, 2/3 year ochem lab, 1 year biology, 2/3 year bio lab. All were completed at brick-and-mortar 4-yr universities with a GPA of about 3.6-3.7. I got a lawyer job I wanted, so I stopped the postbac.

Fast forward to today, where I am re-considering medicine. It is, and has been, difficult to fit the prereqs into my schedule, so I am considering taking the all the prereqs (except physics), including labs, at a DO school that offers the undergrad prereqs online.

Would this be acceptable to med schools, considering the fact that I completed a significant amount of the coursework and labs, and two degrees (bachelors and juris doctor), in brick and mortar schools? Of course, I would need to contact the individual schools, but I was wondering what you thought.
 
Ok, how about this scenario? In my undergrad and in an informal postbac in the mid 1990s (not sure if we even called it that back then), I completed 1 year of physics, 2/3 of a year of general chem, proficiency exam credit for 1 year gen chem lab, 1/3 year gen chem lab, 1/3 year ochem, 2/3 year ochem lab, 1 year biology, 2/3 year bio lab. All were completed at brick-and-mortar 4-yr universities with a GPA of about 3.6-3.7. I got a lawyer job I wanted, so I stopped the postbac.

Fast forward to today, where I am re-considering medicine. It is, and has been, difficult to fit the prereqs into my schedule, so I am considering taking the all the prereqs (except physics), including labs, at a DO school that offers the undergrad prereqs online.

Would this be acceptable to med schools, considering the fact that I completed a significant amount of the coursework and labs, and two degrees (bachelors and juris doctor), in brick and mortar schools? Of course, I would need to contact the individual schools, but I was wondering what you thought.

You need to contact every school that you anticipate applying to in order to see if your plan is sound. I can tell you that the two schools that I serve on the admissions committee does not accept online coursework for pre-med prerecs. General ed requirements are OK but not the premed prerecs.

We do accept community college credits for those prerecs as long as they are transferable to a 4-year college. This means that Biology for nursing or A & P for nursing will not work but General Biology with lab and General Chemistry with lab (one year each) will work.

When we have a question about the content of a course, we will contact the school where the course was taken. Online coursework does not generally have the requisite content for the pre-med prerecs. Before you spend tuition dollars, make sure that your coursework is adequate.
 
I have email confirmations from about a dozen schools that state they will accept online prerequisite courework so why should the rest of it matter. If the program is regionally accreditted I don't think it could be rightfully held against you. Also, if you happened to live marginally close to the institution from which you were receiving the degree how would a medical school even know? From the few online courses I've taken in life (mostly for personal gain) my transcripts, didn't reflect any difference.
 
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