orgo/physics

[lalaland123]

My school recommends we take orgo/physics the same year (sophmore year) but I was thinking wouldn't that be a little too much? Esp if you have other bio courses?


someone recommend that i take one semester of orgo and one physics sophmore year and then repeat the same thing junior year, rather than taking them together...is that a good idea?


Also, I just feel quite overwhelmed...how did people get everything done on time!!!

mcats, prep courses, research, volunteering, shadowing, clinical job, preparing your application, etc...

Any help would be appreciated =)

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[Frazier]

I will be taking org1 and phys2 concurrently next semester.
I got A's in both [yes, back from the future].

So, yes, it is quite do'able.

 

[lalaland123]

How did you get A's, if you are going to take them?

Also, I have to struggle a lot for my grades, i guess im not too smart : ) I just dont wana take them and do bad.

 

[rxnfiend]

I took orgo 2 with phys 1 and got As in both. Phys really doesn't take a whole hell of a lot of time to study for so orgo was definitely the harder of the two. I just took two "easier" classes with them to lighten up the load also.

 

[Frazier]

How did you get A's, if you are going to take them?

Hence my aside concerning back from the future... Oh nevermind.

You will do fine, take the classes with some easier ones and buckle down.

 

[apumic]

I did ochem + physics + bio + full-time job and managed near-perfect grades (as in literally... like a 97%+ in all of them). They really aren't that difficult. Just go for it.

 

[lalaland123]

ok thanks guys!

apumic...wish i could do that

 

[apumic]

ok thanks guys!

apumic...wish i could do that

I bet you could if you put your mind to it. A lot of it is about being strategic with your time and focusing on concepts, not problems. Problems are only meant to reinforce concepts. Physics and ochem are really not that unlike one another. They both involve taking general principles from specific situations in order to reuse those principles on other similar situations.

 

[lalaland123]

^people usually tell me it's about practicing as much as you can! but thankss!!

 

[apumic]

^people usually tell me it's about practicing as much as you can! but thankss!!

haha, well I guess I'd say they're probably half-right. Problems give you exposure to multiple scenarios where the general concept applies. The difference between, say, soccer, though, and physics is that practicing in soccer is really the only way to improve. (I.e., you're not going to improve by just understanding how soccer works.) OTOH, physics and ochem are much more about understanding. Once you get what a good nucleophile is, for instance, and what a good leaving group is (as well as the various cases -- 1º vs 3º Alpha or Beta carbons for instance -- necessary for the rxn to occur) more problems won't really do you much good. To me, problems are more about verifying I get the concept than learning the concept. You can't simply memorize the solutions of thousands of different problems or rxn mechanisms. You have to build an understanding of how someone initially came to the conclusion you are now studying. Once you are able to follow their train of thought, applications of the concepts to problems become second-nature.

 

[lalaland123]

i have tried following this mechanism...but i see people who find test banks and go through all the possible questions and score wayyy higher

i really appreciate your advice tho, i think its important to find an approach and master it! (which you have)

 

[apumic]

haha. well thanks and in reponse to ^... yeah, I can see where they would. I guess for me, personally, the extra couple of % I might get by doing those problems just isn't worth it. If I get the concept well enough for my A (and a good MCAT score and to be successful later), then why put in so much extra effort (i.e., doing 100s of problems) for such a small reward (actually an insignificant reward as both a 97% and a 100% are As)?

 

[getright]

I'm planning on taking Physics 2 w/lab, Org 1, bio 2, and genetics next spring. Bad idea? I DON'T CARE

 

[175961]

if I can do it, you can do it!!!!

 

[lalaland123]

i hope to just pull A-'s

good luck get right!

n cuadrado...lets hope

 

[orgohacks]

You can't simply memorize the solutions of thousands of different problems or rxn mechanisms. You have to build an understanding of how someone initially came to the conclusion you are now studying. Once you are able to follow their train of thought, applications of the concepts to problems become second-nature.

This is absolutely correct. I couldn't have said it better myself.

I'm a Ph.D. organic chemist. A little over a month ago, I started a little blog devoted to teaching organic chemistry along these lines. It's still in its early stages. I'm really interested in hearing from students currently taking organic chemistry... I want to make it as useful as possible.

http://masterorganicchemistry.wordpress.com/

Thanks! - James

 

[Frazier]

This is absolutely correct. I couldn't have said it better myself.

I'm a Ph.D. organic chemist. A little over a month ago, I started a little blog devoted to teaching organic chemistry along these lines. It's still in its early stages. I'm really interested in hearing from students currently taking organic chemistry... I want to make it as useful as possible.

http://masterorganicchemistry.wordpress.com/

Thanks! - James

I'll bookmark your site for future reference -- then let u know if it helped or not about 8 months from now.

 

[cfx]

I see absolutely no reason to take the two concurrently, unless you don't have enough time left to spread them out, or if they're both prereqs for other classes you want to take soon. It's highly unlikely that the two classes will overlap much in their content, and I can't see how taking one would be a requirement for taking the other.

My school recommends a sequence for taking the basic sciences, but I just took everything in the order that I wanted to (with the obvious exception of taking all the "101s" before the "202s," and genchem before ochem). If you're feeling overwhelmed, why take what is largely considered to be the hardest two prereqs simultaneously? If you have the time, why not save yourself some stress and spread it out a bit more?

Also, the people who are saying that physics doesn't require much work or isn't difficult are full of it. I found it to be one of the most labor-intensive sciences. If you care to really "get it," there are a great deal of abstract concepts, and challenging problem solving that you need to gain a lot of experience with. I suppose you could luck out and get a "plug-and-chug" oriented teacher, or you could have a leg-up from AP physics, but I found it to be just as much of a challenge (if not more so) than ochem.

Just my two cents, though.

 

[Frazier]

Also, the people who are saying that physics doesn't require much work or isn't difficult are full of it.

What would they be full of? Theta?

 

[cfx]

What would they be full of? Theta?

Exactly.

 

[Pwny]

OP- I can definitely relate. I just began the quarter and am taking physics and ochem concurrently. I decided to drop an extra class I was enrolled in to concentrate on the science load because grades are also an issue for me... not to mention working (student fees are crazy!), clinic work, research, and club duties this quarter.

I can also say from experience that I've loaded myself with units and extracurriculars before, and it ended horribly with me playing catch up. It's definitely something you want to avoid if you'd like to spare yourself a few gray hairs.

Anyway, I apologize for the long tangent. You just got to roll with it and make the decision you feel is best for you at the moment. Prioritize what's important to you and stick with it because in the end, your hard work will pay off. If you feel that you need to take a remedial quarter and lay off taking multiple science courses simultaneously in order to concentrate on finding the best method of studying, by all means, do it. A lot of people especially premeds may sometimes feel pressured to "go with the flow" of their peers even if they don't feel prepared. Don't let it get to you if that ever happens- remember, it's all you.

Best of luck with your endeavors!

 

[apumic]

Also, the people who are saying that physics doesn't require much work or isn't difficult are full of it. I found it to be one of the most labor-intensive sciences. If you care to really "get it," there are a great deal of abstract concepts, and challenging problem solving that you need to gain a lot of experience with. I suppose you could luck out and get a "plug-and-chug" oriented teacher, or you could have a leg-up from AP physics, but I found it to be just as much of a challenge (if not more so) than ochem.

Just my two cents, though.

lol, well I'm glad that's "just your two cents," because I must respectfully disagree and give you your two cents back. Here, I'll even give you an extra cent in interest (that's a pretty awesome return on your investment!)

Physics and Ochem are both conceptual subjects. A lot depends upon who you are. Some are able to "get it" on the first try while others may need a few problems and this probably varies by topic. Honestly, though, if you pay attention to the general ideas (i.e., concepts), most of physics and ochem is not really all that difficult. Much of physics is simple proportions -- understanding that certain things can't change (i.e., are constant) -- or rates and sums. If you can get the overall concepts, the applications aren't that difficult.

 

[Procyon]

This is absolutely correct. I couldn't have said it better myself.

I'm a Ph.D. organic chemist. A little over a month ago, I started a little blog devoted to teaching organic chemistry along these lines. It's still in its early stages. I'm really interested in hearing from students currently taking organic chemistry... I want to make it as useful as possible.

http://masterorganicchemistry.wordpress.com/

Thanks! - James

Thanks for the link. I'll be taking orgo next fall, so this could be useful.

 

[lorenzomicron]

It'll be alright man.
next semester i'm taking intro bio, orgo, an engineering class, an upper level physics class, and an upper level english class.
we can do it bro.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

I'm taking physics 1, o-chem 1, and their labs this fall along with genetics unless I learn that the genetics class is too hard to walk into expecting an A. I used to teach biology and have read various genetics books. In the spring I'll take part 2 of the above classes and cell biology instead of genetics. Cell bio has no lab there, and like genetics if I discover that it's a bitch of a class I won't take it either, but like I said I talked about and read about cells for years. I've got A's in lots of other bio classes from years past so all I really need are o-chem and phys which are two classes I've never wanted to take due to A) lack of interest and B) sucking at math.

 

[snorlax]

I know plenty of people at my school that take Ochem, Physics, and Bio at the same time. It's up to you and how good you are at science.

Personally, I find bio takes the most time since it's the most memorizing. Ochem and physics at the same time is not challenging.