Ortho residency?

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
T

TDT

New Member
10+ Year Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2010
Messages
5
Reaction score
0
I need some advice on an ortho residency. I have only gone through one year of dental school and unfortunately messed up my first semester. My gpa is only a 3.0 and I got an 84 on NBDE part I. I have an interest in orthodontics and perio, but I do not think that these grades will suffice, but I am also unsure about that.

This is only my first year, and I know that my gpa is going to improve over the next two years because I just screwed up that first semester and my second semester was much better. I was wondering what you people think out there if my gpa were to get to around a 3.4 or 3.5 or so with an 84 part I, if there is any chance to get into an ortho or perio program
Members don't see this ad.
 
you could probably get into perio but doubtful for ortho.
 
although with ortho your numbers should be "superior", you still have a chance

it depends on the programs you are applying to, e.g. if you can pay 100,000$/year then UCLA would be a possible chance!

just work hard and improve your GPA and CV (published research, do some externship, may be internship/GPR ...etc)
 
Members don't see this ad :)
How competitive are those ortho residencies that charge $75k/yr? I believe they are in FL and NV.
 
Ninety said:
although with ortho your numbers should be "superior", you still have a chance

it depends on the programs you are applying to, e.g. if you can pay 100,000$/year then UCLA would be a possible chance!

just work hard and improve your GPA and CV (published research, do some externship, may be internship/GPR ...etc)
Click to expand...

You are a bit misinformed. UCLA ortho is very competitive (same as any other ortho I guess) because residents get paid a reasonable stipend, unlike most ortho programs.
 
i am sorry, i should have mentioned UCLA for international (where you only pay without any stipend)
 
Ninety said:
i am sorry, i should have mentioned UCLA for international (where you only pay without any stipend)
Click to expand...

They do not accept international students either 🙂
 
you know what --- people need to know that orthodontics sucks. it just does in so many ways. it really sucks. best specialty is always and will always be O.S. from lifestyle to income to opportunities. any tooth carpenter can do orthodontics. orthodontists are a dime a dozen. everyone and their mother is an orthodontist nowadays. its a dying specialty -- why? each stupid residency accepts like 100 residents and more are opening up. more and more GP's are doing ortho -- just go to dentaltown and see all the dumbarse gps talking about their stupid 6 month b.s. braces where occlusion doesn't mean crap to them, and all these stupid 95 yr old orthodontist who are still bending wires don't retire unless,like someone says, they croak.

and they need to realize that sears and walmart will have or already have ortho carpenters in their stores. that is the tooth. in my mind OS or if not then GP. perio sucks too. dont be a gum plumber.

those that really want to make money forget all of health field really forget it. go get a business degree and be a hedge fund manager. thats what I'm doing -- no joke. will finish night school in 2 months and will start work in a bank as an investment banker. thats the real way to go.
 
dort-ort said:
you know what --- people need to know that orthodontics sucks. it just does in so many ways. it really sucks. best specialty is always and will always be O.S. from lifestyle to income to opportunities. any tooth carpenter can do orthodontics. orthodontists are a dime a dozen. everyone and their mother is an orthodontist nowadays. its a dying specialty -- why? each stupid residency accepts like 100 residents and more are opening up. more and more GP's are doing ortho -- just go to dentaltown and see all the dumbarse gps talking about their stupid 6 month b.s. braces where occlusion doesn't mean crap to them, and all these stupid 95 yr old orthodontist who are still bending wires don't retire unless,like someone says, they croak.

and they need to realize that sears and walmart will have or already have ortho carpenters in their stores. that is the tooth. in my mind OS or if not then GP. perio sucks too. dont be a gum plumber.

those that really want to make money forget all of health field really forget it. go get a business degree and be a hedge fund manager. thats what I'm doing -- no joke. will finish night school in 2 months and will start work in a bank as an investment banker. thats the real way to go.
Click to expand...

Unless Harvard Business School is offering night courses you are sh#% out of luck bro. Maybe you should do your research and realize that while investment banking is a good route, it is a VERY DIFFICULT route. Unless your pedigree is a top 5 MBA, don't expect to walk onto wall street with open arms. Making VP is very very very difficult, and out of the i dunno 30,000 imployees at goldman only about 100 make patner every couple years. Most associate get axed and it gets very difficult up the ladder. At least an orthodontist don't go to work everyday hoping he won't get the axe from some deushbag managing director.

I agree that ortho is way overrated and too heavily saturated in some areas to afford the lifestyle most residents think they will attain. BUT, it is a SECURE job, something you cannot say in the business world.

Plus, a busy OMFS in a good area can possibly gross 800k. 800k in Mississippi (lets just say) goes a hell of a lot further than 800k in NYC...

But heck what do I know I was just a summer analyst way back when in college (a college that is heavily recruited).
 
dort-ort said:
you know what --- people need to know that orthodontics sucks. it just does in so many ways. it really sucks. best specialty is always and will always be O.S. from lifestyle to income to opportunities. any tooth carpenter can do orthodontics. orthodontists are a dime a dozen. everyone and their mother is an orthodontist nowadays. its a dying specialty -- why? each stupid residency accepts like 100 residents and more are opening up. more and more GP's are doing ortho -- just go to dentaltown and see all the dumbarse gps talking about their stupid 6 month b.s. braces where occlusion doesn't mean crap to them, and all these stupid 95 yr old orthodontist who are still bending wires don't retire unless,like someone says, they croak.

and they need to realize that sears and walmart will have or already have ortho carpenters in their stores. that is the tooth. in my mind OS or if not then GP. perio sucks too. dont be a gum plumber.

those that really want to make money forget all of health field really forget it. go get a business degree and be a hedge fund manager. thats what I'm doing -- no joke. will finish night school in 2 months and will start work in a bank as an investment banker. thats the real way to go.
Click to expand...

Yeah! You tell them! Everything sucks other than what you hope to do!
 
LBJ 2 MIA said:
Unless Harvard Business School is offering night courses you are sh#% out of luck bro. Maybe you should do your research and realize that while investment banking is a good route, it is a VERY DIFFICULT route. Unless your pedigree is a top 5 MBA, don't expect to walk onto wall street with open arms. Making VP is very very very difficult, and out of the i dunno 30,000 imployees at goldman only about 100 make patner every couple years. Most associate get axed and it gets very difficult up the ladder. At least an orthodontist don't go to work everyday hoping he won't get the axe from some deushbag managing director.

I agree that ortho is way overrated and too heavily saturated in some areas to afford the lifestyle most residents think they will attain. BUT, it is a SECURE job, something you cannot say in the business world.

Plus, a busy OMFS in a good area can possibly gross 800k. 800k in Mississippi (lets just say) goes a hell of a lot further than 800k in NYC...

But heck what do I know I was just a summer analyst way back when in college (a college that is heavily recruited).
Click to expand...


800k isn't a lot more than what the average GP grosses. :laugh::laugh:
 
monreal said:
They do not accept international students either 🙂
Click to expand...

They do have an international program and it is extremely expensive (around 60-70k for 3 years). If you are trying to get into UCLA's ortho program for US residents it is extremely competitive due to the stipend and living in LA.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
How competitive is USC ortho? Does anyone know people that got in there and what there scores were? They are soo expensive so maybe less people end up applying..
 
Harvard ortho program in 2010 is unique in many ways:
1. It's the program in the USA with the highest % of faculty with foreign dental degrees, without USA DDS or DMD (Harvard dental school can't afford to hire American orthodontists for full-time faculty work)
2. It's the only USA program that has only 1 full time faculty member and a total of 5 full and part-time to teach a postgrad student population of 16. Half of the current faculty just graduated ortho programs within 2 years. 17 experienced part-time faculty members resigned in 2010 to protest the crazy leadership and non-clinical mission of the program.
3. The education in clinical orthodontics is given largely by reading chapters in textbooks. There is no one on the faculty with clinical experience enough to lecture and demonstrate.
4. The head of the department is not even a dentist, and the head of the postgrad program is a foreign dentist who's primarily a basic researcher.
5. The orthodontists on the faculty are entirely unknown in the world of contributors to orthodontics. Nada for name recognition anywhere. All unknowns.
Check it out for yourself: http://www.hsao-online.org/faculty.html

So apply to this ortho program if all you want is the name "Harvard" on your certificate, because that's all you're going to get there. Then go somewhere else to learn to become a good orthodontist, something Harvard doesn't care about.
 
i heard the same about the program, and one of their faculty (the only one as you stated) visited us once to present their program

i will add that the residents have to fight for chairs with dental students and that the program is mostly research-oriented

very bad for the big H to have such program!
 
chinnychinchin said:
Harvard ortho program in 2010 is unique in many ways:
1. It's the program in the USA with the highest % of faculty with foreign dental degrees, without USA DDS or DMD (Harvard dental school can't afford to hire American orthodontists for full-time faculty work)
Click to expand...


I was going to say that you are just bitter by your post. I checked out the link and actually think your on to something. Especially with this guy.

Mohammed H. Butt, DMD, BDS LOL!!! 😀
 
Who wants to bet ChinnyChinChin is of of those 17 "experienced" faculty that resigned and is now bitter, trolling SDN, posting off topic comments under a new name with only one post.

My guess is he was probably one of those volunteers, which every ortho program has, that comes 1-2 half clinic sessions per month, and frequently cancels with little notice.

Somehow I think the big H is better off without this character.
 
Ninety said:
i heard the same about the program, and one of their faculty (the only one as you stated) visited us once to present their program

i will add that the residents have to fight for chairs with dental students and that the program is mostly research-oriented

very bad for the big H to have such program!
Click to expand...

Is it really bad (Orthodontic program in Harvard) ?
 
monreal said:
I am curious to know why you excluded perio, prostho, and public health!
Click to expand...

For perio -> I do not wanna spend my life as GUM PLUMPER , trained to clean calculus everyday !

For prostho -> well trained GP could be so far better than PROSTHODONTIC SPECIALIST. " I am sure that the good GP is the Future Prosthodontist"

For public health ->I am not interested in begin a TEACHER all my life.

Now if any body tell me what do you think of GPA 3.85 then I would be thankful.
 
Alexanderplatz said:
For perio -> I do not wanna spend my life as GUM PLUMPER , trained to clean calculus everyday !

For prostho -> well trained GP could be so far better than PROSTHODONTIC SPECIALIST. " I am sure that the good GP is the Future Prosthodontist"

For public health ->I am not interested in begin a TEACHER all my life.

Now if any body tell me what do you think of GPA 3.85 then I would be thankful.
Click to expand...

A gum plumper? lol
 
Alexanderplatz said:
ranked as Third.
what exactly do you mean by "irrelevant" ?
Click to expand...

Class rank is much more important when it comes to evaluating specialty applications. If you are third in your class, you will be looked at by Ortho, OMS, and Endo programs. "Looked at" means you will likely be invited to interview at a few programs but this doesn't mean you will get in. Getting into a program will depend on a lot of factors including how well your interview goes.

However, if you are a foreign grad (I think you mentioned somewhere that you are), then your application will likely not be looked at with the US grad applications. Foreign applicants are generally looked at separately and have their own hoops to jump through. Some programs will require you to submit your NBDE score and if you have an 82, that is going to hurt your chances even if your class rank was 3. No one on here can tell you which program will interview you or accept you. Basically you have to do it the hard way which is applying to programs and waiting. BTW, it is incredibly rare for a foreign grad to get into an OMS program compared to Endo or Ortho because of various visa, citizenship, and DDS/DMD requirements by a lot of the hospitals where the training programs are located. There was a discussion about this on SDN a few years ago. Your best resource would be graduates from your dental school who are in any residencies in the US. The next best resource you have is the Foreign Dentist forum on SDN.

(I got tired of seeing this poster ask the same question over and over on every other thread).
 
Alexanderplatz said:
For perio -> I do not wanna spend my life as GUM PLUMPER , trained to clean calculus everyday !

For prostho -> well trained GP could be so far better than PROSTHODONTIC SPECIALIST. " I am sure that the good GP is the Future Prosthodontist"

For public health ->I am not interested in begin a TEACHER all my life.

Now if any body tell me what do you think of GPA 3.85 then I would be thankful.
Click to expand...

Lol with an 82 you wont be guaranteed any of these either.:laugh:
 
Alexanderplatz said:
nobody forced you to comment !

this is public !
Click to expand...

Um, nobody was answering your question. And the 82 refers to a hypothetical NBDE score in the example I gave above. Many programs will ask you for a NBDE score with your application. If you don't have a good score (at least high 80s, preferably 90+) to go along with your class rank, your chances of having your application considered seriously will decrease.
 
gryffindor said:
Um, nobody was answering your question. And the 82 refers to a hypothetical NBDE score in the example I gave above. Many programs will ask you for a NBDE score with your application. If you don't have a good score (at least high 80s, preferably 90+) to go along with your class rank, your chances of having your application considered seriously will decrease.
Click to expand...


Many programs BUT not all.
some of them they do not ask for it for international applicants and in this case I do not believe it will influence my chances in any way.
 
i may suggest to mods to start a thread with a heading "what are my chances in so and so specialty" so that the number of the so called posts would reduce and these potential applicant will be answered
 
Ninety said:
i may suggest to mods to start a thread with a heading "what are my chances in so and so specialty" so that the number of the so called posts would reduce and these potential applicant will be answered
Click to expand...

Is it annoying to this extent helping international graduates seeking for good education ?
 
Alexanderplatz said:
Is it annoying to this extent helping international graduates seeking for good education ?
Click to expand...

i am an international graduate and i like to help others, but my suggestion was to organize forums, don't take it seriously!
 
Ninety said:
i am an international graduate and i like to help others, but my suggestion was to organize forums, don't take it seriously!
Click to expand...

Huh .. well then
Have got an admission to a graduate program ?
 
Alexanderplatz said:
Many programs BUT not all.
some of them they do not ask for it for international applicants and in this case I do not believe it will influence my chances in any way.
Click to expand...

Dream on! … I would listen to recommendations from Gryffindor. You’ve been on the forum just an hour and twenty minutes. Gryffindor has been here for years. Like we say, he drove backward more than you drove forward…. You don’t have to be a Bad A $ $ - when you asked a question, you will get an answer, but not necessary the one that you would like.

Alexanderplatz said:
Is it annoying to this extent helping international graduates seeking for good education?
Click to expand...

An answer to this question you should find in the “International Dentist” forum.
 
Alexanderplatz said:
Sir, Do you agree or disagree ?
Click to expand...

I have no problem with foreign dentists. My problem is with people who DON'T follow forum rules and use the search function prior to posting. Please read the forum rules prior to making your next post. I and the rest of the forum members would greatly appreciate it.

Welcome to the forum, but I still think you may be a TROLL. I hope you prove me wrong. 😎
 
Pedosmakebank said:
I have no problem with foreign dentists. My problem is with people who DON'T follow forum rules and use the search function prior to posting. Please read the forum rules prior to making your next post. I and the rest of the forum members would greatly appreciate it.

Welcome to the forum, but I still think you may be a TROLL. I hope you prove me wrong. 😎
Click to expand...


Really ? Really , you do not have problem with international grads , how do you explain your reply :
Alexander : Is it annoying to this extent helping international graduates seeking for good education ?
Pedo : Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees with thum upward !

huh ? is it really pedo ? huh ... you turned it to Forum rules, you think you are smart taking it this way ?
 
Alexanderplatz said:
Really ? Really , you do not have problem with international grads , how do you explain your reply :
Alexander : Is it annoying to this extent helping international graduates seeking for good education ?
Pedo : Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees with thum upward !

huh ? is it really pedo ? huh ... you turned it to Forum rules, you think you are smart taking it this way ?
Click to expand...

You're not helping your cause.

I think Alexander was basically stating that it doesn't matter if it's the guy from Des Moines, Iowa with a 98 NBDE asking his chances to get into x-specialty, it can get repetitive and annoying.

Still I don't want to discourage folks from asking questions. SDN was a huge resource for me when I was going through all this stuff a few years ago.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

O
Ortho residency and existing disability insurance
Replies
4
Views
727
Dentists Disability Ins.
D
T
Texas AM ortho residency
Replies
5
Views
2K
Lemillion
Lemillion
M
GP going ortho, how to approach residency tuition
Replies
8
Views
2K
gryffindor
G
P
Chances of Applying to Ortho
Replies
1
Views
2K
DustFreeEraser
D
D
Pay over $350k for ortho residency?
2
Replies
94
Views
9K
yappy
Y
Top