Osteopathic Oath

[MedicinaeDoctor]

Does every school have it's own osteopathic oath at it's white coat ceremony?

NYCOM ( http://iris.nyit.edu/nycom/ ) seems to have its own own oath, as opposed to the regular oath, which is as follows:

I do hereby affirm my loyalty to the profession I am about
to enter.

I will be mindful always of my great responsibility to
preserve the health and the life of my patients, to retain
their confidence and respect both as a physician and a
friend who will guard their secrets with scrupulous honor
and fidelity, to perform faith. fully my professional duties, to employ only those recognized methods of treatment
consistent with good judgment and with my skill and ability, keeping in mind always nature's laws and the body's inherent capacity for recovery.

I will be ever vigilant in aiding in the general welfare of the
community, sustaining its laws and institutions, not
engaging in those practices which will in any way bring
shame or discredit upon myself or my profession. I will give no deadly drugs to any, though it may be asked of me.

I will endeavor to work in accord with my colleagues in a
spirit of progressive cooperation and never by word or by
act cast imputations upon them or their rightful practices.

I will look with respect and esteem upon all those who have taught me my art. To my college I will be loyal and strive always for its best interests and for the interests of the students who will come after me. I will ever be alert to adhere to and develop the principles of osteopathy as
taught by Andrew Taylor Still.

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[Lukat]

I think they have the same oath cuz I saw the exact oath on CCOM website

 

[DoctorPenguin]

I figure I should post this here since it's similar. It's not about the oath; rather, the philosophy of osteopathy itself.

I've heard from a few DO medical students that the philosophy which made osteopathic medicine so special back in the day is beginning to fade; either that, or allopathic medicine is starting to encompass it just as much as osteopathic medicine.

I figure with OMM being an actual course at every DO school (correct me if I'm wrong), the DO traditions still hold strong... since it is specifically being taught.

What are ya'lls opinions on this??? 😎

 

[DrDOit]

*

 

[VA1986]

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[VeeTeeHokies]

I will give no deadly drugs to any, though it may be asked of me.

I actually had a question about this... So physician assisted suicide is a pretty hot button issue. Has osteopathy long been opposed to this, thus they employ it within the oath? How does this sit if your views don't align with this? I only ask because it was a huge topic in an ethics class I took and I have read a book on the subject. Please no ethical debates haha.

 

[VeeTeeHokies]

I feel that allo is starting to use some of the osteo principles, but that's a good thing because these are humane principles IMO, for example, treat the patient rather than the disease. When a UC Davis med student about her revelation about this principle in her ethics class, I did a face palm in my mind lol

Sooo a lot of schools are beginning to offer integrative medicine electives (Harvard actually has a few for instance). These basically go into the holistic approach that osteopathic schools teach within their curriculum from day 1. There are also workshops within some organizations, AMSA for example has an integrative medicine workshop that anybody can attend. I also recently found out at a conference over the weekend that there are post-graduate courses available teaching OMM to allopathic physicians, and they are subsequently awarded a certificate which is basically a license to practice OMM. Being a huge proponent of osteopathy, I'm not exactly sure how well this sits with me. I guess I should be happy that these osteopathic principles are becoming mainstream but I think it does dilute the osteopathic profession somewhat, especially for those that have earned their DO degrees.

 

[DoctorPenguin]

Interesting point Veetee. I'm not an expert on the subject, but in my ignorant opinion I think physician assisted suicide should have regulations (of course), but should be permitted under certain circumstances. It would be more detrimental to not allow PAS than to not allow it. Again, just my opinion. I'm sure my views will evolve on the subject.

 

[The Poet Sings]

I actually had a question about this... So physician assisted suicide is a pretty hot button issue. Has osteopathy long been opposed to this, thus they employ it within the oath? How does this sit if your views don't align with this? I only ask because it was a huge topic in an ethics class I took and I have read a book on the subject. Please no ethical debates haha.

the hippocratic oath includes that part too ("I will not give a lethal drug to anyone if I am asked, nor will I advise such a plan; and similarly I will not give a woman a pessary to cause an abortion." [or "I will neither give a deadly drug to anybody if asked for it, nor will I make a suggestion to this effect. Similarly I will not give to a woman an abortive remedy." if you like to kick it old school style] - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippocratic_Oath), and i'm guessing that many things from the hippocratic oath were borrowed for the osteopathic one. i'll admit i haven't read them both and done a side by side analysis, but they seemed similar enough to me.

 

[VeeTeeHokies]

Interesting point Veetee. I'm not an expert on the subject, but in my ignorant opinion I think physician assisted suicide should have regulations (of course), but should be permitted under certain circumstances. It would be more detrimental to not allow PAS than to not allow it. Again, just my opinion. I'm sure my views will evolve on the subject.

Agree with you 100%. The three states that have legalized it (Oregon, Washington, Montana) have very stringent policies to prevent its abuse. I don't plan on practicing in those states as of now, so it really isn't the most pressing thing on my mind now, but if it did eventually relate to my practice I don't know how I would handle it. Whether I would follow suit with my oath or go with what I believe in, are there repercussions for reneging on your oath? Would schools perhaps cater to you and change that line of the oath?

 

[VeeTeeHokies]

the hippocratic oath includes that part too ("I will not give a lethal drug to anyone if I am asked, nor will I advise such a plan; and similarly I will not give a woman a pessary to cause an abortion." [or "I will neither give a deadly drug to anybody if asked for it, nor will I make a suggestion to this effect. Similarly I will not give to a woman an abortive remedy." if you like to kick it old school style] - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippocratic_Oath), and i'm guessing that many things from the hippocratic oath were borrowed for the osteopathic one. i'll admit i haven't read them both and done a side by side analysis, but they seemed similar enough to me.

Interesting, I guess I probably shouldn't have stopped after the "First, do no harm" part every time . Well that makes me feel like less of a rebel considering the amount of abortions carried out every day.

Thanks for the reply.

 

[The Poet Sings]

Interesting, I guess I probably shouldn't have stopped after the "First, do no harm" part every time . Well that makes me feel like less of a rebel considering the amount of abortions carried out every day.

Thanks for the reply.

interestingly enough, the phrase "first, do no harm" isn't anywhere in the wiki version of it. i guess it's one of those things that through time has changed into it's own little phrase, with no regard for how the original went. or it WAS in the original and wiki lied. who knows? but check out the wiki page because they talk about the modern challenges of abiding by the hippocratic (and i guess by some extension the osteopathic) oath.
my favorite blurb (since i know you all were dying to know!):

"I will not cut for stone, even for patients in whom the disease is manifest; I will leave this operation to be performed by practitioners, specialists in this art. The "stones" referred to are kidney stones or bladder stones, removal of which was judged too menial for physicians, and therefore was left for barbers (the forerunners of modern surgeons). Surgery was not recognized as a specialty at that time. This sentence is now interpreted as acknowledging that it is impossible for any single physician to maintain expertise in all areas. It also highlights the different historical origins of the surgeon and the physician."

edited to add sidenote: the barber as surgeon thing is why the united kingdom's surgeons go by "mr/miss/ms/mrs" rather than "dr".

 

[VeeTeeHokies]

interestingly enough, the phrase "first, do no harm" isn't anywhere in the wiki version of it. i guess it's one of those things that through time has changed into it's own little phrase, with no regard for how the original went. or it WAS in the original and wiki lied. who knows? but check out the wiki page because they talk about the modern challenges of abiding by the hippocratic (and i guess by some extension the osteopathic) oath.
my favorite blurb (since i know you all were dying to know!):

"I will not cut for stone, even for patients in whom the disease is manifest; I will leave this operation to be performed by practitioners, specialists in this art. The "stones" referred to are kidney stones or bladder stones, removal of which was judged too menial for physicians, and therefore was left for barbers (the forerunners of modern surgeons). Surgery was not recognized as a specialty at that time. This sentence is now interpreted as acknowledging that it is impossible for any single physician to maintain expertise in all areas. It also highlights the different historical origins of the surgeon and the physician."

edited to add sidenote: the barber as surgeon thing is why the united kingdom's surgeons go by "mr/miss/ms/mrs" rather than "dr".

AH yeah I wondered why UK surgeons weren't referred to as Dr. Yeah the First, do no harm thing was more a misguided joke than anything, but I believe it was either a quote from Hippocrates "Primum non nocere," which may or may not have been in the oath but apparently was uttered or written by him at some point. I can't believe I didn't go to wikipedia first though... I still even argue with professors over its credibility as a source.

 

[The Poet Sings]

AH yeah I wondered why UK surgeons weren't referred to as Dr. Yeah the First, do no harm thing was more a misguided joke than anything, but I believe it was either a quote from Hippocrates "Primum non nocere," which may or may not have been in the oath but apparently was uttered or written by him at some point. I can't believe I didn't go to wikipedia first though... I still even argue with professors over its credibility as a source.

which leads me to a saying from our time, "first, check wiki" 😉

 

[VeeTeeHokies]

which leads me to a saying from our time, "first, check wiki" 😉

👍

 

[DoctorPenguin]

or it WAS in the original and wiki lied.

IMPOSSIBLE!! Wiki never lies! 😛

 

[JaggerPlate]

Sooo a lot of schools are beginning to offer integrative medicine electives (Harvard actually has a few for instance). These basically go into the holistic approach that osteopathic schools teach within their curriculum from day 1. There are also workshops within some organizations, AMSA for example has an integrative medicine workshop that anybody can attend. I also recently found out at a conference over the weekend that there are post-graduate courses available teaching OMM to allopathic physicians, and they are subsequently awarded a certificate which is basically a license to practice OMM. Being a huge proponent of osteopathy, I'm not exactly sure how well this sits with me. I guess I should be happy that these osteopathic principles are becoming mainstream but I think it does dilute the osteopathic profession somewhat, especially for those that have earned their DO degrees.

Integration of OMM into the Allo world is fine by me. To be honest, I don't think many MDs will get the certificates in it or whatever, but I only see a few things from it (all pluses):

1. It helps keep up the spirit of collaboration (which I worry about sometimes because a lot of the higher ups like to keep the DO spirit separate - which is fine - and not allow MDs into DO residencies - which I also don't care about - but DOs NEED ACGME residencies ... so all olive branches are good)

2. It could help spread the word to the masses.

3. If it ever did catch on ... on a wide scale, DOs would still obviously be at the forefront and the "experts" in the field, better positioned for patients, better positioned for cash based practices ($), teaching MDs how to do it ($), etc.

4. It doesn't really dilute the Osteopathic profession (IMO).

 

[VeeTeeHokies]

Integration of OMM into the Allo world is fine by me. To be honest, I don't think many MDs will get the certificates in it or whatever, but I only see a few things from it (all pluses):

1. It helps keep up the spirit of collaboration (which I worry about sometimes because a lot of the higher ups like to keep the DO spirit separate - which is fine - and not allow MDs into DO residencies - which I also don't care about - but DOs NEED ACGME residencies ... so all olive branches are good)

👍 Great point that I really didn't think about beforehand, nice little bartering system with the MDs 🙂

2. It could help spread the word to the masses.

👍 This is why I'm ultimately for these programs and closing the gap.

3. If it ever did catch on ... on a wide scale, DOs would still obviously be at the forefront and the "experts" in the field, better positioned for patients, better positioned for cash based practices ($), teaching MDs how to do it ($), etc.

👍 Very true, and I like those dollar signs you threw in there for dramatic effect.

4. It doesn't really dilute the Osteopathic profession (IMO).

Ok, you just convinced me...

JaggerPlate, the patron saint of osteopathic optimism.

 

[JaggerPlate]

JaggerPlate, the patron saint of osteopathic optimism.

Hahahahaha. I was going to put "Lightning Bone Setter" on my business cards, but "Saint of Osteopathic Optimism" sounds cooler.

 

[Ansylhein]

First, my background. I am finishing my second bachelor's degree, the first was in Photograhy, the second is in General Science. I am also a certified massage therapist. I am applying this cycle to only DO schools.

In the book What Your Doctor Didn't Learn in Medical School: And What You Can Do About It! by Stuart Berger, originally published in 1988, he says that his alma mater, Tufts University, had composed its own version of the oath to include some holistic principles about listening to and caring for patients. The book is basically an early version of Jerome Groopman's How Doctors Think, and I actually listened to it from Audible, so I can only roughly paraphrase, not quote.

Point 1: I think all medical schools have a certain latitude in writing their own oaths, depending on what they want to emphasize.

Point 2: The perception of osteopathic medicine and holistic principles has changed back and forth with the generations. According to Wiki in the article "Osteopathic Medicine in the United States", In the 1960s California refused to allow DOs licensure, and required them to attend a seminar and pay a $65 fee to switch to an MD license. I'm sure I've also seen a statement that prior to 1970, the American Medical Association considered it "unethical" for an MD to associate with a DO. I can no longer find this statement in the Wiki pages I've searched, which may be why Wiki isn't a legitimate source, as its content is always being edited. 😉

I have also found quite a few posts in the Google archives from the mid to late 1990s (i.e. http://groups.google.com/group/alt....2ced00017/6a936237c8204bae?q=ohio+osteopathic ) that have an almost embarassed sound to them as DOs hasten to say that they don't "do that manipulation thing". The post at http://www.quackwatch.com/04ConsumerEducation/QA/osteo.html was particularly vehement, and includes responses from DOs and MDs.

However, I hear a lot more from people now that are open to a wide range of possibilities, from medicines to manipulation, depending on what the circumstances and the patient require. I think alot of the perceptions are based on what someone grew up with and where they are from. I hope that DOs will be good representatives of the profession, by not sounding fanatical but also by not being embarassed by their extra skill set. Moderation in all things!

So, to tie this into the thread, I'm happy that holistic principles are gaining a wider appreciation, but after the "persecution" of DOs, I hope that the allopathic community doesn't think it was all their idea 😉

 

[EmersonAnne]

KCUMB's oath is different.

 

[MedStudentWanna]

KCUMB's oath is different.

If I remember, KCUMB webcast their WW ceremony last year. Are they doing it this year too?