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kaizendj

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Hi pre-meds. I am interested in osteopathic medicine. I am also interested in becoming a physician assistant, because they skip the worst part of most doctors' job (paperwork and battling insurers). So, I would like to know if there is a such thing as an osteopathic physician assistant. Thanks in advance.
 

BradenDO

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Hi pre-meds. I am interested in osteopathic medicine. I am also interested in becoming a physician assistant, because they skip the worst part of most doctors' job (paperwork and battling insurers). So, I would like to know if there is a such thing as an osteopathic physician assistant. Thanks in advance.

You can work for a DO but there aren't any PA schools that teach OMT. :(
 

kaizendj

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Bummer :oops: May PA's take elective OMT courses like MD's?
 
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EastCoaster78

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Try looking into pcom's PA program. I don't know how "osteopathic" it is but it's worth a look.
 

WestcoastMedicine

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The PAs at PCOM do NOT undergo OMT training to my knowledge. We used to have an Osteopathic Nursing school decades ago.......
 

primadonna22274

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PLEASE don't be so naive as to think we practicing PAs don't have to do the same garbage as our supervising docs...battling with insurers and being buried neck-deep in paperwork. ANY provider in this game has to do this stuff. Half the reason I left primary care was to get away from so much paperwork!
Just irks me when people think being a PA means you don't have to do the dirty work. If anything, we do MORE of the dirty work because our SPs can "delegate" it.
Lisa PA-C
 

BradenDO

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PLEASE don't be so naive as to think we practicing PAs don't have to do the same garbage as our supervising docs...battling with insurers and being buried neck-deep in paperwork. ANY provider in this game has to do this stuff. Half the reason I left primary care was to get away from so much paperwork!
Just irks me when people think being a PA means you don't have to do the dirty work. If anything, we do MORE of the dirty work because our SPs can "delegate" it.
Lisa PA-C

That's what I was thinking! The two PA's I work with are always doing Prior authorizations and things of that sort. So I agree with you!
 

Dr.Inviz

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i laughed when i saw the title of this thread. my initial reaction was, so next step, the osteopathization of teeth and eyes.

being a PA isnt fun and games. they have to know their stuff and be second in command when the doc isnt around.
 

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Western University of Health Sciences has a masters-level PA program. It shares a similar clinical mission of compassion & humanism like its osteopathic medical school:

"The program incorporates the appropriate elements of the traditional osteopathic philosophy into students training. These elements include:

1. An understanding of the patient as a 'whole person.'
2. Emphasis on those aspects of health education that stress 'wellness' and disease prevention.
3. An appreciation of the role of physical medicine in the diagnosis and management of illness."

http://www.westernu.edu/xp/edu/cahp/mspas_about.xml
 

Talula21

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I agree with most of the above posters! Being a PA is HARD work. A very close member of my family is a PA and he says you have to be willing to do a lot of work without always being fully recoginzed for it. Its not the glory without the "pain" as is being suggested!

To the OP: If you haven't already, shadow a PA. Ask them the good and bad. But make sure you get the opinion of many. PA work is VERY important and should not be a considered the easy way out. Because it is not easy.
 

WestcoastMedicine

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I know this isn't really related, but in the November 2006 issue of the "D.O.", they interview a Dr Robinson, DO, DVM who uses OMM on her animals....

I have the utmost respect for PAs and hope I didn't convey that I thought PAs weren't a vital part of healthcare. I was just simply stating that the PA program at PCOM is its own program sep from the DO and to my knowledge does not incorporate osteopathic techniques, not saying I thought any less of them
 

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I am also interested in becoming a physician assistant, because they skip the worst part of most doctors' job (paperwork and battling insurers).

:laugh:

You need to spend time shadowing some PAs.
 
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kaizendj

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Thanks for all of the feedback. Becoming a PA is a recent interest of mine, so most of my knowledge about the profession only came from online resources. One of the punch lines that caught my attention came from a CNN study on "best" jobs available in America that rated PA's 5th in rank: "For most doctors, the worst part of their job is filling out paperwork and battling insurers. Physician's assistants get to skip all that ... Doctors' work, bankers' hours. PAs average 35 to 40 hours a week, and they can work part time and in a variety of settings." I have shadowed physicians, dentists, and a nurse practitioner, but have yet to shadow a physician assistant. Back to the drawing boards :rolleyes:
 

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Its true that many physicians work longer hours than their PAs, but it all comes out equal in the end with salary.

Are there PAs out there pulling down big salaries? Absolutely. But they are few and far between and those jobs often come with the long hours and paperwork.

I know a neurosurgical PA making over $150,000. But who do you think is on call for that group? Thats right, the PA. 7 docs, 2 PAs. You bet your ass the senior physicians arent taking call. So is the $150,000 worth it? I dont know. Not when you could be making 3-4 times that...not in my mind anyway.

I considered becoming a PA way back when. But in the end it just didnt add up.

23 years old and graduating from PA school or 30 years old and finishing a residency program?

Personally I want the autonomy. I didnt want to spend the rest of my life being first-assist on cases, doing consults that needed to be cosigned and doing nearly 85% of the scope of the doc for far less money.

Dont get me wrong. PAs fulfill a valuable role in the health care field. I am damn glad there are PAs that can be relied on to take some of the workload from me. But I just feel that I would have been very frustrated as I got older thinking "just 7 more years could have meant a world of difference."

I hear some PAs saying "I wish I went to medical school."

I have never heard a doc say "gee, I wish I were a PA."
 
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Dr. Josh

would shadowing a PA and getting a LOR help at all for med school admissions or is it a waste of time that could be better utlized in other clinical experience?
 

BradenDO

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would shadowing a PA and getting a LOR help at all for med school admissions or is it a waste of time that could be better utlized in other clinical experience?[/Q]

The schools I applied to all wanted a LOR from a DO or MD. I think the experience would be beneficial and the additional LOR wouldn't hurt, but if you don't have a doctor's LOR I would focus on getting one.
 
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Dr. Josh

would shadowing a PA and getting a LOR help at all for med school admissions or is it a waste of time that could be better utlized in other clinical experience?[/Q]

The schools I applied to all wanted a LOR from a DO or MD. I think the experience would be beneficial and the additional LOR wouldn't hurt, but if you don't have a doctor's LOR I would focus on getting one.

I know I can get a DO's LOR(I already did some volunteer work) ; and if i shadow an MD, I can get that one also.
 

ESSmithPA

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Thanks for all of the feedback. Becoming a PA is a recent interest of mine, so most of my knowledge about the profession only came from online resources. One of the punch lines that caught my attention came from a CNN study on "best" jobs available in America that rated PA's 5th in rank: "For most doctors, the worst part of their job is filling out paperwork and battling insurers. Physician's assistants get to skip all that ... Doctors' work, bankers' hours. PAs average 35 to 40 hours a week, and they can work part time and in a variety of settings." I have shadowed physicians, dentists, and a nurse practitioner, but have yet to shadow a physician assistant. Back to the drawing boards :rolleyes:

I was quite amused, as were many of my PA colleagues, who saw the above quote on the CNN and Money Magazine reports about the "best jobs." Stating that PAs "get to skip all that" truly shows that whoever did the research on this article was very ill-informed. I love being a PA, don't get me wrong, but I work in primary care and I am the ONLY one filling out paperwork, for both my patients AND my supervising physician's patients. And while PAs may average 35-40 hours a week, this is a stat taken from the AAPA that seems to include part-timers as well as full-timers. I work over 50 hours a week and that does NOT include how many hours my call includes. Doctors hire PAs so that they can decrease their own workload... it is not the other way around, as that article insinuates. Makes me wonder, if the author of that "best jobs" piece knew what PAs really did, would it still be considered the 4th or 5th "best job" in America???
 

ESSmithPA

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Hi pre-meds. I am interested in osteopathic medicine. I am also interested in becoming a physician assistant, because they skip the worst part of most doctors' job (paperwork and battling insurers). So, I would like to know if there is a such thing as an osteopathic physician assistant. Thanks in advance.

Oh, and to answer your other question... I am a PA working for an osteopathic physician in Florida. PAs are not permitted to perform OMT (or OMM as it is now called) on their patients, and no training to my knowledge is given to PAs in PA Programs in this state. Insurance companies wouldn't pay us to do it even if training was given, and you better believe our malpractice coverage wouldn't allow it. But it is a great opportunity to work for a D.O. seeing the different ways that they are able to deal with situations... it also is a great setting for a PA, especially in primary care. My osteopathic doc's schedule books up several days in advance for patients, so I will often see the acute care people and get them back in with the physician as soon as possible for OMT in their follow up visit if it is necessary. Works out great for everyone involved usually.
 

kaizendj

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This is all very helpful. ESSmithPA, if you don't mind me asking, why did you choose PA school over med school? Would you ever consider going to med school now that you have worked as a PA?
 
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primadonna22274

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Well, for heaven's sakes, don't believe everything you read...even in such a reputable peer-reviewed journal as CNN.

Thanks for all of the feedback. Becoming a PA is a recent interest of mine, so most of my knowledge about the profession only came from online resources. One of the punch lines that caught my attention came from a CNN study on "best" jobs available in America that rated PA's 5th in rank: "For most doctors, the worst part of their job is filling out paperwork and battling insurers. Physician's assistants get to skip all that ... Doctors' work, bankers' hours. PAs average 35 to 40 hours a week, and they can work part time and in a variety of settings." I have shadowed physicians, dentists, and a nurse practitioner, but have yet to shadow a physician assistant. Back to the drawing boards :rolleyes:
 

ESSmithPA

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This is all very helpful. ESSmithPA, if you don't mind me asking, why did you choose PA school over med school? Would you ever consider going to med school now that you have worked as a PA?

No problem kaizendj...

I actually attended Pre-Med and upon graduation had to put off my med school plans due to financial and medical disasters with my family. After I obtained my Bachelors, I became an EMT and worked for 2 years trying to help support my dad and my dying mother. After my mom's passing, I decided I wanted to go back, but at the same time I felt it would be unfair to my family to go to school for 6-8 more years when they needed my help. The PA field seemed perfect... I was able to do what I always wanted, which was help people in the medical field. I never felt upset that I couldn't be my own boss or make the money the doctors make... originally I even told myself I might one day return to med school. But after going through the intense schooling, working in this field for nearly 6 years, and loving this profession with all my heart, I now know I will not be returning to school to get my MD or DO. I do work longer hours, more hospital and more nursing home than the doc I work for... but I am very comfortable with that and embrace the relationship I have with him. The Physician/PA team concept is truly the answer to the health care access crisis in our country and I am a firm believer in that.
 

catgotmytongue

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That's what I was thinking! The two PA's I work with are always doing Prior authorizations and things of that sort. So I agree with you!

That sounds miserable. I've yet to meet any PA's who are always doing prior auths, or doing any prior auths for that matter. I think that is the reason most practices have MA's and additional admin. staff.
 

engineeredout

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I support the creation of the position of Osteopathic Janitor. Someone who cleans the floor and could crack my back would be damn valuable in my book :thumbup:
 

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hey kaizendj

I agree with some of these posts. Being a PA has many positives but also many negatives. The hours you work and the amount of work you do, depends on your field and practice settings. Working in private surgical practice will pay you more money but will also require you to work more hours. Work doesn't end simply because its 5pm, you leave then the last case is done and the last patient is seen. Once home, you will likely be on first-call and surgical-call.

You should shadow multiple PAs in different settings to get a good picture of what it is all about. Best of luck. :)
 

eklip53

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this thread is 3 years old guys... the original posters are either dead or very old. Let the rest in peace.
 

Green6936

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Hi everyone!

I tried to get into DO school about 2 years ago. I tried twice, got 2 interviews, but didn't get in. I gave up and had the "i'm too old and tired" attitude for a while.

Now that I am stuck in a job that I hate, I am considering PA school. I had thought about PA school in the past, but when the DO route. Now that I am more settle and have a house I am thinking PA will be the way to go. There are 2 PA schools where I am.

The MCAT was horrible for me and now I dread having to take the GRE

Any advise from anyone out there is welcome!

I'm 27, have my BS in microbiology, 3.4 overall gpa

Thanks :)
 

elektroshok

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Hi everyone!

I tried to get into DO school about 2 years ago. I tried twice, got 2 interviews, but didn't get in. I gave up and had the "i'm too old and tired" attitude for a while.

Now that I am stuck in a job that I hate, I am considering PA school. I had thought about PA school in the past, but when the DO route. Now that I am more settle and have a house I am thinking PA will be the way to go. There are 2 PA schools where I am.

The MCAT was horrible for me and now I dread having to take the GRE

Any advise from anyone out there is welcome!

I'm 27, have my BS in microbiology, 3.4 overall gpa

Thanks :)

you should try posting in the "what are my chances forum" - you'll get more responses.
 
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I have never heard a doc say "gee, I wish I were a PA."

That is funny that you say that because one of the biggest reasons I decided to go the PA route over the MD route is that the vast majority of MDs I talked to said they wished they had known about the PA route when they decided to become a doctor because they would choose that hands down.
 

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That is funny that you say that because one of the biggest reasons I decided to go the PA route over the MD route is that the vast majority of MDs I talked to said they wished they had known about the PA route when they decided to become a doctor because they would choose that hands down.

Hypothetically speaking, I highly doubt that if it came down to the point where these physicians were given the choice of PA over their own career, they would stick with being a physician. I think they are just being kind and trying to make you feel good about becoming a PA. :)
 

jslo85

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Hypothetically speaking, I highly doubt that if it came down to the point where these physicians were given the choice of PA over their own career, they would stick with being a physician. I think they are just being kind and trying to make you feel good about becoming a PA. :)

To be completely honest I do agree with this post for the most part but I also will quickly state that many attendings have the utmost respect for the PAs that they work with and often partner with. Though the training is far shorter (2 years) PAs (the ones I've met and talked to while doing preceptorships) were fully experienced and very disciplined. By strict definition, PAs are trained to be able handle anything their SPs are willing to authorize them to do. They also function as almost full fledged physicians in many rural communities. But you all know that already and i'm just stating the obvious. :) Everyone has a role to play.
 

ErinEmSee

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i laughed when i saw the title of this thread. my initial reaction was, so next step, the osteopathization of teeth and eyes.

being a PA isnt fun and games. they have to know their stuff and be second in command when the doc isnt around.

Do you even know what the osteopathic philosophy is? The whole body is connected, I hope you agree to that. The osteopath treats the whole body, concerned with all the intertwining nature of the human body -YES, even the teeth and eyes. Actually, Nova Southeastern U now offers a D.O./D.M.D program. The osteopath treats the person, not just the symptoms.

You should do some research before you criticize. D.O.'s are just as skilled and trained as M.D.'s, in fact more-so due to their intensive OMT/OMM training.

Being a part of the health-care provider team (P.A., N.P., D.O. and M.D., etc.) are ALL important and not "fun and games", everyone has to "know their stuff". Well, some D.O.'s have fun =] because the more you utilize OMT, the better you get - and improvement is fun!!

- Erin
 

fiznat

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Well, damage is done as far as the resurrection. I might as well add at this point that some PA programs actually do include some training in OMM. I just happened to have a conversation with one of our professors the other day who mentioned that the PA program here at DCOM does about 25-30 hours of OMM at some point during their training. Its a pretty stripped-down version, but its a taste....
 

willen101383

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Well, damage is done as far as the resurrection. I might as well add at this point that some PA programs actually do include some training in OMM. I just happened to have a conversation with one of our professors the other day who mentioned that the PA program here at DCOM does about 25-30 hours of OMM at some point during their training. Its a pretty stripped-down version, but its a taste....

And the sad thing is that "stripped down" version is probably all the OMM education that should be taught...bc thats the only stuff that actually has any pertinence to real life practice for your average physician.
 

BrownEyedJedi

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Its true that many physicians work longer hours than their PAs, but it all comes out equal in the end with salary.

Are there PAs out there pulling down big salaries? Absolutely. But they are few and far between and those jobs often come with the long hours and paperwork.

I know a neurosurgical PA making over $150,000. But who do you think is on call for that group? Thats right, the PA. 7 docs, 2 PAs. You bet your ass the senior physicians arent taking call. So is the $150,000 worth it? I dont know. Not when you could be making 3-4 times that...not in my mind anyway.

I considered becoming a PA way back when. But in the end it just didnt add up.

23 years old and graduating from PA school or 30 years old and finishing a residency program?

Personally I want the autonomy. I didnt want to spend the rest of my life being first-assist on cases, doing consults that needed to be cosigned and doing nearly 85% of the scope of the doc for far less money.

Dont get me wrong. PAs fulfill a valuable role in the health care field. I am damn glad there are PAs that can be relied on to take some of the workload from me. But I just feel that I would have been very frustrated as I got older thinking "just 7 more years could have meant a world of difference."

I hear some PAs saying "I wish I went to medical school."

I have never heard a doc say "gee, I wish I were a PA."



I've heard plenty of physicians/doctor say they wish they would've gone to PA school or even SUGGEST to me that I go to PA school instead of MD/DO/DPM school.


It's 50/50, kiddos.
 

moocow47

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Just want to say again that PAs do a LOT of paperwork and battling with insurers. I worked directly with PAs and docs for several years and I'd say that major difference (obviously there are a billion but in the interest of time I'll just choose one since we're discussing overarching differences) is that one of them got to home a lot earlier than the other.

(once again, there are a million differences b/w docs and PAs so please don't freak out and write me a scathing reply.)
 
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