LoveDoc

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OK....

It was bound to come out so here it is.

I think the attitude of some people on this board are super arrogant and pompous. Is this how people are going to treat their future patients? Or will they be fake and hide that side of their personality?

Also, I am older (29) and don't have a lot of the hang-ups, insecurities that younger people have. Is America turning out young, immature, arrogant doctors?

Is there an article on this somewhere on the web?

I know that older doctors will have their shortcomings as well but this is just something that has really been on my mind. I took a Princeton Review class where the instructors were college seniors about to enter Med School and I thought to myself, 'OMG they have no reasoning skills or sincere depth to their thought patterns at all.'

Am I being too judgemental?

(Please noone take offense. I am saying this in love and sincerity)
 

tBw

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Originally posted by LoveDoc
OK....

I am older (29) and don't have a lot of the hang-ups, insecurities that younger people have. Is America turning out young, immature, arrogant doctors?

I know that older doctors will have their shortcomings as well but this is just something that has really been on my mind. I took a Princeton Review class where the instructors were college seniors about to enter Med School and I thought to myself, 'OMG they have no reasoning skills or sincere depth to their thought patterns at all.'

Am I being too judgemental?

Hmmm, you think people are arrogant and pompous and yet you state sweeping generalisations like you don't have the "hang-ups and insecurities that younger people have". Hmmm...who's being pompous?

Sure, some of the people on here and out in the world are arrogant and pompous, but it's not a factor of age, it's a factor of personality.

While your particular princeton review instructors may have had "no reasoning skills or sincere depth to their thought patterns at all." I am unsure whether this was an assumption you made based on the fact they were seniors or if this was based on observation over time. If you are making assumptions based on age you are in for a rough time ahead - as a mature medical student many of the med students and residents you will encounter will be younger than you but that won't mean they don't know anything. If you make the mistake of thinking that you know more because you are older you will (a) irritate them (b) be constantly irritated yourself at having to take instructions from them (c) not learn much and (d) thus not be able to provide optimal patient care.

I think you need to think hard about where these feelings come from. In the long run they can only hold you back.
 

saiyagirl

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LoveDoc,

you might be a little too judgemental. most of the people here are nice and helpful, and i think you'll see that as you explore the site and ask questions. i'm not sure what sort of behavior you're referring too.

i wouldn't worry about their future as america's doctors. keep in mind a few things. remember--most people here aren't doctors yet, and neither was the senior in college you mentioned. we all have to grow, mature, and be humbled by years of school and training. secondly, this is the net. you gotta be really careful assuming things about a person--much less an entire group. and finally, true we have insecurites you may have outgrown, but there are plenty of insecurities that come with time as well.

i am confident that the vast majority of people on this site will be fantastic docs. i hope you'll see that soon!

just my $.02
 
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CoffeeCat

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I'm not sure what sort of response you are looking for. I think the best you could hope for is people writing that they are not really the things you say they are and how does prove or disprove what you are saying?? I think you need to reevaluate your reason for posting this, it does not seem like a mature, non-arrogant, non-judgemental post.
 
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LoveDoc

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Thanks saiyagirl. That was the insight I was looking for. "Humbled by years of school and training..." is a promising concept.

Also, this is the net and I'm also intelligent enough that anonymity renders itself to the disclosure of one's true opinion.

This is what bothers me. And for the people who obviously took offense to what I said...I am sorry.
 

tatabox80

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Originally posted by LoveDoc
OK....
Is America turning out young, immature, arrogant doctors?

(Please noone take offense. I am saying this in love and sincerity)
Yes. Most people on the pre-allo board are younger than you. So many people here would take offense to this. I understand where you're coming from, but sometimes the people you have mentioned above stick out like a sore thumb and are all you can remember. I've known a lot of pre-meds that are young and immature and arrogant, but also know MANY MANY more who are GREAT people. I don't understand the criticizing out of love and sincerity though. If you don't like something or someone just say it, it doesn't need to come from love and sincerity!
 

tBw

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Originally posted by LoveDoc
And for the people who obviously took offense to what I said...I am sorry.
...and who would they be?? seriously, re-reading both my and coffeecats responses I don't think either of them indicate offense, so much as just the opinion that this is more about you than anyone else...
 

Adcadet

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hmm....
sure, some people come off as arrogant pompous jerks here (and everywhere), but there are so many really good people here (and elsewhere) that I just ignore the former and talk with the later.
 

monster2

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This is old news. Of course EVERYBODY here is arrogant and pompous. That's exactly the way doctors are. We can all hide our arrogance in an appropriate manner, especially to our patients, after all that's what healing is all about. But come up to any doctor and call him/her mister/missus, and believe me, there will be a frown on their faces. Heck, there's even some guy herefrom U of Rochester, who has some crappy website diary about his achievements and scholarships, I mean why? Because he knows that all that hard work mustn't go unnoticed just as that Dr. title isn't invisible. Arrogance is bound to happen... good doctors are able to hide it from their patients. But to the public and amongst themselves? I think not.

Originally posted by LoveDoc
OK....

It was bound to come out so here it is.

I think the attitude of some people on this board are super arrogant and pompous. Is this how people are going to treat their future patients? Or will they be fake and hide that side of their personality?

Also, I am older (29) and don't have a lot of the hang-ups, insecurities that younger people have. Is America turning out young, immature, arrogant doctors?

Is there an article on this somewhere on the web?

I know that older doctors will have their shortcomings as well but this is just something that has really been on my mind. I took a Princeton Review class where the instructors were college seniors about to enter Med School and I thought to myself, 'OMG they have no reasoning skills or sincere depth to their thought patterns at all.'

Am I being too judgemental?

(Please noone take offense. I am saying this in love and sincerity)
 
C

carbonatedH20

"This is old news. Of course EVERYBODY here is arrogant and pompous. That's exactly the way doctors are. We can all hide our arrogance in an appropriate manner, especially to our patients, after all that's what healing is all about. But come up to any doctor and call him/her mister/missus, and believe me, there will be a frown on their faces. Heck, there's even some guy herefrom U of Rochester, who has some crappy website diary about his achievements and scholarships, I mean why? Because he knows that all that hard work mustn't go unnoticed just as that Dr. title isn't invisible. Arrogance is bound to happen... good doctors are able to hide it from their patients. But to the public and amongst themselves? I think not."

Speaking from experience, it is not only the MD's that expect to be called dr. I have seen phd's get after students and lab techs for calling them by their first name. I have heard dpm's express how this type of behavior bothers them.

All of these people have worked hard for their degrees: MD/DO, PHD, DPM, DDS, DVM, etc. However, some don't get offended when being called by their first name under certain circumstances.

For example, a podiatrist told me that he expects all his patients to call him doctor on their first meeting with him. If any of his patients have one of these titles after their name, he will respectfully use the title before their name. As he gets to know his patients, he and the patient drop the Dr. thing.

Another example, some psychiatrists don't mind at all being called by their first name because they just want the patient to feel comfortable. I have also seen this.
 

Caffeinated

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I am already a "doctor" although I am not a physician. I am an optometrist. I am also on active duty in the Army. Every once in a while I have a patient that calls me by my first name because he or she is a higher rank than me, and they think they can pull that. I usually let them get away with it. But if a patient asks me my first name, I tell them "Doctor". But I will tell you that it drives me bonkers when people try to sidestep the title. When I am in a non-patient care situation, I hate to be called "Mr." I have been through too much to be a Mr. I'd rather be called by my first name than be called a Mr. Call me "Captain" or call me "Dr." or just call me Aaron, but the Mr. thing is like nails on a chalk board.
 

FutureM.D.

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Originally posted by monster2
This is old news. Of course EVERYBODY here is arrogant and pompous. That's exactly the way doctors are. We can all hide our arrogance in an appropriate manner, especially to our patients, after all that's what healing is all about. But come up to any doctor and call him/her mister/missus, and believe me, there will be a frown on their faces. Heck, there's even some guy herefrom U of Rochester, who has some crappy website diary about his achievements and scholarships, I mean why? Because he knows that all that hard work mustn't go unnoticed just as that Dr. title isn't invisible. Arrogance is bound to happen... good doctors are able to hide it from their patients. But to the public and amongst themselves? I think not.
You make too many generalities, no wonder nobody on SDN likes you. I don't think all of us on here are arrogant, I'm not.
 

monster2

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Lord, give me some salt and pepper for this corn. Is this a world of birds, butterflies and people with shiny pants and smiling faces? Doctors themselves pride in the fact that the medical profession is the GREATEST of ALL professions. It's been said in many speeches for incoming students. Doctors are arrogant by default... their compassion is LEARNED, a part of the required patient-doctor curriculum. And in the end, financial security is the biggest draw... who's stupid enough to pay such an exorbitant amount of tuition, profess extreme amount of sacrifice, and tolerate the worst of peoples without expecting anything back? Let's stop playing the visionary.

Originally posted by Northerner
I think often times people get hung up on how people think of them and forget about why they started this whole medicine thing anyway. I know there has to be a decent segment of pre-meds out there that actually give a damn about their patients, because I am one of them. Granted, I have little clinical experience in relation to most, and I know there are clinicians on all grades of the spectrum, but this argument seems so silly, have confidence in all you do, but please remember your passion for rebuilding people, and for me the decision to practice medicine required my entire being, and a great deal of soul-searching, I'm assuming you all went through the same thing I did. As my future colleagues, I really hope you're in this for the right reasons; the reason that looks you in the eye and knows its in good hands, the reason that looks to you for expertise in their own body, the reason that can be won over with that smile and look in your eyes that says "I am on your side, for better or worse". I think a lot of people equate doctor with success, which in my opinion is wrong. You're a success if you can be happy, hopefully you find that in medicine. Maybe this is all idealistic, and maybe the best we can all hope for is for people to note our inevitable flaws and comment, "...yeah, but he's a great doctor...", but I know what I am for, and that's enough for me. In conclusion, my response is that I don't know what the right mindset is, all I can hope for is the strength to be myself and the best damn doctor I could ever be, and know I have that capacity. (it kinda felt good to write)
 
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