Pa-c

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Breno58

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Has anyone ever thought about becoming a physician assistant. They do the same thing, from what I have observed as an EMT in the ER. The PA just has less education, they make less, but have more free time. This seems like a good deal! I have talked to alot of PA's and they say they love the job, since they basically do the same job as a MD, but with better hours 👍 and some are better than the MD in patient care. A PA told me that "Most PA's have 5+ years of healthcare experience before going to PA school, so they have better patient care in mind" she stated-(This is not a post to put down MD's because I want to be an MD, but was wondering if other students have considered other healthcare routes)
 
I assume you mean an EM physician, not an EMT.

I don't think the OP is a EM physician.

PA and MD work closely together, but you must keep in mind that they do indeed have different jobs with different pros and cons. Just like anything, if one job feels like a better fit over the other one, that's what you should do.
 
Has anyone ever thought about becoming a physician assistant. They do the same thing, from what I have observed as an EMT in the ER. The PA just has less education, they make less, but have more free time. This seems like a good deal! I have talked to alot of PA's and they say they love the job, since they basically do the same job as a MD, but with better hours 👍 and some are better than the MD in patient care. A PA told me that "Most PA's have 5+ years of healthcare experience before going to PA school, so they have better patient care in mind" she stated-(This is not a post to put down MD's because I want to be an MD, but was wondering if other students have considered other healthcare routes)

Most PA programs require their students to have 1000-5000 hours prior to matriculation in a paid clinical setting. Overall it's a better deal in many regards.... no call, no malpractice or getting sued, significantly less time spent in school, PA's don't need to take Organic chemistry 2....
 
Never considered it. Oh wait. Yes I did. Probably before this thread was done 1000 times. Sorry OP but these types of threads are perrennial.
 
"Most PA's have 5+ years of healthcare experience before going to PA school, so they have better patient care in mind" she stated

"PAs have better patient care in mind." Of course she said that -- she's a PA. That's as surprising as a car salesman talking up the latest model he's trying to shove in your garage.

I chose to go for an MD for my own reasons. God bless a good PA, but only you can figure out if you'd be happy as one.
 
Never considered it. Oh wait. Yes I did. Probably before this thread was done 1000 times. Sorry OP but these types of threads are perrennial.

Never considered it. Oh wait. Yes I did. Probably before this thread was done 1000 times. Sorry OP but these types of threads are perrennial.

Did anyone else catch the irony here? 😛
 
Has anyone ever thought about becoming a physician assistant. They do the same thing, from what I have observed as an EMT in the ER. The PA just has less education, they make less, but have more free time. This seems like a good deal! I have talked to alot of PA's and they say they love the job, since they basically do the same job as a MD, but with better hours 👍 and some are better than the MD in patient care. A PA told me that "Most PA's have 5+ years of healthcare experience before going to PA school, so they have better patient care in mind" she stated-(This is not a post to put down MD's because I want to be an MD, but was wondering if other students have considered other healthcare routes)

Uhh, they don't do the same job as MD. I got melonoma, I don't go see a PA, I go see a MD. I got a herniated disc, I don't go see a PA, I go see a MD. Lots more
 
I have a brilliant friend that easily could have went to medical school, and he actually went to PA school right out of college.

His reasoning was that he wanted to get out of school earlier and start working, also to have a family. Another thing he really liked was never having to deal with insurance and that PAs can switch specialties easily, he liked the flexibility.

At the hospital where I volunteer, everyone trusts the trauma PA in the emergency department more than the EM Physicians. The trauma PA is the first one to get a call when a serious trauma comes in. So again it comes down to how you are as an individual and not so much your title.
 
At the hospital where I volunteer, everyone trusts the trauma PA in the emergency department more than the EM Physicians. The trauma PA is the first one to get a call when a serious trauma comes in. So again it comes down to how you are as an individual and not so much your title.

Ok, I believed the first part of your answer but let's be serious here. A PA is not the professional equivalent of a doc, period. The PA might be the first to respond to a trauma to start an IV, slap on some EKG leads, etc but they will call the doc in for the big guns later.
 
That's what I am aiming for. Easier to have a family, ability to change specialities without completing a residency (exam). I don't need to be the top decision-maker, and the "Dr." title doesn't really matter to me.

This issue has been debated verbatim for a long time. Just google "PA vs. MD", and you'll see what I mean. Just a matter of what a person wants to do in their life. However, I don't agree with the idea "PA-C=MD." Two different jobs with different roles.

PA's are slightly more equal in primary care roles since the cases aren't as difficult there, but the two roles aren't equal in other specialties, including ER. If I'm not mistaken, PA's assist in serious cases and work on less severe cases, such as splints, sutures, etc.
 
Ok, I believed the first part of your answer but let's be serious here. A PA is not the professional equivalent of a doc, period. The PA might be the first to respond to a trauma to start an IV, slap on some EKG leads, etc but they will call the doc in for the big guns later.

They do call in the docs as well. But this particular PA has an incredible reputation, and I believe they are not professional equivalents as well. Regardless, that is the way this PA at this particular hospital is viewed as.

I am just giving input based on the particular situation I have seen. I am not advocating for professional equivalence between PA and MD. Based upon the difference between the two roles, I have chosen to become MD, I understand the difference.
 
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Ok, I believed the first part of your answer but let's be serious here. A PA is not the professional equivalent of a doc, period. The PA might be the first to respond to a trauma to start an IV, slap on some EKG leads, etc but they will call the doc in for the big guns later.
"The big guns"-PA's are professionals too....He prob is better in trauma situations-Actually while I was working on the ambulance one night, we got called out to an MVA. That night we also had a MD riding along with us. When we pulled up, we had a semi v.s car- we started triaging and staring iv's and intubating etc.-The MD WAS LOST, we actually had to yell at him and tell him what to do-it all depends on who you are-not your title.
 
If the responsibilities are identical, then why does the EM doc make 3X the salary? In all seriousness, though, both routes are good careers options. Frankly, I wish they would allow physicians that opt out of residency to become PAs. That would seem logical.
 
"The big guns"-PA's are professionals too....He prob is better in trauma situations-Actually while I was working on the ambulance one night, we got called out to an MVA. That night we also had a MD riding along with us. When we pulled up, we had a semi v.s car- we started triaging and staring iv's and intubating etc.-The MD WAS LOST, we actually had to yell at him and tell him what to do-it all depends on who you are-not your title.

A PA is better in trauma situations than a board certified EM doc? You're kidding me, right?
 
"The big guns"-PA's are professionals too....He prob is better in trauma situations-Actually while I was working on the ambulance one night, we got called out to an MVA. That night we also had a MD riding along with us. When we pulled up, we had a semi v.s car- we started triaging and staring iv's and intubating etc.-The MD WAS LOST, we actually had to yell at him and tell him what to do-it all depends on who you are-not your title.

Nope not kidding....he was real lost!
 
A PA is better in trauma situations than a board certified EM doc? You're kidding me, right?

Maybe an EM doc wet behind the ears vs a PA with 20+ years of experience... Maybe... 😀
 
PA is my back up plan. However, I am hoping to never use it. =)
 
"The big guns"-PA's are professionals too....He prob is better in trauma situations-Actually while I was working on the ambulance one night, we got called out to an MVA. That night we also had a MD riding along with us. When we pulled up, we had a semi v.s car- we started triaging and staring iv's and intubating etc.-The MD WAS LOST, we actually had to yell at him and tell him what to do-it all depends on who you are-not your title.

That's not surprising.. he was trained to work in the ED, not the back of an ambulance. Why would you jump to that conclusion? Watch an EM doc in action, in the ED.. you will see the difference.

As for the original point, PAs are not the equivalent of an MD. They only function under supervision to an attending physician. They are, of course, very valued in the healthcare team -- but they fill a niche. If you look at the extensive training process to become an MD, you will understand why they are qualified to be the person who "calls the shots." Becoming a PA is intensive, but the length of training is considerably less. I would want an MD treating me in any sort of complicated situation.
 
Nope not kidding....he was real lost!

Ok, if you take a doc out of an ED setting and put him in the back of an ambulance with some rolls of gauze bandage and some safety shears then I would imagine he'd be out of his comfort zone. (Although I have a hard time believing that a doc would be uncomfortable intubating or starting an IV). In any case, it IS about the title behind someone's name because the title is associated with many more years of didactic training and (barring a freshly minted MD) many more clinical hours.

Edit: Evergrey beat me to it.
 
A PA is better in trauma situations than a board certified EM doc? You're kidding me, right?

I might be able to buy it, assuming the PA is just the trauma surgery PA and the EM guy doesn't end up handling trauma. It's my understanding that the initial management of trauma is pretty much following algorhythms. If that's all you do every day, you're going to know it cold.

In the hospital where I worked, the PAs saw primarily "urgent care", which is synonymous with minor to no-way-you-should-be-receiving-any care. Sure, some things that seem minor ended up in the ICU, but those typically were staffed with the physician as well, at least to bounce ideas off them.
 
Ok, if you take a doc out of an ED setting and put him in the back of an ambulance with some rolls of gauze bandage and some safety shears then I would imagine he'd be out of his comfort zone. (Although I have a hard time believing that a doc would be uncomfortable intubating or starting an IV). In any case, it IS about the title behind someone's name because the title is associated with many more years of didactic training and (barring a freshly minted MD) many more clinical hours.

Edit: Evergrey beat me to it.

He wasnt uncomfortable intubating and starting IV's, he was uncomfortable that when we pulled up we had to secure the scene. Then we had to have the fire department start extricating. While FD was extricating we had to climb down in the car to start an IV of lactated ringers etc...he didnt know how to use a backboard, or traction splint...I really think ED physicians should do rotations on ambulances while in residency-it would help them see what we deal with on the other side
 
Why is it that these forums always turn into an argument? I wrote this to see what other students thought about considering PA....you'll like to fight 😱
 
Why is it that these forums always turn into an argument? I wrote this to see what other students thought about considering PA....you'll like to fight 😱

Usually, anything that involves PA vs. MD will turn into an argument. Sad, but true. The one piece of advice I can give is never use PA as a medical school back-up. There are enough people who want to become a PA outright (admittedly myself), and the competition for PA schools is extremely high. I have always read that PA schools look down upon candidates who use PA as a back-up.
 
Why is it that these forums always turn into an argument? I wrote this to see what other students thought about considering PA....you'll like to fight 😱

I didn't mean to attack you, it's just that statements like these are misleading to prospective health students. PAs are absolutely necessary (as are MDs, nurses, and all other staff members) but there is no good reason to compare them apples to apples.

Has anyone ever thought about becoming a physician assistant. They do the same thing, from what I have observed as an EMT in the ER. The PA just has less education, they make less, but have more free time.
 
I didn't mean to attack you, it's just that statements like these are misleading to prospective health students. PAs are absolutely necessary (as are MDs, nurses, and all other staff members) but there is no good reason to compare them apples to apples.

Sorry, didnt mean to compare the two. I was just seeing if students have considered a PA profession before deciding on MD. I threw that in prob because I grew up in a non-medical family and they always said go to the PA or Nurse practitioner-they treat you better as a patient. but I realize the education that it takes to be an MD now but that was a true story about the MD in the ambulance, however he was not in a hospital setting. Sorry

P.S this is between me and aSagacious, this is not to start an argument
 
Usually, anything that involves PA vs. MD will turn into an argument. Sad, but true. The one piece of advice I can give is never use PA as a medical school back-up. There are enough people who want to become a PA outright (admittedly myself), and the competition for PA schools is extremely high. I have always read that PA schools look down upon candidates who use PA as a back-up.

Thanks for the advice..Goodluck in school!
 
Usually, the doctor is smarter...

Usually 😎
 
Most PA programs require their students to have 1000-5000 hours prior to matriculation in a paid clinical setting.

Eh, still not that impressive. A system where you're required to have more clinical experience hours PRIOR to receiving any education or training instead of AFTER doesn't make much sense to me. Either you have a bedside manner and communication skills or you don't, and that's most of what you'll get with clinical experience prior to any training. The hundreds of hours I spent in a clinical setting prior to med school was probably, in terms of contributing to my clinical practice, about the equivalent of a few hours worth of internship. And, frankly, comparing 1000-5000 hours of experience prior to having any practical knowledge personally pales in comparison to the 11,500+ hours of post-graduate MD/DO training (or, similarly, the first few years working as a PA).

In the whole PA vs MD debate, I think it comes down to whether you'd be happier making final decisions or having to follow other people's decisions. People who don't want final responsibility (which is an incredibly valid choice) love the PA route...those who do want final responsibility are happier on the MD route. MDs often compare being a PA to being an intern for life, since you spend all the work doing the daily minutia but ultimately any decision you make can be overruled and double-guessed, which can become incredibly irritating once you do have experience and expertise. The PAs I know who love their job aren't bothered by that; the PAs I know who hate their job hate it because they would have managed patients differently than their MD dictates. Picture being a super-competent PA working under an idiot MD...if that idea horrifies you, you should go the MD/DO route. 😉
 
Eh, still not that impressive. A system where you're required to have more clinical experience hours PRIOR to receiving any education or training instead of AFTER doesn't make much sense to me. Either you have a bedside manner and communication skills or you don't, and that's most of what you'll get with clinical experience prior to any training. The hundreds of hours I spent in a clinical setting prior to med school was probably, in terms of contributing to my clinical practice, about the equivalent of a few hours worth of internship. And, frankly, comparing 1000-5000 hours of experience prior to having any practical knowledge personally pales in comparison to the 11,500+ hours of post-graduate MD/DO training (or, similarly, the first few years working as a PA).

In the whole PA vs MD debate, I think it comes down to whether you'd be happier making final decisions or having to follow other people's decisions. People who don't want final responsibility (which is an incredibly valid choice) love the PA route...those who do want final responsibility are happier on the MD route. MDs often compare being a PA to being an intern for life, since you spend all the work doing the daily minutia but ultimately any decision you make can be overruled and double-guessed, which can become incredibly irritating once you do have experience and expertise. The PAs I know who love their job aren't bothered by that; the PAs I know who hate their job hate it because they would have managed patients differently than their MD dictates. Picture being a super-competent PA working under an idiot MD...if that idea horrifies you, you should go the MD/DO route. 😉

I will be going the MD/DO route! That paragraph actually did horrify me :scared:
Thanks for the advice 👍
 
Why is it that these forums always turn into an argument? I wrote this to see what other students thought about considering PA....you'll like to fight 😱

I don't think everything on these forums turns into an argument 🙂 As I've said before, PAs are valued members of the healthcare team. The training to become one is rigorous and admission is competitive. However, to claim that they do the same thing is not entirely accurate. Making an informed decision about which path to choose is important, and I like to think that the SDN community attempts to contribute to that goal in an earnest manner 👍
 
I don't think everything on these forums turns into an argument 🙂 As I've said before, PAs are valued members of the healthcare team. The training to become one is rigorous and admission is competitive. However, to claim that they do the same thing is not entirely accurate. Making an informed decision about which path to choose is important, and I like to think that the SDN community attempts to contribute to that goal in an earnest manner 👍

Yea, I started reading up on PA's..From the perspective that I have when going to the ER, they do the same thing. However, from reading today they are different! Thanks for the comment 👍
 
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