Paid clinical experience

[COMBAT MEDIC172]

All my clinical experience is paid and I don't think that I will have time to do much volunteering at all. I will also most likely have no research. However do you think that my unique experience and exposure will make up for the lack of research/volunteering? Between work/school full time It is impossible unless I dont sleep(crossed my mind). My other option would be to take 1 less course each quarter and replace the the time with research/volunteering. I just want to make sure I dont end up short changing my self. Any advice is welcome.

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[LizzyM]

All my clinical experience is paid and I don't think that I will have time to do much volunteering at all. I will also most likely have no research. However do you think that my unique experience and exposure will make up for the lack of research/volunteering? Between work/school full time It is impossible unless I dont sleep(crossed my mind). My other option would be to take 1 less course each quarter and replace the the time with research/volunteering. I just want to make sure I dont end up short changing my self. Any advice is welcome.

Could you find 8 hours a month (2 hours wk or split another way--maybe on weekends), to do something to improve your community? It doesn't have to be medical. Coach, tutor, "Big Brother", friendly visitor to the aged, guide a boy scout with merit badge requirements....

I'd also suggest exploring whether you can do research for credit. You'd be taking the same number of credits but you'd have a research experience to add to your application. The other alternative would be to see if there is a research question in the your clinical setting where you work that could be answered with a retrospective chart review study. Many docs have myriad questions but no time to dig through the records & record the data. Partner with one and do the chart reviews a few at a time over the course of a year. You'll need IRB (reserach ethics oversight board) approval but in most instances you can ask for a waiver of informed consent for retrospective chart reviews.

 

[COMBAT MEDIC172]

I work fri, sat , sun every other weekend and my main study hours come from the weekend that I have off. As far as the research for credit , thats not a bad idea Im going to look in to that. Thanks

 

[olemissbabydoc]

Honestly, clinical experience is clinical experience... it doesn't have to be volunteer. Sure, it looks good... (which is why I suggest following the above advice and trying to find a LITTLE time, albeit an hour per week to do something community service related) but your clinical experience will probably get more attention

Research for credit = amazing

 

[COMBAT MEDIC172]

What kinds of courses are research for credit?

 

[luckyducky87]

But I think some sort of community service is also important - to show that you're genuinely interested in serving others.

 

[luckyducky87]

What kinds of courses are research for credit?

At my school, "research for credit" requires you finding a research lab first (with hte permission of the PI of that lab - basically, talk to some research groups in the dept you'd be interested in joining, and see if they're willing to take you on or have an opening for an undergrad). Once you do that, we have to get a form signed to "sign up" for credit and turn it into the dept. Your PI will probably know what you need to do at your school. But the first step is to find a lab...

 

[LizzyM]

I work fri, sat , sun every other weekend and my main study hours come from the weekend that I have off. As far as the research for credit , thats not a bad idea Im going to look in to that. Thanks

Could you spare 2 hours during the work week to volunteer in a school, shelter, nursing home, Red Cross office, adult day care center, food pantry, community center, scout troop? any interests outside of medicine that could be turned int a volunteer service to your community with a minimum of effort on your part?

 

[COMBAT MEDIC172]

Thanks for all the info. I just talked with an advisor at my school, and there is a evnviromental science research course that I am going to take. I will try to volunteer with some programs that might be availible around campus.

 

[LizzyM]

That's a great start. Maybe the quarter after that you can do an "independent study" where you go further with a testable hypothesis that you and your mentor come up with.

 

[Excelsius]

That's a great start. Maybe the quarter after that you can do an "independent study" where you go further with a testable hypothesis that you and your mentor come up with.

Lizzy, do research and independent study grades count towards BCPM? Is it safe to assume that if you do research in a BCPM course, such as physics, it will always count towards BCPM? I guess research in non-BCPM course will not count towards BCPM GPA (such as engineering or humanities research).

Also, my school doesn't offer independent study courses. There is only research, but students do have the option of submitting their own research proposals, which I will be doing soon. I guess this is something that should be mentioned in the activities description and perhaps the PS on the AMCAS application.

 

[Excelsius]

Lizzy, one more thing - do you think it is ok for a student to sacrifice some clinical experience hours to do research instead? I had the privilege of being introduced to a medical school professor who happens to do research in an area that has interested me for a while. I am working on my proposal now and will be able to do research in medical school. Because that is not usual for my undergraduate school, I may end up not receiving any school credit at all (which I don't care much about), but I am somewhat concerned whether adcoms might not like the fact that I chose to spend so much time on just one (or two) research projects instead of spending more time volunteering at a hospital. Is there a particular number of cumulative clinical experience I should aim at? I have a total of less than 100hrs as of now. I am also a low-GPA non-trad applicant. Thanks.

 

[Emmet2301]

My pre-med advisor said that you should only do research if you want to apply for MD/Phd. Otherwise don't do it at all...Is she right? Should I do some just in case?

 

[justdoit31]

Lizzy, do research and independent study grades count towards BCPM? Is it safe to assume that if you do research in a BCPM course, such as physics, it will always count towards BCPM? I guess research in non-BCPM course will not count towards BCPM GPA (such as engineering or humanities research).

Also, my school doesn't offer independent study courses. There is only research, but students do have the option of submitting their own research proposals, which I will be doing soon. I guess this is something that should be mentioned in the activities description and perhaps the PS on the AMCAS application.

At my school if you do research (either as directed study *under university faculty* or internship *outside, for example CDC*) then it goes in as Biology 4490 course credit... it is the same way in chemistry and we don't have a physics department.

My research was in humanities and I didn't get credit for it *unless you count a national presentation as credit* but the classes I took while conducting research abroad were in my non-BCPM calculation.

 

[justdoit31]

My pre-med advisor said that you should only do research if you want to apply for MD/Phd. Otherwise don't do it at all...Is she right? Should I do some just in case?

I believe over 60% of the students who are accepted into medical school have research experience and the big name schools (Harvard, Hopkins, Washington U, etc) have even higher percentages... I would highly recommend it if you were interested. However, if you have no interest in research just make sure to do other things to make yourself stand out!

 

[LizzyM]

I don't care how you do the research (credit/no credit/independent study/ etc) but do it. If possible, don't just be a research assistant but actually get in there and design and conduct your own experiment or your own investigation (test a hypothesis).

Everyone needs clinical experiece. I've seen as little as 2 hrs/ wk for a semester, which I think is not quite enough-- the point is, you should show that you have a familiarity with the environment in which you propose to spend the rest of your career.

Most students at the top schools do have research experience. It doesn't matter to me what kind of experience it is (humanities is ok by me, but make it original sources, please, not just a rehash of the published literature) but something demonstrating an interest in the scholarly side of academic life is important.

 

[alibai3ah]

I don't care how you do the research (credit/no credit/independent study/ etc) but do it. If possible, don't just be a research assistant but actually get in there and design and conduct your own experiment or your own investigation (test a hypothesis).

Everyone needs clinical experiece. I've seen as little as 2 hrs/ wk for a semester, which I think is not quite enough-- the point is, you should show that you have a familiarity with the environment in which you propose to spend the rest of your career.

Most students at the top schools do have research experience. It doesn't matter to me what kind of experience it is (humanities is ok by me, but make it original sources, please, not just a rehash of the published literature) but something demonstrating an interest in the scholarly side of academic life is important.

I feel as though it's difficult to find a research job where you would be organizing or conducting your own study, especially when you are a student. Becoming a CRA usually requires a BS at most pharmaceutical, biotech, or school affiliated hospitals....I would assume that most applicants who have research have been research assistants, unless they are much older.

 

[alibai3ah]

My pre-med advisor said that you should only do research if you want to apply for MD/Phd. Otherwise don't do it at all...Is she right? Should I do some just in case?

That is definitely not true. You should do research if it interests you and in no way are you obligated to apply to MD/PhD programs....regular MD programs value research as well... And don't do it just b/c med schools like it, do it if you are interested in research

 

[LizzyM]

I feel as though it's difficult to find a research job where you would be organizing or conducting your own study, especially when you are a student. Becoming a CRA usually requires a BS at most pharmaceutical, biotech, or school affiliated hospitals....I would assume that most applicants who have research have been research assistants, unless they are much older.

By organizing and conducting a study, I mean getting some experience in a lab and then proposing a small project to your PI. You might say, we've been doing x but some recent work done elsewhere has been showing that y works well, could we try adding y and looking at the effect it has on our outcomes. You hypothesize that adding y will change the outcome and you test that hypothesis in a series of experiments. Students do this all the time. The point is to know the literature, know what is going on in the professor's lab and make a reasonable proposal within the context of the ongoing research agenda.

Students are capable of being research assistants in clinical settings. Identifying patients to are eligible to enroll, informing them & getting their consent, collecting data (often helping them with questionnaires or seeing that additional blood draws are done & sent for analysis), entering data. I've interviewed college students who have done exactly this sort of stuff and someone who is already working in a clinical setting may have a good idea of some of the questions that have arisen (are pt outcomes better in circumstance "a" than in circumstance "b"? does doing x decrease the time it takes to get the patient to point y where it is known that speedy arrival at point y increases the likelihood of survival?)

 

[Druggernaut]

For volunteer experience, should it be in a different area than your clinical experience, or does it not matter? I've been doing EMS and working in the ED, and one of the more enjoyable volunteer options open through the Red Cross is volunteering doing first aid and such for summer festivals.

I've been accepted into a lab for two semesters of research in a social science field, if diversifying that kind of thing matters.

 

[LizzyM]

For volunteer experience, should it be in a different area than your clinical experience, or does it not matter? I've been doing EMS and working in the ED, and one of the more enjoyable volunteer options open through the Red Cross is volunteering doing first aid and such for summer festivals.

I've been accepted into a lab for two semesters of research in a social science field, if diversifying that kind of thing matters.

If you are really excited about using your skills to help the public at summer festivals and you can express that on paper and in an interview, then it's fine.