Pathologists voting Bush, Kerry, or Nader?

[b&ierstiefel]

You can always bitch about clinical medicine. Like the presentation I wanted to give.

Well, I won't be exposed, in person, to the absurdity of clinical medicine until I start residency. But I guess I can always bitch about how studying for Step 2 sucks donkey testicles

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[deschutes]

Thank god my school doesn't make us do AI's during our fourth year.

What are AI's?

In 9 hours I am going to be in the gross room. Whee!!
I need this. Something without an exam at the end.

The Official Anti-Clinical Medicine Thread was my venting ground....

I also recall many others!

I have to agree about the hate dissipating quickly. It does however, reappear just as quickly.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

What are AI's?
In 9 hours I am going to be in the gross room. Whee!!
I need this. Something without an exam at the end.

earth to deschutes: you still got the step twoozies.

i hope you don't get too grossed out. there are some frightening and smelly things down there.

remember to respect the poo.

 

[gungho]

LOL!! That's awesome! Unfortunately I live in Jesusland. I like the South for the weather, food, friendliness. However, the religous right has got to go.




Man! I am sooo jealous!

Go where? Why? Can you please define "religious right"?

 

[Doctor B.]

I am disappointed that in this country where people succeed so much and achieve great things that our two choices for the president of our country were so disappointing.

I couldn't agree more. It's been interesting to hear all the different views on the election. I have my views as well but I always wonder how they would be if I knew what actually has been happening rather than what the media presents us with. For example, many people claim our invasion of Iraq is unjustified. However, it's tough for me to decide if I agree with that or not because I don't have enough information to accurately evaluate the situation. Some will say there were no WMD's and no links to Al-Queda and that may be true. On the other hand, maybe there were WMD's and we gave Sadaam enough time to get rid of them. I don't know. I did find the link to the article comparing Bush to Churchill interesting. If Churchill had preempively attacked Germany, I wonder if the world would think of him like some think of Bush now? If we had let Sadaam continue, would he have invaded other countries? Who knows? He likely would have continued to rule in the same fashion as before and for that, perhaps the war on Iraq is justified.

The IQ chart was interesting as well. I'm not sure how much we can read into that; I guess you'd have to look at the IQ of who voted for Bush or Kerry not just the general IQ of each state in order to see which set of voters had the highest IQ.

The Jesusland map was hilarious.

I agree with those above about Kerry; I think it was very professional for him to concede when he did.

 

[Mrbojangles]

What are AI's?

Ai's are acting internships. People usually take them in their fourth year and you only see them for the clinical specialties not like path or rads. You take a little more responsibility than third year medical students. Maybe like covering 5-7 patients instead of 3-5 like at my school.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

that's what I thought...so basically AI=subI=suck. gotcha

 

[yaah]

I couldn't agree more. It's been interesting to hear all the different views on the election. I have my views as well but I always wonder how they would be if I knew what actually has been happening rather than what the media presents us with. For example, many people claim our invasion of Iraq is unjustified. However, it's tough for me to decide if I agree with that or not because I don't have enough information to accurately evaluate the situation. Some will say there were no WMD's and no links to Al-Queda and that may be true. On the other hand, maybe there were WMD's and we gave Sadaam enough time to get rid of them. I don't know. I did find the link to the article comparing Bush to Churchill interesting. If Churchill had preempively attacked Germany, I wonder if the world would think of him like some think of Bush now? If we had let Sadaam continue, would he have invaded other countries? Who knows? He likely would have continued to rule in the same fashion as before and for that, perhaps the war on Iraq is justified.

Yes! One of the things that bothers me about the media is that they go around polling people about things like "was the war in Iraq justified" or "Did the president do the right thing?" Well, there are multiple things wrong with this. #1, it is hindsight. Clearly, if we all had the benefit of hindsight history would be drastically different and no one would ever be wrong. Governments have to make tough decisions, and while many say this decision turned out to be wrong, at the time the situation was different. And plus, as you said, we know nothing about all of this! How can Joe Average from Anytown USA possibly know enough to answer a question like "was the Iraq war justified?"?? Then they take the results of the poll and act as though it is big news and an important finding. If they called my house as part of a poll and asked "Did the president falsify information to make a case for war against Iraq?" I would probably answer "I have no idea but I hope not." And if enough people responded like me, it would be reported as continued ignorance among the american public.


I count on my elected officials to digest all their information, weigh the risks and benefits, and take the appropriate course of action. I don't care what the vast majority of americans think.

 

[Mrbojangles]

Actually, yes, I think people do understand that. Remember how the situation was originally decided - by judicial fiat. Regarless of how one feels about about abortion, it is hard to argue that it was decided in a democratic way. It was a sudden court decision that set the country on its ear. So yes, people do understand the implications of reversing something that has been in place for decades - it happened that way in 1973.

I hate to keep braying like a donkey, but this will be my last politics related thread. I really don't think the people on the right really have fully thought out the consequences of illegalizing abortion. When they are asked what kind of preventive measures they would like to have to avoid unwanted pregnancies they cite abstinence. They are the same people who do not want high schools supplying condoms for students, who do not want a health education class taught in their children's school and will not have a frank discussion of sex with their children. I myself am not a person who supports free hippie love. I grew up in a very socially conservative but non-religious home and I probably come from a page more similar to the conservatives than the hippies. Using abstinence as a preventive measure against unwanted pregnancy is very unrealistic and dangerous. If you grew up in a high school in urban or suburban America we all know how unrealistic it is. And teenagers should know about pregnancy and STDs. I feel that what they are subtly saying is that if you happen to become pregnant or have an STD you desrve it because you had pre-marital sex or whatever. This puts alot of Ob-gyn people in a really hard position if abortion is illegalized. What about the social consequences that would resolve from a large segment of society who are born to unwed mothers who would rather not have had a child? Does anyone have any idea how that can play out? I don't.

Does your school let you do overseas electives? I did 2 months, and I highly recommend it - a great way to get out and see the world while helping out (if you go to an underserved area). We can even get the trip paid for, since we're paying tuition anyway.

I don't think my school will pay for expenses to do oversees electives. They pay for expenses to do away electives at either of our two clinical campuses but that is it. I wonder how pathologists can try to contribute to working in an underserved part of the world. It's best for surgeons because they can do alot within a finite amount of time.

 

[yaah]

I myself am not a person who supports free hippie love.

Me neither! No way! Hippies usually smell and don't shave. Why anyone would want free love from a hippy is beyond me.

And by the way, if you never talk about it or discuss it, it clearly won't happen. Children have never, throughout history, done things that their parents disagree with.

Abstinence is pretty effective though, you have to admit. I guess we all just have to decide how to make abstinence cool. The person who succeeds in that will deserve a special Nobel Prize.

 

[deschutes]

Abstinence is pretty effective though, you have to admit. I guess we all just have to decide how to make abstinence cool. The person who succeeds in that will deserve a special Nobel Prize.

Abstinence is most effective. One could even argue that abstinence is self-defeating. In broad strokes:

1) abstinence --> fewer offspring who are genetically-predisposed to abstain
2) make love like rabbits --> reproduce like rabbits --> many offspring who are genetically-predisposed to behave sexually like rabbits

But that is my red/blue view of things.

Don't get me wrong - I am no huge fan of free love myself.

 

[Mrbojangles]

Where's that sound clip when Cartman was having nightmares about hippies?

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Where's that sound clip when Cartman was having nightmares about hippies?

hmm...couldn't find it.

However in episode 801, "Good Times with Weapons", Cartman so eloquently elaborates on his attitude towards hippies:

"HYA! Shut up hippie! I'll kill ya! HYA!"

"I am Bulrog. Tough brute ninja who has dedicated his life to eradicating the world of hippies."

 

[gungho]

[/QUOTE]
Labels and pigeonholes. What do people mean by "the right"? The fact that all 11 amendments for legalizing homosexual marriage were approved-does that mean that all people who voted for those amendments were on "the right"? If one believes that human life begins at conception, and that life has value, and that the vast majority of abortions are done for the convenience of the mother, does that mean one is on "the right"? I guess I can't be on "the right" because if I were, I would be "one of those people" who will not have a frank discussion of sex with their children, when, in fact, from infancy we have discussed such matters with our boys. But, I guess I must be on "the right" because I'm not a big fan of condom distribution in schools. Well, maybe I am not on "the right" because I don't have any big problem with health education in schools, but not when sexual techniques are discussed, or when abstinence is not presented as an option, or when facts about developing embryos are withheld for fear of making someone "feel bad" if they choose or have chosen to get an abortion.
What is meant by a "large segment of society born to unwed mothers" who would prefer not to have a child? How large? Does that doom every child to being abused and thrown on the street? Could it be that maybe some of those moms would figure out a way to show some love and care for the child? And, if they didn't, is the answer to kill the child? As the adoptive father of two boys, I am eternally grateful to their birth moms and dads for giving us the privilege of being their parents, and in my opinion, a single child is worth that.
As for abstinence not working, the only time I can think of when abstinence didn't work was the Immaculate Conception. When abstinence is practiced, I imagine it works fairly well. Sure, many people (adults and teens) don't practice it, but don't tell me they can't control themselves. Do people run down the street naked? Do they go squat in the corner and defecate (in America)? People can control things they want to control if they think it's important.
Maybe I am on "the right". If I am, I'm still waiting for Smitty to tell me where I need to go and why I need to go there.
Whew, I feel better.

 

[gungho]

Sorry, I'm an idiot at trying to use the "quote" options in these replies. I end up not quoting or quoting more than I need to, or double posting. Instructions need to be idiot-proof.

 

[Smitty]

If I am, I'm still waiting for Smitty to tell me where I need to go and why I need to go there.

Can you please define "religious right"?

Dude. Seriously. Get a hold of yourself. Let me get this straight. You obviously somewhat identify yourself with the right, yet you need a definition so that you can know exactly what you identify with? OK, what the heck. I'll give it a try. By "religious right" I mean those who hold conservative beliefs and are also in my opinion fanatically religious. By conservative I mean the popular definition: pro-gun, pro-life, small gov, anti-same sex marriage, etc. By "religious" I am referring to fundamentalist Christianity, although religious fanaticism is by no means restricted to one religion or culture. We all know what these terms mean. Does that mean that everyone fits into a tidy little liberal or conservative package? Yes and no. Some people definitely fit the sterotypes. Some don't. I myself hold varied beliefs ranging from far left to far right depending on the issue at hand. I guess I'm a "moderate" (Wow, pigeonholing IS fun!). But I don't pretend not to know what terms like "left" and "right" mean.

Back to the "religious" in "religious right". Personally, I believe that religious fanaticism is dangerous, especially when it influences policy. I think decisions should be based on love, humanistic values, and common sense. I don't think decisions should be made based on a narrow and simplistic interpretation of a religious text or dogma. Does love and common sense sometimes overlap with religious views? Of course. Some of the best people I've ever known are deeply religious, including my family. Are there instances where religious beliefs don't overlap with love and common sense? You bet. And that's when things get creepy. We see religious fanaticism all the time, and the examples can range from humorous to down right evil:

Humorous: The lady with big hair on cable access who screams hits such as "My God is an Awesome God" with a straight face. Also those fish symbols on the bumpers of cars. Pat Robinson and Jimmy Swaggart come to mind as well.

Idiotic: The whole Kansas Board of Education fiasco regarding evolution in the classroom. People getting their tidy-whitey's in a twizle over gay marriage.

Evil: Crashing planes into WTC towers and killing thousands of innocent people. (Hey, remember I said fanaticism isn't just a Christian thing). Also, The Crusades.

Look, I'm sorry if I've offended anyone. I'm not replying just to bust on people, and it's not just specific beliefs I'm talking about. It's an attitude. And that attitude is that if you ever question any of our national policies, then you're un-american, you don't "support our troops", and your going straight to hell. That attitude seems to unfortunately prevail in areas of the country that tend to be a little warmer and muggy, an area that I grew up in and also happen to love. I grew up going to church, and fortunately our preacher spent more time on "love thy neighbor" and less time on bigotry and exclusionism.

Where should the religious right go? From what I can see, they're not going anywhere. All I can hope is that as older generations die out and as the US becomes more "diverse", the religious right will eventually become more diluted.

Whew! I feel better.

Sorry, I'm an idiot at trying to use the "quote" options in these replies.

I won't make fun of your quoting handicapp if you don't make fun of my spelling/grammer!

 

[gungho]

 

[Harbster]

I've created a MONSTER!

 

[yaah]

Proud of yourself?

I feel bad because I was watching TV late last night and the Bill Maher show was on HBO and I found myself agreeing with Bill Maher quite a lot. Dammit. About the only thing I don't find myself agreeing with him on lately is the whole illegal drugs thing. He had Andrew Sullivan on last night who is a fascinating person. Normally Bill Maher makes other people look kind of silly and ignorant but this guy made Bill Maher look silly and ignorant.

Someone help me! I am out of touch with America!

P.S. - More cool election maps here: http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/

 

[Harbster]

Proud of yourself?

I feel bad because I was watching TV late last night and the Bill Maher show was on HBO..............

Yeah, I missed it...a buddy of mine was telling me about it. Maher voted Nader!

BTW, cool link! I love the analysis.

 

[Matte Kudesai]

I grew up going to church, and fortunately our preacher spent more time on "love thy neighbor" and less time on bigotry and exclusionism.

Hey Smitty........WHO IS YOUR NEIGHBOUR?
It may be that person from the religious right next door......

 

[Smitty]

It may be that person from the religious right next door......

I'm positive they are, and I do love them. I just don't agree with their outlook.

Again, my opinions vary greatly depending on the issue. I just think religious fanaticism is creepy.

Why is it that when individuals want to keep the being growing in their womb, its a life and devastating to lose..... But if it impinges on their personal life, or they're not ready.... its a tumor that has to be extracted.

I have to admit, I agree somewhat with the above statement. Abortion is a complex issue, but I left my Ob rotation a little more conservative than I thought I would.

 

[Matte Kudesai]

Hey all,Quick question.........If you plan on applying for radiology, you also apply for a transitional year as well. Do you use the same personal statement that you used for radiology for the transitional year? Or do you just send in the same stuff that you sent to the radiology programs to the transitional year programs? I'm confused. Please enlighten me!.

Hey Harbster, are you a closet radiologist? I see you posting alot in the radiology forum as well.

So what are you going to rank higher ? Pathology or radiology?

 

[yaah]

Abortion is a tough topic, and I will say nothing about it other than the fact that it is rather interesting that the future of the supreme court seems like it is going to depend on this issue above all others. For many (on both sides), support for a supreme court candidate depends upon their view on this issue, regardless of their views on other topics. I find this curious.

 

[Harbster]

Hey Harbster, are you a closet radiologist? I see you posting alot in the radiology forum as well.

So what are you going to rank higher ? Pathology or radiology?

Is this not a PUBLIC FORUM??? I never knew I was concealing anything, Sherlock.

 

[yaah]

That's OK. You can be a closet radiologist with the door open.

Path is much more interesting anyway!

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Is this not a PUBLIC FORUM??? I never knew I was concealing anything, Sherlock.

Totally. It's the internet people! Who cares? Do what's best for you Harbster...you're a cool guy and I wish you the best in whatever you do.

Plus, sometimes when I come on SDN, I'm reminded of the slogan..."Arguing on the internet is like the..." woops...can't finish the statement cuz it bashes on exceptional people.

 

[Matte Kudesai]

Is this not a PUBLIC FORUM??? I never knew I was concealing anything, Sherlock.

I was not accusing you of concealing anything.....

Good luck in the match.

Peace

 

[Harbster]

Totally. It's the internet people! Who cares? Do what's best for you Harbster....

It's 'round that time again we go out and get us some Guinness. Maybe we can get Yaah-man to join us....or is he gonna be a lil' mama's boy about it.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Sounds good to me. I lost your number...I thought I programmed it into my cell phone but can't find it. PM me your number again or just give me a call and we can make arrangements.

Yaah can join us if he likes. I didn't know he lives with his mom though .

I leave town tomorrow afternoon so we can get together tonight or when I get back on Monday. Whatever your preference is. I'll PM you my cell number in case you lost it too

 

[yaah]

It's 'round that time again we go out and get us some Guinness. Maybe we can get Yaah-man to join us....or is he gonna be a lil' mama's boy about it.

Mama's boy, you say? I think not.

I am always up for some nice beer. You know where to find me...

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Yaah, me and Harbster may try to make arrangements to go for a few beers early this week after I get back into town. Want me to page you when sh1t goes down?

And Harbster, I got your PM and cell number. I'll give you a ring Monday to see what your schedule is like. I'll only be in town Mon-Wed this week and so if we go out drinking, it will fall on an off-night. However, screw those stupid rules. There's always time every night for some drinkypoo action.

 

[yaah]

Rules are for sissies!

I sent you a PM.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Rules are for sissies!

I sent you a PM.

got it. i sent you one too.

"rules are for sissies" ... that's a real gentle way of putting things. I would've replaced sissies with a different 7-letter adjective which also ends in the last 5 letters.

 

[yaah]

I could say wussies, then at least I would be getting closer.

Since we are off topic again - I thought this was interesting - read it this AM while waiting for my slides to come out. About the disappearance of the southern democrats. Interestingly, though, from what they talk about in the article there seems to be very little difference between traditional southern democrats and current southern republicans. For some reason, though, the former southern democrats used to vote with the national democrats on big issues? Is that it?

 

[b&ierstiefel]

I could say wussies, then at least I would be getting closer.

Yeah that's the word I was thinking of

 

[b&ierstiefel]

You're all mistaken. "S" is alphabetically closer to "P" than is "W".

yes but the vowel is different if the "S" is used.

 

[deschutes]

Which I realized and erased, you fool!

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Which I realized and erased, you fool!

unfortunately, not quickly enough.

now now, let's not resort to name-calling

 

[Doctor B.]

Sorry, this is totally off topic but every time I look at your avatar, andy, I laugh my ass off.

 

[yaah]

Sorry, this is totally off topic but every time I look at your avatar, andy, I laugh my ass off.

You're banned! You got off topic. Here we stick to form and function, mister.

I have to see that movie...there was a story on CNN today about the Kim-Jong-Il pictures and tributes disappearing all over north korea...hmmm....

 

[deschutes]

You're banned! You got off topic. Here we stick to form and function, mister.

Oh dear... where did everyone go? Hello? Hello??

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Sorry, this is totally off topic but every time I look at your avatar, andy, I laugh my ass off.

Good deal. I downloaded that movie and watched it before flying out here. It cracked my **** up...uh-gain!

Just saw an article that KJI is losing grip of his country...