PBL: how do you like it?

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docmemi

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for those of you whose school is pbl, how do you like it? do you find it better than lecture? do you find yourself researching a lot of random topics? is it lots of work to present the info you find to your group? how is your group leader/faculty...i heard some are as clueless as the students? other good or bad things bout it?

thanks!!
 
I hated the part where we used it to learn something new for the first time. I liked the 7 weeks at the end of the year when we used it to intergrat everything that we had already learned.
 
I think it really depends on how its implemented. Like Jalby said, its not so great for learning new stuff, but good for integrating stuff you already know. Our school uses it in addition to lectures. Sometimes we're covering new material, and sometimes we're integrating, but overall its not bad.

This year, we used it most in Pathology, and all of the facilitators were attending pathologists or upper level residents. Most of the time they were pretty good and knew the stuff, but some of them had a tendency to interrupt and interject with more (too much) extra info and detail.

I think it would be really hard for a school to do an entire curriculum PBL with no lecture and still provide everyone with the same fund of knowledge.
 
PBL works well if you're dedicated and you know what is important to study (MSII). PBL is a NIGHTMARE if you have NO CLUE what's important, are learning about an organ system for the first time,and you have a lot of conflicting personalities. Picture a group of people who hate each other trying to work up twenty "learning issues" every two days and then "presenting" to each other and then arguing as different people came up with different information from different sources. Think how much fun it is when you spend thirty minutes out of the three hours you get for this exercise trying to bull**** up a pathophysiological process from odds and ends of knowledge because it's "part of the learning process" when the answer is one minute away in the textbook. Sitting on the table. In front of you.

Bitterness aside, if you have the DRIVE to cover topics on your own (because PBL will only introduce you to broad topics - you need to fill it in), if you have the ABILITY to integrate yourself with a diverse group of other people (i.e. dinguses), and if you have the THIRST FOR KNOWLEDGE that everyone says they do in their applications (yeah, but see how fast they drop a topic when they find it "isn't on the test" 😀 ), then this is a GREAT program. No falling asleep in boring lectures (until second year, mostly); lots of clinical thinking and case analysis; you learn an incredible amount when you have to teach it to someone; and, everyone knows you've been slacking when you try to present your learning issue on two minutes of frantic reading, so you have some incentive to push it. A competent preceptor will make sure you know it when the BS hits the fan, and hopefully present some guidance. And it's a bonding experience - especially when you bond together to throw that obnoxious idiot who always asks dumb questions in group out the window. You know how they say there are no stupid questions? I used to say there are no stupid questions, just stupid people - however in light of my new experience, there are some pretty stupid questions out there too...

PBL in the hands of a competent director (of the program) has my vote. PBL in the hands of someone who refuses to change the obvious errors everyone has been pointing out for five years is a detriment to the school ....bitter, anyone? 😀
 
I attend an allopathic institution which was completely PBL (about to start my internship :scared: ). Let me just say that there are many variables to a successful group. The most important are the participating constituents (STUDENTS more important than the director/facilitator). There were some groups I was in that the facilitator was a complete ***** (i.e. he not only interrupted us,but fed us WRONG info). Most of our groups were 6-7 students (ideal in my opinion). I was never up front about the idea of doing a freaking 15-20 min presentation on just one topic while learning the other topics from other students some of whom had no idea what was the pertinent information. I LOVED it when everybody read all the assignments and just came to group to DISCUSS and go over any questions that anyone had. The relaxed atmosphere where you didn't have to present anything worked the best with 95% of the students. AND if you get that superstud in your group than you are golden for that rotation. Lets face it, i could use my time much wisely if i didn't have to make up freakin posters for everything that I read for the group. I will say this that almost all the groups at the end of the 2nd year were using that relaxed/open way of just DISCUSSING the issues in the cases, and everyone was getting a lot more out of it. AND it showed: Our class average step 1 score : 227. So i think that PBL works with a little direction up front, then followed by mainly student led groups.
 
Jalby, it is sad to think that the sacrifices of the men and women you talk about in your signature died or were injured so you could write the words you wrote. Your freedom and my freedom is being protected on many fronts because our enemy will not stop until all of us, "the infidels", are dead. Putting your political views in your signature where most posters would not take notice nor respond to is throwing out arguments that you really do not want to debate but you do want to be seen. Hiding from debate makes me wonder how long you thought about your signature before using it.

The dead and hurt in Iraqi were not the first nor will they be the last to sacrifice for us. The only question is whether the war will be waged in the USA or on foreign soil. Right now it is mostly on foreign soil but this could change if we are not successful overseas.

Just a few thoughts for people who enjoy the freedoms and take them for granted. Freedom is not free.
 
🙄

Can you say "off topic"?


DadofDr2B said:
Jalby, it is sad to think that the sacrifices of the men and women you talk about in your signature died or were injured so you could write the words you wrote. Your freedom and my freedom is being protected on many fronts because our enemy will not stop until all of us, "the infidels", are dead. Putting your political views in your signature where most posters would not take notice nor respond to is throwing out arguments that you really do not want to debate but you do want to be seen. Hiding from debate makes me wonder how long you thought about your signature before using it.

The dead and hurt in Iraqi were not the first nor will they be the last to sacrifice for us. The only question is whether the war will be waged in the USA or on foreign soil. Right now it is mostly on foreign soil but this could change if we are not successful overseas.

Just a few thoughts for people who enjoy the freedoms and take them for granted. Freedom is not free.
 
DadofDr2B said:
Jalby, it is sad to think that the sacrifices of the men and women you talk about in your signature died or were injured so you could write the words you wrote. Your freedom and my freedom is being protected on many fronts because our enemy will not stop until all of us, "the infidels", are dead. Putting your political views in your signature where most posters would not take notice nor respond to is throwing out arguments that you really do not want to debate but you do want to be seen. Hiding from debate makes me wonder how long you thought about your signature before using it.

The dead and hurt in Iraqi were not the first nor will they be the last to sacrifice for us. The only question is whether the war will be waged in the USA or on foreign soil. Right now it is mostly on foreign soil but this could change if we are not successful overseas.

Just a few thoughts for people who enjoy the freedoms and take them for granted. Freedom is not free.

1. No weapons of mass destruction.
2. No link to Al Quade
3. People in Iraq are less secure and have a lower standard of living than they did before
4. North Korea and Iran have sped up their quest for a nuclear weapon so that they would hold leverage
5. Precous resources that could have been used to catch the real threat and cause of 9/11 have been diverted to Iraq, where Saddam wasn't even a threat to his nieghbors (but definately to Iraqis)


This war wasn't about protecting American freedom. Even though it was posed this way to the people, it hasn't turned out this way and I post this to point out how many people made thier ultimate sacrifice for a cause that made the world worse off than it was before. Iraq has become the biggest recruiting tool for Al Quade to get more terrorists who are willing to kill innocent civilians. Heck, this war made americans kill thousands of innocent civilians. I post the statistics in my signature to make sure people remember the sacrifices that was made because of Gerge W Bush's mistake and remember this when the choose a candidate on November second. I don't know how people can forgive him for that big a mistake that caused that many lives to be lost in vain.
 
There is a learning curve to being president, and even the best presidents make mistakes. Unfortunately, W appeares to be the type to prolong even the longest of learning curves, and the learning curve he's on could make the numbers in your signatures look like peanuts -- remember the guy has the ability to launch nuclear weapons in a few minutes of delusion. It's not about forgiveness, it's about safety.

Anka
 
Boy I think all the people who are against the war are right - look at all the innocent civilians getting killed! We should have just sat back, used all those millions to develop our own infrastructure. I mean, all those people getting killed and tortured and oppressed are foreigners - every woman and child killed just means less people to hate us! "Ethnic cleansing"? They're not cleansing us. And after we bomb their country to crap we have to waste all our money rebuilding it. Talk about an utter waste of time.

Of course, one of the few things that makes humans better than animals (except in the eyes of those friggin' PETA people) is that we actually are concerned for people more than just how they can be useful to us. If you wanted to be totally pragmatic, we'd have no welfare, people who couldn't afford medical care just wouldn't get it, and in ten or twenty years we'd have all the deadwood pared from society, but it wouldn't be much of a society.

Does anyone think we're actively bombing the civilians into dust? Somewhere some general is saying, gee, I have all these bombs that cost several hundred thousand dollars each and I think I'll use them to wipe out civilians because I have a hard on for wasting money and getting bad PR?

Grossly simplified? Absolutely. Could we use some cheap oil and gas? Hell yeah! Look how much I freaking spend on gassing my car for rotations! But did we or will we really save more money on gas than we spent in resources and lives by going to war? Unless the pres has some really sh***y financial advisors on his board there could be some reasons other than financial for going to war...
 
My own personal belief is the biggest readon George Bush wanted to go to war was so that he could create a domocratic state from which christianity could have a base to convert the muslim people. But make no doubt about it, our goals of going to Iraq was not to liberate the people. That might have been presented, but that was low on the list compared to the other things presented to the american people. Heck, we could have spent the 200 Billion Dollars just giving food and Aids drugs to people in africa and it would have done a lot better than what the 200$ Billion has gotten us in Iraq.
 
Can we focus on the thread please - The lounge has many threads dedicated to this issue. This one should be about PBLs
 
While the idea that we went to war for the Iraqi people may be untrue, the thought that we did it to establish a forward base for the conversion of the people to Christianity is pretty laughable. Is George Dubya known to be that much of a fanatic for Christianity? And is the USA really that much of a Christian state he'd do it just for the votes? "Vote For Me, I'm Going To War To Spread Christianity"? Most of the only people who really think that are the terrorists who see America as the shining beacon of Christianity come to convert the Muslims. Boy if they only knew, the *****s.

From what I can see in the news, legalized abortion, taking prayer out of school, having any trappings of Christianity (e.g. a statue of The Ten Commandments, for instance) being removed from public areas, etc. etc. I'd say we're not exactly the bastion of Christianity advertised. And the thought that all presidents are Christians of some kind - yeah, that Clinton, what a pillar of religion and morality. Most of the time we have such a hard on for separation of church and state I think we actually end up having a reverse-racism toward Christianity. I bet if we put up the Kwanza whatever-it-is on the lawn of a courthouse we'd hear "How cultural, how open-minded," while a cross would elicit, "There they are again, the Christians takin' over the government. Where my civil rights?"

But otherwise, I'd agree - we have a number of reasons why we went to war, some hidden, but just because helping the Iraqi people may not have been the main, or even one of the major reasons, don't discount it altogether. The soldiers over there aren't bleeding for oil, even if people over them have that intention, they're fighting for something higher. (well, ok they're probably fighting because they signed up for the military and it pays ok, but you get my point)
 
Jalby said:
My own personal belief is the biggest readon George Bush wanted to go to war was so that he could create a domocratic state from which christianity could have a base to convert the muslim people. But make no doubt about it, our goals of going to Iraq was not to liberate the people. That might have been presented, but that was low on the list compared to the other things presented to the american people. Heck, we could have spent the 200 Billion Dollars just giving food and Aids drugs to people in africa and it would have done a lot better than what the 200$ Billion has gotten us in Iraq.

Dude. Maybe we've been giving you too much credit for having a reasonable opposition to President Bush. Converting the muslims was the justification for war? Tell you what, if you delete that post I'll never mention it again and give you credit for being wrong but at least well informed.
 
Panda Bear said:
Dude. Maybe we've been giving you too much credit for having a reasonable opposition to President Bush. Converting the muslims was the justification for war? Tell you what, if you delete that post I'll never mention it again and give you credit for being wrong but at least well informed.

My parents are missionaries, and have been around the conservative Christian crowd for ages. I do think that that was one of his reasons for wanting to go to war, along with Saddam trying to kill his dad. They can "save" millions of muslims if they had a open democracy where they think christianity can flourish. I stand by my opinion.
 
AF_PedsBoy said:
Is George Dubya known to be that much of a fanatic for Christianity?

Yes, if recorded interviews from his EVANGELISTIC church bible group are to be believed. This is a digression.

I am a traditional learner---lecture + books. PBL may have its proven merits, but I wonder how valuable it is in MS1.

-Harps
 
Jalby said:
My parents are missionaries, and have been around the conservative Christian crowd for ages. I do think that that was one of his reasons for wanting to go to war, along with Saddam trying to kill his dad. They can "save" millions of muslims if they had a open democracy where they think christianity can flourish. I stand by my opinion.

Well, you'll have to back it up with some evidence to convince anybody other then those who already believe it, unless of course you are a mind reader and can with certainty tell us what people are thinking. The fact that President Bush is a devoutly religious man neither makes him a fanatic nor irrational. And Jalby, I am not flaming you. I'm just puzzled why, of all the at least superficially plausible conspiracy theories you've latched on to this one.

On another note, I'm sorry to hear that your school is all PBL. Good Lord. My school flirts a little with PBL and I have hated every minute of it. Nothing sets my teeth on edge like "group learning." If we're not going to have formal lectures then I'd prefer to be presented with a list of learning objectives for self-study. "Group learning," to my mind, is very inefficient as a lot of time is wasted on the mechanics of group dynamics.

Call me old-fashioned. Say I am not hip and with-it. Even tell me I am too lazy or too stupid to take advantage of the newest wave in medical education. But, goldarnit, I like lectures. (Actually, I like the opportunity to attend lectures and skip the ones I don't want to.) I am a self-directed learner, I swear. During third year all I did was learn in a self-directed manner.
 
I think that he believes that because I know evangelical christians real well, having grown up with them and having my parents be them. That was thier biggest positive for going to war in Iraq, and I believe it did come into play with George W. This is my personal opinion and I don't think I have ever read anything about this in the paper or anywhere else. But it is a huge thing for christians and missionaries. The bible says somewhere that Jesus won't come back until everybody has had a chance to hear the word. That's part of why christians are so behind Isreal. One of the signs that Jesus is coming back is that Isreal will be held by Jewish people again.

Do you think that George W didn't consider this when he was deciding to invade Iraq?? I'm sure the WMD's and Saddam trying to kill his dad was high on his list of reasons to invade, but I also think his trying to get a "democracy domino" effect goign so that christianity can be taught to billions of people who would go to hell otherwise would be high on his list, if not up there with WMD's and revenge.

Granted, that is a lot of mind reading and assumtions, but it is my belief having grown up with missionaries and knowing evangelical Christians.
 
Jalby said:
I think that he believes that because I know evangelical christians real well, having grown up with them and having my parents be them. That was thier biggest positive for going to war in Iraq, and I believe it did come into play with George W. This is my personal opinion and I don't think I have ever read anything about this in the paper or anywhere else. But it is a huge thing for christians and missionaries. The bible says somewhere that Jesus won't come back until everybody has had a chance to hear the word. That's part of why christians are so behind Isreal. One of the signs that Jesus is coming back is that Isreal will be held by Jewish people again.

Do you think that George W didn't consider this when he was deciding to invade Iraq?? I'm sure the WMD's and Saddam trying to kill his dad was high on his list of reasons to invade, but I also think his trying to get a "democracy domino" effect goign so that christianity can be taught to billions of people who would go to hell otherwise would be high on his list, if not up there with WMD's and revenge.

Granted, that is a lot of mind reading and assumtions, but it is my belief having grown up with missionaries and knowing evangelical Christians.

Well hell, at least you realize that you're relying on your own personal feelings and a whole lot of extrapolation.
 
We did a handful of PBL sessions and everybody absolutely hated them. I would have shot myself in the head midway through first year if our entire curriculum was PBL. Rumor has it that the student response to the PBL sessions has been so overwhelmingly negative over the past few years that the powers-that-be are considering dropping them.
 
no WMD?!?!?!?

they found mustard gas recently ...leave it to the leftist media to ignore such an issue
 
pratik7 said:
no WMD?!?!?!?

they found mustard gas recently ...leave it to the leftist media to ignore such an issue

if you really believed the media is liberal, then you are sadly mistaken. Why wouldn't the mustard gas thing be all over the news? it would just be proof saying "look, we DID find something" though its not even significant
 
lol, I was surprised you didn't mention FOX news earlier - if you dont know, but they are THE most biased news station out there.

As for the link you posted, 2 shells does not amount to the thousands that were predicted to have been in Iraq. And all this from how many months of searching? theyre able to find 2 shells? yeah that deserves a pat on the back 🙄
 
DadofDr2B said:
Jalby, it is sad to think that the sacrifices of the men and women you talk about in your signature died or were injured so you could write the words you wrote. Your freedom and my freedom is being protected on many fronts because our enemy will not stop until all of us, "the infidels", are dead. Putting your political views in your signature where most posters would not take notice nor respond to is throwing out arguments that you really do not want to debate but you do want to be seen. Hiding from debate makes me wonder how long you thought about your signature before using it.

The dead and hurt in Iraqi were not the first nor will they be the last to sacrifice for us. The only question is whether the war will be waged in the USA or on foreign soil. Right now it is mostly on foreign soil but this could change if we are not successful overseas.

Just a few thoughts for people who enjoy the freedoms and take them for granted. Freedom is not free.

why did you ruin an interesting thread by hijacking it with your politics? If you want to discuss that material, go to the lounge area. Signature files are meant to be a form of self-expression.
This discussion is ruining a thread that started off very well.
 
4 Ever said:
lol, I was surprised you didn't mention FOX news earlier - if you dont know, but they are THE most biased news station out there.

As for the link you posted, 2 shells does not amount to the thousands that were predicted to have been in Iraq. And all this from how many months of searching? theyre able to find 2 shells? yeah that deserves a pat on the back 🙄


Two shells are enough to kill thousands of people;what more do you want?? I never said that fox news wasnt to the right...but they do report the success in iraq unlike some other people (cough rather, jennings, and cnn cough). ten bucks says that you use to be part of the blood for oil crowd. I suppose you have to keep looking for a new angle when your hate for bush ideology doesnt pan out. Go hug a tree :meanie:
 
10 bucks say that you have anti-muslim sentiment because of your cultural background
 
you guys need to let the thread go back to the question that the OP asked. You can always go to the Everyone forum to start a thread continuing your conversation.
 
So yea... PBL.

I think you'll like PBL because it is a nice change in pace. I mean, lectures, text reading in the library gets to be SOOOO boring after a while. The problem with PBL is that it's graded so it creates this really weird need for people to show the amount of work they do and it becomes less about learning and teaching each other than it is about wanting to H the class.

Couple of things I like about PBL:
1) Believe it or not, you do remember some of the learning issues that you look up. Not all of them, not even the most obscure ones either... some stick, others don't. But they do come up either on the Boards (sometimes) or the Wards (usually as a form of pimping questions).
2) Working through pathophys and phys. This is the best part of PBL. PBL is the WORST when all you have to do is memorize facts and regurge it. PBL is BEST when you have to explain a patient's symptoms, physical findings, lab values in the context of a disease. It's a great forum to explain physiology to each other. Other crap like micro and pharm are best studied and reviewed at HOME through First Aid.
3) Getting to meet classmates that you don't usually hang out with. My best friend married a girl he met in PBL. Our facilitator always brought food for us to eat during PBL, definitely a bonding experience. It's a great time for people who want to just kick back and learn... it's a stressful period for the anal retentive people.
4) Cases are presented in ways similar to Boards (vignettes) and are usually written in a way that simulates patient presentation that you would give during your clerkship years or the way you'll see patients at the clinic. CC, HPI, PMH, FH, SH, ROS, PE, Labs, Problem List, DDx, Assessment, Plan, Follow Up.


Couple things I don't like:
1) It gets old after 2 years... especially when the Boards roll near because NO ONE looks up learning issues and stupid facilitators don't realize that. Some purist facilitators go overboard.
2) Bad facilitators or group members can really spoil a good time.
3) Over reliance on the power of PBL. Some faculty think you can learn so much just by listing a Learning Objective. Ours, for example, would write on the case summary: "Students should know all about purine synthesis by the end of this case" and you sit there and think, what the HELL are you talking about?... and then on the exam, you'll see some question about some obscure enzyme deficiency NOT covered in lecture that faculty will say, "well you should've learned about it in PBL"...
4) Over emphasis on self-learning. This part pisses me off. On many occasions, you feel as if you're better off investing $20 on a public library card and a couple of days of late fees than pay tuition towards faculty members who stand there pointing out what you should know rather than actually teaching it to you.
5) Dumb ass administrators who look at Board score improvement and then claiming that the PBL curriculum CAUSED the Board scores to go up. Uh... hello? Can we say I had to teach my freaking self? The school shouldn't get credit if they didn't teach you.

Anyways, case-based learning is the way medicine is taught so you might as well get used to it.
 
lol. What I find funny is 4 ever was the first guy who said please get back on track.
 
That's the other thing - most groups will come up with different learning issues with varying degrees of relevancy (for instance stinking PAP - Physician and Patient or whatever it stands for - would invariably have us looking up some social crap like support groups for hypercholesterolemia, etc. etc)(just joking for those with impaired senses of humor) and then when test time rolls around if your group didn't happen to cover it... yes, yes, there are learning objectives given at the END of the case that tell you what you were SUPPOSED to cover. And gee, doesn't it make you feel good to realize that half the learning issues that you spent like 8 hours on covering weren't even mentioned? And some obscure issue wasn't even mentioned? At which point you get to go out and cover it yourself while trying to cover the next batch of useless learning issues for the next case.

Needless to say, this stopped happening second year when we started to get an inkling of what we were really supposed to look for in each case, but was it REALLY helpful wasting the first year when you're supposed to be picking up the basics running after your tail? This might be much improved if we started getting guidelines DURING the case - yeah yeah, if it interferes with the "PBL learning style", just give it to us after we've come up with our 20 useless issues, but for crying out loud, GIVE IT TO US!!!!

It was just an extra thorn in the side when the few lectures we had weren't scribed because "there just aren't enough of you to justify it" - meanwhile our traditional path classmates are out playing football on the lawn before they go read the scribes for the class they just cut...
 
You meet mon 8-10 and again on fri 8-10. Things go well if you have a good tutor and he can keep you on track. On mon you well be given a scenario video or on paper w/a patient presenting with blah blah blah. You gather some patient data, think of a hypothesis, formulate an action plan and find some learning issues. Then they give you some more 411 and you repeat process again data, hypothesis, action plan, issues. You do this a few times narrow down your hypoth, and rule out other things. With 8 people in your group you divvy up the learning issues, 2 of those people will be assigned a journal club article to look up on the newest 411. There are some major learning issues that may or may not be assigned but they are important enough that everyone should learn them. The major learning issues are normally covered in lecture threw out the week. On fri when you meet again you take what you've learned in class and looked up and discuss the case. In the course of the discussion you present your learning issue.

The good thing about the way it is done is that the important things you need to know will be covered in class. Meeting on Monday just sets you up for how to approach and think of things while learning the material in lecture. Example, your case on Monday is a lady with double vision and blind spots when she looks a certain direction. Threw out the week you get lectures on the anatomy of the eye, physiology of vision, routing of neuro pathways etc. So all during lecture your thinking to yourself what is causing her symptoms, and then a light bulb goes on during a lecture and you go a hah. This process just makes it more salient for me at least, then just memorizing notes. PBL also fine tunes your ability to look things up. My suggestion uptodate.com, emedicine.com, merck.com and of course google, but if you are assigned to look up the journal club article go to pub med (clincial queries), jama, and nejm.

So unlike other schools that are heavy pbl, if you memorized lecture alone you could pass the blocks. PBL is to supplement your learning, and most of the learning issue if they are important will be covered in class. Having a classmate go over them is redundant but it helps me to retain things when things are gone over and over again, especially the important stuff. And for the learning issues that you did look up you do tend to remember those really well.

Suggestions to not be totally clueless in pbl like I was:

Block 1 get a high yield cell and molecular bio book only about 100 pages read it before like first week of school. It is a good review of stuff you should of learned in undergrad. Get BRS path and read the general pathology section along with the class so when you're being lectured about inflammation or neoplasia read along the corresponding chapters in BRS. Also get Medical Micro & Immuno by levinson & jawetz and read the immuno section when they are covering immuno in lecture.

Block 2 get BRS physio read the cardio, renal and respiratory sections early in the block or before school starts. Do this as a primer for the course so when things come up in pbl you know a little something, or when they come up in lecture things sound a little familiar.

Block 3 get High Yield Bio Chem read this early in the block or before school starts. Also read the endocrine and reproduction part out of BRS physio, again as a primer for pbl and the course.

Block 4a get HY neuro anatomy this book is a must have and again use early so you're not playing catch up, but things actually are familiar to you.

Block 4b get HY behavioral sci. and do the same thing.

Threw out all blocks make sure you are learning the material from lecture because knowing this stuff alone you can pass the blocks. Dean Parker once told us that "a 99% on a test counts the same as a 71%, both are passing". Follow along with HY histo during the blocks as well. I only read review books before the actual course because I'm a slow learner and need many passes to learn things, to many raves during undergrad has left my memory not as good as it used to be. This method worked really well for me and might not be for you but is just a suggestion. I did save a ton of money on books cause I didn?t buy any of the required text books all I bought were review books, and anatomy atlas. Sorry about the grammar and spelling errors just taking a brake from studying for finals tomorrow. Yes finally summer after tomorrow, gotta go back to studying psyche stuff.
 
I'm sure the far left is proud of its newest "spokesman," M. Moore.

But I digress.

Yea, PBL is great. Took this ol' boy with a 29 MCAT --> 267 Step I.
 
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