PE exam knocking students out of residency programs

[PathDoctor]

Stony Brook:
Applicants who have failed Step 2-CS or COMLEX 2-PE even once WILL NOT considered.

Frequently Asked Questions... | Renaissance School of Medicine at Stony Brook University

What do I need to know to apply to Stony Brook Neurology? Please click here for additional application requirements: What are your interview dates for the 2024-25 interview season? All interviews are conducted on Tuesdays and Fridays. All interviews will be conducted virtually for the...

renaissance.stonybrookmedicine.edu

University of Toledo:
All candidates must pass Step 2 CS or COMLEX Level 2-PE on their first attempt to be considered.

General Psychiatry Residency FAQs

General Psychiatry Residency FAQs : Psychiatry Residency Program : The University of Toledo

www.utoledo.edu

MedStar Health
As with the USMLE, we do not have a minimum passing score, but most invited candidates have scores above 540 on COMLEX Level I & II and passed the PE exam on the first attempt.

Applicant Requirements & Information | Internal Medicine Resident Program | MedStar Health

Find information and application requirements for the MedStar Health’s Internal Medicine Residency program. Learn more.

www.medstarhealth.org

Indiana University
No prior failures on USMLE CS or COMLEX PE.

Application Criteria & FAQs

Find answers to the most common questions about our Internal Medicine Residency Program at Indiana University Health Ball Memorial Hospital

iuhealth.org

Parkview
Comlex PE - Pass (must be on first attempt)

Internal Medicine Residency Applicants - Parkview Medical Center - Pueblo, Colorado

The educational goals of our Internal Medicine program include training the residents in the prevention, diagnosis and treatment of patients while emphasizing the principles of OPP/OMM, medical knowledge, patient care, professionalism, interpersonal skills, system based practice, and practice...

www.parkviewmc.com

University of North Dakota
USMLE Step 2CS or COMLEX-USA Level 2-PE (pass on first attempt; passing results should be available by the end of January, or by mid-February at the very latest, in order to be considered for our match list)

How To Apply

Applying to the UND School of Medicine & Health Sciences Psychiatry residency.

med.und.edu

Lower Bucks
Successful completion (on first attempt) of USMLE Steps 1 & 2, CS & CK - OR - COMLEX Steps 1 & 2, CE & PE. Minimum score for USMLE Step 1&2 are 214 & 220. Minimum score for COMLEX Step 1 & 2 are 500 & 520.

Contact and Apply | Lower Bucks Hospital

Contact and Apply - Lower Bucks Hospital provides quality healthcare that is cost effective. Offering radiology, cardiology, OB/GYN services and more.

www.lowerbuckshosp.com

Aultman
COMLEX (first time pass): Level 1 = minimum 500 Level 2 CE = minimum 500 Level 2 PE = Pass

APPLICANTS

How To Apply (Application deadline is October 1st): We participate in the ERAS program and NRMP match process. Information on the ERAS process can be obtained through your medical school. We...

www.aultmanobgyn.com

Floyd Health
Receive passing score on USMLE Step 2 CS or COMLEX Level 2 PE on first attempt.

Apply | Floyd Family Medicine Residency Program | Floyd Health

Learn what you need to apply to the Floyd Family Medicine Residency Program in Rome, Georgia.

www.floyd.org

West Suburban Medical Center
USMLE Step 2-CS / COMLEX Level 2-PE Exams must be passed on first attempt for interview consideration.

How to Apply

www.westsuburbanmc.com

Eastern Virginia Medical School
As a point of reference for prospective applicants, the average Step 1 USMLE and COMLEX scores for our current intern class are 229 and 541, respectively. In addition:
All steps must be passed on the first attempt.

Application Process - Macon & Joan Brock Virginia Health Sciences at Old Dominion University

www.evms.edu

Phelps
Passed USMLE/ COMLEX both Step I and II-Clinical Knowledge by the second attempt and passed Step II-Clinical Skills/COMLEX PE on the first attempt.

Apply | Phelps Family Medicine Residency Program

phelpsresidency.org

Bingham
COMLEX 1, score must be at least 450 or above on first attempt
COMLEX 2, score must be at least 450 or above on first attempt
COMLEX PE, pass on first attempt

Interviews | Auditions | Bingham Internal Medicine Residency

How to Audition and general information. Bingham Internal Medicine Residency Located in Blackfoot Idaho

www.binghamimr.org

Largo Medical Center
DO applicants must pass COMLEX Level 1 and 2 with a score of 500 or better and passing grade of Level 2 - PE on first attempt.

Graduate Medical Education at Largo Medical Center

HCA Healthcare, the nations leading provider of quality, patient-centered care, is also the leader in graduate medical education (GME). Learn about the GME programs at Largo Medical Center in Largo.

largomedical.com

University of Louisville
USMLE Step 1/COMLEX Level 1 = passed by 3rd attempt
USMLE Step 2 CK/COMLEX Level 2 CE = passed by 2nd attempt
USMLE Step 2 CS/COMLEX Level 2 PE = passed on first attempt

Recruitment FAQ — School of Medicine University of Louisville

Marian Regional
First attempt pass COMLEX Parts I and II (CS and PE) for osteopathic graduates, with a minimum score of 550.

Application Process | Marian Regional Medical Center | Dignity Health | Dignity Health

Application Process

www.dignityhealth.org

Geisinger AtlantiCare
STEP 1 score of 220 or COMLEX Level I score of 460, passing on the first attempt; Candidates who have already taken Step 2 CS/CK or Level II P.E. must have passed on first attempt.

How To Apply

Thank you for your interest in our program! We will consider candidates for the 2025-2026 academic year with the following credentials:

www.atlanticare.org

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[Lexdiamondz]

Why is this news?

95% of people who take PE or CS pass on their first attempt. It's a really stupid test, but it's board exam just like I and II and you need it to be licensed. Just prepare for the thing and pass it.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Well shucks, I guess I should have expanded my list some more. Plenty of fish out there. I don't think I applied to any of these.

Lol at Largo minimums, if that program is like some of the others they got there its a DO sweatshop with minimal teaching. Got to earn that privelge.

 

[samac]

Well shucks, I guess I should have expanded my list some more. Plenty of fish out there. I don't think I applied to any of these.

Lol at Largo minimums, if that program is like some of the others they got there its a DO sweatshop with minimal teaching. Got to earn that privelge.

I did an AI at Largo and that was the most miserable I have ever seen residents. It was my first AI with a psych residency and I was like “man residency is more miserable than I thought it’d be,” I later realized just how bad it was and was debating on if I’d interview there, but it didn’t matter.
They didn’t invite me to interview because of my board failure and their new cutoffs is 490 for all applicants and no fails.
I know someone who does have an interview there and on eras all of their dates had slots still available lol

 

[ciestar]

The majority of programs I applied to have the same stipulations, for ALL board exams.

 

[Ho0v-man]

My sites programs said they’ll take board failures of level 1&2. But a PE failure is an automatic interview rejection. Seems absolutely crazy to me. When I asked why, they said the majority of people who fail it have personality/professionalism issues.

I can’t believe anyone puts any stock into this stupid thing.

 

[Goro]

Why is this news?

95% of people who take PE or CS pass on their first attempt. It's a really stupid test, but it's board exam just like I and II and you need it to be licensed. Just prepare for the thing and pass it.

Getting a strong whiff of a grudge by someone who failed PE and/or CE. And one going loose cannon as well.

 

[zero0]

It was so crazy to me I found such statements ubiquitously when I applied for residency. Totally looney tunes anyone puts ANY stock into that worthless exam.

It's weird but when you consider how badly you have to screw up to actually fail that exam. It has to come down to cheating issues (putting down things you didn't actually do on notes) or personality disorders. The only guy I know personally who failed PE, or at least admitted to it, was extremely offputting.

 

[DennisReynolds]

You have been learning how to do a history and physical since the 1st year of medical school and had 3 years to learn how to do it.

If you can't perform such simple tasks, then yes... you PROBABLY need to re-evaluate how you apply to residency.


**Edit: changed my verbiage because I admit ... I was being pretty mean. I am nobody to say who deserves what and why. I apologize for any future readers who read my post and felt some way or if it came off as a very nasty post. I am just displacing my thoughts because our school has decided to further limit our interview time this year for some odd reason and it pissed me off. Once again...

I'm sorry and hope it works out for those who failed this stupid exam.**

 

[BorntobeDO?]

It's weird but when you consider how badly you have to screw up to actually fail that exam. It has to come down to cheating issues (putting down things you didn't actually do on notes) or personality disorders. The only guy I know personally who failed PE, or at least admitted to it, was extremely offputting.

I have definately met normal students from my school who have failed. I can't find the rhyme or reason. I am sure some of the people have issues for personality reasons but its certainly not all.

Edit: should clarify, it does get some of the fails right tho.

 

[Epilepsy365]

Some very normal and sweet people do fail these exams. I find it equally offsetting that we have colleagues who automatically assume that failed people are incompetent cheaters, crazies, or weirdos.

Have some compassion for your classmates who are traveling on the same road as you.

This culture of medicine sucks, and I hope that some of you have the integrity and authority to do the right things instead of following trends.

 

[PathDoctor]

COMLEX PE first time pass rate
2018-2019 93.2%
2017-2018 93.2%
2016-2017 92.8%
2015-2016 92.9%
2014-2015 92.1%

COMLEX-USA Examination Performance Data - NBOME

COMLEX-USA Examination Performance Data COMLEX-USA Level 1 COMLEX-USA Level 2-CE COMLEX-USA Level 2-PE COMLEX-USA Level 3 The data on this page is updated […]

www.nbome.org

 

[zero0]

I have definately met normal students from my school who have failed. I can't find the rhyme or reason. I am sure some of the people have issues for personality reasons but its certainly not all.

Edit: should clarify, it does get some of the fails right tho.

I'm sure normal people do fail it, but in that case it's probably an issue of unpreparedness, not knowing what the examiners are looking for, or just plain old stupidity. Look I know it's not a popular opinion on here because everyone just loves to think it's random and stupid to fail, as did I. But after personally experiencing the exam and meeting my cohort I am more inclined to think the people who fail probably do for a reason. That said, it's still a stupid unnecessary exam.

 

[AlteredScale]

This is my conspiracy theory, but for each test, they adjust scoring in a way to reflect the national failure rate and in some cases, the people they "inevitably" choose appear to be pretty normal students but as @zero0 said, they had to have been borderline on their performed in some way, shape, or form to have failed. Now I wouldn't go as far as the pass judgement on their entire personality and whether or not they "deserve a residency" because no cap, that's mean. Sometimes can just chalk it up to having a poor test days as well.

 

[DrStephenStrange]

Normal people can definitely fail. I'm actually very worried about this test because of my slow typing speed which is 40 wpm on a good day, 35 wpm at its worst. I'm so glad I won't have to take the USMLE version of PE. I mean it's not my fault I grew up in the poorest country of the Caribbean and didn't own a laptop till I was 20 years old in Freshman year. SOAP is what I struggle the most with right now, but I still managed to pass by memorizing it beforehand and using lots and lots of acronyms for everything. My SOAP notes are probably the shortest among all my peers. I will absolutely need to work on that typing speed between Step1/Level 1 and Level 2 PE.

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[DennisReynolds]

This is my conspiracy theory, but for each test, they adjust scoring in a way to reflect the national failure rate and in some cases, the people they "inevitably" choose appear to be pretty normal students but as @zero0 said, they had to have been borderline on their performed in some way, shape, or form to have failed. Now I wouldn't go as far as the pass judgement on their entire personality and whether or not they "deserve a residency" because no cap, that's mean. Sometimes can just chalk it up to having a poor test days as well.

I agree.

I changed my verbiage in my post.

Always appreciate your insight! <3

 

[4thyeartoss]

PE fail right here! Walked in that morning with a 102 fever and sore throat, lost my voice on my 5th encounter. Strep is funny like that, but it doesn’t mean I’m some socially inept weirdo who doesn’t deserve a residency. Please don’t assume things about people you don’t know, this ish is hard enough without cyber colleagues being condescending.

 

[THEBACKANDFORTH]

Also, seriously, why not just have a non punitive system to recognize lower performing students and divert resources their way until a benchmark of success is reached? Failing someone in a high intensity and novel setting over a learned skill is stupid

 

[Goro]

Also, seriously, why not just have a non punitive system to recognize lower performing students and divert resources their way until a benchmark of success is reached? Failing someone in a high intensity and novel setting over a learned skill is stupid

Because patients lives are at stake? Becoming a doctor is not a right, it is a privilege that has to be earned.

 

[Mass Effect]

I did an AI at Largo and that was the most miserable I have ever seen residents. It was my first AI with a psych residency and I was like “man residency is more miserable than I thought it’d be,” I later realized just how bad it was and was debating on if I’d interview there, but it didn’t matter.
They didn’t invite me to interview because of my board failure and their new cutoffs is 490 for all applicants and no fails.

I did two rotations at Largo Med. One was in psych and one was in medicine. Psych is downright horrendous. I don't know how they have psych residency accreditation. I don't get it. But medicine actually wasn't bad. The residents were smart, good teachers, and looked like they were having about as much fun as people have in residency. They socialized outside the hospital and seemed to have good rapport with one another, particularly when they were all in the resident room with folks doing subspecialty and other rotations.

My sites programs said they’ll take board failures of level 1&2. But a PE failure is an automatic interview rejection. Seems absolutely crazy to me. When I asked why, they said the majority of people who fail it have personality/professionalism issues.
I can’t believe anyone puts any stock into this stupid thing.

It was so crazy to me I found such statements ubiquitously when I applied for residency. Totally looney tunes anyone puts ANY stock into that worthless exam.

It's actually not anymore stupid or worthless than the Steps/Levels and I'd argue it's a hell of a lot more pertinent than Step/Level 1. Yes, good students rarely fail, but it's a test with high sensitivity in terms of highlighting those not ready for intern year. Unfortunately, some "false positives" get caught in the crosshairs, but it doesn't mean it's still not a useful test and that it shouldn't be weighed as much as any other Step/Level.

Plus you guys are encouraging PathDoctor's conspiracy theories and that's wrong just on principle.

 

[THEBACKANDFORTH]

Because patients lives are at stake? Becoming a doctor is not a right, it is a privilege that has to be earned.

yes, yes, correct if the test was reliably measuring ability to keep people alive.

 

[mathnerd88]

If you perform most of what Kauffman does on his PE videos, act professional and humanistic, and can type fast and 95% complete a SOAP note, you'll definitely pass the PE. As for the 90-95% of the people who failed, they probably have had deficiencies in one of the things I listed above and/or had a bad test day due to illnesses, etc (which then you shouldn't take the PE in the first place.) They could also have underprepared, and not get their timing right. It's definitely extremely fast paced. People who complain about failing most likely did not self-reflect what they actually did wrong, and was quick to blame the exam. I know this comment will get a lot of hate, but I believe this to be true. Part of being a physician is to self reflect on your own mistakes and figure out how to improve. Residencies do not like to have physicians who are quick to put the blame on others. I don't think NBOME fails random people on purpose. I believe the whole exam is based on a checklist if you've asked certain questions and performed some key humanism when prompted by the SP. My school grades you on the OSCE the same way. It's not as subjective as people say. Even the First Aid Step 2 CS book gives you the checklist to see if you've asked the appropriate questions.

Honestly, it's just OPQRST/OLDCARTS/CLODIERS, ROS, SMASHFM, FEDTACOS, then perform a physical exam which consists of the basic auscultation of heart, lungs, abdomen (while draping appropriately and also on skin,) check some pulses/JVD/carotid bruit if there's a cardiac issue, come up with a differential and discuss with the patient the plan, write a complete SOAP note with your findings and not misrepresent you'll 99.999% pass.

 

[Wjldenver]

...Speaking of Burrell, around 12.5% of their first class failed the PE exam upon first attempt. But what really irks me about this test, is that the program directors I know, use it as a simple screening tool to weed out applicants. If they see a PE fail, they simply put those applicants in the reject pile because they need to reduce the sheer number of residency applicants to their program down to a manageable number.

Of course, the NBOME folks don't seem to see how damaging a PE fail can be, and they seem to have no empathy for a student's high debt load and years invested in their education. In my opinion, only the real outliers should fail this exam, with a overall fail rate of 2% or so.

https://bcomnm.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/Institutional-Snapshot-10.28.19.pdf

 

[Mass Effect]

yes, yes, correct if the test was reliably measuring ability to keep people alive.

It can't test on that. Med students don't have the knowledge to do such a thing.

 

[Roxas]

Because patients lives are at stake? Becoming a doctor is not a right, it is a privilege that has to be earned.

A privilege that should not be determined by acting school rejects.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I'm sorry, but I can't take any argument defending PE seriously. The exam is a total crapshoot and the fact that 8% of people fail is insane to me. If it really were screening out outliers then it should be 3% or lower.

Becoming a doctor is not a right, it is a privilege that has to be earned.

A privilege that shouldn't be decided by this joke of an exam.

 

[Epilepsy365]

For the Step 2 CS, the failure rate is 3% for American medical grads and 8% for international medical grads:

USMLE™ Step 2 CS

www.amboss.com

Yet, the NBOME believes that we should fail 7-8% of our American osteopathic medical grads. Really unbelievable. This 7-8% failure rate is among people who can speak fluent English and see patients on a regular basis through third year.

Yet, more and more programs nowadays are screening out students with a CS failure or even without a CS pass in order to extend II.

 

[Thelonious Chunk]

This exam should be gotten rid of. Let the medical schools determine the student’s abilities with OSCEs instead of this inconsistent, vague, and unfair cash grab. I know somebody who knows an SP for the PE who tries to fail half of the students she encounters. The consequences that the 8% who fail this exam face are heartbreaking. I agree with the sentiment regarding failing 2% at most if we can’t just get rid of it all together. Most attendings working currently never had to take this dumb exam.

Anyone who thinks this is a reasonable exam has likely never taken it.

 

[Goro]

I'm sorry, but I can't take any argument defending PE seriously. The exam is a total crapshoot and the fact that 8% of people fail is insane to me. If it really were screening out outliers then it should be 3% or lower.



A privilege that shouldn't be decided by this joke of an exam.

I'm not defending the exam, just attacking the entitlement attitude.

The only way you will fix the deficiencies of the NBOME is from within.

 

[Giovanotto]

Make sure you guys fill out the survey sent by the NBOME recently. I put on it that I felt like a 2% fail rate was reasonable, and something else 2%, forget exactly what.

 

[Roxas]

Make sure you guys fill out the survey sent by the NBOME recently. I put on it that I felt like a 2% fail rate was reasonable, and something else 2%, forget exactly what.

There's no way the nbome gives a rat's anus what we think, or things would be different already. If the current fail rate is 8%, Why would they forfeit the income of those 6% who pay to retake to drop it to 2?. This exam has and always will be a shameless money making scam, no matter how much these knobs in admin or school faculty claim it's about patient care.

 

[Roxas]

The PE wasn't introduced until 2005. Step 2 CS was 2004. Somehow we got along fine before then.

 

[Neopolymath]

The PE wasn't introduced until 2005. Step 2 CS was 2004. Somehow we got along fine before then.

And of course we get one less minute for each section so we may thump our DO chests and say we did it faster and better. Makes me want to vomit.

 

[Osteosaur]

And of course we get one less minute for each section so we may thump our DO chests and say we DO it faster and better. Makes me want to vomit.

Its not a DO school if there aren't incessant puns using DO in place of 'do'.

More seriously what are the reasons for failures in most cases? (1) School skimps on a good OSCE lab and students are underprepared? (2) ESL students taking the test in a zip code where you don't have as much diversity? This is an entire can of worms but I can see how it might contribute to humanism issues. (3) Students not taking it seriously, and not taking a very structured history/ROS?

 

[FutureInternist]

Wasn’t it originally for FMGs to show they had competence in written and spoken English?

Not sure why someone who did medical school in US would have any issues with that, and if the 2 years of doing H&Ps and notes didn’t address any issues someone has, then that school needs to beef up its rotations and not have every single medical student pay whatever it is to line pockets.

 

[DrStephenStrange]

Its not a DO school if there aren't incessant puns using DO in place of 'do'.

More seriously what are the reasons for failures in most cases? (1) School skimps on a good OSCE lab and students are underprepared? (2) ESL students taking the test in a zip code where you don't have as much diversity? This is an entire can of worms but I can see how it might contribute to humanism issues. (3) Students not taking it seriously, and not taking a very structured history/ROS?

(4) slow typing speed (mostly ESL students as well)

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[BorntobeDO?]

...Speaking of Burrell, around 12.5% of their first class failed the PE exam upon first attempt. But what really irks me about this test, is that the program directors I know, use it as a simple screening tool to weed out applicants. If they see a PE fail, they simply put those applicants in the reject pile because they need to reduce the sheer number of residency applicants to their program down to a manageable number.

Of course, the NBOME folks don't seem to see how damaging a PE fail can be, and they seem to have no empathy for a student's high debt load and years invested in their education. In my opinion, only the real outliers should fail this exam, with a overall fail rate of 2% or so.

https://bcomnm.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/Institutional-Snapshot-10.28.19.pdf

Well I filled out a survey the other day they sent me on PE and told them I thought that the exam should have a 98% pass rate. I doubt they do it, but I did fill it out.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Wasn’t it originally for FMGs to show they had competence in written and spoken English?

Not sure why someone who did medical school in US would have any issues with that, and if the 2 years of doing H&Ps and notes didn’t address any issues someone has, then that school needs to beef up its rotations and not have every single medical student pay whatever it is to line pockets.

The Step 2 CS was for that reason. Our exam was just a copy of it. PE didn't actually have a reason to exist other than money: a non-us DO can't practice here like we do, the training is completely different. But ironically we still fail more people than the MD one which does test actual foriegn grads.

 

[mathnerd88]

...Speaking of Burrell, around 12.5% of their first class failed the PE exam upon first attempt. But what really irks me about this test, is that the program directors I know, use it as a simple screening tool to weed out applicants. If they see a PE fail, they simply put those applicants in the reject pile because they need to reduce the sheer number of residency applicants to their program down to a manageable number.

Of course, the NBOME folks don't seem to see how damaging a PE fail can be, and they seem to have no empathy for a student's high debt load and years invested in their education. In my opinion, only the real outliers should fail this exam, with a overall fail rate of 2% or so.

https://bcomnm.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/Institutional-Snapshot-10.28.19.pdf

BCOM also has a horrendous first time pass rate for Level 1...Almost 20% of the class failed on first attempt for class of 2021. I wouldn't be surprised they have a high failure rate for the other board exams.

I believe some schools have a curriculum that prepares you well for the PE, while other schools may be lacking which is contributing to these failures. That's what's causing the discrepancy. My school has a 99% first time pass rate for the PE. People don't realize there's differences between DO schools.

 

[Goro]

Its not a DO school if there aren't incessant puns using DO in place of 'do'.

More seriously what are the reasons for failures in most cases? (1) School skimps on a good OSCE lab and students are underprepared? (2) ESL students taking the test in a zip code where you don't have as much diversity? This is an entire can of worms but I can see how it might contribute to humanism issues. (3) Students not taking it seriously, and not taking a very structured history/ROS?

There's no excuse for schools to fail to film OSCEs and then not give students feedback.
We found here that a fair number of students failed thier OSCEs due to treating the exercise like a test questions. All the kids who failed their OSCE's obsessed about was getting to the "right answer" and making a diagnosis...as if doing all the clinical doing stuff that gives you the answer was irrelevant.

We also found a direct correlation between poor OSCE performance and weak PEs. As a rule of thumb, from what I remember the students did poorly on the humanistic portions of the exam...ie' making eye contact, greeting the patient, shaking hands, etc.

 

[Goro]

BCOM also has a horrendous first time pass rate for Level 1...Almost 20% of the class failed on first attempt for class of 2021. I wouldn't be surprised they have a high failure rate for the other board exams.

I believe some schools have a curriculum that prepares you well for the PE, while other schools may be lacking which is contributing to these failures. That's what's causing the discrepancy. My school has a 99% first time pass rate for the PE. People don't realize there's differences between DO schools.

This doesn't surprise me. A brand new school will have trouble attracting the strongest students, and so are forced to fill seats with weaker, more at-risk students. They may also have less resources to help said students succeed. Those schools that have a required lecture attendance policy sure don't help things, either.

 

[Goro]

BCOM is also a for-profit school. $$$. The founding dean was gone before the first class graduated.

Color me surprised!

 

[Ho0v-man]

This doesn't surprise me. A brand new school will have trouble attracting the strongest students, and so are forced to fill seats with weaker, more at-risk students. They may also have less resources to help said students succeed. Those schools that have a required lecture attendance policy sure don't help things, either.

BCOM is also a for-profit school. $$$. The founding dean was gone before the first class graduated.

Sucks. I really thought bcom was gonna be great. Like the next RVU great. Almost attended there myself.

 

[DrStephenStrange]

BCOM is also a for-profit school. $$$. The founding dean was gone before the first class graduated.

Same for ICOM. For profit and founding dean gone before the inaugural class even finish 1st year to be the founding of dean of the new proposed DO school in Kansas, but then I guess things didn't work out for him there. He's no longer gonna be the founding dean of the Wichita school.

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[BorntobeDO?]

Sucks. I really thought bcom was gonna be great. Like the next RVU great. Almost attended there myself.

Sometimes you dodge bullets just by being lucky.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

From a large NBOME study:
"None of the differences in clinical skills training and test preparation was associated with statistically significant differences in pass or fail status."

https://bcomnm.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/Preparation-Strategies-of-Osteopathic-Medical-Students-for-the-COMLEX-USA-Level-2.pdf

Seems like a bit of a crapshoot!!

JK you are my hero, this is what I have been wondering for a while. Something isn't right with the fail rate.

 

[PathDoctor]

JK you are my hero, this is what I have been wondering for a while. Something isn't right with the fail rate.

Da** right that something isn't right with the fail rate. Students now have better incoming stats and better COMLEX prep than 2005 students. Failure rate should be less than 3% imo.

COMLEX-USA Examination Performance Data - NBOME

COMLEX-USA Examination Performance Data COMLEX-USA Level 1 COMLEX-USA Level 2-CE COMLEX-USA Level 2-PE COMLEX-USA Level 3 The data on this page is updated […]

www.nbome.org

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Da** right that something isn't right with the fail rate. Students now have better incoming stats and better COMLEX prep than 2005 students. Failure rate should be less than 3% imo.

COMLEX-USA Examination Performance Data - NBOME

COMLEX-USA Examination Performance Data COMLEX-USA Level 1 COMLEX-USA Level 2-CE COMLEX-USA Level 2-PE COMLEX-USA Level 3 The data on this page is updated […]

www.nbome.org

I actually agree with you on this and I told the NBOME so as well on the survey they sent me post PE (I said that I thought 98% should be the goal rate). There aren't that many duffus students that get to 4th year.

 

[Mad Jack]

I have definately met normal students from my school who have failed. I can't find the rhyme or reason. I am sure some of the people have issues for personality reasons but its certainly not all.

Edit: should clarify, it does get some of the fails right tho.

There were a couple of fantastic students from my school that failed. Good, likable people who were good on rotations. Maybe they choked under pressure, who knows.

The computers crashed during my exam and I damn near failed it because I had horrible carpal tunnel and could barely hand write my notes legibility. Pulled through but damn it was worrying

 

[BorntobeDO?]

It can't test on that. Med students don't have the knowledge to do such a thing.

But NPs do!!


*backs away from the keyboard...*