Peds-Cards salaries

[9hoursofsleep]

Does anyone know roughly how much Peds cardiologists make? I'm hearing anything from $60,000 (since they're pretty much tied to academic facilities) to $300,000 (since they ARE specialized). Can someone clear this up for me? Thanks!

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[14022]

Does anyone know roughly how much Peds cardiologists make? I'm hearing anything from $60,000 (since they're pretty much tied to academic facilities) to $300,000 (since they ARE specialized). Can someone clear this up for me? Thanks!

Really not that variable. What you are quoting, those are the extremes. According to the American Association of Medical Colleges Careers in Medicine website, the salaries are as follows.

Low (25th Percentile) Median High (75th Percentile)
Early Career $139,000 $160,000 $188,000
Mid to late Career $165,000 $198,000 $229,000

They define early as assistant professor and mid/late as associate professor. These data are from docs in academic medicine. Private practice will make more, but most docs are in academics. I would say add $40-60K per year on average for private practice, but it is only a guess. The lower end salaries are usually from super duper highly ranked programs, like CHOP/Boston Children's because those places provide much more prospect for future success. Less known programs pay more to attract people away from the powerhouse institutions. I have never heard $60K. Lowest I have heard is $90K.

By the way, when you compare peds cards to adult cards, adult cards in academics make about only $30-40K more per year in academics. When people tell you that the adult cards docs make double what a peds cards doc makes, they are comparing academic peds to private practice adult, so do not be fooled. I have heard as well that after fellowship, the powerhouse adult cards programs (eg, Cleveland Clinic, Brigham and Women's) also pay around $90K starting. So it sucks either way.

Personally, I know I want to do academics, so the $30K more I will make as an adult cards doc is not worth it to me. Peds cards has much cooler pathophys and kids are way more fun than fat old noncompliant smoking adults.

 

[Leukocyte]

Do Pediatric Cardiologists do any interventional procedures?

Is there an interventional fellowship after a Cards fellowship like the adult counterparts? If so where?

Thank you.

 

[14022]

Do Pediatric Cardiologists do any interventional procedures?

Is there an interventional fellowship after a Cards fellowship like the adult counterparts? If so where?

Thank you.

Interventional is becoming bigger. Any pediatric cardiologist can do diagnostic cath, similar to adult cardiologists. Diagnostic cath in kids includes imaging to see the anatomy, pressure and PO2 measurements to look for shunting, and endomyocardial biopsy in routine heart transplant follow-up. To do interventional procedures, you must do an extra year of interventional training. I believe most big places train in interventional after cards fellowship. You wont find that info on FRIEDA and sometimes not even on the program's website.

Interventional procedures include ASD closures with an Amplatzer "barbell" closure device (google that and read about it...pretty cool device), balloon septostomy (they create an ASD through the fossa ovalis to allow left to right shunting in children with LV outflow obstructing lesions like critical AS or hypoplastic left heart), baloon angioplasty for coarctation of the aorta, baloon valvuloplasty for stenotic valves, and coil closure of PDA's. A newly emerging procedure done at some centers is VSD closure with a device similar to that used for ASD's. It will save some kids from having open-heart surgeries but cannot be used for all VSD's. Some interventional peds cards docs will assist in the OR with the cardiac surgeon on certian procedures, although I do not know much about this.

As you would imagine, interventional peds cards will supplement their income a bit (maybe $200K) but will make nowhere near the income of their adult counterparts who make $400-600K. A busy adult center will do 10-20 caths a day. A busy children's hospital will do 2-3 a day, with about 1/4-1/3 of these being interventional. The children's hospital at my school only does 3-4 caths a WEEK on a busy week but they only have one interventional doc.

Peds cards is a great field with interesting aspects such as congenital heart disease and fetal echo, as well as easy stuff such as evaluating benign murmurs found on routine athletic physicals. Unfortunately the pay will discourage some but they make a decent living doing what they love to do. The only reason I would discourage you from going into it would be because I cannot imagine myself going into many other fields and I would very much like to have as little competition as possible. 😀 But hopefully that will not discourage you from going into it.

 

[LADoc00]

Low (25th Percentile) Median High (75th Percentile)
Early Career $139,000 $160,000 $188,000
Mid to late Career $165,000 $198,000 $229,000

That Peds with a BC Fellowship in Cardiology?! Isnt that like 6 years of training? Ouch, ok I wont complain about how much I get to pediatricians anymore.

 

[Leukocyte]

That Peds with a BC Fellowship in Cardiology?! Isnt that like 6 years of training? Ouch, ok I wont complain about how much I get to pediatricians anymore.

Well, this is the truth about pediatrics in general:

Peds = Low income (compared to other medical specialties)

Doing a fellowship will not really increase your income potential. And Peds Cards is NOT like Adult Cards. There is no comparison:

$1xx,000 in Peds Cards compared to
$4xx,000 in Adult Cards

So, go into pediatrics because you like it. Do not go into pediatric Cardiology if you are hoping to make lots of money, b/c you will not.

 

[LADoc00]

Well, this is the truth about pediatrics in general:

Peds = Low income (compared to other medical specialties)

Doing a fellowship will not really increase your income potential. And Peds Cards is NOT like Adult Cards. There is no comparison:

$1xx,000 in Peds Cards compared to
$4xx,000 in Adult Cards

So, go into pediatrics because you like it. Do not go into pediatric Cardiology if you are hoping to make lots of money, b/c you will not.

So whats the catch?? Is ped cards easier? Do you have more vacation? Less call? Less stress? Less to know/do???

Why would sit back and let yourself get raped like that??
/shakes head

 

[Leukocyte]

So whats the catch?? Is ped cards easier? Do you have more vacation? Less call? Less stress? Less to know/do???

Why would sit back and let yourself get raped like that??
/shakes head

Well, quite the opposite. Peds Cards is the BUSIEST service in peds, with MORE CALLS, and MORE STRESS than any other service.

Why go into a speciality like this that pays so little?

It might not make sense, but.....as they say, love is blind. 🙂

 

[14022]

So whats the catch?? Is ped cards easier? Do you have more vacation? Less call? Less stress? Less to know/do???

If you haven't figured this out yet, reimbursement has nothing to do with difficulty of the specialty. Family medicine doctors need to have the most extensive wealth of knowledge than any other specialty yet they are among the lowest paid.

Regardless, the adult cardiologist that makes $400,000 per year is either in private practice or an interventionalist. Obviously, private practice and procedural fields make much more money than academic jobs. I said this before, and you can find this quoted on the Careers in Medicine website (part of the American Assoc. of Medical Colleges), the average academic general cardiologist makes less than $200,000 per year, which is not markedly more than their pediatrics counterparts.

Why would sit back and let yourself get raped like that??

It may be hard for someone as shallow as yourself to believe that there are people who choose a field based on what they enjoy rather than their pay check. And when these doctors have the satisfaction of treating a kid with severe heart failure or managing their care after a heart transplant, a sensation of being "raped" is typically the last thing they experience.

 

[LADoc00]

Ironically its because there are so many suckers like you that the field is so poorly compensated to begin with. If more people walked away and said there is this crazy demand for radiology, Ill do that instead, then things might actually even out!

 

[14022]

Ironically its because there are so many suckers like you that the field is so poorly compensated to begin with. If more people walked away and said there is this crazy demand for radiology, Ill do that instead, then things might actually even out!

Wow, if you think that radiology is going to keep getting reimbursed as much as they do now, you are going to be majorly disappointed over the course of your career. Just talk to the orthopedic surgeon from the late 1980's\early 1990's and see what happened to their salaries over the last 15-20 years.

And when your gorgeous wife, who married you for your money, sees your income fall, she's going to start sleeping around, provided she hadn't already. And the poor "sucker" who happens to be your primary care doctor is the person who is going to have to work-up the strange new burning sensation that you are experiencing when you pee.

 

[LADoc00]

Wow, if you think that radiology is going to keep getting reimbursed as much as they do now, you are going to be majorly disappointed over the course of your career. Just talk to the orthopedic surgeon from the late 1980's\early 1990's and see what happened to their salaries over the last 15-20 years.

And when your gorgeous wife, who married you for your money, sees your income fall, she's going to start sleeping around, provided she hadn't already. And the poor "sucker" who happens to be your primary care doctor is the person who is going to have to work-up the strange new burning sensation that you are experiencing when you pee.

Mmm okay. hahahaha

 

[pedsid]

It baffles me why people like you bother replying to threads like these ... is it just to piss people off. People who do peds do it for the kids, not for the money. I can tell by your signature where your priorities are ... if money is all that you are after you are going to live an empty life.

Mmm okay. hahahaha

 

[LADoc00]

It baffles me why people like you bother replying to threads like these ... is it just to piss people off. People who do peds do it for the kids, not for the money. I can tell by your signature where your priorities are ... if money is all that you are after you are going to live an empty life.

Honestly I dont care if pediatricians make 5 bucks an hour, I was just wondering if anyone had insight into how (!) you could hang out with adult cards docs and be cool with them getting paid 3x as much. Personally, I would be pissed as hell if not throwing people in headlocks. That is all.

 

[oldbearprofessor]

Honestly I dont care if pediatricians make 5 bucks an hour, I was just wondering if anyone had insight into how (!) you could hang out with adult cards docs and be cool with them getting paid 3x as much. Personally, I would be pissed as hell if not throwing people in headlocks. That is all.

Dear LADoc00:

Don't stop posting! I find you one of the most interesting and honest folks on SDN and the perspectives of attendings are, I think, of value here. It is important for students to hear every side on these issues.

I'll answer your question, although I think you know what I'm going to say, albeit perhaps not stated in this way. As background, I am a neonatologist, not a pedi cardiologist, and started medical school back when a peanut farmer was in the White House....

In any case, many pediatric folks, including myself, can live with the potential jealousy of seeing others around them who make more money, because we have found a career that not only is enjoyable, but represents what we believe is what we are "supposed" to be doing with our lives. That is, we believe that one of life's goals is to uncover the work that will make us satisfied and fulfill the tasks we are intended. to fulfill. Although, just like there may be more than one "perfect" life's partner, there may be more than one such "perfect" career match, if one finds either, then there is no reason to be jealous about someone elses "match" or money. Virtually all pediatricians, even us "pobres" in academic medicine, make enough money to have a decent, enjoyable lifestyle.

It is my experience, from those many pedi cards folks that I know, that career satisfaction is very high in pedi cards. It is a truly intellectual field - there are no "cookie cutter" approaches to congenital heart disease and managing these patients can be immensely rewarding and satisying. Like all critical care pedi fields, it can be frustrating, heartbreaking and overly filled with the aspects of medicine no one likes, but so what - this is the price of doing what you are meant to be doing.

I hope you can find that career that similarly suites you as well and I think you will eventually.

Regards

OBP