BadVB750

Senior Member
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Apr 23, 2002
461
0
America
Visit site
Status
Attending Physician
So, lately I have been kicking around the idea of doing a Peds fellowship. However, I don't like the idea of training longer to make less money. So my question is how much less do strictly Peds EM folks make.

I figured I could possibly split my time between adult and peds shift.
 

iatrosB

trying not to kill anyone
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Jun 9, 2004
2,207
0
hiding from a code
Status
Resident [Any Field]
So, lately I have been kicking around the idea of doing a Peds fellowship. However, I don't like the idea of training longer to make less money. So my question is how much less do strictly Peds EM folks make.

I figured I could possibly split my time between adult and peds shift.
You can make 200K pretty easily, but don't expect to make much more.

Unless you do work in both adult and kids...only problem with working in Peds EM solely, is that you are limited geographically...not that limited, but limited still.
 

12R34Y

10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Apr 5, 2000
1,678
2
Visit site
Status
Attending Physician
You can make 200K pretty easily, but don't expect to make much more.

Unless you do work in both adult and kids...only problem with working in Peds EM solely, is that you are limited geographically...not that limited, but limited still.
One of the oldest peds EM fellowships in country in big midwest city.

140,000 per year as Peds EM attending to start.

I quickly crossed this off my list.

later
 

socmob

10+ Year Member
Jul 14, 2007
95
1
Status
Medical Student
I looked this up last year as I was also seriously considering peds EM. The pay cut is pretty drastic...around 120-140K on average for Peds-only EM. Reimbursement just isn't as great for peds - not as many big procedures and the like too.
 

southerndoc

life is good
Moderator Emeritus
Lifetime Donor
15+ Year Member
Jun 6, 2002
12,015
994
Atlanta
Status
Attending Physician
I looked this up last year as I was also seriously considering peds EM. The pay cut is pretty drastic...around 120-140K on average for Peds-only EM. Reimbursement just isn't as great for peds - not as many big procedures and the like too.
Plus a higher number of lower acuity patients. In a typical shift, you may see nothing but 99283's. The 99285 is only an occasional thing in pediatrics. That makes reimbursement the same as a primary care physician.
 

TeleoDeum

Peds EM
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Mar 11, 2001
44
0
Oklahoma City, OK
Visit site
Status
Attending Physician
Here is my opinion as a Peds EM fellow who did peds first and is now doing a PEM fellowship - for whatever the hell that is worth...

If you did Peds first as a residency, than PEM is a pretty competative fellowship to land. There were approximately 200 PGY4 PEM spots out there this year, and the application rate was about 2.5:1 (2.5 applicants for every one spot), which is high, since most peds subspecialties do not fill since they do not get paid for crap, and are mostly required to work in academics, which does not pay well.

Doing a PEM fellowship for a pediatrician is a good step up, ... if you like the ED. The upside is shift work, a pretty good life style without call, not having to deal with general peds office crap - ADHD, behaviour probs, developmental disability (hey, if you like that stuff, than power to you!) and better money (in both academics and private world - these are very rough, off the top of my head #s)

Academic General Peds start ~ 110-120K, max 160-170K (not administrative or department chair, etc...)
Private Gen Peds - depends on the practice set up and regional location
start ~130-140K, max 200-250K if partner

vesus

Academic PEM start ~ 140 - 150K, max 180-220K
Private PEM start ~ 200-225K, max ??? (rates vary with variable benefit packages from $100/h -$170/hr, average probably 125-135/hr)

Again, the money is not as good as your adult ED comrades will make(but who the hell likes sick old people? j/k), but it can be significantly better than gen peds with a better lifestyle.

As an adult ED person... I do not really get the draw. If you really like kids or if you want more experience, or if you want to work in academics doing both adult and peds EM, then, OK. But otherwise, why would you want to train more with deferred compensation for two years, then do time in a Peds ED where you will get paid less? Again, if this is your bag, come on down, but I do not see it.

Again, just my humble, FOS opinion.

Peace,
Greg
 

southerndoc

life is good
Moderator Emeritus
Lifetime Donor
15+ Year Member
Jun 6, 2002
12,015
994
Atlanta
Status
Attending Physician
If you did Peds first as a residency, than PEM is a pretty competative fellowship to land. There were approximately 200 PGY4 PEM spots out there this year, and the application rate was about 2.5:1 (2.5 applicants for every one spot), which is high, since most peds subspecialties do not fill since they do not get paid for crap, and are mostly required to work in academics, which does not pay well.
Is this number correct? I was told by our peds EM section chief/fellowship director that she received 71 applications for the 2 positions available last year.

Also, there are opportunities for private peds EM jobs. The group I signed with recruits peds EM people. As I said previously, the acuity level is low, and reimbursements probably won't be that great.
 
May 21, 2012
3
0
Status
Fellow [Any Field]
I looked this up last year as I was also seriously considering peds EM. The pay cut is pretty drastic...around 120-140K on average for Peds-only EM. Reimbursement just isn't as great for peds - not as many big procedures and the like too.
I just finished picking my place to attend and I saw 180-200K in academics with benefits up to 250 -320K in private set up with productivity bonuses and RVU compensation on top of hourly rate. When it all breaks down it averages between 180- 220 per hour.

Look at multiple jobs to get a better feel. PEM is in high demand a 90% of pem is gen peds. we spend less money figuring cases out and tend not to over treat conditions.

PGY6:)
 

TylerDurden

Member
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Jul 27, 2003
35
0
Visit site
Status
Attending Physician
Wow- when I was looking 2 years ago 225k was quite rare of for dedicated PEM (let alone 320k!). Do you mind my asking what part of the country and what hours to get that level of compensation? Thanks.