Per diem disability evals - rate?

[neuropsych54321]

Recently contacted by a company that does per diem/moonlighting disability psych evals (not neuropsych). Rate per eval is $85-95, which covers 45 minute appt and templated report. Minimal pay for no shows. Role is set up for flexibility (for example, can work 1-2 days/month or more and can set how many evals each day). It is W4 and includes limited admin support, office space, software, malpractice coverage; no other benefits. The rate seems low, but want other opinions about the rate and setup.

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[PsyDr]

The Medicare rate for just evaluating someone, in clinical settings, without a write up, is higher than this. Why would you agree to a medicolegal evaluation that has a higher risk to your license, than straight clinical work?

 

[summerbabe]

I'm just a regular VA therapist who has never done PP/contract work and even I'm offended by that rate!

Hell, there's probably some ESA company with better flexibility that will pay a higher hourly rate to literally rubber stamp a bunch of templated apartment letters than this gig.

 

[R. Matey]

I'm just a regular VA therapist who has never done PP/contract work and even I'm offended by that rate!

Is that a business proposition?

 

[neuropsych54321]

Thanks for the responses. I thought the pay seemed low, but now it is clear that it is disgustingly low!

Embarrassed to admit that I did not know you could look up medicare reimbursement rates before this conversation. I do not want to get scammed or taken advantage of, and it is scary how close I was to even considering this for a second. It feels like "wow, $90/hour sounds like good money" is an easy trap to fall into coming from postdoc pay (which these companies are clearly preying on).

Wish there was more focus on business matters throughout school and training years. Any recommendations for how to become better informed about the money side of things?

 

[psych.meout]

Hell, there's probably some ESA company with better flexibility that will pay a higher hourly rate to literally rubber stamp a bunch of templated apartment letters than this gig.

I would do this in a heartbeat.

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

I'm just a regular VA therapist who has never done PP/contract work and even I'm offended by that rate!

Hell, there's probably some ESA company with better flexibility that will pay a higher hourly rate to literally rubber stamp a bunch of templated apartment letters than this gig.

Plumbers get higher rates for just showing up.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Thanks for the responses. I thought the pay seemed low, but now it is clear that it is disgustingly low!

Embarrassed to admit that I did not know you could look up medicare reimbursement rates before this conversation. I do not want to get scammed or taken advantage of, and it is scary how close I was to even considering this for a second. It feels like "wow, $90/hour sounds like good money" is an easy trap to fall into coming from postdoc pay (which these companies are clearly preying on).

Wish there was more focus on business matters throughout school and training years. Any recommendations for how to become better informed about the money side of things?

I'm sure others will have better suggestions than me, but just doing what you're doing (i.e., checking Medicare rates for yourself, asking around with colleagues) is, I would imagine, the way most folks learn about these sorts of practice issues. If your state psych association has an early-career and/or private practice group, joining that can be helpful. Same goes for similar groups with other professional organizations (e.g., NAN, INS, AACN, Division 40 for neuropsychology). You can ask former supervisors with whom you keep in touch. You could even "cold call" other psychologists in your area and offer to take them out to lunch to pick their brains a bit.

 

[BuckeyeLove]

This is a company that is OVERTLY taking advantage of early career people. it sounds eerily similar to one i know in my town who hoards newly licensed people and then keeps them locked in due to non competes. SSI eval rates are set and generally pay out 165ish per interview and then 100ish for testing (almost always WAIS but sometimes a WMS is requested). These types of evals are an ever flowing source of small but easy passive income for garbage practices like the one youre describing. (side note: the only way to make money doing these is to schedule 13ish within a 5 hour period, use a psych assistant to get background, and then meet with the claimant for roughly 15 minutes, at least this is how i saw a former mentor doing it, but I'm not sure if you would feel safe doing that haha, i know i wouldnt).

 

[WisNeuro]

People really need to seek out more seasoned colleagues in their practice niche as mentors and such. It would dissuade all but the diploma millers to even consider garbage offers like this. Like AA said, if you don't know anyone, offer to take someone out for dinner/drinks for a business chat. See if your division/specialty area organizations has a mentor program. Maintain good relationships with former supervisors/preceptors. This information is pretty easily available.

 

[PsyDWannabe]

Thanks for the responses. I thought the pay seemed low, but now it is clear that it is disgustingly low!

Embarrassed to admit that I did not know you could look up medicare reimbursement rates before this conversation.

A lot of people don’t. We all had to learn it for the first time at some point

 

[PsyDr]

Thanks for the responses. I thought the pay seemed low, but now it is clear that it is disgustingly low!

Embarrassed to admit that I did not know you could look up medicare reimbursement rates before this conversation. I do not want to get scammed or taken advantage of, and it is scary how close I was to even considering this for a second. It feels like "wow, $90/hour sounds like good money" is an easy trap to fall into coming from postdoc pay (which these companies are clearly preying on).

Wish there was more focus on business matters throughout school and training years. Any recommendations for how to become better informed about the money side of things?

Use a calendar, mark what you are doing every half hour, assign a CPT code to those 30 min sections, calculate what you are bringing in. If you know what you are worth, you can negotiate. It also helps you track your own productivity.

I would do this in a heartbeat.

You should REALLY read Younggrens' article on why you should NOT write ESA letters. Like everything else, you should read the literature before jumping into something.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

You should REALLY read Younggrens' article on why you should NOT write ESA letters. Like everything else, you should read the literature before jumping into something.

I don't know which I would actively avoid more--child custody evals or ESA letters. If that's all I were left with, I'd probably quit and open a food truck or something.

 

[WisNeuro]

I don't know which I would actively avoid more--child custody evals or ESA letters. If that's all I were left with, I'd probably quit and open a food truck or something.

I wouldn't touch either with a 10 foot pole, but I think I'd be more loathe to get into custody eval stuff. That's where I could see an angry parent assaulting someone, or worse.

 

[psych.meout]

Use a calendar, mark what you are doing every half hour, assign a CPT code to those 30 min sections, calculate what you are bringing in. If you know what you are worth, you can negotiate. It also helps you track your own productivity.

You should REALLY read Younggrens' article on why you should NOT write ESA letters. Like everything else, you should read the literature before jumping into something.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

I wouldn't touch either with a 10 foot pole, but I think I'd be more loathe to get into custody eval stuff. That's where I could see an angry parent assaulting someone, or worse.

Agreed. There isn't enough money in the world for me to deal with child custody cases bc parents can be completely irrational (& some can be quite violent). ESA requests are just begging for Axis-II personalities and I want no part of getting involved with local disputes (e.g. housing, flying, working, etc).

It's good to discuss predatory jobs so students and new clinicians know to avoid them. Disability evals, VA Compensation & Pension Evals, ESAs, court evals (some are perfectly fine, others are horribly reimbursed).

 

[futureapppsy2]

I wouldn't touch either with a 10 foot pole, but I think I'd be more loathe to get into custody eval stuff. That's where I could see an angry parent assaulting someone, or worse.

One of my professors in undergrad did child custody evals in his part-time private practice. I remember one week he said he couldn't meet because a child's parent had threatened to murder him.

 

[erg923]

Recently contacted by a company that does per diem/moonlighting disability psych evals (not neuropsych). Rate per eval is $85-95, which covers 45 minute appt and templated report. Minimal pay for no shows. Role is set up for flexibility (for example, can work 1-2 days/month or more and can set how many evals each day). It is W4 and includes limited admin support, office space, software, malpractice coverage; no other benefits. The rate seems low, but want other opinions about the rate and setup.

Dude, seriously, WTF? Why would you consider this? This is nasty, high stakes stuff here. And..."Templated Reports" from someone else (the company that pays you???) are never a good idea here. Terrible idea. People kill for sex/love....AND money!

As an aside, keep in mind this is, in reality, alot of work for you for each case (certainly 3 hours or more) and almost none for them. If you want to make "side hustle money," ask Lincoln Financial or UNUM about doing STD records review or appeals. At least that way you don't have to actually see anyone or take on any liability.

 

[PsyDr]

One of my professors in undergrad did child custody evals in his part-time private practice. I remember one week he said he couldn't meet because a child's parent had threatened to murder him.

I’m legitimately surprised that death threats in forensics even warrants mention. protip: The ones who do it casually are the dangerous ones. Someone who threatens you like it’s a normal day is more dangerous than someone who is upset.

 

[Sanman]

I’m legitimately surprised that death threats in forensics even warrants mention. protip: The ones who do it casually are the dangerous ones. Someone who threatens you like it’s a normal day is more dangerous than someone who is upset.

 

[Sanman]

The bottom line here, $85-95 per eval and $85-95 per hour are different numbers.