PGSP-Stanford Psy.D. Consortium

[Betemit]

I'm new to this site (which is super helpful, by the way!) and to the application/interview process this year. I've had several Psy.D. program interviews in the last month, including yesterday at the PGSP-Stanford Consortium. The program seemed GREAT to me - incredible faculty, great classes and practicum/internship opportunities! Had never been to the Bay Area before either (I live in Philly) and it seemed beautiful. The reputation of the program/school already had me interested, but I wasn't sure. Having seen it, it sold me completely.

So, my question is, does anyone know what chance an interviewee has of getting in there? Did anyone else interview? I know the program is expensive (though looking online at least, housing doesn't seem to be quite as co$tly as people say), but what did others think of it? Anybody else applying to Psy.D.'s have it as a top choice?

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[erg923]

I am not at PGSP or in that program, but am in another (more researched focused) program in the bay area and can say they enjoy a solid rep around here, clinically speaking. However, the price tag is prohibtive considering the likelyhood of what you will be making when you come out (median salary of a psychologist is 60k or so). Try paying back 200k (plus interest) in debt on 60 grand a year..... no way!!

My experience is that the ph,.d program students actually have it slightly better off, as they have specialty tracks (good rep for neuro in the area) and seem to be slightly more favored when applying to practicum externships and in getting paid research positions, even at Standford itself....go figure. But again, the cost seems prohibtive to me.

 

[CApsych]

Hi Betemit- I interviewed in February and it's my top choice. That was actually the only PsyD program i applied to but I absolutely loved it! I have worked in the Stanford Psychiatry department for a few years so I know a lot of the PsyD students and talked to them at length before my interview. They seem to love it as well. I can tell you more about housing, area etc if you PM me, but so far I have been nothing but impressed with the whole thing (except, of course, the price!).

 

[BCR]

Betemit et al.,

I am a first year student at the PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium so feel free to ask me any specific questions you may have. Thus far, my experience has been wonderful and the faculty outstanding (both on didactic and personal levels). Obviously I'm biased, but the opportunities here are unrivaled and this year's match rate was well above average for both PsyD or PhD programs (90.5%). The program has a very strong emphasis on evidence-based treatments and greatly encourages students to become involved in and critical consumers of research.

Vis-à-vis the program costs, obviously it's a lot of money, but the faculty and staff try to accommodate students in any way that they can. If the program is the best fit for you, how do you put a price tag on 5 years of your life doing exactly what you want to be doing?

That's just my quick two-cents, but again, let me know if you have any specific questions you'd like me to answer 🙂

 

[BCR]

I am not at PGSP or in that program, but am in another (more researched focused) program in the bay area and can say they enjoy a solid rep around here, clinically speaking. However, the price tag is prohibtive considering the likelyhood of what you will be making when you come out (median salary of a psychologist is 60k or so). Try paying back 200k (plus interest) in debt on 60 grand a year..... no way!!

My experience is that the ph,.d program students actually have it slightly better off, as they have specialty tracks (good rep for neuro in the area) and seem to be slightly more favored when applying to practicum externships and in getting paid research positions, even at Standford itself....go figure. But again, the cost seems prohibtive to me.

I'm a student at the PGSP-Stanford PsyD and was very curious as to where you've gotten your information from. What program are you in?

The PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium (completely separate from the PGSP PhD program) has been developing a child-track for those who are interested in taking that route. The lack of options is mostly due to wanting to ensure quality core competence and includes a breadth and depth of exposure to empirically-based treatment; this is clearly reflected in our internship match rates, to give but one example.

 

[CaliPsych]

I'm a first year student in the Consortium as well. I chose between this program and a few other competitive PsyDs, as well as 2 PhD programs. Ultimately, my choice came down to here and one PhD. I really liked the price tag on the PhD (free plus a stipend), but I was convinced that I wouldn't get strong clinical training at that program. I will admit though, that I was tempted to just go there to avoid the loans I would have to take on at the Consortium. I can honestly say that knowing what I know now, that would have been a career-altering mistake.

I have been extremely impressed by the balance the Consortium has managed to achieve. The clinical training is excellent, and there are many opportunities for research as well. I have been involved in a lab since I began school here, and I am already on track to having several publications by the time I graduate. Many people in our program have gone on to elite internships and postdocs, some of which have never taken PsyDs before. I am confident that, like them, I'll be competitive for top jobs at VAs and medical schools and that paying off my loans won't be a problem. I think the 60k estimate is low; every graduate I have talked to is making 80-110k after postdoc. Perhaps that 60k estimate is more reflective of private practice or community mental health positions, but I don't know anyone who has such a position so I can't comment.

The other comment I'll add about loans is that regardless of which PsyD you choose, you'll be paying back your loans for a looooong time. One thing that appealed to me about our program was that it would set me up for an APA internship, which means that no jobs are closed to me. Since VAs and prisons pay the highest and both require APA internships, it's important to consider match rates when choosing a PsyD if you want to pay back your loans quickly.

Anyway, I hope that was helpful. Please feel free to PM me if you want more information.

 

[erg923]

I'm a student at the PGSP-Stanford PsyD and was very curious as to where you've gotten your information from. What program are you in?

The PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium (completely separate from the PGSP PhD program) has been developing a child-track for those who are interested in taking that route. The lack of options is mostly due to wanting to ensure quality core competence and includes a breadth and depth of exposure to empirically-based treatment; this is clearly reflected in our internship match rates, to give but one example.

Its just what ive heard from ph.d students......

Regarding your other comment, most would agree that it is extemely naive not to consider the price tag of "doing what you want to be doing." I was not brought up to think in such a carefree manner, but I guess people are different. And of course, as JN said...um yea, thats nice and all, but "what about the other 50, or so.

 

[CaliPsych]

Its just what ive heard from ph.d students......

Regarding your other comment, most would agree that it is extemely naive not to consider the price tag of "doing what you want to be doing." I was not brought up to think in such a carefree manner, but I guess people are different. And of course, as JN said...um yea, thats nice and all, but "what about the other 50, or so.

The information you've heard from PhD students is simply not true. They are absolutely not more competitive for practicum and research positions, and our match rates provide objective evidence that our program is highly regarded both in the Bay Area and nationwide.

I don't think anyone in our program is cavalier about the debt we have taken on, but we've done a cost-benefit analysis and determined that, for us, this is the right decision. It may not be for you, and there's nothing wrong with that, but it may be the right choice for other people on this forum. I'm just trying to provide my rationale for coming here so that it may benefit other people.

 

[jnine]

i interviewed there 2 yrs ago and was very impressed by everything except the cost. charging a student 30k per year while they're doing their dissertation seems wrong.

that said, it seemed to me that everyone there is very aware that students pay a lot to go there and the faculty/supervisors work hard to give you value for the money. your clinic expereinces seem to be really well managed from day one. you get a lot of help preparing you to be as competetive as possible for an APA internship. (mabye the current students can comment) all in all, it seems like a great program.

my first advice to any student considering the program is do the financial math and see what your bottom line would be if you make a realistic salary. project 10 yrs, 20 yrs into the future and compare vs funded programs or programs that might cost you less over the 5+ yrs.

oh and i can't not reiterate that palo alto and the bay area is beautiful.

 

[CApsych]

Also, in my experience, the PsyD students have more access and options with Stanford Research labs than some other students. When I was using this board 2+ years prior to applying, some of the comments made it seem as if the Consortium was some money-sucking professional school purely out for financial gain (still not convinced those actually exist). Even while working directly with the students and seeing the amazing projects they got to work on, I questioned applying. Luckily, I came to my senses and I encourage anyone considering the program to speak directly to someone who is informed (some of the current students in this discussion).

 

[JockNerd]

And of course, as JN said...um yea, thats nice and all, but "what about the other 50, or so.

JS said it. Flattered, though. Obviously I agree anyhow.

 

[CApsych]

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[Acceptmealready]

I also applied to this program but I unfortunately did not get in. However, Instead they offered me a chance to interview with the Clinical PHD program at the university. Does anyone know anything about it?

 

[erg923]

Loan debt taken on by students affects much more than the individual who takes it on.......it affects this profession as a whole as well. You will see this once you are out in the real world and are more exposed to and educated on the financial aspects of a practice, and of the economics of this profession in general (ie., how salary trends are created, inflations, deflations, third party reimburment nuances, etc). When one is just starting grad school (or applying to grad school), they generally are not cognizant of these issues because they are so focused on learning and accomplishing their dream. But they are real issues. Thats why its brought up so often.

Students have the right to be informed of the pros and cons of their decisions, and thats what the OP was seeking. Moreover, it is a legitimate concern, and a warning to future students about institutions that, in our view, are financially exploitative of their students. But if you deem your dissertation project to be worth 32k, then go right ahead. I simply can not understand the mind-set of someone who thinks that 32k per year (especially in the last year or 2 when your not even talking classes) is not overpriced to the point of being exploitative.

 

[CApsych]

I actually have loan debt from my Master's program that I am currently paying back, two adult sisters with 150k+ loan debt from law school and a whole lot of loan research under my belt. I honestly do appreciate you guys letting people know what it means to take this on. It was my most important question during the interview process. But I wish that when I searched for information online about the program I didn't get mostly threads from this site about the loan debt it incurs. It would be cool to learn other information about the program, like the students above provided, along with your information about loans. But from my search I mostly see loan debt discussions and defensive posts from current students.

 

[erg923]

But I wish that when I searched for information online about the program I didn't get mostly threads from this site about the loan debt it incurs.

Well lets think about this for a minute......

What might this mean? What might it mean that there are realtively few comments about the program's content and quality (although even i admit they share a rather solid rep in the area clincially) and that there are many, many negative comments and warnings about its excessive cost? This screams something to me......

 

[CApsych]

Alright I give up. You guys win. I luckily had the benefit of going directly to the faculty and current students (as well as students who had chosen not to go) to discuss the program and its quality. I'm sorry that other students who only have access to this board to discuss these issues will have a somewhat skewed (of course, in my opinion) perception of what the program offers (and doesn't offer). I'm really glad I live nearby the program and didn't have to depend on this board or I might have missed out on an opportunity that works very well for my goals and situation.

 

[DrMaxPsyD]

Ignore them. We all make the best decisions based on our personal circumstances. It may not be what everyone else wants for their lives but in the end there are many factors affecting why psychologists are paid ~60k after 6 years of training.

Furthermore, with all due respect, if there was a PhD program up you know who's you know what they would reside there happily. So when they speak, it's from a very narrow perspective if you get my drift.

 

[zzzz2]

Alright I give up. You guys win. I luckily had the benefit of going directly to the faculty and current students (as well as students who had chosen not to go) to discuss the program and its quality. I'm sorry that other students who only have access to this board to discuss these issues will have a somewhat skewed (of course, in my opinion) perception of what the program offers (and doesn't offer). I'm really glad I live nearby the program and didn't have to depend on this board or I might have missed out on an opportunity that works very well for my goals and situation.

I don't see this as a matter of "winning" or "defending" your decision. An open forum is constructed to invite opinions of all sorts, which is why it can be informative. The financial implication of going to this particular program is certainly an important matter. Spelling it out does not mean that your decision is questioned, but rather as something to think about.

 

[erg923]

Ignore them. We all make the best decisions based on our personal circumstances.

I am interested in why people dont seem to understand, or have insight into, how the massive debt accumluated by it students eventually affects this profession. Are you all really this egocentriclaly focused, or are you not aware of principles of economics that influence practice standards and practice styles/preferences, salary trends, professional worth of a profession in the eyes of others.....etc.?

 

[zzzz2]

`

 

[DrMaxPsyD]

.

 

[DrMaxPsyD]

I don't see this as a matter of "winning" or "defending" your decision. An open forum is constructed to invite opinions of all sorts, which is why it can be informative. The financial implication of going to this particular program is certainly an important matter. Spelling it out does not mean that your decision is questioned, but rather as something to think about.

As if this doctoral level student hasn't already thought about it. Geewhiz, he must have poop for brains.

 

[erg923]

As if this doctoral level student hasn't already thought about it. Geewhiz, he must have poop for brains.

Take it easy pal, this is professional forum. Also, I am active in fighting APAs lack of focus on this issue on the professional advocate level as well, so go easy....

I also agree that posting on this forum is a form of advocacy as well. This is a large board that reaches lots of potential future psychologists. Who bettre to target. Not really sure why one would be considered honorable and why the other one (ie., this board) is somehow not?

I disagree that no one cares. In fact, lots of people do. In fact, thats why this place exists, no? To get others perspectives, opinions, experiences, etc. This is professional forum where people seek advice and then recieve it. Again, students who are naive to the profession and many of these issues have the right to be informed by more seasoned students and professionals who do. Hence, the title "Student-Doctor Network." What is your understanding on the purpose of this forum?

 

[BCR]

I spoke to some students from their recently (about to go on internship). They thought it was too expensive and that the standards were being lowered (letting in more students).

I'm not trying to be rude, merely trying to clear up a reputation that's become so distorted, but are you sure you were talking with PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium students? Let me set the record straight: Admission to the program is becoming anything BUT less competitive -- Average incoming scores for c/o 2014 were a 3.60 GPA and 1270 GRE. And no, they are not letting in more students. The class size is capped at 30 students and that's where the Consortium plans to keep it at; no more, preferably less. As far as the debt goes, I have yet to come across a student (or alumni) that doesn't believe the program was expensive. Of course it's expense! It's something we all carefully considered before making our decision to attend. Thus far, I haven't met a single student (or alumni) that has regretted their decision to attend the program.

 

[BCR]

Its just what ive heard from ph.d students......

Regarding your other comment, most would agree that it is extemely naive not to consider the price tag of "doing what you want to be doing." I was not brought up to think in such a carefree manner, but I guess people are different. And of course, as JN said...um yea, thats nice and all, but "what about the other 50, or so.

Good point. It would be "extremely naive not to consider the price tag"! I don't know a single person in my program that didn't take cost into consideration.

By the way, you never answered which program you're attending. You seem to speak with such authority on a number of issues specific to PsyD program so why not disclose the program that you're attending? This way we can have a fair and honest discussion and it would help to me and everyone else to understand your point of view.

On another note, those who are curious about the program should feel free to PM me. We can have an honest, productive discussion about the PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium since discourse on this board only seems to revolve (ad nauseum) around the financial aspects.

 

[BCR]

Hey, no worries (rude).

Yes, I'm positive I was talking to PGSP students. They also mentioned a better rep of PhD over PsyD at the program. But, I really don't know that much about the program aside from the cost, which we've discussed, that it's a standalone professional school with loose affiliation with Stanford, and that it has both psyd and phd students. I've never worked with anyone from the program or met a professional in any context that attended the program.

Hi there,

Let me try and set the record straight:

You said you were speaking with a PGSP student; A PGSP student and a PGSP-Stanford student are very very different -- Confusing, so let me explain. There is no PhD program at the PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium. There is a PhD program at PGSP, however, but it is in no way affiliated with Stanford and very very separate from the PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium; Admission requirements and curriculum are different and they do not take classes at Stanford or with Stanford faculty.

PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium students are considered just that, PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium students. They are not PGSP students.

To date, PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium has a burgeoning and well-respected reputation and prospects look bright. Also, our affiliation with Stanford is not even markedly close to "loose". Our program is split 50-50 between PGSP and Stanford Medical School: that includes our tuition (half to both schools), the faculty and directors of clinical training (50% from PGSP and 50% from Stanford), classes (half at Stanford half at PGSP) and even our diploma (which will have the seals of BOTH Stanford and PGSP).

Thanks for your willingness to have an honest discourse about this topic 🙂

 

[erg923]

By the way, you never answered which program you're attending. You seem to speak with such authority on a number of issues specific to PsyD program so why not disclose the program that you're attending? This way we can have a fair and honest discussion and it would help to me and everyone else to understand your point of view.

So......the value of my opionion is attached to what program I attend? I dont think so......thats not what this board is about. Information is presented and must be evaluated on the facts and experiences put forth, not based on the authority of the source, but the information itself.

What we all seem to agree upon is that PGSP-Stanford appears to produce quality clinicans. I have run into a couple of them during a prac I did in san fran a few years ago and both appeard to be well informed, bright clincians-in-training (more so than the student I met from Alliant). They also appear to have a good focus on developing scientific thinking and research (one of my big gripes with most psy.d programs is the lack of "think like a scientist" attitudes and mind-sets). These are all good things.

However, does taking on the large debt affect more than just you at the end of the day? Well, yes it does actually. Exactly how it does will come into focus more as one moves from student to professional, so I don't expect all aspiring doctoral students to undertand or appreciate the signficant impact economic factors have on the evolutions and trends in clinical practice and the market-place at large for psychologists. But again, this focus on "its my choice, leave me alone" is simply not correct. This is a hugely egocentrist view that I have never quite understood. Your finances do not exist in a vacumm (see above for how they affect the profession down the line). To feel that your financial actions and attitudes wont shape and impact this field (both financially and clinically) is amazing to me. To me this is very common sense. I can not understand how that has attitude developed.

 

[greensky]

From what I understand, many students want to go there because they want to have Stanford written on their diploma. The program is a lot easier to get into than most university based PhD/PsyD programs, but harder than schools such as Alliant and Argosy (however, they cost the same).

 

[BCR]

So......the value of my opionion is attached to what program I attend? I dont think so......thats not what this board is about. Information is presented and must be evaluated on the facts and experiences put forth, not based on the authority of the source, but the information itself.

What we all seem to agree upon is that PGSP-Stanford appears to produce quality clinicans. I have run into a couple of them during a prac I did in san fran a few years ago and both appeard to be well informed, bright clincians-in-training (more so than the student I met from Alliant). They also appear to have a good focus on developing scientific thinking and research (one of my big gripes with most psy.d programs is the lack of "think like a scientist" attitudes and mind-sets). These are all good things.

However, does taking on the large debt affect more than just you at the end of the day? Well, yes it does actually. Exactly how it does will come into focus more as one moves from student to professional, so I don't expect all aspiring doctoral students to undertand or appreciate the signficant impact economic factors have on the evolutions and trends in clinical practice and the market-place at large for psychologists. But again, this focus on "its my choice, leave me alone" is simply not correct. This is a hugely egocentrist view that I have never quite understood. Your finances do not exist in a vacumm (see above for how they affect the profession down the line). To feel that your financial actions and attitudes wont shape and impact this field (both financially and clinically) is amazing to me. To me this is very common sense. I can not understand how that has attitude developed.

So......the value of my opionion is attached to what program I attend? I dont think so pal......thats not what this board is about. Information is presented and must be evaluated on the facts and experiences put forth, not based on the authority of the source, but the information itself.

Well, I'm sorry to have to be the one to tell you this then, but separating the information from the source is impossible -- our opinions stem from our experiences. Obviously we're all coming into this conversation with some sort of bias and it would be good to know how your experiences have affected your opinion. Further, the board IS about opinion! Prospective applicants are asking current students (like myself) for an opinion about their program.

Also, your hostility and immaturity are absolutely unnecessary -- are you really going into a "helping profession?" The combination of your animosity and the extent to which you're posting skewed info. actually discredits you as a reliable source -- and people look at the source to decide whether or not to believe the information they present.

On another note, it would be nice if we could steer this conversation back to a more constructive one, one where the focus is on aspects of the program (questions regarding curriculum/faculty/location etc) and NOT on the finances -- your discussion of the program cost is nowhere close to constructive (extremely argumentative and dogmatic if anything) and its been discussed on this board already, ad nauseum. It's going nowhere.

 

[BCR]

From what I understand, many students want to go there because they want to have Stanford written on their diploma. The program is a lot easier to get into than most university based PhD/PsyD programs, but harder than schools such as Alliant and Argosy (however, they cost the same).

A major problem with this site is that so many people throw out "facts" without supporting evidence. Where are you be getting your information from?

 

[erg923]

I am in a ph.d program in california..its a UC.....there. Now does this change anything about the PGSP-Stanford tuition? No. Does it change the fact that they charge 30k during the year when all your doing is writing a dissertation project? No. Does it change the fact that student loans debt impacts salary levels in a profession? No. So whats the point?

If my points about the impact finances have on the trends and evolution of this profession fall on deaf ears....so be it. If you can not understand the relevance this has to the greater good of the profession, I dont know how else I can say.

But its interesting that all the other posters who are pointing out the same issues as I am (and advocating on your behalf against institutions that could exploit you financially I might add) are elders grad students and/or early career professionals already working in the field (T4c, Jon Snow, JockNerd), and all the ones railing against it are prospective or newbie grad students. Now what might that suggest to you?

If you want to turn a deaf ear to the advice of more clinically and professionally seasoned members of the profession because you dont like the way it sounds, well....as Harvey Keital says in Pulp Fiction.... "lots of luck gentelman....."

 

[CApsych]

greensky- some students, myself included, want to go there because they want to work with professors who are leaders in their fields and are in the Stanford Psychiatry department. There is no other way to do this since the Consortium is Stanford's only clinical program.

I already have Stanford on a diploma, and I can attest to the fact that having a fancy diploma stamp isn't that exciting all by itself.

 

[erg923]

True. Although I really meant "elder" referring to older/elder grad students and early career people who have already had a variety of professional experiences from which to observe from.

 

[greensky]

greensky- some students, myself included, want to go there because they want to work with professors who are leaders in their fields and are in the Stanford Psychiatry department. There is no other way to do this since the Consortium is Stanford's only clinical program.

I already have Stanford on a diploma, and I can attest to the fact that having a fancy diploma stamp isn't that exciting all by itself.

I am under the impression (from people who I know who go there) that you are not accepted to work with specific professors in the PsyD program, since the program is very clinically focused. I also understand that there are "famous" professors who work there, which certainly attracts students, but I do not think it is worth the money. My comment was not directed towards you, but towards others who I spoke with that said "OMG...my diploma is going to say Stanford". Personally, I'd rather graduate with as little debt as possible and would only attend a program that charged so much as a last option. Also, 30 in doctoral program seems might large...Again, this is just my opinion.

 

[spike 8]

Well this has been pretty funny and entertaining! I am a current PGSP-Stanford Consortium student and I will offer my thoughts about the strengths of the program.

- Outstanding, outstanding faculty - from both PGSP and Stanford. This was one of the main reasons I chose to go there and I have not been disappointed. Our classes are taught by some of the top researchers and leaders in the field and yes, I feel this does make a huge difference.
- Research opportunities at Stanford - not all Psy.D. students have access to such amazing research opportunities, research being done in the very building where half of our classes take place. I could go on and on about this strength but PM me if you want more details.
- Relatively lower class size, compared to many other Psy.D. programs. The cap is at 30 per class and it is not going up.
- The sequence of classes (you can take a look for yourself on the PAU website). Amazing. More specialized clinical classes in the third year- some examples - DBT, Eating Disorders, Child Assessment and Child Psychotherapy.
- Affiliation with the Palo Alto VA - one of the best VA training sites in the country. One of our captive practicum sites is at the Menlo Park/Palo Alto VA. The majority of our students complete one practicum (or more) at the VA.
- Good relationships with many other amazing practicum sites in the Bay Area.
- Excellent match rate.

 

[spike 8]

Prospective students who have questions - feel free to PM me.

 

[spike 8]

I was once tempted to ask Suze Orman if I could afford a doctoral degree hoping for a "You are approved, girlfriend/boyfriend!"

But I restrained myself.

Hilarious!!🙂

 

[lexicon]

Well this has been pretty funny and entertaining! I am a current PGSP-Stanford Consortium student and I will offer my thoughts about the strengths of the program.

Spike, I really appreciate your input here and I was wondering if there is anything (besides the price 🙄) that you don't like about the program. I mean, no place is perfect so if you had a magic wand what would you improve about it?

 

[jnine]

something that struck me, shoud give PGSP-Stanford students reason to rejoice. No one is really criticising the program, only the finances. in context of past threads, this is pretty good and a sign that people recognize the quality of the program.

 

[UniqueSnowflake]

Hi all,
As usual, a spirited debate about how other people should make personal decisions! Ah, how I love SDN.
I'm looking to get in touch with the incoming cohort at the Consortium (2010). I could not be more excited to be attending this program in particular, and it would be nice to geek out with the rest of the incoming class, not to mention find out more about the area from folks who live there already.
Should we make a super secret new thread? Hehehe.
Anyway, other 2010 Consortium folks feel free to PM me. I know there will be a Google group starting after 4/15 but I'm jumping the gun🙂

 

[Beebly]

dd

 

[erg923]

Yep, Im passionate, but obviously not the only one....and not enough to raise this thread from the grave. Please move on. Im not going to get into all this again.

PS: And ok, my bad, they charge 80% of 30k during the internship year, is that accurate? Yes, thats much better...

 

[DrGero]

Why do they charge anything during the internship year? What service are they providing?

Well, from what I recall when I was there, they *do* have like, five different vice presidents of academic affairs, no doubt pulling down six figures. That does get expensive.

 

[CaliPsych]

Why do they charge anything during the internship year? What service are they providing?

I am a second-year student in the Consortium. In response to the above question, the reason that the program charges tuition during the fifth (internship) year is that the overall price of tuition is distributed over 5 years instead of over 4. So the money paid during the fifth year is part of the total tuition price, and not a separate charge for the internship year. A lot of students appreciate this policy because it makes the first 4 years of the program less costly. Since federal loans only cover a certain amount of tuition, it makes sense to lower the yearly price so that students on loans can pay most or all of their tuition costs with subsidized loans. Feel free to PM me with any questions you have about this topic or the PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium.

 

[zzzz2]

I am a second-year student in the Consortium. In response to the above question, the reason that the program charges tuition during the fifth (internship) year is that the overall price of tuition is distributed over 5 years instead of over 4. So the money paid during the fifth year is part of the total tuition price, and not a separate charge for the internship year. A lot of students appreciate this policy because it makes the first 4 years of the program less costly. Since federal loans only cover a certain amount of tuition, it makes sense to lower the yearly price so that students on loans can pay most or all of their tuition costs with subsidized loans. Feel free to PM me with any questions you have about this topic or the PGSP-Stanford PsyD Consortium.

I guess you can see it both ways. Spreading out 4 years of tuition into 5 years sounds like a reasonable policy. Or you can see it as paying "tuition" for your internship year. If the idea is to allow students to pay most of their tuition loans, then why charge students so much on tuition in the first place? Probably because they want your money but pitch it in a way that it seems reasonable to pay during your internship year.

 

[DrGero]

I am sure that's what they tell students. But, isn't PGSP-Stanford one of the most expensive professional schools in psychology? Don't they decide what they're going to charge? Isn't their overall tuition fairly much arbitrary? It's not like they are required to charge what they charge. This is exactly the problem with the loan system. Their tuition is so high because they are charging near the limit of what's loanable thru the government backed loans. Greedy bastards. . . . and can you say housing market crash?

While I think it's fair to direct criticism at places like PAU (PGSP) for taking student loan money in such a way, there's something to be said for questioning the wisdom of shoveling out such funds to students in the first place, e.g., the entire way we fund an enormous chunk of higher education from bachelor's degrees on up (funded graduate programs aside). I note you do mention problems with the "loan system." Here's what I think:

I would imagine that PAU/PGSP thinks they would be at a competitive disadvantage, probably, if they took anything less than what students pull down maxing out their federal student loans, because their competitors certainly won't, and, they probably tell themselves, those five "vice presidents of academic affairs" afford them some value-added services that make them more competitive.

It's interesting that hyperinflation of higher education in this country historically only started happening when federal money started becoming so freely available. Cheap money = inflation. It's just the way things work, and it's no different in higher education than it is in health care, or any other sector of the economy.

So, labelling what PGSP does as "greed," oversimplifies things. The macroeconomics of why PGSP and hundreds of other professional schools (in psychology, law, and otherwise) as well as undergraduate programs charge so much for their tuition has maybe something to do with "greed" per se, but much more to do with the highly distorted economics that are in play in the higher education system.

 

[erg923]

I apologize, but this does nothing to make it better, and frankly seems even worse to me now.

Let meet get this straight Calipsych, PGSP sets their tuition (coincidentally?) at an amount that is right near the max for student loan disbursement for one year and you THANK them for backing off during the fourth year only to recoup it during your fifth? Kinda like a used car lot, no payment for one year, right? The fact that you cant see whats going on here is amazing. I mean, tuition just happens to be the amount that a student loan disbursement is for one year...GET REAL! They are purposely maxing you out, and you're thanking them for it?

 

[zzzz2]

PGSP sets their tuition (coincidentally?) at an amount that is right near the max for student loan disbursement for one year and you THANK them for backing off during the fourth year only to recoup it during your fifth?

Sounds terribly familiar, like victims defending their abusers.

 

[Student4Life0]

How much is tuition...isn't it aprox. 30,000/year? And then on top of tuition that is charged during the internship year?