Physician Assistants in Medical school now?
Started by medgirl234
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Hey medgirl,
Welcome to SDN!
I have not been through that, but I know many others who have. It is entirely possible and it looks awesome on your app that you have so much experience in the medical field. What are your stats? How many years have you been a PA (experience)? Have you taken the MCAT yet? You can also do a search for threads about this, I assume there is no shortage of information about PA --> MD
Good luck in your applications!
Hey medgirl,
Welcome to SDN!
I have not been through that, but I know many others who have. It is entirely possible and it looks awesome on your app that you have so much experience in the medical field. What are your stats? How many years have you been a PA (experience)? Have you taken the MCAT yet? You can also do a search for threads about this, I assume there is no shortage of information about PA --> MD
Good luck in your applications!
I totally read this in Buddy the Elf's voice.
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I rotated with a girl who went through the same thing. I don't remember her stats except her MCAT was in the low 30s but she went to a DO school in Arizona and quit being a PA after 4 years.
I also read all posts in buddy the elf's voice.
Haven't taken the MCAT yet, I am finishing PA school in a few weeks. That being said, I dont have work experience as a PA, but have over 1500 hours of clinical experience as a PA student which is as hands on as I would be as a med student. IMO you can't get any closer to the front line than what I have been doing.
Started pre-med and got derailed by a family crisis. Science GPA took a hit (3.3) which is why i made the switch to PA school. Overall GPA is >3.6.
I figured that with great LOR and a high MCAT I would have a decent chance, just wondered what other non-traditional students thoughts were!!
Thanks everyone!!
Haven't taken the MCAT yet, I am finishing PA school in a few weeks. That being said, I dont have work experience as a PA, but have over 1500 hours of clinical experience as a PA student which is as hands on as I would be as a med student. IMO you can't get any closer to the front line than what I have been doing.
Started pre-med and got derailed by a family crisis. Science GPA took a hit (3.3) which is why i made the switch to PA school. Overall GPA is >3.6.
I figured that with great LOR and a high MCAT I would have a decent chance, just wondered what other non-traditional students thoughts were!!
Thanks everyone!!
I wouldn't guarantee that. The PA student's I have seen did not have the same responsibilities and did not do the same things as the med students. Maybe your rotations were different...but at my school they certainly weren't close.
Just go in with an open mind. You will definitely have a head start when you hit third year regardless.
Many people do it. It is interesting to me that you don't even want to give it a go as a PA. Why not go for it for a couple of years and see if it is a career you can learn to love? Could save you a boat load of debt not to mention another 7+ years of your life. Then if you try it and still feel MD/DO is right for you than you will have several years of additional experience to add to your application.
Just a thought.
Survivor DO
Just a thought.
Survivor DO
These are good thoughts.
I understand the rotations and responsibilities are different which is why I want to go to medical school. My point is that the hours I have put in are certainly hands on and I am not standing in the corner as a nieve pre-med that is just shadowing. That was my point.
I also want to have a family someday. So if I know that I want to be a Physician, which I do, working as a PA is only delaying starting a family. I have thought about both sides of the argument, I am just thinking that If i want to go for it, now may be the time.
I understand the rotations and responsibilities are different which is why I want to go to medical school. My point is that the hours I have put in are certainly hands on and I am not standing in the corner as a nieve pre-med that is just shadowing. That was my point.
I also want to have a family someday. So if I know that I want to be a Physician, which I do, working as a PA is only delaying starting a family. I have thought about both sides of the argument, I am just thinking that If i want to go for it, now may be the time.
Are you thinking of applying to any DO schools? Or are you only considering MD? Do you plan on trying the PA path at all before medical school? I know you gave reasons for med school rather than continuing PA, but if there's any chance you may enjoy PA it'd save you lots of $$$$$$ and years of schooling.
Im considering all options. As far as applying now vs. practicing as a PA for a few years. Im just looking for feedback and wondering if anyone else has completed the same path I am on!
good luck to you in your application! i am confident that the clinical knowledge learned during PA school, let alone clinical practice, will help throughout the application/interview process.
D
deleted6669
most PAs who return to medschool tend to go to DO programs as they like older applicants with life experience> MD programs.
I know 2 PAs who have gone MD and maybe 6-8 who have gone DO.
I know 2 PAs who have gone MD and maybe 6-8 who have gone DO.
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OFF-TOPIC: interesting to see the PAs admit that they only went to PA school because of poor undergrad GPAs that wouldn't let them in med school
what happened to the "PA is just as hard to get in as med school" "PA applicants can get into any med school" etc etc.
what happened to the "PA is just as hard to get in as med school" "PA applicants can get into any med school" etc etc.
D
deleted6669
N=1. not exactly a convincing arguement.
That's like me saying my gpa was 3.97(it was) so PAs are obviously smarter than docs....
You really need to do something about that inferiority complex of yours.
Many PAs could get into med school, although, I don't think anyone has delusions that PA school is just as hard to get into as med school.
Off topic: I got accepted to a US MD program with a 3.19 GPA.
He mad. He real mad.
Medical school is going to delay starting a family much much more than working as a PA. There is no maternity leave in medical school protected by OHSA.
I'm surprised emedpa stays around when you guys are such *******s to him. Regardless of whether he is wrong or not, it is useful to have a different opinion around.
I think it's probably as difficult to get into DO as the average PA program. Top PA programs are probably about as hard to get into as low to mid tier MD programs, but they will have very different admissions criteria.
If the OP does apply for med school, I would expect this to be a question at most of your interviews.
Well, since I've applied to PA schools as well as MD schools, I'll throw my two cents in on this fun debate. My opinion is that PA school is easier to apply to for a few reasons. One, they don't require the MCAT. Two, although they value high science GPA's as well, they tend to look over the application as a whole (as one person pointed out, much like a lot of DO schools).
However, applying to either school really says little, if anything, about the quality of education or the end product that results from that school.
On a side note, most of my PA teachers/instructors/preceptors were physicians. The dozen or so that commented about PA vs med school at all seemed to agree that PA school was harder comparatively in the short term due to the extensive amount of medicine to learn in a single didactic, a single year of clinicals and that PA school required a much higher GPA to graduate.
Everything is relative and pretty pointless to debate one way or the other. Interesting to read about every level of insecurity around here though. If you can't be proud of yourself, happy with your path you've chosen, and not belittle everyone else for the part they play, then you've got issues you should work through.
However, applying to either school really says little, if anything, about the quality of education or the end product that results from that school.
On a side note, most of my PA teachers/instructors/preceptors were physicians. The dozen or so that commented about PA vs med school at all seemed to agree that PA school was harder comparatively in the short term due to the extensive amount of medicine to learn in a single didactic, a single year of clinicals and that PA school required a much higher GPA to graduate.
Everything is relative and pretty pointless to debate one way or the other. Interesting to read about every level of insecurity around here though. If you can't be proud of yourself, happy with your path you've chosen, and not belittle everyone else for the part they play, then you've got issues you should work through.
All of which are easier to get into when compared to dental schools - as long as we're ranking professional programs.
Smh. 3.8ish GPA in undergrad prior to PA school. And I have never known any PA claim they could get into any medical school but I would venture the great majority could get into med school somewhere.
Also the established PA schools weed out lower quality applicants but the newer ones I think are too lenient and we don't know where the OP went or is going....
No inferiority complex here before you claim such a thing(I am a med student like most of you).
I would say work a year or so because you bailing on the PA profession literally right after graduation will show an understandable lack of commitment to interviewers. That might come back to haunt you.....
I liked that movie until I got into dental school. When people ask me about my life plans the first thing they say, after I tell them I'm going to be a dentist, is "Oh, have you watched Hangover?" 😱
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I agree.
OP, why not try working as a PA. You can realistically make 90K+ in your first year out in ortho or EM. Or you can slog through school for four more years and pay 200K in tuition. Give the PA thing a shot, see what you like and don't like. I think you are crazy to have such a marketable degree and not even attempt to use it.
BTW it is funny seeing douche bag med students talk crap to EMEDPA. You guys can barely write a freaking soap note. Dudes got like 25 years experience in the ED. Get off your high horse kids.
Um what? This is the opposite of what I hear most women say who are PA's or in PA school.
Going through med school and residency will delay starting a family.
Well, actually nothing delays having a family, you can do it whenever. But if you do it during physician training you will be unlikely to be financially secure and have very little ability to take off time without compromising your training/career.
Being a PA would actually allow you to have children and be financially secure at a much younger age.
D
deleted6669
Thanks!
With your goals, it makes sense to work as a PA and have kids. Being a PA is a rewarding career financially that can easily fit in a part time schedule.
It is very unlikely you would be admitted to a US MD program with that GPA and your history of just finishing PA school and not working at all as a PA.
It does not make much sense to go to medical school after completing PA school if you want to have children. It is possible to have children as a woman in medical school or residency, but it is certainly not easy financially or personally. It will be much easier if you stay as a PA.
It is very unlikely you would be admitted to a US MD program with that GPA and your history of just finishing PA school and not working at all as a PA.
It does not make much sense to go to medical school after completing PA school if you want to have children. It is possible to have children as a woman in medical school or residency, but it is certainly not easy financially or personally. It will be much easier if you stay as a PA.
I interpreted this as saying that if she knows she wants to be a physician (MD/DO), then working as a PA first, for a year like some are suggesting, would only delay starting a family by a year. So saving that year and going for it now would be better.
Its this guy again (guy who told me I was taking his jobs? Still confused) spouting/flaming midlevels. Why dont you look up the statistics yourself and compare them? Because their is a lot of validity to that statement. But taking one anecdote is morr appropriate for someone attacking others.
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Here is this guy (told me I had no relevant clinical exposure, but then wouldnt respond to my replies? ) again. Remember that little talk on the other thread? That if you had something contributory to post it doesnt matter if you are actually pre-med/medical student etc? Here is your sign, you dont have anything contributory to post. Go away.
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http://lecom.edu/college-medicine.php/Accelerated-Physician-Assistant-Pathway-APAP/49/2205/612/2395
3 year PA to DO program.
3 year PA to DO program.
This is how I interpreted what she said as well. My response would be that it is probably easier to take 2 years now to work, make some money and start your family now rather than wait until after medical school.
She would not be a good candidate for that program with no work experience as a PA when you got so many practicing PAs that would love to take a shot at the program.
Yeah, I don't have kids and I'm not in medical school yet, so I really don't have anything to offer on that. But I know a few ppl who went the route of having kids first. Then starting med school after the kids and they seemed to think it worked well for them. Of course this all depends on the OP's relationship status anyway. If the OP is single then the timing is a completely different can of worms.
OP,
I know you have probably already made your decision but I thought I would post for the benefit of those with the similar questions about PA and med school that stumble upon this thread in the future. I have a few opinions on this topic and will briefly give you my background before sharing my thoughts. I entered PA school directly out of undergrad and soon into my clinical rotations I knew I wanted to go to medical school. PA school was a decision made in haste and I would have benefited from a year off after school to weigh my options. Anyway, after graduation I started working as an EM PA and learned a TON about how to take care of patients from a group of phenomenal physicians who took time to invest in me. Remember that PA's are VERY green upon graduation because we typically aren't residency trained and while I don't have PA residency experience, I wouldn't imagine that it compares to that of a physician's residency training. I ultimately worked as a PA for 2.5 years before starting at a middle of the road (rankings wise) allopathic medical school. I am in the second semester of my M1 year so my experience is a small sample size. Also, in that time as a PA my wife and I had two kids. There's the background; now let me give you my take away points. You should take my experience/advice with a grain of salt because everyone's story and didactic/clinical experience is unique.
-Medical school is MUCH more comprehensive but, in my experience, my PA school was more intense on a day to day basis. We were trained how the physicians used to back in the day (lecture 8-5 five days a week) but we had multiple courses at the same time and tests every week or so. I would estimate that I studied or was in class 15 hours a day in PA school compared to 12 in MD school. I was top 10% in my PA class and currently am top 10% in med school and my quality of life is better. I say that even though I am married and have two kids now (all three are prioritized over school which is why the discrepancy in work hours exists).
-It would be easy to say I am biased because I had medical training prior to med school but I am mainly basing my opinion off the first semester (biochem and anatomy). Biochem wasn't covered in my PA school and med school anatomy cannot be compared to PA school anatomy because the detail that you are required to know is on a whole different level.
-When people say PA school is harder to get into than med school I think they are referring to the number of spots available per applicant. In my opinion if you stack the average accepted medical student against the average accepted PA student the med student will win every time. In my experience, the exception to that rule are the extremely intelligent woman in PA school who clearly could have excelled in med school but chose not to because they wanted to start a family before they were 30.
-In the hospitals and clinics I rotated in as a PA, we were expected to do everything the med students did.
-To anyone looking to attend PA school as a way to make yourself a better candidate for medical school, I wouldn't recommend it. The obvious reason is the $80k in loans that you will have. The other being that I don't know how favorably an adcom will look at someone applying to med school right out of PA school. In my experience, adcoms loved the fact that I was a PA because of all the experience I had taking care of patients and because I knew exactly what I was getting into with all the changes occurring in the health care system. You have a unique perspective that almost none of the 22-24 year olds that you are competing with have. None of that would be relevant if I didn't actually work as a PA for a few years. Also, to further argue against using PA school as a stepping stone to medical school; imagine shadowing an M4 as they show you how to listen to heart sounds after you have been taking care of 90% of your patients by yourself for a few years...you feel a goof. A very awkward goof.
-If you know you want to be a physician be a physician. There is nothing like living with regret as things may come up and you may never go back to school to be an MD.
-If anyone has any questions please feel free to PM me. I only come here once every few months (med school/married/kids) but I would be happy to help in any way I could.
I know you have probably already made your decision but I thought I would post for the benefit of those with the similar questions about PA and med school that stumble upon this thread in the future. I have a few opinions on this topic and will briefly give you my background before sharing my thoughts. I entered PA school directly out of undergrad and soon into my clinical rotations I knew I wanted to go to medical school. PA school was a decision made in haste and I would have benefited from a year off after school to weigh my options. Anyway, after graduation I started working as an EM PA and learned a TON about how to take care of patients from a group of phenomenal physicians who took time to invest in me. Remember that PA's are VERY green upon graduation because we typically aren't residency trained and while I don't have PA residency experience, I wouldn't imagine that it compares to that of a physician's residency training. I ultimately worked as a PA for 2.5 years before starting at a middle of the road (rankings wise) allopathic medical school. I am in the second semester of my M1 year so my experience is a small sample size. Also, in that time as a PA my wife and I had two kids. There's the background; now let me give you my take away points. You should take my experience/advice with a grain of salt because everyone's story and didactic/clinical experience is unique.
-Medical school is MUCH more comprehensive but, in my experience, my PA school was more intense on a day to day basis. We were trained how the physicians used to back in the day (lecture 8-5 five days a week) but we had multiple courses at the same time and tests every week or so. I would estimate that I studied or was in class 15 hours a day in PA school compared to 12 in MD school. I was top 10% in my PA class and currently am top 10% in med school and my quality of life is better. I say that even though I am married and have two kids now (all three are prioritized over school which is why the discrepancy in work hours exists).
-It would be easy to say I am biased because I had medical training prior to med school but I am mainly basing my opinion off the first semester (biochem and anatomy). Biochem wasn't covered in my PA school and med school anatomy cannot be compared to PA school anatomy because the detail that you are required to know is on a whole different level.
-When people say PA school is harder to get into than med school I think they are referring to the number of spots available per applicant. In my opinion if you stack the average accepted medical student against the average accepted PA student the med student will win every time. In my experience, the exception to that rule are the extremely intelligent woman in PA school who clearly could have excelled in med school but chose not to because they wanted to start a family before they were 30.
-In the hospitals and clinics I rotated in as a PA, we were expected to do everything the med students did.
-To anyone looking to attend PA school as a way to make yourself a better candidate for medical school, I wouldn't recommend it. The obvious reason is the $80k in loans that you will have. The other being that I don't know how favorably an adcom will look at someone applying to med school right out of PA school. In my experience, adcoms loved the fact that I was a PA because of all the experience I had taking care of patients and because I knew exactly what I was getting into with all the changes occurring in the health care system. You have a unique perspective that almost none of the 22-24 year olds that you are competing with have. None of that would be relevant if I didn't actually work as a PA for a few years. Also, to further argue against using PA school as a stepping stone to medical school; imagine shadowing an M4 as they show you how to listen to heart sounds after you have been taking care of 90% of your patients by yourself for a few years...you feel a goof. A very awkward goof.
-If you know you want to be a physician be a physician. There is nothing like living with regret as things may come up and you may never go back to school to be an MD.
-If anyone has any questions please feel free to PM me. I only come here once every few months (med school/married/kids) but I would be happy to help in any way I could.
Apply to OHSU. You sound like an ideal candidate!
I think that makes it one of the most awesome intros to SDN ever.
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