Please Advise Me!

[Pandacinny]

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Okay, so here's the deal. I'm trying to get more veterinary experience than the dog and cat stuff I have right now. I've left my old job and gotten a new one within the past few months. It's a lab animal care job. I get to go to different lab facilities and perform various tasks caring for the animals. Mostly husbandry, but some technical work. Mostly rats and mice, but also some other animals, too. I really like this job.

I've recently been offered a one year internship position. In this position, I'd be doing a lot of really technical laboratory work. In the past, the doctor coordinating this has helped interns work on their own projects and get published. So now I'm unsure whether I should stay at my current job, or go for the internship.

The other factor here is, of course, money. I currently make a little over $30,000 per year. The internship stipend would be around $23,000. Which is a lot less.


What do you guys think? Is it worth living really poor for the next year to do this? Will the internship help me into vet school more than my current job? What would you pick here?

 

[MickeysPet]

Believe me, I know money is an issue...but I'd go for the internship. Adds to the diversified experience, unless you already have some research under your belt...

 

[Electrophile]

So are you going to be like a lab tech? When you say doctor coordinating the project, do you mean MD, DVM, or PhD? If it was a DVM, that'd be especially helpful. Just FYI, be wary whenever someone says, "Oh yeah, you'll definitely get published!" Definitely never any guarantees on that, as I know from personal experience... 🙄

 

[Pandacinny]

Yeah, I know there aren't any guarantees. I'm just going by the experience of a couple of students who've worked in the lab before. It'd basically be a post-baccalaureate research position. I'm interested because it sounds like I'd learn a lot. I mean, I learn a lot in my current job but, when it comes down to it, husbandry is sort of husbandry. There are minor variations between, say, changing out a rabbit cage and cleaning dog runs, but the basic idea is the same.

I'm really just worried about being able to survive in this area on $23,000. I can't live at home with my parents and don't have a spouse or anything. My student loans have come due, though, and what with that and all the normal bills (rent, car insurance, etc), I'm worried about not breaking even. That's basically the only thing holding me back.

 

[pressmom]

I would pull all your bills for the last 6 months, all your credit/debit card statements, and really go over them with a fine-toothed comb. Ask yourself the hard questions about what you can give up that you're doing now (eg, that unlimited texting plan, eating out, new clothes, keeping the heat up high or the AC down low, cable) Once you decide what you can't live without, make a strict budget factoring in necessary bills first--student loans, electricity, water, gas, car insurance, rent etc. Then add in from the most important extras to the least important. Make sure you give yourself some fudge room and see if you can do it.

At the beginning of the month carry your check register around with the starting balance of all the necessary expenses listed above subtracted from the balance of your paycheck. Then record every extra expense. It will make you think before you spend and keep and accurate running total of how much you've spent.

 

[VAgirl]

I would pull all your bills for the last 6 months, all your credit/debit card statements, and really go over them with a fine-toothed comb. Ask yourself the hard questions about what you can give up that you're doing now (eg, that unlimited texting plan, eating out, new clothes, keeping the heat up high or the AC down low, cable) Once you decide what you can't live without, make a strict budget factoring in necessary bills first--student loans, electricity, water, gas, car insurance, rent etc. Then add in from the most important extras to the least important. Make sure you give yourself some fudge room and see if you can do it.

At the beginning of the month carry your check register around with the starting balance of all the necessary expenses listed above subtracted from the balance of your paycheck. Then record every extra expense. It will make you think before you spend and keep and accurate running total of how much you've spent.

Excellent advice! 👍

FWIW, I think you should try to make the internship happen. I think it sounds like an amazing opportunity.

 

[tastrophe]

What exactly is this internship? That's really something to consider too, since "really technical lab work" could be anything from stereotaxic surgery to running HPLCs all day. I'm in favor of sacrificing $ for experience, but make absolutely sure you're getting the experience you want/need! Keep in mind too that what you're told you'll be doing could change between now and when you start (or even after you start), so read some previously published papers and get a feel for what the lab as a whole is doing, rather than just what you expect to be doing, again making sure it's something that can help you.

And, ditto on electrophile's comment - unless you're going into a lab where everyone in the lab's name gets put on every paper, I wouldn't count on getting published. Realistically, I don't see how someone can get trained, start and finish a project, write it up for publication, submit it, and then do whatever followup experiments the journal requires, all in a year. It does happen, but it's not the norm by any means.

good luck with your decision, and keep us posted!

 

[Electrophile]

Honestly, I think you could probably get a job (not an "internship") as a research lab tech for a year for more than 23K and get a little more money, possible benefits from being a full time employee from the university or whatever, probably comprobable experience, and possibly get published either by going to a conference or a written paper. Btw, when you do work on animals, it takes much much longer to get an experiment done from start to finish than it does if you something with cell culture or something similar, so like I said, don't absolutely count on a publication. Plus those darn animals don't always do what they want you to do! 😀

I somewhat dislike when there are "programs" out there that are really nothing more than a source of cheap labor for either a company or a university. There are so few good NIH grants out there any more, so researchers do what they can to cut costs and this is definitely one of them. Both my brother (who was a finance major) and my husband (a marketing major) noticed the same kind of thing in the business world with folks who get internships during or after college and you don't get to do anything but make copies, file, and get coffee for people, but lo and behold, you get to call it an internship for your resume. But...if it's the only thing available, it may not be so bad. Maybe ask an adcom what their opinion is?

 

[VAgirl]

I somewhat dislike when there are "programs" out there that are really nothing more than a source of cheap labor for either a company or a university. There are so few good NIH grants out there any more, so researchers do what they can to cut costs and this is definitely one of them.

Since she's given us so few details about this, there is no way you could possibly know definitely that this is one of them. You raise a valid point that she might be able to find a similar opportunity for more pay as a job, but please don't knock what might be a very unique and exciting opportunity for her. You don't know enough to judge yet.

 

[Moonpaw]

Since she's given us so few details about this, there is no way you could possibly know definitely that this is one of them. You raise a valid point that she might be able to find a similar opportunity for more pay as a job, but please don't knock what might be a very unique and exciting opportunity for her. You don't know enough to judge yet.

I think Electrophile was saying that calling manual labor an 'internship program' for low pay is definitely one of the ways to cut costs, and not that pandacinny's internship is definitely one of those internships.

 

[VAgirl]

I think Electrophile was saying that calling manual labor an 'internship program' for low pay is definitely one of the ways to cut costs, and not that pandacinny's internship is definitely one of those internships.

That's a very good point, I hadn't read it with that slant. If that was the intended meaning, my apologies. 🙂

 

[BrumleyVet]

Make sure you enjoy what your doing and the rest will fall into place.

Up your deductables, take a part-time job (work a couple of days off per month). If this is truly what you want to do, you'll find the steps get easier to take.

 

[Pandacinny]

I couldn't give a whole lot more details earlier as I made my comment just as I was walking out the door for work. This is actually an NIH IRTA position and I think it pays slightly more than I posted above, but not a whole lot. Information on the program is here: http://www.training.nih.gov/student/Pre-IRTA/previewpostbac.asp

I definitely hear you on the "Hey, go get me coffee and file a few things, intern!" nature of a lot of positions, Electrophile. I'm hoping this wouldn't turn out that way, but I guess it's hard to tell.

I'm also not in it for the whole possibly being published aspect of it. I mean, it's exciting to be published, don't get me wrong. I wouldn't turn that down at all, but I'm looking into this much more for the experience of being in and around a research lab. Research is something I have interest in, but only a little bit of experience. I'm hoping that if I take this position, it'll help me decide if research is for me.


The PI who I could be working with is doing a lot of really compelling stuff. I've spoken to two people in his lab and they say that he's very supportive and tries really hard to make sure his IRTA people learn a lot during the year they're in the program. I'm just trying to figure out if I can swing it, financially.

 

[OSJ]

When does the job start and when are you applying? I know most schools will take update experience but not all. You might consider how long you will work there before applying, if you start working in September it may be hard to get a good letter of recommendation for October and it may hard to really talk about your new job in your personal statement etc. If you do get interviews you can always talk about it then, but I think the job would be most valuable if you are starting soon or applying next cycle (as in class of 2014.)

 

[Electrophile]

That's a very good point, I hadn't read it with that slant. If that was the intended meaning, my apologies. 🙂

Yeah, that's what I meant! No worries! 🙂 Some internships are fantastic! My husband ended up with a pretty good one and it helped him get his first job. I had a good honors research experience in undergrad that helped me get into grad school. But it does seem that you kind of need to look through stuff and make sure you'll actually get what is promised as I knew some people in undergrad who got summer internships where it was pretty much cheap labor. I'd suspect if it's sponsored by the NIH, it's probably on the up and up. And even if you don't end up in a journal, you may still be able to go to a national conference or something, which is still a definite booster!