Please help me with ranking programs.

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Dr. Anonymouss

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Hello, current 4th year in the match process right now and am struggling with solidifying my rank list. My top 4 programs based on interviews and what I have learned about the programs are: UAB, Wake, MUSC, and Cincinnati. I am curious on how you would rank these programs if you were in my situation. Any information based on perception, word of mouth, and pros/cons would all be appreciated!

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Where would you like to live for the next 4 years? That is the most important decision.

Those are vastly different parts of the country with regards to climate, culture, food, beaches, airport proximity, etc.

You’ll be fine at any of them for your career goals, whatever they are.
 
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Where do you want to live after you're done? Pick the one that's closest to that area
 
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I'm going to parrot what the others have said. Move to a place where you either want to live when you're done, or where you and/or your significant other already have a good life family connections, etc.

When I've read people's CVs that have interviewed with my old group, the last thing I cared about was where they trained and more "Are they going to harm someone? Are they going to be easy to work with?"
 
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I loved Wake Forest. Great training. Great place to live. UAB is phenomenal. I think Charleston is a great city—we did our Carolina anesthesia conference every other year there. Any one of those programs would prepare you for a solid career.
 
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UAB #1 by far. Outstanding program, great training, literally the best moonlighting in the country.
 
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Those are vastly different parts of the country with regards to climate, culture, food, beaches, airport proximity, etc.
I like to pick the one with the biggest airport hub.
 
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Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Based on all that info I will likely rank in this order: UAB, Wake, MUSC, Cincy.
 
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All are great. Each has their advantages. When you have great programs like that and are undecided, location has to be a huge factor. Charleston is the coolest city of all of those. I think Wake and UAB are the better programs but the worse of the cities, though both Birmingham and Winston Salem have great things to offer, likely to include a lower cost of living. Cincy is cool but would probably end up fourth on that list for me.
Strictly in reputation, I think Wake has the rest beat with UAB a close second. A couple years out from training, no one will care. If you wish to be academic, Wake may have some connections the others may not have.
 
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The farther out I am from residency the more I realize how many good programs there are out there, despite what all the ivory tower dickerds like to think. Can't go wrong with any of those.
 
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Which one has the shortest work hours? Pick that one. All of them are solid programs.
 
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UAB #1 by far. Outstanding program, great training, literally the best moonlighting in the country.
Can you expand on best moonlighting in the country? We have several residents pulling 180-220k pretax since ca1 year here so just curious
 
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Can you expand on best moonlighting in the country? We have several residents pulling 180-220k pretax since ca1 year here so just curious

That’s insane. How’s that even possible? UABs moonlighting is 100 an hour after 3pm. But that’s still an extra 400 hours you’ll have to work in a year on top of your normal work week in order to get to 100k salary.
 
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That’s insane. How’s that even possible? UABs moonlighting is 100 an hour after 3pm. But that’s still an extra 400 hours you’ll have to work in a year on top of your normal work week in order to get to 100k salary.
Are people actually out by 3pm??

Our base is high + we are also at $100/hour but we routinely can stay til 10pm almost every night. And can work precall (7-4pm). That plus weekend opportunities in OB/icu/ep/trauma which can be 24h.

Most of us crack 100k without even intending to moonlight just by getting stuck late. We are hcol though
 
Are people actually out by 3pm??

Our base is high + we are also at $100/hour but we routinely can stay til 10pm almost every night. And can work precall (7-4pm). That plus weekend opportunities in OB/icu/ep/trauma which can be 24h.

Most of us crack 100k without even intending to moonlight just by getting stuck late. We are hcol though

I was out by 3 pm 99% of the time I wanted to. There were between 3-5 times I was stuck past 3 on days I didn’t want to moonlight; I was never stuck past 3:30 on those days. You could easily stay until at 7-8 pm every night if you wanted to, and usually a handful of people could make it to about 10. About every other night at least one person would make it past midnight, which means you don’t have to come back in later that morning (I think after my graduation they actually changed it to 11 pm is the time you don’t have to come back the next day if you stay that late). There were a lot of good ICU moonlighting options, not sure if those have changed but I had a few weekends I made $4000k extra in one weekend in the ICU. A few of us even hit the century club (100 hours moonlighting in a month = $10k extra on top of base).

And $100/hr in Birmingham is like $275/hr in NYC/LA/SF/etc.
 
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UCSF PGY-1s start at 88k but it’s VHCOL and everybody at UCSF works hard.



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I was out by 3 pm 99% of the time I wanted to. There were between 3-5 times I was stuck past 3 on days I didn’t want to moonlight; I was never stuck past 3:30 on those days. You could easily stay until at 7-8 pm every night if you wanted to, and usually a handful of people could make it to about 10. About every other night at least one person would make it past midnight, which means you don’t have to come back in later that morning (I think after my graduation they actually changed it to 11 pm is the time you don’t have to come back the next day if you stay that late). There were a lot of good ICU moonlighting options, not sure if those have changed but I had a few weekends I made $4000k extra in one weekend in the ICU. A few of us even hit the century club (100 hours moonlighting in a month = $10k extra on top of base).

And $100/hr in Birmingham is like $275/hr in NYC/LA/SF/etc.
Now that’s insane haha. I can count on one finger the amount of times I’ve been out before 4 this year
 
I was out by 3 pm 99% of the time I wanted to. There were between 3-5 times I was stuck past 3 on days I didn’t want to moonlight; I was never stuck past 3:30 on those days. You could easily stay until at 7-8 pm every night if you wanted to, and usually a handful of people could make it to about 10. About every other night at least one person would make it past midnight, which means you don’t have to come back in later that morning (I think after my graduation they actually changed it to 11 pm is the time you don’t have to come back the next day if you stay that late). There were a lot of good ICU moonlighting options, not sure if those have changed but I had a few weekends I made $4000k extra in one weekend in the ICU. A few of us even hit the century club (100 hours moonlighting in a month = $10k extra on top of base).

And $100/hr in Birmingham is like $275/hr in NYC/LA/SF/etc.
I hope no one from ACGME RRC sees this. No way your residents can pull 100 hours of moonlighting and stay under 80hr/week and one day off/week. Might want to move this to private. Don't kill the golden goose.
 
I hope no one from ACGME RRC sees this. No way your residents can pull 100 hours of moonlighting and stay under 80hr/week and one day off/week. Might want to move this to private. Don't kill the golden goose.
?math

If they get out by 3pm and can stay til 8 every day that’s 5 hours per day…20 days of this is 100 hours a month. And 7am-8pm 5 days a week is only 65 hours a week

that’s cushy af lol what is there to cause problems about?
 
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I hope no one from ACGME RRC sees this. No way your residents can pull 100 hours of moonlighting and stay under 80hr/week and one day off/week. Might want to move this to private. Don't kill the golden goose.

You clearly didn’t read my post. If you stay until or after midnight (which I think has now been changed to 11 pm), you don’t come in the next day, unless you moonlight again which would not start until 3 pm. So you theoretically could come in to work Monday morning, moonlight until 2 a.m., be off until 3 pm Tuesday afternoon, moonlight until midnight, off until Wednesday afternoon, etc. The best week I ever had was one where I worked 50 hours and 42 of them were moonlighting.
 
You are right. My bad. That does sound like a great place to work.
 
You clearly didn’t read my post. If you stay until or after midnight (which I think has now been changed to 11 pm), you don’t come in the next day, unless you moonlight again which would not start until 3 pm. So you theoretically could come in to work Monday morning, moonlight until 2 a.m., be off until 3 pm Tuesday afternoon, moonlight until midnight, off until Wednesday afternoon, etc. The best week I ever had was one where I worked 50 hours and 42 of them were moonlighting.
Does this **** over the other residents/staff during the day shift? Or is it discouraged by the department? I obviously get those night shifts need to be covered by someone, but sounds like you found the loophole lol
 
Does this **** over the other residents/staff during the day shift? Or is it discouraged by the department? I obviously get those night shifts need to be covered by someone, but sounds like you found the loophole lol

No, it generally does not. Even through the midst of COVID/post-COVID CRNA pay being preposterous, there was always still plenty of spare CRNAs who were scheduled for nothing but breaks that served as a replacement pool to fill a room. Some of the trauma anesthesia attendings would push back and try to send people home right before midnight but, as long as we weren’t abusing it, we would occasionally overrule them.
 
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