There are a bunch of programs in the South: UVA, VCU, EVMS, Georgetown, Carolinas, UNC, ECU, Kentucky, Louisville, Emory, UAB, LSU, and Arkansas. On here, they rarely get mentioned in the same breath as the Midwest and Northeast programs, though, despite affiliation with some very good medical schools. What kind of national reputations do these programs have? Any top 10 or top 15 in the lot? It'd be nice to get some opinions and info on the region's programs all in one place.
PM&R in the South
- Thread starter DrJMD
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IMO-VCU, UVA and Emory (as well as some of the others mentioned) are very good academic programs. Some of the ones you mentioned are more community programs which have certain perks as well. For instance, EVMS is more community based but is very strong in pediatric rehab. It all depends on what you want to do... If you want to do general PM&R it doesn't matter as much. If you want to do a fellowship it is helpful to go to a program that has that fellowship.
It definitely depends on what you want to do. There are people who will find ECU to be a better fit than Baylor/UTH, but I imagine the residents coming from Baylor/UTH will have an easier time landing big name fellowships based on the reputation of their program.
If we broke it down to top 10/15, very strong/great rep, above average and average, where would these Southern programs fit in? Any residents or students from these programs, plug away.
If we broke it down to top 10/15, very strong/great rep, above average and average, where would these Southern programs fit in? Any residents or students from these programs, plug away.
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I was really impressed by VCU and UNC. If I were going to do just outpatient I'd have been very impressed by UVA as well. I hear great things about Carolinas, as well as ECU, but I didn't interview at either. Haven't heard too many great things about EVMS--ended up canceling my interview there to interview at Mayo. I definitely hear good things about Emory.
I have no idea if any of those are in the top 10/15 (everyone's top 10/15 differ by quite a bit--a lot of people don't even agree on the top 5). But the programs I listed above are probably all average or above average, except for EVMS. And I've heard Emory mentioned in people's top 10-15 programs before.
Of all the programs, I'd say VCU residents probably have the easiest time getting fellowships--because they offer just about every fellowship you could want 🙂 But otherwise Emory probably has the strongest reputation of the Southern programs, unless you're counting Baylor as well. Then Baylor wins.
But, I really think the more important things is the contacts you make, the fellowship you're going into, and how well-liked and well-trained you are. Names/reputations generally only get you through the door--once you get there you have to prove yourself. (Of course, programs with names/reputations generally have them because most of their graduates have proved themselves).
I have no idea if any of those are in the top 10/15 (everyone's top 10/15 differ by quite a bit--a lot of people don't even agree on the top 5). But the programs I listed above are probably all average or above average, except for EVMS. And I've heard Emory mentioned in people's top 10-15 programs before.
Of all the programs, I'd say VCU residents probably have the easiest time getting fellowships--because they offer just about every fellowship you could want 🙂 But otherwise Emory probably has the strongest reputation of the Southern programs, unless you're counting Baylor as well. Then Baylor wins.
But, I really think the more important things is the contacts you make, the fellowship you're going into, and how well-liked and well-trained you are. Names/reputations generally only get you through the door--once you get there you have to prove yourself. (Of course, programs with names/reputations generally have them because most of their graduates have proved themselves).
Texas is Texas, just like the Florida peninsula is Florida. No one really counts them as the South.
Bias aside, I agree that Emory has the best rep in the South. Shepherd is amazing. I haven't heard much about UNC, but from what I gather Carolinas is the larger, more established program in NC. I don't know anything about UVA or EVMS, but VCU tends to have a pretty good reputation. From my experiences and word of mouth, I'd probably have them ranked:
1. Emory: top 10, great rep
2. Carolinas: top 15-20, great rep
3. VCU: above average, fellowship haven
4. Georgetown/NRH: above average
5. UAB: above average
This is based off my experiences, having heard little to nothing about UVA, EVMS, UNC,Kentucky, and Louisville.
Bias aside, I agree that Emory has the best rep in the South. Shepherd is amazing. I haven't heard much about UNC, but from what I gather Carolinas is the larger, more established program in NC. I don't know anything about UVA or EVMS, but VCU tends to have a pretty good reputation. From my experiences and word of mouth, I'd probably have them ranked:
1. Emory: top 10, great rep
2. Carolinas: top 15-20, great rep
3. VCU: above average, fellowship haven
4. Georgetown/NRH: above average
5. UAB: above average
This is based off my experiences, having heard little to nothing about UVA, EVMS, UNC,Kentucky, and Louisville.
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At this years AAPM&R meeting, reps from the Vandy program said that they would begin their categorical program in 2014.
wow. sounds like every program out there is great.
these types of threads are really only useful if people have some concrete NEGATIVE things to say. otherwise, its just sunshine and lollipops. they cant all be great programs (and i know for a fact that they are not).
ill start: as of about 4 years ago, the NRH/georgetown program was mediocre at best, and had a hard time retaining residents.
these types of threads are really only useful if people have some concrete NEGATIVE things to say. otherwise, its just sunshine and lollipops. they cant all be great programs (and i know for a fact that they are not).
ill start: as of about 4 years ago, the NRH/georgetown program was mediocre at best, and had a hard time retaining residents.
Carolinas: 5/year, advanced. Huge healthcare system and a huge independent academic institution. Multiple rehab hospitals and therapy offices (190+ beds, I believe) and building 2 new rehab hospitals. Plenty of money and looking to grow even more. Model TBI, well balanced. In house call first month only. 3 months electives. Not many spine procedures. TBI fellowship.
ECU: 5/year, categorical with built in transitional year that includes ortho, neurosurg, and 2m electives. Vidant Medical Center is enormous. Rehab has 75 beds. Very balanced, plenty of procedures. 3 months electives, no in house call. Not much to do in Greenville, which is the big downside to the program. Residents seemed very happy with the staff and coordinators, but I found them to be a bit unorganized. No fellowships.
Emory: 6/year, advanced. Not much else has to be said aside from Shepherd. Elite rehab hospital--150+ beds. Incredible SC and TBI rehab, great for msk. Very balanced program, plenty of interventional experience. 1 month elective. Some in house call. One miserable attending. Hospitals are spread out, and Atlanta traffic is outrageous. Peds, sports, and pain fellowships.
LSU: Categorical with built in transitional year (cush). Great hours. Stronger in msk. Plenty of interventional and pain procedures. New VA in the works. No electives due to extra pain rotations. Weak in peds (no pediatric physiatrist in the city, I believe). Plenty EMG experience, but a few months spent at hospital ~1 hr outside the city. No in-house call. ACGME Pain fellowship very PM&R friendly (took 2 from last years class, I believe).
UAB: 4/year, advanced. Well balanced in msk and inpatient, plenty of interventional experience, amazing hospital system, Spain Rehab--47 beds. Birmingham is great for singles and families, traffic isn't bad. In house call. Pain med fellowship, used to have an association with Dr. Andrews (not sure if he still takes on fellows) but no longer have sports fellowship.
ECU: 5/year, categorical with built in transitional year that includes ortho, neurosurg, and 2m electives. Vidant Medical Center is enormous. Rehab has 75 beds. Very balanced, plenty of procedures. 3 months electives, no in house call. Not much to do in Greenville, which is the big downside to the program. Residents seemed very happy with the staff and coordinators, but I found them to be a bit unorganized. No fellowships.
Emory: 6/year, advanced. Not much else has to be said aside from Shepherd. Elite rehab hospital--150+ beds. Incredible SC and TBI rehab, great for msk. Very balanced program, plenty of interventional experience. 1 month elective. Some in house call. One miserable attending. Hospitals are spread out, and Atlanta traffic is outrageous. Peds, sports, and pain fellowships.
LSU: Categorical with built in transitional year (cush). Great hours. Stronger in msk. Plenty of interventional and pain procedures. New VA in the works. No electives due to extra pain rotations. Weak in peds (no pediatric physiatrist in the city, I believe). Plenty EMG experience, but a few months spent at hospital ~1 hr outside the city. No in-house call. ACGME Pain fellowship very PM&R friendly (took 2 from last years class, I believe).
UAB: 4/year, advanced. Well balanced in msk and inpatient, plenty of interventional experience, amazing hospital system, Spain Rehab--47 beds. Birmingham is great for singles and families, traffic isn't bad. In house call. Pain med fellowship, used to have an association with Dr. Andrews (not sure if he still takes on fellows) but no longer have sports fellowship.
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It was more about reputation, but it would be great to get more reviews so people don't have to search several threads to find info on regional programs.
Any particular reason Georgetown was average and had problems holding on to residents? People seemed to be impressed with the program over the past couple years.
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I agree about NRH/Georgetown--I hadn't heard great things about them or their reputation. Programs do chance, but I wasn't interested enough in the program to really see if things were different now.
Anyway, here's my short bits on the three programs you asked about.
1) VCU. Extremely well rounded (probably the best of any Southern program, other than perhaps Emory and Baylor, which I don't know much about). Very strong VA--in fact Richmond is one of the "flagship" VA's in the country, being one of five VA's with an inpatient polytrauma unit and one of nine classified as a regional amputee center. Also the largest SCI unit in the VA I believe (and maybe the country). The VA itself isn't that nice looking. Not ugly, but certainly not as nice as some of the others. I thought the faculty were fantastic, especially Dr. Cifu--you could tell he's a guy that would go to bat for you. VCU has tons of opportunities as far as fellowships. Personally, while I loved Virginia, I just didn't "feel" like I belonged there, and I didn't mesh as well with the residents as I was hoping to. Still, it would have been in my top 5 or 6 if my wife hadn't "vetoed" the Southerns, to some degree. (But she did strongly prefer the South to Philadelphia/NY).
2) UNC. A very pleasant program. Small--only three residents per year. All three are categorical, and you have a very well-rounded prelim year. The attendings were some of my favorite (and so were the residents) of the places I interviewed. Everyone was happy and caring. A bit more laid back (it's the South!), which I liked. But the attendings all come from impressive residency programs. Definitely a program where it felt like a good fit for me. Brand new Spine Center and they're building a new outpt MSK center as well (renovating an old Borders store). Most beautiful rehab floor of any program I interviewed at. Wonderful city. Downsides to me were lack of a VA, relatively young program, and my wife and I just didn't feel like the South was the place for us.
3) UVA: Categorical/advanced. Love Charlottesville--right next to Shenandoah National Park. Overall a very strong outpatient program, but I really felt like the program is lacking in inpatient training. Minimal SCI/TBI exposure, and the rehab hospital (run by HealthSouth) is only BLS-certified. For someone strongly considering inpatient rehab, I just couldn't limit myself to this program, despite all the great things you hear about it. But I think without a doubt VCU is the strongest Virginia program. Unless you're dead set on sports, then maybe UVA, but for anything inpt, pain, msk, I think VCU wins.
Keep in mind--these are the opinions of just one person. What I look for in a program may be very different than others. Hopefully others can chime in on their opinions. And keep in mind, a program some people say bad things about might just be the perfect place for you, so it's still worth considering applying there. (Granted, if all you hear is bad stuff, and you have enough interviews, you might as well save yourself the time and money...)
Anyway, here's my short bits on the three programs you asked about.
1) VCU. Extremely well rounded (probably the best of any Southern program, other than perhaps Emory and Baylor, which I don't know much about). Very strong VA--in fact Richmond is one of the "flagship" VA's in the country, being one of five VA's with an inpatient polytrauma unit and one of nine classified as a regional amputee center. Also the largest SCI unit in the VA I believe (and maybe the country). The VA itself isn't that nice looking. Not ugly, but certainly not as nice as some of the others. I thought the faculty were fantastic, especially Dr. Cifu--you could tell he's a guy that would go to bat for you. VCU has tons of opportunities as far as fellowships. Personally, while I loved Virginia, I just didn't "feel" like I belonged there, and I didn't mesh as well with the residents as I was hoping to. Still, it would have been in my top 5 or 6 if my wife hadn't "vetoed" the Southerns, to some degree. (But she did strongly prefer the South to Philadelphia/NY).
2) UNC. A very pleasant program. Small--only three residents per year. All three are categorical, and you have a very well-rounded prelim year. The attendings were some of my favorite (and so were the residents) of the places I interviewed. Everyone was happy and caring. A bit more laid back (it's the South!), which I liked. But the attendings all come from impressive residency programs. Definitely a program where it felt like a good fit for me. Brand new Spine Center and they're building a new outpt MSK center as well (renovating an old Borders store). Most beautiful rehab floor of any program I interviewed at. Wonderful city. Downsides to me were lack of a VA, relatively young program, and my wife and I just didn't feel like the South was the place for us.
3) UVA: Categorical/advanced. Love Charlottesville--right next to Shenandoah National Park. Overall a very strong outpatient program, but I really felt like the program is lacking in inpatient training. Minimal SCI/TBI exposure, and the rehab hospital (run by HealthSouth) is only BLS-certified. For someone strongly considering inpatient rehab, I just couldn't limit myself to this program, despite all the great things you hear about it. But I think without a doubt VCU is the strongest Virginia program. Unless you're dead set on sports, then maybe UVA, but for anything inpt, pain, msk, I think VCU wins.
Keep in mind--these are the opinions of just one person. What I look for in a program may be very different than others. Hopefully others can chime in on their opinions. And keep in mind, a program some people say bad things about might just be the perfect place for you, so it's still worth considering applying there. (Granted, if all you hear is bad stuff, and you have enough interviews, you might as well save yourself the time and money...)
Of course, all these are opinions. Baylor/UTH is elite according to everyone, but I preferred nearly every other Southern program I interviewed at. To each his own.
Anyone else with info, please keep it coming.
Anyone else with info, please keep it coming.
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Here are some reviews from some of the other recent threads on the Southern programs:
Arkansas
This might come as a surprise to some people. It certainly did to me. Wonderful PD, awesome facilities, and REALLY friendly and obviously happy residents. The strengths of the program are more inpatient as of now, but they're hiring MSK/Sports faculty right now so that is likely to change in the next year or so. Rotations vary by year, but you get approximately 18 mos inpatient at Arkansas Children's Hospital, Univ Arkansas Medical Center, and Baptist Rehabilitation Institute. While you're on inpatient rotations, you sometimes cover in clinic if inpatient is slow. While on outpatient, you will sometimes see consults as needed. Outpatient rotations involved stroke, SCI, pain, cerebral palsy, spina bifida, and also wheelchair and brace clinic. They also have an EMG rotation and then another at the VA, which is great. The downside is that the rotations are 3 months at a time (I prefer 2 month blocks), the pay is a little less than other programs, and there are currently no electives in the PGY-4 year. But honestly, the cost of living is cheap, some people prefer longer rotation blocks, and you're getting plenty of exposure in clinics and inpatient that you may not even want electives. I just got a great vibe from the program and it's not too far from where I was raised. That's why it's so high.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
Carolinas
Charlotte was gorgeous, young, vibrant and just an all-around great place to live. If rankings were based just on location, this program would have been way higher for me. This is a program I wanted to love, unfortunately, I just didn't have a good gut feeling about. Other applicants I met on the trail said they loved it. The hospital system itself is beautiful and the program honestly offers very strong inpatient and outpatient training opportunities. I think I was most turned off by the emphasis on the business of medicine - this would probably be a great thing for other applicants. The residents seemed to love Charlotte but I had a harder time feeling out if they loved the program. Call schedule seemed more intense than any other place I looked (but still, it's PM&R so compared to other specialties not intense at all). I wanted to rank this program more highly as in theory/on paper it was a perfect fit for me.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13762838&postcount=83
ECU
Haven't really seen a lot about this program but it's a hidden gem! It is a categorical program with an easy built-in TY with ortho, neurosurgery, etc so you will know all the attendings when you start PGY2. Lots of outpatient emphasis. No pain fellowship but there are a few in Raleigh/Durham an hour away. Lots of perks: pay for USMLE 3, $100/month food stipend at the 3 cafeterias, free car/gas to borrow to drive to EMG facility 40 minutes away, low cost of living, Raleigh 90 minutes away. Everyone was really nice and seemed happy.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13742363&postcount=76
Greenville, NC (town of ~78k, school has ~28k). 5 ppl/class (i think). CATEGORICAL. I really liked the southern feel (plus only 1-1.5 hrs from beach and outer banks). Even though it's a small town, the hospital services a large portion of the state, so it's quite large (something like 1000 beds) and gets a diverse population of patients. Broad pgy1 curriculum that gives good exposure into fields that relate to Pm&r. Pgy2 is inpatient heavy and from multiple sources I think a busy year (competitively to other pgy2 years). The residents I met ( all upperclassmen) seemed very happy and really got along with one another. The day I arrived and had dinner with the residents, they had been over at an attendings watching football. The cost of living in Greenville was cheap and a lot of the residents had purchased houses. Most clinics were in the area and the site that was far away, the program gave you a car and gas to commute to. Home call.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13868678&postcount=90
Emory
One of my favorite in terms of its curriculum. great exposure to all aspect of PM&R and having just about all of the ACGME approved PM&R fellowships will help since they do take quite a few of their own. The residents get along well there; they hang out with each other and are passionate about their program. Emory is not often talked about on this forum, but I feel it is definitely worthy of being mentioned as one of the top programs. Emory with its affiliation with Shepherd Center has the Atlanta market covered, so there is no competition from other places/programs. The next closest are UAB and Charlotte. One down side similar to Texas programs above, is the driving and traffic.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13704601&postcount=15
Very well rounded and complete program with strong didactics. A little inpatient heavy in the first two years. PGY 4 is all outpatient with no call or weekends. Once again, friendly, low key residents. They have some unique rotations, such as critical care physiatry. Atlanta traffic is terrible as some previous posts on this program indicate. But not as bad as LA. I heard through the grapevine that an attending here is outright malignant and brutal to the residents. However, based on my experience, I think this would be a great place to train. Seems to be the best program in the SE. Possible malignant attending raises some questions.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13652339&postcount=1
New CRM building hopefully by 2014. Shepherd Center is amazing.
PGY2 -- 2 mos each of: CRM stroke, CRM ABI, Shepherd ABI, Shepherd SCI, general and ortho, outpatient
PGY3 -- 2 mos each of: critical care/consults, emg, peds, shepherd sci, va msk/emg, cardiac rehab, p&o, outpt clinic
PGY4 -- 2 mos of each: senior elective, sports med, interventional spine, va msk/emg, pain/emg, VA ortho/rheum/interventional spine
plenty of opportunities to independently perform EMGs and interventional spine procedures
didatics are on 18-month schedule, Tues 7-8am, Thurs 7-10am
call: Shepherd center (home), CRM (in-house, post-call day off) -- PGY2: Shepherd 5-6/month, CRM 4-5/month; PGY3: Shepherd 5-6/month, CRM 3-4/month; PGY4: no call
moonlighting allowed but have to cover own insurance?
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13661973&postcount=6
EVMS
This program is "just ok". Nothing special. Still not clear on how many they're letting in per year. The residents were happy for the most part, but were honest about the shortcomings. The attendings I met seemed very nice and knowledgable, and the hospital is a nice size teaching hospital. I didn't want to take a chance and not rank the program, because obviously I need a job, but if I'd interviewed at a couple more programs, it probably wouldn't have made the list.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
A bit disorganized. Every year they take a different amount of residents. They have a pain fellowship and take residents each year for the 1 position. Lots of outpatient exposure. No weekends unless you are on call (which is rarely). There are a lot of tunnels in Norfolk so some of the hospitals can take awhile to get to. Small program so board pass rate is easily changed if someone fails. Pass rate is 70%. Seems like a lot of staff turnover but there is a new PD (interventional pain and sports PMR) starting this month so maybe things will get even better.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13742363&postcount=76
Kentucky
Another super nice group of residents, faculty, and staff. They have a very nice rehab center, and go to the main hospital/VA for EMG's. The PD in particular struck as a great guy, and everyone there seemed very happy.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13742787&postcount=35
Louisville
Recently expanded Fraizer Rehab Institute (Lots of room to grow), great faculty, friendly residents, good cost of living, and also the opportunity to work with U of L athletics sold this program for me. It's only 2 residents per year currently, but I know that the program director plans to expand it to 4-5 in the next 2 years or so (they definitely have the room for it). It doesn't differ from the top 2 programs I've mentioned. Home call when at Frazier. Very laid back. Good board pass rates.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
LSU
CATEGORICAL. Great pain/procedure exposure. Do 2 months of pain as pgy1. PD really pushes to make pgy1 year as Pm&r heavy as possible. Residents all happy and seemed to work great hours. Board pass rate not as good as most above.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13868678&postcount=90
A hidden gem in PM&R. The staff is very dedicated to teaching and very laid back. These are probably the happiest residents I came across. The categorical program incorporates the prelim year into PGY1 and PGY2, so you get PM&R exposure right off the bat. They also eliminated medicine wards as a requirement, and they tailor the prelim requirements to the resident's liking. There is no in house call for 4 years. They get tons of exposure and procedure numbers are through the roof. Medical students walk away from rotations with upward of 10-20 injections in a 4 week span. There is no elective time, though, because of the extra rotations spent in pain clinic. The program didn't seem to take a hit with the Louisiana budget cuts that are going into effect. They also have an ACGME accredited pain fellowship and are very kind to the PM&R residents. 2 of their PGY4's got positions this year. New Orleans is also a pretty amazing place to live. The weather can be miserably hot in the summer, but it has mild winters if the cold is not your cup of tea. The downside is a couple EMG rotations in a city 45-60 mins away, but everythig else is pretty close, and traffic is not bad. The VA hospital is still run down from Katrina, and they have one floor for PM&R, which isn't much to write home about. That said, the experience trumps the facilities. They are also building a state of the art VA that is set to open in 3-4 years, as well, which can't hurt when it comes to finding jobs.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13705564&postcount=17
NRH/Georgetown
This is another program that pleasantly surprised me. Really nice facilities and great PD. They are really building an excellent program here. Attendings are good teachers and residents really felt supported. Have gotten more into research recently and offer great resources in terms of conference stipends, etc. My sister lives in DC so I really like the location.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13706784&postcount=20
I was blown away by this program. PD (Dr. Whitehair) was amazing and really dedicated to innovation in teaching. Beautiful, clean free-standing rehab hospital with lots of natural light and a very cool gait lab. Coolest, happiest, and most down-to-earth residents I met on the entire interview trail. I could really picture myself fitting in here and it seemed to have a great mix of inpt/outpt/research experience. They also get to rotate through Walter Reed (amazing EMG experience). I almost cancelled my interview based on negative things from residents/attendings/past student doc postings but I am so glad that I didn't. Would very highly recommend this program to any future applicants!
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13762838&postcount=83
UAB
Really loved the program director (who's actually transitioning to program chair) and again the opportunity for outpatient exposure and procedures. Birmingham is cool, only two hours away from ATL if you wanna get away, and cost of living is hard to beat. Most residents do live in the suburbs because some rough areas of the city and folks with families want better school districts. 6 months of electives in pgy4 was a BIG plus, also there is an interventional spine fellowship (non-ACGME accredited) that has one reserved spot for someone from the program if they wish. No call pgy4 🙂
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
Solid overall program. Birmingham is a sneaky nice city. You just have to get over preconceived notions you have about Alabama. Strong didactics and happy, friendly residents. Also, everything is very centralized within the program, which requires very little driving between sites.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13652339&postcount=1
Again, B-ham is a very nice city. All of the residents seemed very happy here. The entire program is very tightly knit. Several attendings have parties at their houses. Family type atmosphere. The only reason why this program is so far down is because I do not think they are strong in the areas where I see my career going. Otherwise, this program would have been much higher on my list. I think anyone would be extremely happy here.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=982972
UNC
North Carolina is pretty nice place to live, and people there are easy going/laid back. Another small program ( 3 categorical positions each year) like Baylor Dallas. So it definitely has a nice feel. Good thing about categorical is that you don't have to look for a separate intern year, and you will get to know your colleagues from other specialties well, ie Ortho, Rads, Anesthesia, Neuro...etc so you can get some good networking experience. Home call, which is nice, but the only concern about these small programs is the amount of experience. UNC is still a relatively young program, so its still establishing itself in the UNC system I feel. but it is getting better i heard. They just moved their outpatient to a brand new/renovated location. EMG is share with neuro dept, and you get 6 months of it ,but primarily working with the PM&R attending though.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13704601&postcount=15
Young but wonderful faculty, happy residents, prettiest rehab floor I saw during my entire interview trail. Chapel Hill is a beautiful college town and more lively Durham is right around the corner. Program is small but residents get great training and especially strong outpt msk/spine (strongest of any program I looked at). They are opening a massive new outpatient rehab center by next year. Research opportunities abound and it is a top NIH funded PM&R program. Also has a great complementary medicine program that works very closely with PM&R.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13762838&postcount=83
UVA
Charlottesville is a great college town, lots of restaurants, plenty to do, especially if you're an outdoorsy type of person. Cost of living is great, and if smaller towns aren't your thing, DC is only 2 hours away. There is a categorical option which is great (the first year is pretty chill from what it seems-ortho, ER, neuro, GI, pm&r rotations. PM&R rotation is usually scheduled over Thanksgiving or Christmas so you get an extra week or so of vacay as a categorical which is sweet.) The chair Dr. Wilder was really nice as was the rest of the faculty. You get A LOT of sports exposure and opportunity to cover sporting events, etc. Like a lot of other programs, pgy-2 year is all inpatient and 5 months of electives are provided in your senior year. The downside I guess is that you do have call as a 4th year, but it's not as frequent as 2's/3's. That's the only major negative I can think of.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
VCU
6 positions = 4 categorical + 2 advanced
6 outpt, 6 inpt mos in PGY2; 6 mos total dedicated EMG; 1 of 5 VA polytrauma centers in country
Friday didatics from 7-10am, additional lectures on different days at different sites (inclu business and ultrasound)
call: home call, PGY2: every 6th night, PGY3: every 6 weeks, PGY4: every 10 weeks
another program that I was pleasantly surprised by -- very well-rounded, great mentorship, required sports coverage city of Richmond gets a bad rep, but I liked it.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13661973&postcount=6
Arkansas
This might come as a surprise to some people. It certainly did to me. Wonderful PD, awesome facilities, and REALLY friendly and obviously happy residents. The strengths of the program are more inpatient as of now, but they're hiring MSK/Sports faculty right now so that is likely to change in the next year or so. Rotations vary by year, but you get approximately 18 mos inpatient at Arkansas Children's Hospital, Univ Arkansas Medical Center, and Baptist Rehabilitation Institute. While you're on inpatient rotations, you sometimes cover in clinic if inpatient is slow. While on outpatient, you will sometimes see consults as needed. Outpatient rotations involved stroke, SCI, pain, cerebral palsy, spina bifida, and also wheelchair and brace clinic. They also have an EMG rotation and then another at the VA, which is great. The downside is that the rotations are 3 months at a time (I prefer 2 month blocks), the pay is a little less than other programs, and there are currently no electives in the PGY-4 year. But honestly, the cost of living is cheap, some people prefer longer rotation blocks, and you're getting plenty of exposure in clinics and inpatient that you may not even want electives. I just got a great vibe from the program and it's not too far from where I was raised. That's why it's so high.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
Carolinas
Charlotte was gorgeous, young, vibrant and just an all-around great place to live. If rankings were based just on location, this program would have been way higher for me. This is a program I wanted to love, unfortunately, I just didn't have a good gut feeling about. Other applicants I met on the trail said they loved it. The hospital system itself is beautiful and the program honestly offers very strong inpatient and outpatient training opportunities. I think I was most turned off by the emphasis on the business of medicine - this would probably be a great thing for other applicants. The residents seemed to love Charlotte but I had a harder time feeling out if they loved the program. Call schedule seemed more intense than any other place I looked (but still, it's PM&R so compared to other specialties not intense at all). I wanted to rank this program more highly as in theory/on paper it was a perfect fit for me.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13762838&postcount=83
ECU
Haven't really seen a lot about this program but it's a hidden gem! It is a categorical program with an easy built-in TY with ortho, neurosurgery, etc so you will know all the attendings when you start PGY2. Lots of outpatient emphasis. No pain fellowship but there are a few in Raleigh/Durham an hour away. Lots of perks: pay for USMLE 3, $100/month food stipend at the 3 cafeterias, free car/gas to borrow to drive to EMG facility 40 minutes away, low cost of living, Raleigh 90 minutes away. Everyone was really nice and seemed happy.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13742363&postcount=76
Greenville, NC (town of ~78k, school has ~28k). 5 ppl/class (i think). CATEGORICAL. I really liked the southern feel (plus only 1-1.5 hrs from beach and outer banks). Even though it's a small town, the hospital services a large portion of the state, so it's quite large (something like 1000 beds) and gets a diverse population of patients. Broad pgy1 curriculum that gives good exposure into fields that relate to Pm&r. Pgy2 is inpatient heavy and from multiple sources I think a busy year (competitively to other pgy2 years). The residents I met ( all upperclassmen) seemed very happy and really got along with one another. The day I arrived and had dinner with the residents, they had been over at an attendings watching football. The cost of living in Greenville was cheap and a lot of the residents had purchased houses. Most clinics were in the area and the site that was far away, the program gave you a car and gas to commute to. Home call.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13868678&postcount=90
Emory
One of my favorite in terms of its curriculum. great exposure to all aspect of PM&R and having just about all of the ACGME approved PM&R fellowships will help since they do take quite a few of their own. The residents get along well there; they hang out with each other and are passionate about their program. Emory is not often talked about on this forum, but I feel it is definitely worthy of being mentioned as one of the top programs. Emory with its affiliation with Shepherd Center has the Atlanta market covered, so there is no competition from other places/programs. The next closest are UAB and Charlotte. One down side similar to Texas programs above, is the driving and traffic.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13704601&postcount=15
Very well rounded and complete program with strong didactics. A little inpatient heavy in the first two years. PGY 4 is all outpatient with no call or weekends. Once again, friendly, low key residents. They have some unique rotations, such as critical care physiatry. Atlanta traffic is terrible as some previous posts on this program indicate. But not as bad as LA. I heard through the grapevine that an attending here is outright malignant and brutal to the residents. However, based on my experience, I think this would be a great place to train. Seems to be the best program in the SE. Possible malignant attending raises some questions.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13652339&postcount=1
New CRM building hopefully by 2014. Shepherd Center is amazing.
PGY2 -- 2 mos each of: CRM stroke, CRM ABI, Shepherd ABI, Shepherd SCI, general and ortho, outpatient
PGY3 -- 2 mos each of: critical care/consults, emg, peds, shepherd sci, va msk/emg, cardiac rehab, p&o, outpt clinic
PGY4 -- 2 mos of each: senior elective, sports med, interventional spine, va msk/emg, pain/emg, VA ortho/rheum/interventional spine
plenty of opportunities to independently perform EMGs and interventional spine procedures
didatics are on 18-month schedule, Tues 7-8am, Thurs 7-10am
call: Shepherd center (home), CRM (in-house, post-call day off) -- PGY2: Shepherd 5-6/month, CRM 4-5/month; PGY3: Shepherd 5-6/month, CRM 3-4/month; PGY4: no call
moonlighting allowed but have to cover own insurance?
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13661973&postcount=6
EVMS
This program is "just ok". Nothing special. Still not clear on how many they're letting in per year. The residents were happy for the most part, but were honest about the shortcomings. The attendings I met seemed very nice and knowledgable, and the hospital is a nice size teaching hospital. I didn't want to take a chance and not rank the program, because obviously I need a job, but if I'd interviewed at a couple more programs, it probably wouldn't have made the list.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
A bit disorganized. Every year they take a different amount of residents. They have a pain fellowship and take residents each year for the 1 position. Lots of outpatient exposure. No weekends unless you are on call (which is rarely). There are a lot of tunnels in Norfolk so some of the hospitals can take awhile to get to. Small program so board pass rate is easily changed if someone fails. Pass rate is 70%. Seems like a lot of staff turnover but there is a new PD (interventional pain and sports PMR) starting this month so maybe things will get even better.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13742363&postcount=76
Kentucky
Another super nice group of residents, faculty, and staff. They have a very nice rehab center, and go to the main hospital/VA for EMG's. The PD in particular struck as a great guy, and everyone there seemed very happy.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13742787&postcount=35
Louisville
Recently expanded Fraizer Rehab Institute (Lots of room to grow), great faculty, friendly residents, good cost of living, and also the opportunity to work with U of L athletics sold this program for me. It's only 2 residents per year currently, but I know that the program director plans to expand it to 4-5 in the next 2 years or so (they definitely have the room for it). It doesn't differ from the top 2 programs I've mentioned. Home call when at Frazier. Very laid back. Good board pass rates.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
LSU
CATEGORICAL. Great pain/procedure exposure. Do 2 months of pain as pgy1. PD really pushes to make pgy1 year as Pm&r heavy as possible. Residents all happy and seemed to work great hours. Board pass rate not as good as most above.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13868678&postcount=90
A hidden gem in PM&R. The staff is very dedicated to teaching and very laid back. These are probably the happiest residents I came across. The categorical program incorporates the prelim year into PGY1 and PGY2, so you get PM&R exposure right off the bat. They also eliminated medicine wards as a requirement, and they tailor the prelim requirements to the resident's liking. There is no in house call for 4 years. They get tons of exposure and procedure numbers are through the roof. Medical students walk away from rotations with upward of 10-20 injections in a 4 week span. There is no elective time, though, because of the extra rotations spent in pain clinic. The program didn't seem to take a hit with the Louisiana budget cuts that are going into effect. They also have an ACGME accredited pain fellowship and are very kind to the PM&R residents. 2 of their PGY4's got positions this year. New Orleans is also a pretty amazing place to live. The weather can be miserably hot in the summer, but it has mild winters if the cold is not your cup of tea. The downside is a couple EMG rotations in a city 45-60 mins away, but everythig else is pretty close, and traffic is not bad. The VA hospital is still run down from Katrina, and they have one floor for PM&R, which isn't much to write home about. That said, the experience trumps the facilities. They are also building a state of the art VA that is set to open in 3-4 years, as well, which can't hurt when it comes to finding jobs.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13705564&postcount=17
NRH/Georgetown
This is another program that pleasantly surprised me. Really nice facilities and great PD. They are really building an excellent program here. Attendings are good teachers and residents really felt supported. Have gotten more into research recently and offer great resources in terms of conference stipends, etc. My sister lives in DC so I really like the location.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13706784&postcount=20
I was blown away by this program. PD (Dr. Whitehair) was amazing and really dedicated to innovation in teaching. Beautiful, clean free-standing rehab hospital with lots of natural light and a very cool gait lab. Coolest, happiest, and most down-to-earth residents I met on the entire interview trail. I could really picture myself fitting in here and it seemed to have a great mix of inpt/outpt/research experience. They also get to rotate through Walter Reed (amazing EMG experience). I almost cancelled my interview based on negative things from residents/attendings/past student doc postings but I am so glad that I didn't. Would very highly recommend this program to any future applicants!
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13762838&postcount=83
UAB
Really loved the program director (who's actually transitioning to program chair) and again the opportunity for outpatient exposure and procedures. Birmingham is cool, only two hours away from ATL if you wanna get away, and cost of living is hard to beat. Most residents do live in the suburbs because some rough areas of the city and folks with families want better school districts. 6 months of electives in pgy4 was a BIG plus, also there is an interventional spine fellowship (non-ACGME accredited) that has one reserved spot for someone from the program if they wish. No call pgy4 🙂
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
Solid overall program. Birmingham is a sneaky nice city. You just have to get over preconceived notions you have about Alabama. Strong didactics and happy, friendly residents. Also, everything is very centralized within the program, which requires very little driving between sites.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13652339&postcount=1
Again, B-ham is a very nice city. All of the residents seemed very happy here. The entire program is very tightly knit. Several attendings have parties at their houses. Family type atmosphere. The only reason why this program is so far down is because I do not think they are strong in the areas where I see my career going. Otherwise, this program would have been much higher on my list. I think anyone would be extremely happy here.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=982972
UNC
North Carolina is pretty nice place to live, and people there are easy going/laid back. Another small program ( 3 categorical positions each year) like Baylor Dallas. So it definitely has a nice feel. Good thing about categorical is that you don't have to look for a separate intern year, and you will get to know your colleagues from other specialties well, ie Ortho, Rads, Anesthesia, Neuro...etc so you can get some good networking experience. Home call, which is nice, but the only concern about these small programs is the amount of experience. UNC is still a relatively young program, so its still establishing itself in the UNC system I feel. but it is getting better i heard. They just moved their outpatient to a brand new/renovated location. EMG is share with neuro dept, and you get 6 months of it ,but primarily working with the PM&R attending though.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13704601&postcount=15
Young but wonderful faculty, happy residents, prettiest rehab floor I saw during my entire interview trail. Chapel Hill is a beautiful college town and more lively Durham is right around the corner. Program is small but residents get great training and especially strong outpt msk/spine (strongest of any program I looked at). They are opening a massive new outpatient rehab center by next year. Research opportunities abound and it is a top NIH funded PM&R program. Also has a great complementary medicine program that works very closely with PM&R.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13762838&postcount=83
UVA
Charlottesville is a great college town, lots of restaurants, plenty to do, especially if you're an outdoorsy type of person. Cost of living is great, and if smaller towns aren't your thing, DC is only 2 hours away. There is a categorical option which is great (the first year is pretty chill from what it seems-ortho, ER, neuro, GI, pm&r rotations. PM&R rotation is usually scheduled over Thanksgiving or Christmas so you get an extra week or so of vacay as a categorical which is sweet.) The chair Dr. Wilder was really nice as was the rest of the faculty. You get A LOT of sports exposure and opportunity to cover sporting events, etc. Like a lot of other programs, pgy-2 year is all inpatient and 5 months of electives are provided in your senior year. The downside I guess is that you do have call as a 4th year, but it's not as frequent as 2's/3's. That's the only major negative I can think of.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13716979&postcount=34
VCU
6 positions = 4 categorical + 2 advanced
6 outpt, 6 inpt mos in PGY2; 6 mos total dedicated EMG; 1 of 5 VA polytrauma centers in country
Friday didatics from 7-10am, additional lectures on different days at different sites (inclu business and ultrasound)
call: home call, PGY2: every 6th night, PGY3: every 6 weeks, PGY4: every 10 weeks
another program that I was pleasantly surprised by -- very well-rounded, great mentorship, required sports coverage city of Richmond gets a bad rep, but I liked it.
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I believe that technically, if we include Kentucky into "the south", we should also include Missouri, which would have both Wash U and U of Missouri... I loved Mizzou.
Mind sharing your experiences?
