Poland Med Schools

[reversescorpion]

Does anyone know anything about schools in Poland? I know there at least 2 English speaking med schools (one in Poznan and one in Krakow)...I also heard that one of the schools in Poland has a partnership with the Cleveland clinic....

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[Rico]

Does anyone know anything about schools in Poland? I know there at least 2 English speaking med schools (one in Poznan and one in Krakow)...I also heard that one of the schools in Poland has a partnership with the Cleveland clinic....

As far as I know, non of the English ones are approved by California which is big issue for me. Only the Polish version is approved.

http://www.medbd.ca.gov/Applicant_Schools_Recognized.htm#C

Rico

 

[reversescorpion]

As far as I know, non of the English ones are approved by California which is big issue for me. Only the Polish version is approved.

http://www.medbd.ca.gov/Applicant_Schools_Recognized.htm#C

Rico

The two schools that I know of that are English-speaking are on the list of schools California approves (Jagiellonian University Medical College in Krakow and Karol Marcinkowski University of Medical Sciences in Poznan)

Hope this helps!

 

[neilc]

The two schools that I know of that are English-speaking are on the list of schools California approves (Jagiellonian University Medical College in Krakow and Karol Marcinkowski University of Medical Sciences in Poznan)

Hope this helps!

be very careful here!!! the schools you mentione (poznan and krakow) are NOT approved for the english program in CA.

if a school has an approved english program, it will have (english program) next to it....here is an example, from the hungarian schools on the list...

University of Szeged Faculty of Medicine (including English program)

University of Debrecen Faculty of Medicine

University of Semmelweis Faculty of Medicine (including English program)

University of Pecs Faculty of Medicine (including English program)

University of Albert Szent-Gyorgyi Faculty of Medicine (including English program)

Pecs University Medical School (including English program)

from this you can see that only one school (debrecen) does not have english program approval....i see zero polish schools that have an approved english program.

if you have any doubts, email the med board.

 

[Rico]

NeilC is right.

Only Polish program is approved.

Compare with Charles in Czeck in the list. Pay attention to the parentheses.

Rico

 

[reversescorpion]

thanks you guys! this helps me out a lot.

Are most states like California in this aspect?

 

[neilc]

thanks you guys! this helps me out a lot.

Are most states like California in this aspect?

as of now, most states are not like CA. however, there does seem to be a trend toward increased evaluation of offshore schools. some other states have wording in the licensure laws that a school must not be disapproved in another state (TX comes to mind), NM actually uses the CA list, and each state seems to be paying closer attention to this sort of thing.

there are many that believe that the CA list will become more widely used, as it is the closest thing to LCME guidelines that is available for offshore schools.

whatever method the states decide to use, it does seem that there will be some sort of stronger guidelines in the future. therefore, it would seem prudent to choose your medical school very carefully. by that, i do not mean find a school on a nice island, or that is cheap, or that is in a comfortable location, etc....i mean pick a school that has the ability to get you licensed in all states, and has that ability NOW! there are many, many schools out there. use the CA list as a good guideline, because if it is approved there, it is pretty likely ok everywhere....

some schools to consider are:
SGU, AUC, ross, saba, ireland, australia, isreal, czech rep, hungary, AUG
if you speak another language, consider a program in that language

all the above schools are very well recognized in the states. they SHOULD not give you licensing issues. at least they are better off than the rest of the schools out there. they all have there pros and cons, and you should carefully evaluate each of these options, and pick the best fit. but, because your eventual goal is to GET A LICENSE, i would certainly make sure to stick to a school on the above list...graduating med school, getting great scores on the usmle, and a good residency, and then not getting a license, or best case being extermely limited on where you can practice, would really, really suck.

put a lot more weight on the long term goals (ie licensure) than the short term goals (ie i want to live here, or class size, etc..) and you will be better off. med school is a short part of your life, and do not put yourself in a position to be fractionally happier for 4 years and screwed for your life as a practicing doc instead of the other way around.

 

[reversescorpion]

thanks so much! your posts have been ridiculously helpful! this will definitely give me some kind of guide when thinking about applying to med schools in the U.S. and those offshore

 

[deepbluesea]

Is there a listing of international schools and the states in which they are accredited in?

I am interested in Hope Medical Institute in Poland, I would like to know which states recognize their English program. I understand that by considering Poland, I may be restricting my licensing prospects but I have financial issues that may not let me apply to the other more expensive schools such as in Ireland or the Caribbeans. In the Hope Institute, the tuition plus the cost of living for the entire program (all 4 years) would cost me about 60-70 thousand USD. I don't mind large/small class sizes or if the weather is too hot/too cold where I go to practice medicine. I don't want to restrict my future license but I might not have a choice.

Any comments would be appreciated

 

[Rico]

deepbluesea,

Why don't you consider Saba which is cheap and also recognized by all medical boards in States...

 

[Miklos]

Is there a listing of international schools and the states in which they are accredited in?

I am interested in Hope Medical Institute in Poland, I would like to know which states recognize their English program. I understand that by considering Poland, I may be restricting my licensing prospects but I have financial issues that may not let me apply to the other more expensive schools such as in Ireland or the Caribbeans. In the Hope Institute, the tuition plus the cost of living for the entire program (all 4 years) would cost me about 60-70 thousand USD. I don't mind large/small class sizes or if the weather is too hot/too cold where I go to practice medicine. I don't want to restrict my future license but I might not have a choice.

Any comments would be appreciated

I think that you are seriously underestimating your expenses. I suspect that they are significantly higher, especially with current US dollar weakness (even rural Poland is not that much cheaper than the rest of Central Europe).

Additionally, if you got this information from HMI, it is doubly suspect.

How do they break down the expenses?

 

[neilc]

Is there a listing of international schools and the states in which they are accredited in?

I am interested in Hope Medical Institute in Poland, I would like to know which states recognize their English program. I understand that by considering Poland, I may be restricting my licensing prospects but I have financial issues that may not let me apply to the other more expensive schools such as in Ireland or the Caribbeans. In the Hope Institute, the tuition plus the cost of living for the entire program (all 4 years) would cost me about 60-70 thousand USD. I don't mind large/small class sizes or if the weather is too hot/too cold where I go to practice medicine. I don't want to restrict my future license but I might not have a choice.

Any comments would be appreciated

cheap options:
1) saba
2) hungary

i really strongly recommend that you avoid HMI and all other agents.

 

[Miklos]

cheap options:
1) saba
2) hungary

i really strongly recommend that you avoid HMI and all other agents.

Well, I wouldn't go so far as to call Hungary cheap.

Outside of Budapest (Semmelweis), one can complete a six year program (including expenses) on Stafford's alone which means roughly 120k, depending of course on one's lifestyle.

One of the key advantages versus HMI are that all Hungarian English language programs are California approved.

If one is interested, I recommend doing additional research on the Europe forum at www.valuemd.com

Miklos

 

[neilc]

Well, I wouldn't go so far as to call Hungary cheap.

Outside of Budapest (Semmelweis), one can complete a six year program (including expenses) on Stafford's alone which means roughly 120k, depending of course on one's lifestyle.

One of the key advantages versus HMI are that all Hungarian English language programs are California approved.

If one is interested, I recommend doing additional research on the Europe forum at www.valuemd.com

Miklos

well, i thought hungary was a bit cheaper than prague, but i guess not...we are at about 120000+ as well. but, we only have one approved school in the area, and i have no idea if or when the other schools are even going to apply.

still, value is more important to consider than price. the value of a $60,000 polish degree is far less than the value of an education aprox double that cost that gives you more opportunities as far as employment/licensur/residency.

we are all going to be in debt, but if you go to a good school you have a far better chance to make the big bucks and pay that slightly larger monthly payment.

 

[deepbluesea]

Hi, thanks for the responses first of all.
I actually sent off my application to SGU just a few days ago and I was having second thoughts and worries about the huge loans I'd be carrying on my shoulders. For SGU i'd be looking at 200k, which after calculating the interest who knows how much I'm looking at. It's just very scary.
Poland came up because I know of a couple of people that are already in Poland and apparently they seem to like it there and it is much cheaper. One student, in his third year there just wrote the USMLE step 1 and passed. The student's father is a family friend and he mentioned Hope Institute and that's why I was looking up the info there. Some of you mentioned that HI is not a credible source of info..why is that?

 

[Miklos]

Hi, thanks for the responses first of all.
I actually sent off my application to SGU just a few days ago and I was having second thoughts and worries about the huge loans I'd be carrying on my shoulders. For SGU i'd be looking at 200k, which after calculating the interest who knows how much I'm looking at. It's just very scary.
Poland came up because I know of a couple of people that are already in Poland and apparently they seem to like it there and it is much cheaper. One student, in his third year there just wrote the USMLE step 1 and passed. The student's father is a family friend and he mentioned Hope Institute and that's why I was looking up the info there. Some of you mentioned that HI is not a credible source of info..why is that?

Hope is an agency. They exist simply to make money by delivering students to 'their' universities. As a result, like most agents, they resort to all kinds of promises and sheninigans in order to make the sale (think of used car salesmen). On top of it, they charge additional fees for minimal services.

If you are going to consider Europe, stay away from agents.

Do a search on the Europe forum at www.valuemd.com for keyword 'Hope' You'll find posts, including those describing the experiences that potential students had with them.

Miklos

 

[nasser]

Hope is an agency. They exist simply to make money by delivering students to 'their' universities. As a result, like most agents, they resort to all kinds of promises and sheninigans in order to make the sale (think of used car salesmen). On top of it, they charge additional fees for minimal services.

If you are going to consider Europe, stay away from agents.

Do a search on the Europe forum at www.valuemd.com for keyword 'Hope' You'll find posts, including those describing the experiences that potential students had with them.

Miklos

I'm currently studying at a Polish Uni, not through HMI though.

A lot of the students at my university have mixed feelings about HMI, but thats another story.

One of the benefits of going through HMI is that you get to do 2 years abroad, and the next 2 at home. That gives the HMI programs a great advantage over most European schools simply because you get to do your clinical years back home, in English. That simple fact also gives you a great oppertunity to network, and meet all sorts of people in hospitals, and thats invaluable when it comes to placement once you graduate.

Not pushing any agenda, just another point of view.

 

[Miklos]

I'm currently studying at a Polish Uni, not through HMI though.

A lot of the students at my university have mixed feelings about HMI, but thats another story.

One of the benefits of going through HMI is that you get to do 2 years abroad, and the next 2 at home. That gives the HMI programs a great advantage over most European schools simply because you get to do your clinical years back home, in English. That simple fact also gives you a great oppertunity to network, and meet all sorts of people in hospitals, and thats invaluable when it comes to placement once you graduate.

Not pushing any agenda, just another point of view.

At what price? Placement fees of several thousand dollars above the tuition and the built-in HMI fees?

In addition, where do you get to do your home rotations?

Are they rotations at ACGME programs in that specialty?

Here are two examples of HMI hard-sell deceptions from their websites.

After some study abroad, students are qualified for transfer with advanced standing to American and Canadian medical schools. Source.

We all know how true that is.

As Europe is uniting under the European union, our diploma will make you eligible to practice medicine in any and all European countries without major restrictions. Source

Also false. The four year diploma does not lead to automatic European recognition.

I recommend looking elsewhere.

Miklos

BTW, I find it interesting that you are studying at an HMI school without using them. I wonder why that is?

 

[nasser]

At what price? Placement fees of several thousand dollars above the tuition and the built-in HMI fees?

In addition, where do you get to do your home rotations?

Are they rotations at ACGME programs in that specialty?

Here are two examples of HMI hard-sell deceptions from their websites.



We all know how true that is.



Also false. The four year diploma does not lead to automatic European recognition.

I recommend looking elsewhere.

Miklos

BTW, I find it interesting that you are studying at an HMI school without using them. I wonder why that is?

well I'm not from north america, simple as that.

Look they are agents, and they are in it for the buisness. But that doesn't mean that one can't get an education out of it, or benefit from it. The Uni's don't it for free either.

As for rotations and clinicals, i don't know off hand since it doesn't concern me.

All i was stating was that, for some students it is a factor, getting home to do clinicals. Wheter the cost of such an option is worth it is for prospective students to decide, based on their buget restraints. Worth it for some, not for others.

 

[Miklos]

well I'm not from north america, simple as that.

Meaning, you pay a lot less than your HMI classmates. (A bit of "do as I say, not as I do?")

Look they are agents, and they are in it for the buisness. But that doesn't mean that one can't get an education out of it, or benefit from it. The Uni's don't it for free either.

There's no problem with charging for an education. The question is whether the charges and headaches associated with HMI (or any other agents for that matter) are worth it, especially as there are many other options for North Americans both inside and outside CE.

As for rotations and clinicals, i don't know off hand since it doesn't concern me.

All i was stating was that, for some students it is a factor, getting home to do clinicals. Wheter the cost of such an option is worth it is for prospective students to decide, based on their buget restraints. Worth it for some, not for others.

It is not that simple.

First, none of the HMI programs is currently California approved. Second, if the core (3rd year) rotations are not at ACGME programs in that specialty, licensure problems are a given in certain states. Third, some states even require that elective rotations (or a large part of them) be at ACGME programs in that specialty. A further factor is proper affiliation, which I'm not going to address in detail here.

Simply going "home" to do clinicals is not enough these days. As a USIMG (or an FMG heading to the US) one needs to be sure that US clinicals are:

1) At ACGME programs in that specialty.
2) Properly affiliated with the medical school to meet state licensure standards, unless strictly elective and
3) Remain within state licensure limits (c.f. California, New York)

Considering HMI's other tactics and deceptions, I would be really surprised if they were.

Miklos

 

[nasser]

Meaning, you pay a lot less than your HMI classmates. (A bit of "do as I say, not as I do?")



There's no problem with charging for an education. The question is whether the charges and headaches associated with HMI (or any other agents for that matter) are worth it, especially as there are many other options for North Americans both inside and outside CE.



It is not that simple.

First, none of the HMI programs is currently California approved. Second, if the core (3rd year) rotations are not at ACGME programs in that specialty, licensure problems are a given in certain states. Third, some states even require that elective rotations (or a large part of them) be at ACGME programs in that specialty. A further factor is proper affiliation, which I'm not going to address in detail here.

Simply going "home" to do clinicals is not enough these days. As a USIMG (or an FMG heading to the US) one needs to be sure that US clinicals are:

1) At ACGME programs in that specialty.
2) Properly affiliated with the medical school to meet state licensure standards, unless strictly elective and
3) Remain within state licensure limits (c.f. California, New York)

Considering HMI's other tactics and deceptions, I would be really surprised if they were.

Miklos

ermm........ Where do i begin? Infact I'm contemplating if its even worth posting But anyway.

Its not a case of do as I say...... I made it clear from the begining, I have nothing to do with HMI. Nada.

I was just giving a different perspective.

Different students, different needs, different list of priorities.

Now you on the other hand seem to have much to say about HMI. Personal experience? Or maybe something else? Spill.

 

[Miklos]

ermm........ Where do i begin? Infact I'm contemplating if its even worth posting But anyway.

Its not a case of do as I say...... I made it clear from the begining, I have nothing to do with HMI. Nada.

I was just giving a different perspective.

Different students, different needs, different list of priorities.

Now you on the other hand seem to have much to say about HMI. Personal experience? Or maybe something else? Spill.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with different students, needs and priorities.

As far as this discussion goes, here is my principal issue (apart from my opinion regarding agents).

One of the benefits of going through HMI is that you get to do 2 years abroad, and the next 2 at home. That gives the HMI programs a great advantage over most European schools simply because you get to do your clinical years back home, in English. That simple fact also gives you a great oppertunity to network, and meet all sorts of people in hospitals, and thats invaluable when it comes to placement once you graduate.

IMO, in the current context of IMG licensure, that is very poor advice for the reasons I elaborated in the previous post.

You stated:

well I'm not from north america, simple as that.
.
.
.
As for rotations and clinicals, i don't know off hand since it doesn't concern me.

So, why promote the HMI program to North Americans when you aren't from NA and you don't plan to do rotations there (and appear to be completely unfamiliar with IMG licensure issues in the U.S.)?

Miklos

 

[Dio]

I contacted a man with heavy Indian accent named Aaron at HMI yesterday. I enquired about the one specific school that I am interested in regarding the fee that is involved. On the school's web site, it very clearly says it's 6000 USD annually, but coming from Aaron, it became a whopping 14250 USD annually. Now what I would like to ask those who might know is what is the living cost at Poland, say Katowice for a year. I really need to know this so I can decide whether I should go with HMI or apply on my own.

 

[Miklos]

I contacted a man with heavy Indian accent named Aaron at HMI yesterday. I enquired about the one specific school that I am interested in regarding the fee that is involved. On the school's web site, it very clearly says it's 6000 USD annually, but coming from Aaron, it became a whopping 14250 USD annually. Now what I would like to ask those who might know is what is the living cost at Poland, say Katowice for a year. I really need to know this so I can decide whether I should go with HMI or apply on my own.

For an in-depth discussion about HMI fees see the following thread (about half-way through that page) at ValueMD: http://www.valuemd.com/ftopic34157-15.html

Also, keep in mind that the $14,250 may not include up-front "placement" fees.

Good luck.

Miklos

 

[DominStef]

Does anyone know anything about schools in Poland? I know there at least 2 English speaking med schools (one in Poznan and one in Krakow)...I also heard that one of the schools in Poland has a partnership with the Cleveland clinic....

Hello,
Here is a website with links to all medical universities in Poland offering English programs in medicine:
http://www.geocities.com/magdaemily/medical_studies.html

And here is the list:

Krakow
http://www.medschool.cm-uj.krakow.pl/

Szczecin
http://www.pam.szczecin.pl/index_en.php?cid=190&unroll=190

Wroclaw
http://www.am.wroc.pl/ed/index.html

Bialystok
http://www.amb.edu.pl/en/index.html

Warsaw
http://www.amwaw.edu.pl/english1.html

Lodz
http://www.umed.lodz.pl/index.en.php

Gdansk
http://www.ed.amg.gda.pl/main.html

Lublin
http://www.englishdivision.am.lublin.pl/

Poznan
http://www.am.poznan.pl

Katowice
http://www.slam.katowice.pl/index_en.asp

 

[dthomas]

Dio,

I am assuming you talked with Arun Acharya at HMI.

Mr. Arun Acharya
[email protected]
Director of Student Placement & Advising

Well the cost he gave $14,000 is still totally unaccurate figure.

As far as I know the cost of education for a 4 year program is awfully high.

Tuition $ 9,500

Room (1st year students) $2,500

Malpractice Insurance $100

Meals (self purchase) $3,000

Books and Supplies (self purchase) $750

Transportation: $1,100

Living Expenses (self purchase) $2,000

HMI's cut: $5,000

Placement fees: $8,900

AP: $33,000 for first year

Around 23,000 for second year.

Just as Miklos mentioned in his post look for Hope Medical Institute, Studies in Poland, and various other thread where elaborate and decisive arguments regarding the schools in Poland will be seen.


Good Luck

dt

 

[Paing]

Dio,

I am assuming you talked with Arun Acharya at HMI.

Mr. Arun Acharya
[email protected]
Director of Student Placement & Advising

Well the cost he gave $14,000 is still totally unaccurate figure.

As far as I know the cost of education for a 4 year program is awfully high.

Tuition $ 9,500

Room (1st year students) $2,500

Malpractice Insurance $100

Meals (self purchase) $3,000

Books and Supplies (self purchase) $750

Transportation: $1,100

Living Expenses (self purchase) $2,000

HMI's cut: $5,000

Placement fees: $8,900

AP: $33,000 for first year

Around 23,000 for second year.

Just as Miklos mentioned in his post look for Hope Medical Institute, Studies in Poland, and various other thread where elaborate and decisive arguments regarding the schools in Poland will be seen.


Good Luck

dt

The cost that you have listed is totally correct. I can confirm it. HMI charges a lot of fees. Before school starts, it charges $8900. Then each year, it charges $5000. I wonder what these fees are all for