Post-Grad Training in the UK

[BerlinNeuro]

---

Members do not see this ad.

So - I have a question for my UK, european or otherwise knowledgeable SDNers. I just started med school in the US (I'm American) and I'm interested in finding out whether it's possible to do my post-grad training in the UK and then staying in the UK to work. I know all about the PLAB exam and let's assume the work-permit VISA thing isn't an issue in this equation, because it probably won't be one. 😉

What would I need to do? Do I need post-grad training in the USA first or can I just hop the pond immediately, assuming I can find a post? How do you go about getting them and how early do you start looking? I was thinking if I did some clinical electives in the UK, I could try to make some connections. I know this is all quite a few years down the road yet, but I'm hoping/looking for a light at the end of the tunnel situation to keep me motivated. It's hard already. My boyfriend of many years has to stay in London and doesn't have many options for moving to the USA with his career, so we're hoping I can come to the UK when this school shizazz is all over with.

Thanks for anything you can tell me!!

Cheers.

 

[dr strangelove]

I'm not too sure about the procedure exactly, but one thing I know is that getting into a training programme in the UK is extremely difficult - if the papers are to be believed there were at least a thousand UK graduates who could not get a place this year! I read somewhere else that they're 200 applicants for every place! 😱

It's enough to make getting into medical school seem like the easy part. 😉

I'd suggest doing your basic postgraduate training in the USA, and then come over here. I'm not trying to put you off or anything; I'm just saying it would be difficult to get in. Still, nothing ventured, nothing gained!

 

[f_w]

If your longterm plan is to go to the UK, you might actually be better off returning to germany for medical school. Yes, it will take you 2 years longer, but in all likelihood you won't have to take the PLAB to practice in the UK. Also, the flights from Berlin to London are much more frequent and easier on the wallet than Cincinati London and you would save on tuition.

If your longterm plan is to go to the UK, you might actually be better off returning to germany for medical school. Yes, it will take you 2 years longer, but in all likelihood you won't have to take the PLAB to practice in the UK. Also, the flights from Berlin to London are much more frequent and easier on the wallet than Cincinati London and you would save on tuition.

There are 2 bottlenecks in the UK medical education system.

- Currently it is very hard to find accredited senior house officer position. In order to be eligible for a registrar or specialist registrar position you need to have SHO experience.

- The second hurdle is the 'national training number' and with that the access into accredited registrar positions. Only on these positions you can accumulate the time necessary to get evaluated for the respective royal college membership. Competition for these NTNs is nationwide and fierce.

While I believe that the '2000 UK medical graduates unemployed' line is a lot of hype from the BMA to get even more funding into the NHS, it is probably true that getting into the UK training system is a lot harder today than it was lets say 5 years ago. As an oversease graduate, you are competing with a large army of motivated folks from all over eastern europe and the commonwealth.

(Marry your BF. Within 3-5 years you will be a EU citizen and at least on an administrative level be treated somewhat better than a complete 'alien'.)

 

[TobiBobi]

I found this post and wanted to follow-up....

I am an american, who studied and graduated from medical school in Germany.

What are my chances of getting a position in the foundation programme or any other programme that is available in the UK?

Oh yes, I have been married to a German citizen for 5 years.

 

[f_w]

I found this post and wanted to follow-up....

I am an american, who studied and graduated from medical school in Germany.

What are my chances of getting a position in the foundation programme or any other programme that is available in the UK?

Oh yes, I have been married to a German citizen for 5 years.

You might have more luck looking around on discussion websites frequented by overseas physicians seeking residencies in the UK. My understanding is that it has become extremely difficult for non-UK grads to get the foot in the door at the training level (fully trained specialists and 'trust grade' midlevel people are still in demand).

Being married to a EU citizen gives you 'EU rights' under a number of the EU treaties. This means you cannot be discriminated against based on your non-EU nationality. Given that your medical degree is from germany, you shouldn't have difficulties obtaining registration with the GMC.

Anyway, as a US citizen with german medical degree, you have as good a shot as anyone to get a residency stateside. The UK used to be a good alternative, but after the recent re-shuffling of the training scheme it seems to be far less interesting.

 

[TobiBobi]

Thank you for your honest assessment.

I can't get a residency stateside because I am not considered competitive (USMLE scores).

perhaps medicine is not the way for me after all.


Thanks again.

TobiBobi.

 

[f_w]

Thank you for your honest assessment.

Please remember that this is an assessment not based on my own experience in the UK but based on what people who went there are telling me as well as articles in the BMJ about the current training situation.

I can't get a residency stateside because I am not considered competitive (USMLE scores).

There is allways a place looking for a warm body to fill the call schedule. You might not get into the specialty of your choice, but there is a residency slot for most candidates. You have the citizen thing going for yourself, the program doesn't have to worry about getting visas approved etc.

perhaps medicine is not the way for me after all.

Last I heard the job situation in germany has reversed from what it was even 5 years ago. Can't you find a job locally ?

Viel Glueck !

 

[leorl]

Hey, there are plenty of IMGs who do not have good scores. Yes, it's harder...but there are ways around it. Apply to prelim years or transitional years and if you do well in the attachments that you'd like to eventually practice in, it could only boost you. It does seem very daunting, I agree.

 

[TobiBobi]

Well, I've tried about 2 years to get a residency here in the States. I don't have the visa issues, I went to school in Germany, I have taken Steps 1, 2 CS, CK, and have just barely passed. I am not very hopefull that "year 3" of the match will do it for me. It hasn't brought me luck in the past.

I'm exploring my opportunities, and hope that perhaps somewhere else in the world I might find a job. I was thinking of the UK because of obvious language issues, but I might just go back to Germany and leave my friends, family and house behind.