Pre-Pharmacy *****s... read this!

[ramizlol]

Just to put my 2 cents in... Programming careers are not as good as they seem. Why? think about it... Programming requires you to critically think. You can teach a 10 year old to write "x" code when he runs into "y" problem. But, teaching him to think by himself to find the solution is different story. What is worse is that most jobs do not pay 100k (to my knowledge). There are so many "programming" schools popping up that the competition is crazy. You still think going into a career in programming is a good idea? let me tell you this. Every 5 to 10 years, a new/modified programming language pops up. Well guess what? you better learn it to keep your job; even when you are 50. Here is a real life example, C++ has been around for decades. When Microsoft released Windows 8 for their PCs. They started using a modified version of C++ for their app development. I used to code in C++ couple years ago; I can tell you that this modified version of C++ is pain in ass to learn. Documentation is still very limited. I would recommend programming to anyone that is good at solving puzzles and has not problem staying updated.

Now for pharmacy, it is sad that the bar has been lowered... I feel I am wasting my hard work by going into the field. 3.9 GPA with 79 PCAT(english isn't my first language. VERBAL!). We will see what happens.

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[oldstock]

Just to put my 2 cents in... Programming careers are not as good as they seem. Why? think about it... Programming requires you to critically think. You can teach a 10 year old to write "x" code when he runs into "y" problem. But, teaching him to think by himself to find the solution is different story. What is worse is that most jobs do not pay 100k (to my knowledge). There are so many "programming" schools popping up that the competition is crazy. You still think going into a career in programming is a good idea? let me tell you this. Every 5 to 10 years, a new/modified programming language pops up. Well guess what? you better learn it to keep your job; even when you are 50. Here is a real life example, C++ has been around for decades. When Microsoft released Windows 8 for their PCs. They started using a modified version of C++ for their app development. I used to code in C++ couple years ago; I can tell you that this modified version of C++ is pain in ass to learn. Documentation is still very limited. I would recommend programming to anyone that is good at solving puzzles and has not problem staying updated.

Now for pharmacy, it is sad that the bar has been lowered... I feel I am wasting my hard work by going into the field. 3.9 GPA with 79 PCAT(english isn't my first language. VERBAL!). We will see what happens.

very good reasoning !!

I'd like to say that not every job out there requires 6-8 yrs of schooling + residency + 150K+ loans.... if you do not have a jobin pharmacy, what are you going to do then ?? computer is a choice and there are many other alternatives out there. Again, if you can't find a job in computer, what are you going to do then ??

The point is pharmacy is saturated and getting even more saturated. We need to recognize this fact. Weigh the pros and cons of pharmacy and your other options to see what would best fit you and better serve your future

 

[PharmtoCS]

Anyone can learn a few lines of code and call themselves a computer programmer, but not everyone has the patience, problem solving skills, and creativity to be a good software engineer. You will see lower division computer sciences filled to the brim, but only a fraction of them will actually be able to pass classes and continue through the major, let alone master it. This is one major barrier of entry into the software engineering job market. As a top software engineer though, the sky is the limit. You can earn upward of $200k/year as an employee of a large company or bill $100/hour as a contractor, or you can build your own startup and sell it for millions of dollars. You also won't have to go through 4 years of schooling, 2 years of residency, and $200k+ debt that most top clinical pharmacists today have to go through to earn about the same as a retail pharmacist.

 

[oldstock]

Anyone can learn a few lines of code and call themselves a computer programmer, but not everyone has the patience, problem solving skills, and creativity to be a good software engineer. You will see lower division computer sciences filled to the brim, but only a fraction of them will actually be able to pass classes and continue through the major, let alone master it. This is one major barrier of entry into the software engineering job market. As a top software engineer though, the sky is the limit. You can earn upward of $200k/year as an employee of a large company or bill $100/hour as a contractor, or you can build your own startup and sell it for millions of dollars. You also won't have to go through 4 years of schooling, 2 years of residency, and $200k+ debt that most top clinical pharmacists today have to go through to earn about the same as a retail pharmacist.

Another way to look at is the ones with logic/math/engineering skills can do medical, dental, pharmacy, nursing, PA, other health professions easily if switched. Much more difficult the other way around. Not everyone has the required math skills to learn and become a good engineer / computer programmer.

But if you got that logic / math skills, I agree w @stoichiometrist that right now computer is offering better ROIs in terms of time and money investment and grow potentials compared to pharmacy, or even dental or medicine.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Another way to look at is the ones with logic/math/engineering skills can do medical, dental, pharmacy, nursing, PA, other health professions easily if switched. Much more difficult the other way around. Not everyone has the required math skills to learn and become a good engineer / computer programmer.

But if you got that logic / math skills, I agree w @stoichiometrist that right now computer is offering better ROIs in terms of time and money investment and grow potentials compared to pharmacy, or even dental or medicine.

Many say that a career in computers is much less stable than in healthcare because of outsourcing. However, healthcare jobs turned out to be just as unstable when a deluge of schools has led to intense competition for available jobs that purportedly would go unfilled due to a supposed "shortage" of healthcare workers. Worst of all, many of these programs require you to take out $150k+ in loans with no guarantee of a job to pay it off.

I facepalm every time someone says that pharmacy has more job security than in computers. The tech field is growing more quickly and workers are in very high demand.

 

[Nic24]

I agree

The Real Life of a Pharmacist

http://careerplanning.about.com/u/ua/occupations/pharmacist_ua.htm

4 or 5 years down the line, don't come back here saying we didn't warn you about this profession and where it is headed.
AVOID PHARMACY SCHOOL! The loans to become a retail bitch isn't worth it!!!

I agree with the retail aspect. Chain pharmacy higher ups only care about money and the bottom line. But there is more to pharmacy than going straight to retail after you graduate. You can do a residency to make yourself look better to hospitals. I think clinical pharmacy is probably the less stressful way to go

 

[PharmtoCS]

Another way to look at is the ones with logic/math/engineering skills can do medical, dental, pharmacy, nursing, PA, other health professions easily if switched. Much more difficult the other way around. Not everyone has the required math skills to learn and become a good engineer / computer programmer.

But if you got that logic / math skills, I agree w @stoichiometrist that right now computer is offering better ROIs in terms of time and money investment and grow potentials compared to pharmacy, or even dental or medicine.

Computer science courses require a great deal of patience and critical thinking skills. On the other hand, nowadays it seems as though anyone can skirt by with poor/mediocre grades, a low PCAT score, and no pharmacy experience and still get into pharmacy school. Just a thought, that is probably one of the reasons why there is a shortage of software engineers whereas pharmacy will continue to become more saturated with new graduates each year.

 

[oldstock]

Computer science courses require a great deal of patience and critical thinking skills. On the other hand, nowadays it seems as though anyone can skirt by with poor/mediocre grades, a low PCAT score, and no pharmacy experience and still get into pharmacy school. Just a thought, that is probably one of the reasons why there is a shortage of software engineers whereas pharmacy will continue to become more saturated with new graduates each year.

agreed 100000%

the required intelligence/math skills to be a good engineer in general and software in particular will serve as a natural barrier to that 100 K + salary and beyond. Either you have that gift or you do not. People with intelligence will always be in great demand, esp in computer + software engineering. If you can do this, this is probably the best ROI in terms of money and time w the highest growth potentials compared to other professions out there...

on the other hand, any avg student can graduate w high marks if the student put in the work in pharmacy. I would argue that pharmacy, dental, or pharmacy, etc is mostly about working hard to master / do rote memorization to cram as much of info as possible into your head. You only need avg intelligence to do well here.

 

[oldstock]

agreed 100000%

the required intelligence/math skills to be a good engineer in general and software in particular will serve as a natural barrier to that 100 K + salary and beyond. Either you have that gift or you do not. People with intelligence will always be in great demand, esp in computer + software engineering. If you can do this, this is probably the best ROI in terms of money and time w the highest growth potentials compared to other professions out there...

on the other hand, any avg student can graduate w high marks if the student put in the work in pharmacy. I would argue that pharmacy, dental, or pharmacy, etc is mostly about working hard to master / do rote memorization to cram as much of info as possible into your head. You only need avg intelligence to do well here.

to make the picture / comparison even more clearer for prospective students, there is almost no barrier in pharmacy now. Almost anyone can get in pharmacy schools these days regardless how low their stats are and make high marks (if they put in the work which I assumed most of them do, esp. as the job market is becoming tighter and more competitive) and then subsequently pass the NAPLEX to become a practicing pharmacist. Plus, it seems that almost anyone can open a new pharmacy school now (to only lead to more job competition)...

So when there is no barrier and anyone can do what you do.... sad... I know many of you are passionate about pharmacy but we all still need to make some money to put food on table and pay back all those student loans...

the only 100% sure thing is that you will have to pay ~150K+ and 6-8 yrs of your life (+ residency) for your PharmD degree diploma

 

[SanMateoRph]

my boss from duane reade told me pharmacy is safest with hospital, then retail, then industry. everyone trying to apply for hospital these days because retail chains are closing down since they're not making enough profits from the insurance companies all switching to 4 dollar generics and staff pharmacist will be mainly affected with cut hours and maybe laid off

 

[Lucky One]

To Pre-Pharmers, if you can't get into a decent/public program don't even bother with attempts into the new private schools and trying your luck into chain pharmacy. Your putting yourself in a bad position competing against these new gungho PharmDs. Competition is fierce do not come to battle with intentions being only money. Your going to have a rough time.

 

[happychemguy]

Does anyone know how the situation is here in Canada? I did a quick search here, and it's *relatively* optimistic, but I'd like a more up-to-date opinion.

I know of a couple foreign pharmacists myself who came to work in Canada a while back so I'd presume the domestic supply isn't excessive unlike what I hear about in the US. We do only have two pharmacy schools in Ontario.

I do wonder about the situation with clinical pharmacy here as I'm not too keen with working in retail.

 

[Humble Sloth]

You can always send the competition into computer programming. They can make $45-60k as a lower level programmer when they learn the skills on their own or with an AS degree (virtually 0 student debt), or $100k as a software engineer with a B.S. in computer science. No $350k+ debt and 7+ years of postsecondary education necessary to become a doctor.

it shouldn't take 7 years to earn this joke of a degree unless you are mentally challenged. The longest it should take is 4 years. 1 year Community college pre-reqs + 3 year program. That being said there are still tens of programs that are complete rip offs Glendale, Saint Jos. CT, Duquesne ect that SHOULD BE AVOIDED LIKE THE PLAGUE.

 

[rederza]

it shouldn't take 7 years to earn this joke of a degree unless you are mentally challenged. The longest it should take is 4 years. 1 year Community college pre-reqs + 3 year program. That being said there are still tens of programs that are complete rip offs Glendale, Saint Jos. CT, Duquesne ect that SHOULD BE AVOIDED LIKE THE PLAGUE.

The extra 4 years are preparing them from when provider status~ will~come.

 

[Humble Sloth]

The extra 4 years are preparing them from when provider status~ will~come.

Hahahahahahahahahhaha

I feel bad for pharmacy students right now. They are in for a wide eye opening.

 

[APN-59 rph]

Hahahahahahahahahhaha

I feel bad for pharmacy students right now. They are in for a wide eye opening.

I have to say that I am with the Sloth lady on this one...tho I am not laughing....I am almost out of the biz, so I am not your competition...When I see postings that start "Whatsamatta U. class of 2021" I just shudder for those people. Unless you are VERY lucky, I would predict that 75% of you are headed for a pharmaceutical train wreck. The Pharm D program is like training someone to operate a space shuttle and then assigning them to drive the tour bus at Cape Canaveral. I suppose you could.. COULD..be the exception. That is a lot to bet a quarter of a mil on....I realize that there are some hospital/academic/industry/and yes, community spots that might be worth it IF you just love the idea. There are some who KNOW what they are doing making it in their own drug store..some are not..I agree with most of the negative comments I read so no use repeating them here....FYI..The state associations are not your friend....the national, same...management is not your friend...the schools are not your friend.....You each need to carefully evaluate your future.....