pbmax

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Does anyone else find it extremely unfair that DO's and FMG's can accept offers from programs prior to the match and US Allopathic graduates cannot. As someone who is going into family medicine and worked extremely hard during medical school, I find it discouraging that my top choice program has already given two spots away to DO applicants even before the match. Although this program still has 11 spots, it would be so much easier for me to accept a prematch offer and start looking for a house now, as opposed to waiting two months and wondering if in fact I'll match there.

The system should work for everyone - we have to do a match then everyone should have to do the match (or at least wait until post-match to accept offers). Just a little frustrated...
 
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pbmax

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And I forgot to add, I'm not worried about not matching at this particular program. I just wish that all applicants were treated fairly - why do some have control of their future while others have to rely on fate through the match. I'd so rather be able to negotiate a contract for myself...
 

PACtoDOC

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pbmax said:
And I forgot to add, I'm not worried about not matching at this particular program. I just wish that all applicants were treated fairly - why do some have control of their future while others have to rely on fate through the match. I'd so rather be able to negotiate a contract for myself...
Hey PB, as a DO applicant this summer, I promise I share in your pain. What you just stated is a great reason to have a combines match with the AOA. The FMG issue is less bothersome to most because most of them come in at the scramble. But yes, it is not correct that DO's can jump in early. The AOA is against a combines match with the AMA because they feel it would mean more DO's bailing to MD residencies. Where it hurts us as DO's is that our match is a complete month earlier than the MD match, and if you enter it and match (which any DO with a pulse would!!), you get pulled from the AMA match. So for me, although most of my top choices are allopathic FP programs, there are 3 that are DO/MD dual programs that require DO's to come in through the AOA side of the match. So if one of these does not turn out to be my top choice, I will not be able to include them in my rankings. A lot of FP programs know how good DO's are at family medicine and primary care in general, and they love to recruit for us. The big trend is that more top programs are becoming dually accredited by the AOA/AMA and thus give DO's the ability to keep their ties with the AOA, but also allow the MD board certification which more times is a better program. For instance, in Wisconsin, all the UW programs are dually accredited now, but even still I know for a fact that they have signed DO's outside the match even now because it is not illegal. The only way it will stop is if there is a joint match. The AMA almost went through with a resolution to approve such match this year but the idea was tabled due to pressure from the AOA. AOA may cave this year is my guess but if they don't this will never improve. So trust me, we too get shafted in this process!! I actually heard a rumor that regardless of whether the joint match happens or not, that AMA programs would no longer be able to sign people outside of the match after this match in 2005. But I also heard the same rumor last year and I have already seen many of my friends in 4th year signing under the radar once again. I would address your complaint to the AMA so that they will have pressure to move forward with this. They have actually been worried I think that MD students would not be in favor of a joint match, but everyone knows that DO's have already been part of the AMA match for decades so I don't know what the big deal is. Good luck, and I am sure you will end up where you want!!
 

erichaj

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The pre match issue is not the fmg or DO fault. It is the individual programs that CHOOSE to do this. It's is the hospitals that are causing you this pain.

EH.
 

EP to FP

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Don't be misled into thinking that allopathic grads do not sign before the match. This also happens all the time. It is really just hospital dependant.
 

Marci Way

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pbmax said:
And I forgot to add, I'm not worried about not matching at this particular program. I just wish that all applicants were treated fairly - why do some have control of their future while others have to rely on fate through the match. I'd so rather be able to negotiate a contract for myself...
Our hospital will not allow any of its residency programs to pre-match. There are many who agree there would be much less stress if contracts could be negotiated on an individual basis.
 

Cristagali

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"The FMG issue is less bothersome to most because most of them come in at the scramble."

You just love to keep kicking us in the groin! :D First, I doubt thats true, since almost half of FM spots go to FMG's. I can't imagine programs would wait to scramble half of their residency spots and lose out on good candidates. I really hope you get into a good program (which you will with your scores) that has a couple of strong FMG's on staff to give you a better perspective. You're choosing a career path overwhelmingly staffed with international doctors, so learn to love us! Good luck on Match and hopefully there will be a couple of strong FMG colleagues waiting to greet you July 1st! :thumbup:
 

Saipan

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"I doubt thats true, since almost half of FM spots go to FMG's."

Is this really true? Where did you get this info? I don't doubt you, I'm just looking for verification (...and reassurance!). What other specialities have high numbers of FMGs?
 

Cristagali

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Well its confusing data. in 2004 there were 2864 FM positions open in the Match. USMG's filled 1185 of those spots, making it 41% of entire spots open. But here is the tricky part. Only 78% of all FM spots were even filled! so that leaves FMG's at 37% of the total filled spots (nearly 50% of all spots filled as I stated (FMG 37% vs. US 41%) But still 22% of spots still go unfilled, which takes me back to my original post to PACtoDOC that programs do not routinely "scramble" FMG's thinking they will fill on Match with USMG's. Good FMG's get interviewed and get offers and probably some good ones get in on the scramble too. but anyway, if you are an FMG and are looking at FM, do as well as you can on the boards to expand your choices and you should have no problem for the foreseeable future. GL :thumbup:
 

bustbones26

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First off, what about the program?? Does the program offer DO's the opportunity to a combined AOA/ACGME program? If this is the case, that particular program 's goal may be to offer a certain number of spots every year to DO's, andif that is the case, then yes, DO's can sign outside the AOA match. However, don;t be fooled, MD can sign outside the match too, just program dependent.
 

BellKicker

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pbmax said:
Does anyone else find it extremely unfair that DO's and FMG's can accept offers from programs prior to the match and US Allopathic graduates cannot.
I understand how that might seem that way to you. I hate prematches - and I'm an FMG who just signed one.

By signing a pre-match you give up the chance to see the rest of your programs. If a program offers you a pre-match, it means that you could most likely have matched there, anyway (if pre-matches were illegal). OTOH, if you reject the prematch offer, it's unlikely that they will rank you high. Being offered a pre-match is more stressful than you might imagine. At first, it's very flattering, especially if the program is a top pick for you. But then reality sinks in; if you sign, you won't be going anywhere else for interviews or second looks. I honestly feel like I singed with my number one choice but would you reject an offer from your number 2 choice? How about number 3?

I'll admit it does seem a little weird that FMGs and DOs can sign pre-matches and 4th year USMD grads can't. I can't imagine the reasoning behind that, other than maybe some FMGs need time to process their visas. Then again. most FMGs in FP seem to be Caribbean grads, anyway (at least in the area I applied).

Anyway, I'm sure you'll match at your number one pick. Most people in FP do. :cool: Good luck.