Problems applying to low&mid-range schools with high scores?

[kiwifriend]

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Thanks everyone! 🙂

 

[To be MD]

I really don't think you have anything to worry about.

Odds are, unless you forgot to disclose to us that you're a convicted murderer or have the social skills of a rabid porcupine, you're going to get accepted somewhere.

 

[Goro]

Stats get you to the door, but ECs will get you through. This holds true for Albany or Yale, JAB or Harvard, Mercer or Stanford.

The simple answer is don't apply until you have the best possible app, even if it means skipping an app cycle.

Hello! I've seen some warnings about students with top scores not getting interviews at low-mid tier schools because those schools think they won't attend. I'm more worried about affordability right now than I am about name recognition when it comes to med schools, so I wasn't planning on applying to that many top schools. I was even considering doing ED at my state school (although the I've heard that's not a great idea).
My stats are good (3.95 GPA and 521 MCAT - but kinda uneven), but my ECs aren't excellent so I don't know if I have good chances at a top school. I became premed late in the game and I'm way behind on shadowing and volunteering (although I do have 2000+ hours of paid clinical experience).

I made a full WAMC post with all my details but mostly I just want to know if this is a real phenomenon? Could I be stuck without acceptances because of the weird position I'm in? Could someone help me strategize a school list? Thanks so much!! 🙂

 

[kiwifriend]

Thank you, @Goro and @To be MD, for your responses!

I've just started my second gap year and I'm hoping to apply in this cycle so I don't have to wait another year. But I definitely don't want to apply if my app isn't ready. It wouldn't be worth having to be a re-applicant.

At this point, I'm really not sure how my app stands in comparison to others. Sometimes, reading the posts on here, it seems like I'm lightyears behind everyone else in terms of research and clinical experience. It seems like some of the top schools reaalllly value that research experience and I am woefully lacking in that department. Would you mind giving me your opinion on whether I should delay applying?

A bunch of facts about me:
I have shadowed a couple of pediatricians and I've just started shadowing in a primary office 5 hours a week. I have have been working as a research study coordinator at a hospital for over a year, which has really solidified my drive to go into primary care. This position involves lots of one-on-one patient interaction, and I will have a great rec letter from my PI (at least that's what she says!). I've gotten positive feedback on my personal statement so far from my school's pre-health department, so I'm hoping that's good. I did one semester of research in a health psychology lab in undergrad (250 hours). In terms of non-clinical things, I've been a children's music teacher for 3 years and a peer counselor for the LGBTQ community (200 hours).

Thank you!

The simple answer is don't apply until you have the best possible app, even if it means skipping an app cycle.

 

[kiwifriend]

I really don't think you have anything to worry about.

Odds are, unless you forgot to disclose to us that you're a convicted murderer or have the social skills of a rabid porcupine, you're going to get accepted somewhere.

I'm no adcom, but I would personally be very impressed by any rabid porcupine applying to medical school. 🙂

 

[WedgeDawg]

What does your research portfolio look right (sorry if you mentioned it already and I missed it)?

 

[kiwifriend]

What does your research portfolio look right (sorry if you mentioned it already and I missed it)?

I unfortunately don't have any publications. I just did some lab work my last semester of college to get a little experience, but I was mostly just running ELISAs and such. I have been working as a study coordinator since the beginning of 2015. My PI mentioned that I would definitely be an author on the paper when the study is complete, but that definitely won't be before I submit my apps - probably around April of next year.

 

[WedgeDawg]

I unfortunately don't have any publications. I just did some lab work my last semester of college to get a little experience, but I was mostly just running ELISAs and such. I have been working as a study coordinator since the beginning of 2015. My PI mentioned that I would definitely be an author on the paper when the study is complete, but that definitely won't be before I submit my apps - probably around April of next year.

Apply to your state schools, a good solid bulk of mid tiers, and then fill the rest up with top tiers that strike your fancy. You're not in danger of not getting accepted (provided your school list is decent), but you're not a shoe-in for a top 20 either.

 

[kiwifriend]

Thanks for your feedback, @WedgeDawg !! I only have the one state school (UMass) which I am absolutely applying to, and depending on financial aid/scholarships, it might be my only reasonable choice.

Would you mind taking a look at this list and telling me what you think? I definitely need to cut down and maybe add some more mid tiers? (Sorry, I did make a similar post in WAMC too)

UMass
Tufts
BU
Harvard
Yale
Quinnipiac
UConn
Rush
UChicago
Northwestern
Temple
UPenn
Drexel
Jefferson
Stanford
UCSF
UCSD
Geffen
Keck
Hofstra
Columbia
NYU
Einstein
Mount Sinai
NYMC
Vanderbilt
Emory
Georgetown
GW

 

[Recon_13999]

so I wasn't planning on applying to that many top schools. 🙂

Thanks for your feedback, @WedgeDawg !! I only have the one state school (UMass) which I am absolutely applying to, and depending on financial aid/scholarships, it might be my only reasonable choice.

Would you mind taking a look at this list and telling me what you think? I definitely need to cut down and maybe add some more mid tiers? (Sorry, I did make a similar post in WAMC too).

UMass
Tufts
BU
Harvard
Yale
Quinnipiac
UConn
Rush
UChicago
Northwestern
Temple
UPenn
Drexel
Jefferson
Stanford
UCSF
UCSD
Geffen
Keck
Hofstra
Columbia
NYU
Einstein
Mount Sinai
NYMC
Vanderbilt
Emory
Georgetown
GW

SDN: "not that many top schools"
translation: "Just 8 of top 10"

btw it's really impossible to give you substantial feedback without knowing your full ECs

 

[WedgeDawg]

Thanks for your feedback, @WedgeDawg !! I only have the one state school (UMass) which I am absolutely applying to, and depending on financial aid/scholarships, it might be my only reasonable choice.

Would you mind taking a look at this list and telling me what you think? I definitely need to cut down and maybe add some more mid tiers? (Sorry, I did make a similar post in WAMC too).

UMass
Tufts
BU
Harvard
Yale
Quinnipiac
UConn
Rush
UChicago
Northwestern
Temple
UPenn
Drexel
Jefferson
Stanford
UCSF
UCSD
Geffen
Keck
Hofstra
Columbia
NYU
Einstein
Mount Sinai
NYMC
Vanderbilt
Emory
Georgetown
GW

UConn, Temple, Drexel, UCSD, UCLA (Geffen), Georgetown, GW, Rush, and possibly Jefferson are likely going to be very low yield for you.

Other schools to consider include Rochester, Hofstra, Wake Forest, SLU, and Miami.

 

[CowboyNiceguy]

I recommend not applying to Rush. I applied to similar schools as your list with a 37/3.9. Rush rejected me and said they wanted 800 hours of community service and 1800 of healthcare exposure.

 

[kiwifriend]

SDN: "not that many top schools"
translation: "Just 8 of top 10"

btw it's really impossible to give you substantial feedback without knowing your full ECs

I'm not actually planning on applying to all of those schools! That would be thousands of dollars! That's just the broad list I've been putting together based on other feedback.

I don't really have too much more to say in terms of my ECs! Haha, unfortunately like I said, they are pretty lacking! I did a lot of non-academic extracurricular stuff in college, work study job, a cappella, teaching music, theater, etc. Most of my time post-grad has been filled with working full time, finishing my pre-recs in night classes, and studying for the MCAT.

 

[kiwifriend]

UConn, Temple, Drexel, UCSD, UCLA (Geffen), Georgetown, GW, Rush, and possibly Jefferson are likely going to be very low yield for you.

Other schools to consider include Rochester, Hofstra, Wake Forest, SLU, and Miami.

Thanks for the feedback!! How can you tell if a school will be low-yield? (apart from looking at 10th and 90th percentiles on MSAR).

 

[WedgeDawg]

Thanks for the feedback!! How can you tell if a school will be low-yield? (apart from looking at 10th and 90th percentiles on MSAR).

I have a (probably outdated and non-comprehensive) list of schools that were determined to be low yield in my ARS thread (in my signature).

However, a school should generally be considered low yield for any particular applicant if it meets any of the following critera:

• The applicant has scores outside the 10th or 90th percentiles without significant reason
• The applicant is OOS and the school is not OOS friendly (think UWashington, UC Davis, etc)
• The school receives an inordinately high volume of applicants (think GW or Drexel)
• The school interviews an extremely small pool of applicants (Brown)
• The school accepts an extremely small group of applicants (Mayo)
• The applicant does not fit the schools mission (a white applicant applying to Howard, etc)

 

[DokterMom]

You mentioned affordability and have a top notch MCAT -- Apply to the Texas schools. Fabulous 'bang for the buck' and they like high MCATs in their OOS'ers.

 

[feather421]

Am I missing something? I think your ECs sound great. You have thousands of hours of clinical exposure, dedicated service to disadvantaged populations (LGBT support group), and interests outside of medicine that will catch someone's eye (a capella, music teacher). You even have some research--maybe not a huge amount, but enough to check the box. Plus your clinical experience is research oriented, so you can emphasize that aspect to make up for a perceived gap. Plus your metrics are awesome.

I have different ECs than you, but was also a working full time post bacc person feeling the pressure of missing a few boxes that everyone else seemed to have, like TA'ing or scribing. But to me, it appears that you've engaged with activities you are genuinely passionate about. That's great, and I think will serve you well. I had great success, and my interviewers wanted to talk to me more about my college non-medical activities than they did my top-tier research.

Right now I think your biggest issue is confidence! When you write your personal statement and activity blurbs, really try to weave a thread of intentionality that draws the reader in. Describe your activities in a calm, self-assured way as if to say, "Look at everything I've done, I'm so excited to talk about it and share it with you." My pre-med advisor told me that sometimes you can sense desperation and insecurity from those parts of the application, and it absolutely hurts you.

Good luck!

 

[Med Ed]

Thank you, @Goro and @To be MD, for your responses!

I've just started my second gap year and I'm hoping to apply in this cycle so I don't have to wait another year. But I definitely don't want to apply if my app isn't ready. It wouldn't be worth having to be a re-applicant.

Based on what you have shared you will be very competitive this cycle, so I would not wait.

Thanks for the feedback!! How can you tell if a school will be low-yield? (apart from looking at 10th and 90th percentiles on MSAR).

I am an adcom, and I have spent a fair amount of time thinking about "yield." My advice is not to worry about this concept, as it can be quite misleading. Just because a school gets a ton of applications doesn't mean most of them are any good. Also, and this is important, if a school receives, say 10,000 applications and interviews 1,000 people, do not be fooled into thinking that there is a 10% chance of getting an interview. I am going to extrapolate some of my own experience here, but out of 10,000 initial applications you can toss about half without batting an eye, so the pool now becomes 5,000. To get 1,000 people to show up for interviews, you may have to invite 1,500.* Assuming you remain in the good half of the pool, your rough odds of getting an interview spot just went from a perceived 10% to (1500/5000 x 100) = 30%. If you are a competitive applicant (which you are) and a reasonable fit for a given school, your odds will further increase commensurately.

All of this is to say that identifying private or OOS-friendly schools where you fit within the 10th/90th is the appropriate place to start. Most people have to throw quite a bit of pudding at the wall in order to make some stick, and you will probably be no different, but do not let yourself become fearful or paralyzed over yield.


* This number varies a great deal by school, and nobody published their numbers, so don't assume that a 1.5 invite/interview ratio is anywhere near universal.

 

[kiwifriend]

You mentioned affordability and have a top notch MCAT -- Apply to the Texas schools. Fabulous 'bang for the buck' and they like high MCATs in their OOS'ers.

Thanks for the advice! I hadn't really thought about Texas schools! I will definitely look into those!

 

[kiwifriend]

Am I missing something? I think your ECs sound great. You have thousands of hours of clinical exposure, dedicated service to disadvantaged populations (LGBT support group), and interests outside of medicine that will catch someone's eye (a capella, music teacher). You even have some research--maybe not a huge amount, but enough to check the box. Plus your clinical experience is research oriented, so you can emphasize that aspect to make up for a perceived gap. Plus your metrics are awesome.

I have different ECs than you, but was also a working full time post bacc person feeling the pressure of missing a few boxes that everyone else seemed to have, like TA'ing or scribing. But to me, it appears that you've engaged with activities you are genuinely passionate about. That's great, and I think will serve you well. I had great success, and my interviewers wanted to talk to me more about my college non-medical activities than they did my top-tier research.

Right now I think your biggest issue is confidence! When you write your personal statement and activity blurbs, really try to weave a thread of intentionality that draws the reader in. Describe your activities in a calm, self-assured way as if to say, "Look at everything I've done, I'm so excited to talk about it and share it with you." My pre-med advisor told me that sometimes you can sense desperation and insecurity from those parts of the application, and it absolutely hurts you.

Good luck!

Thank you so much! I know I have a confidence issue with my application. Because I decided to be pre-med so late, as a senior in college I was in classes with many ambitious hyper-achieving underclassmen, and I got a little wigged out. I am really passionate about my activities and I write about them in my personal statement and definitely try to tie them into my desire to work with others and pursue medicine. I've had a few people read through my essays and help me remove the desperation and insecurity, and they read as much more confident now! My first essay was riddled with self-deprecating remarks, and my friend even asked me if I even thought I deserved to get into med school, which is really bad haha.

I'm hoping my interviewers will find my activities interesting! I definitely have a lot to say about them and they are really important to me.

 

[kiwifriend]

Based on what you have shared you will be very competitive this cycle, so I would not wait.



I am an adcom, and I have spent a fair amount of time thinking about "yield." My advice is not to worry about this concept, as it can be quite misleading. Just because a school gets a ton of applications doesn't mean most of them are any good. Also, and this is important, if a school receives, say 10,000 applications and interviews 1,000 people, do not be fooled into thinking that there is a 10% chance of getting an interview. I am going to extrapolate some of my own experience here, but out of 10,000 initial applications you can toss about half without batting an eye, so the pool now becomes 5,000. To get 1,000 people to show up for interviews, you may have to invite 1,500.* Assuming you remain in the good half of the pool, your rough odds of getting an interview spot just went from a perceived 10% to (1500/5000 x 100) = 30%. If you are a competitive applicant (which you are) and a reasonable fit for a given school, your odds will further increase commensurately.

All of this is to say that identifying private or OOS-friendly schools where you fit within the 10th/90th is the appropriate place to start. Most people have to throw quite a bit of pudding at the wall in order to make some stick, and you will probably be no different, but do not let yourself become fearful or paralyzed over yield.


* This number varies a great deal by school, and nobody published their numbers, so don't assume that a 1.5 invite/interview ratio is anywhere near universal.

Thank you so much for your input! Do you disagree with @WedgeDawg in terms of removing UConn, Temple, Drexel, UCSD, UCLA, Georgetown, GW, Rush, and Jefferson from my list? I'm not against cutting those schools from the list, but I would love another opinion!

How many schools would you recommend as a safe number to apply to?

 

[Med Ed]

Thank you so much for your input! Do you disagree with @WedgeDawg in terms of removing UConn, Temple, Drexel, UCSD, UCLA, Georgetown, GW, Rush, and Jefferson from my list? I'm not against cutting those schools from the list, but I would love another opinion!

How many schools would you recommend as a safe number to apply to?

I would toss out UConn, UCSD, UCLA, and Drexel. The first three have strong IS preferences, the latter will assume that you won't go there.

As for the others, your GPA is essentially at the 90th percentile for each of them, and your MCAT is about 3-5 points above (old scoring system). Some might consider you a great catch and invite you, others may not, the only way to know is to try. Whether or not you apply to any or all of them comes down to how much time and money you wish to invest.

Don't apply to Georgetown until you read this: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/worst-admissions-staff-in-the-country.12212/

 

[Goro]

We see exactly the same thing at my school!

Perversely, it even holds true for faculty jobs.

I am an adcom, and I have spent a fair amount of time thinking about "yield." My advice is not to worry about this concept, as it can be quite misleading. Just because a school gets a ton of applications doesn't mean most of them are any good. Also, and this is important, if a school receives, say 10,000 applications and interviews 1,000 people, do not be fooled into thinking that there is a 10% chance of getting an interview. I am going to extrapolate some of my own experience here, but out of 10,000 initial applications you can toss about half without batting an eye, so the pool now becomes 5,000. To get 1,000 people to show up for interviews, you may have to invite 1,500.* Assuming you remain in the good half of the pool, your rough odds of getting an interview spot just went from a perceived 10% to (1500/5000 x 100) = 30%. If you are a competitive applicant (which you are) and a reasonable fit for a given school, your odds will further increase commensurately.

All of this is to say that identifying private or OOS-friendly schools where you fit within the 10th/90th is the appropriate place to start. Most people have to throw quite a bit of pudding at the wall in order to make some stick, and you will probably be no different, but do not let yourself become fearful or paralyzed over yield.


* This number varies a great deal by school, and nobody published their numbers, so don't assume that a 1.5 invite/interview ratio is anywhere near universal.

 

[ditritium monoxide]

I recommend not applying to Rush. I applied to similar schools as your list with a 37/3.9. Rush rejected me and said they wanted 800 hours of community service and 1800 of healthcare exposure.

For real? Those numbers honestly seem very big.

 

[CowboyNiceguy]

For real? Those numbers honestly seem very big.

Yes. They said (paraphrasing) "As you know, we have a minimum requirement of 150 hours of community service and healthcare exposure" (which they did not publish anywhere) and "we expect our class for 2016 to have over 800 hours of community service, and over 1800 hours of health care exposure."

It was nice to get a semi-personalized rejection. But I am already aware that those are my weak points and it was annoying that they wrote it as if I should be aware of their hard cutoffs, which you could not find anywhere on their website.

 

[ditritium monoxide]

I certainly hope that these numbers aren't standard for every school.

 

[CowboyNiceguy]

I certainly hope that these numbers aren't standard for every school.

They certainly are not. I got 4 interviews (15%).

 

[Curioso06]

Based on what you have shared you will be very competitive this cycle, so I would not wait.



I am an adcom, and I have spent a fair amount of time thinking about "yield." My advice is not to worry about this concept, as it can be quite misleading. Just because a school gets a ton of applications doesn't mean most of them are any good. Also, and this is important, if a school receives, say 10,000 applications and interviews 1,000 people, do not be fooled into thinking that there is a 10% chance of getting an interview. I am going to extrapolate some of my own experience here, but out of 10,000 initial applications you can toss about half without batting an eye, so the pool now becomes 5,000. To get 1,000 people to show up for interviews, you may have to invite 1,500.* Assuming you remain in the good half of the pool, your rough odds of getting an interview spot just went from a perceived 10% to (1500/5000 x 100) = 30%. If you are a competitive applicant (which you are) and a reasonable fit for a given school, your odds will further increase commensurately.

All of this is to say that identifying private or OOS-friendly schools where you fit within the 10th/90th is the appropriate place to start. Most people have to throw quite a bit of pudding at the wall in order to make some stick, and you will probably be no different, but do not let yourself become fearful or paralyzed over yield.


* This number varies a great deal by school, and nobody published their numbers, so don't assume that a 1.5 invite/interview ratio is anywhere near universal.

We see exactly the same thing at my school!

Perversely, it even holds true for faculty jobs.

What are the most common reasons why applicants are easily culled out of the initial group? Are there 1 or 2 factors that predominate?

 

[Med Ed]

What are the most common reasons why applicants are easily culled out of the initial group? Are there 1 or 2 factors that predominate?

GPA and MCAT. You would be shocked at the number of people who apply without any apparent idea of what makes for competitive numbers.

 

[Goro]

100% agree with this.

You would be surprised how many times people post here on Sdn with the nothing ventured, nothing gained mindset.

The schools appreciate the donations.

Another big mistake: people who apply from out of state to state schools that highly favored their own, where people who apply to very mission-specific schools like Howard.

GPA and MCAT. You would be shocked at the number of people who apply without any apparent idea of what makes for competitive numbers.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

I would toss out UConn, UCSD, UCLA, and Drexel. The first three have strong IS preferences, the latter will assume that you won't go there.

Unless I'm mistaken, UCR and UCD are the only California schools with a strong IS preference.

 

[CowboyNiceguy]

1Another big mistake: people who apply from out of state to state schools that highly favored their own

Rutgers for example -- 2076 OOS applicants, 40 interviewed, 1 matriculated. Or Florida. 1512 applicants, 43 interviewed, 16 matriculated.

 

[Med Ed]

Unless I'm mistaken, UCR and UCD are the only California schools with a strong IS preference.

I guess it's all relative. VCU admits almost half its class from OOS, and Vermont two thirds, despite being public institutions.

Compare that to UCSD (3,060 OOS apps, 190 interviewed, 29 matriculated in a class of 124) or UCLA (3,570 OOS apps, 150 interviewed, 31 matriculated in a class of 175).

Unless the OP has some compelling connection to San Diego or Los Angeles I think it's safe to say that applying to those institutions would be a waste of money.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

I guess it's all relative. VCU admits almost half its class from OOS, and Vermont two thirds, despite being public institutions.

Compare that to UCSD (3,060 OOS apps, 190 interviewed, 29 matriculated in a class of 124) or UCLA (3,570 OOS apps, 150 interviewed, 31 matriculated in a class of 175).

Unless the OP has some compelling connection to San Diego or Los Angeles I think it's safe to say that applying to those institutions would be a waste of money.

I just noticed that the OP is lacking ECs, but with their stats, they could have decent a shot at the UCs if they bolster their ECs, no?

 

[Med Ed]

I just noticed that the OP is lacking ECs, but with their stats, they could have decent a shot at the UCs if they bolster their ECs, no?

Three shadowing experiences, currently employed as research coordinator, can make a strong case for primary care, great rec from PI, some undergrad research, children's music teacher for 3 years, peer counselor for LGBTQ. With this package and a 3.95/521 the OP can have an acceptance in hand by the end of the calendar year. Why go chasing the UC dragon?

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Three shadowing experiences, currently employed as research coordinator, can make a strong case for primary care, great rec from PI, some undergrad research, children's music teacher for 3 years, peer counselor for LGBTQ. With this package and a 3.95/521 the OP can have an acceptance in hand by the end of the calendar year. Why go chasing the UC dragon?

Imo, there probably isn't a better dragon, but I see your point 🙂

 

[GrapesofRath]

Yes. They said (paraphrasing) "As you know, we have a minimum requirement of 150 hours of community service and healthcare exposure" (which they did not publish anywhere) and "we expect our class for 2016 to have over 800 hours of community service, and over 1800 hours of health care exposure."

It was nice to get a semi-personalized rejection. But I am already aware that those are my weak points and it was annoying that they wrote it as if I should be aware of their hard cutoffs, which you could not find anywhere on their website.

These average numbers can be very misleading and this especially relates to health care exposure hours.

There are always people every year a number of them who apply who worked in a clinical job for a number of years. Be it an Nurse, be it a phlebotomist, NA, even PAs etc. If you work 5 years full time in this type of job thats over 2000 hours. That adds up to around 11,000 hours if you do it for 5 years.

If a class of 100 on average has 1800 hours that is 180,000 hours total. Those 8 people I listed who work 11,000 hours that is 88,000 hours of the class right there. You can probably find another 5-10 who worked a couple years, maybe had 4,000 hours of experience. Another 30,000 hours accounted for right there.
That means the remaining 80-85 people only had a total of 60,000 clinical hours. That's about 700 per applicant. Still pretty high, but that's rather doable. Volunteering in a hospital one shift a week for 2 years alone can get you over 400.

Point is schools know what htey are doing inflating their numbers like this. Nobody is getting dropped at Rush because they have say only "600" hours of clinical experience despite that being 3X less than 1800.

 

[Med Ed]

Imo, there probably isn't a better dragon, but I see your point 🙂

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Ha!

I had a different analogy in mind, but I appreciate the humor.

 

[christmasindr]

I wouldn't worry too much about what schools you may get into and which ones you won't. It is like reading tea leafs. Even if we have your stats and ECs, there are still lots of factors that are important that we don't know (e.g. letters of rec, interview skills, personal statements, etc).

Simply use MSAR and apply a mix of schools that interest you, and don't apply the ones that are not friendly to OOS or you simply would hate to live in. You will get into somewhere that fit you if you follow the right steps.

 

[christmasindr]

I guess it's all relative. VCU admits almost half its class from OOS, and Vermont two thirds, despite being public institutions.

Compare that to UCSD (3,060 OOS apps, 190 interviewed, 29 matriculated in a class of 124) or UCLA (3,570 OOS apps, 150 interviewed, 31 matriculated in a class of 175).

Unless the OP has some compelling connection to San Diego or Los Angeles I think it's safe to say that applying to those institutions would be a waste of money.

Meh, if the OP is indeed interested in those schools, I don't see why not. It is only 2 schools and they do secondary application screening.

 

[Med Ed]

Meh, if the OP is indeed interested in those schools, I don't see why not. It is only 2 schools and they do secondary application screening.

OP asked for help cutting down his/her list, that's what has been offered.

 

[kiwifriend]

I wouldn't worry too much about what schools you may get into and which ones you won't. It is like reading tea leafs. Even if we have your stats and ECs, there are still lots of factors that are important that we don't know (e.g. letters of rec, interview skills, personal statements, etc).

Simply use MSAR and apply a mix of schools that interest you, and don't apply the ones that are not friendly to OOS or you simply would hate to live in. You will get into somewhere that fit you if you follow the right steps.

Thanks for all the responses, everyone!! I super appreciate all the feedback. What would everyone recommend as a good number of mid-tier and reach schools? I really wanna keep the list as short as possible. Currently the list is about 25 schools and is probably more top heavy than is wise. And I only have the one state school! I ideally need to stay near a major city because of my SO's work, so that does dictate some of my school preferences. But obviously I might need to branch out too!

Here is the work in progress:
UMass
Tufts
BU
Harvard
Yale
Hofstra
Columbia
NYU
Einstein
Mount Sinai
NYMC
UPenn
UChicago
Northwestern
St. Louis University (don’t really want to live here)
Stanford
UCSF
Keck - USC
Wake Forest (don’t really want to live here)
Vanderbilt
Emory
University of Miami
Tulane
Baylor (don’t really want to live here)

 

[Med Ed]

Thanks for all the responses, everyone!! I super appreciate all the feedback. What would everyone recommend as a good number of mid-tier and reach schools? I really wanna keep the list as short as possible. Currently the list is about 25 schools and is probably more top heavy than is wise. And I only have the one state school! I ideally need to stay near a major city because of my SO's work, so that does dictate some of my school preferences. But obviously I might need to branch out too!

Here is the work in progress:
UMass
Tufts
BU
Harvard
Yale
Hofstra
Columbia
NYU
Einstein
Mount Sinai
NYMC
UPenn
UChicago
Northwestern
St. Louis University (don’t really want to live here)
Stanford
UCSF
Keck - USC (LA)
Wake Forest (don’t really want to live here)
Vanderbilt
Emory
University of Miami
Tulane
Baylor (don’t really want to live here)

Wake Forest is in a pretty conservative region of the state, if that makes you hesitant then you should drop it. St. Louis is actually quite fun, although the continental climate can be brutal. Houston is actually great near the med center.

That said, if you are dodgy about SLU and Baylor, consider adding back Temple (currently an underrated school IMHO), and think about Pitt and/or Rochester.

 

[christmasindr]

Thanks for all the responses, everyone!! I super appreciate all the feedback. What would everyone recommend as a good number of mid-tier and reach schools? I really wanna keep the list as short as possible. Currently the list is about 25 schools and is probably more top heavy than is wise. And I only have the one state school! I ideally need to stay near a major city because of my SO's work, so that does dictate some of my school preferences. But obviously I might need to branch out too!

Here is the work in progress:
UMass
Tufts
BU
Harvard
Yale
Hofstra
Columbia
NYU
Einstein
Mount Sinai
NYMC
UPenn
UChicago
Northwestern
St. Louis University (don’t really want to live here)
Stanford
UCSF
Keck - USC (LA)
Wake Forest (don’t really want to live here)
Vanderbilt
Emory
University of Miami
Tulane
Baylor (don’t really want to live here)

If your heart is set for major cities, then focus on schools that are located in major cities (e.g. New York, Philadelphia, Boston, etc). Use MSAR to help you. That means you should also include Drexel and Temple for Philadelphia, and then Rosalind Franklin and Rush for Chicago area. I would also add Dartmouth since it is relatively close to Boston and Vermont because it is a good school IMO.

Without knowing you much personally, I would keep your list of schools 25-30. There's no reason for me to tell you to make the list short since you can always turn down interview offers if you get an acceptance somewhere.

 

[RuggerMD]

Mount Sinai would be a great fit. They've got research if you want it and a special primary care track program (you even get a partial tuition scholarship if I remember the email right).

 

[kiwifriend]

If your heart is set for major cities, then focus on schools that are located in major cities (e.g. New York, Philadelphia, Boston, etc). Use MSAR to help you. That means you should also include Drexel and Temple for Philadelphia, and then Rosalind Franklin and Rush for Chicago area. I would also add Dartmouth since it is relatively close to Boston and Vermont because it is a good school IMO.

Without knowing you much personally, I would keep your list of schools 25-30. There's no reason for me to tell you to make the list short since you can always turn down interview offers if you get an acceptance somewhere.

Well, I wanted to cut it down to closer to 15ish schools because I don't really have the money to apply to 25-30 schools. Would that be a terrible idea?

 

[christmasindr]

Well, I wanted to cut it down to closer to 15ish schools because I don't really have the money to apply to 25-30 schools. Would that be a terrible idea?

15 is risky, especially since you have an SO that wants to be able to settle down at a bigger city for jobs. Please save up money before you apply. Application fee is a drop in the bucket compared to what you will be spending for interview traveling (if you are fortunate enough).

 

[kiwifriend]

Hello everyone! Sorry for the bump!

I recently met with my pre-med dept to try to put together a final list of schools. I would love some feedback. You were all super helpful last time!

I can now apply to 25-30 schools so I don't really need to cut that many anymore, but should probably tweak the list. This is how my adviser classified them as target/reach/super reach (no such thing as a safety medical school). How does it look? Is the list way too top heavy for my ECs? (Anyone who wants more info on me/doesn't feel like reading the whole thread can check out my WAMC post (http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/high-gpa-mcat-weak-ecs-help-with-schools-please.1185645/). I pretty much summarize everything on there.

Thanks!!

Target:
UMass
Tufts
Boston University
Jefferson
Temple
Einstein
Hofstra
NYMC
Keck
Rosalind Franklin

Reach:
Emory
Sinai
NYU
Northwestern
Pitt

Super reach:
Harvard
Johns Hopkins
Columbia
Stanford
UChicago
Weill Cornell
Yale
UPenn
UCLA*
UCSF*
*Maybe shouldn’t apply because OOS but I really like San Francisco and I have family/friends in LA

Low yield but might apply anyway:
George Washington
Georgetown
Drexel
Brown*
*I know Brown doesn't interview very many applicants, but I really want to stay near Boston if possible.

 

[ridethecliche]

OP, is UMass your state school?

Guessing so given you state proximity to boston is of importance.

UConn, Temple, Drexel, UCSD, UCLA (Geffen), Georgetown, GW, Rush, and possibly Jefferson are likely going to be very low yield for you.

Other schools to consider include Rochester, Hofstra, Wake Forest, SLU, and Miami.

Curious why you think that about Jeff?