Programs with large number of D.O./Foreign M.D.'s

[dr aaron]

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hello, I am currently finishing up basic sciences here at St. Matthews on Grand Cayman.....I would love to eventually practice anesthesia. Just wondering if any of you guys could give me an idea of what programs traditionally take IMG's or D.O.'s, considering these will be the programs i will be applying for, thanks

 

[Canrenone]

New Mexico and Texas Tech.

 

[fascinoma]

i think that's an interesting strategy, but why don't you apply to programs you're interested in doing a residency at? The burden of the selection process lies on the program, not you--don't self-select yourself based on previous admissions from certain schools or certain degrees.

i think a better criteria would be board scores and transcript grades, but most programs will tell you that even those have some flexibility to them.

so...don't sell yourself short based on where you got your training! afterall, if you're interested in anesthesiology, you're already smarter than most! good luck!

 

[VentdependenT]

hello, I am currently finishing up basic sciences here at St. Matthews on Grand Cayman.....I would love to eventually practice anesthesia. Just wondering if any of you guys could give me an idea of what programs traditionally take IMG's or D.O.'s, considering these will be the programs i will be applying for, thanks

Cook County is primarily FMG.

BTW, I think your strategy STINKS. Apply where you want to go. Maybe you'll get into a place where you want to go. Not just where you can go.

 

[Pestanas]

My advice would be to incorporate both stategies.

It is a known fact that some programs are just FMG/IMG unfriendly. They have never taken any of them into their program and the likelihood of them accepting them in the future is unlikely -- but then again there is always a chance. So yes, if you are really interested in the program, you should go ahead and apply there, but to be safe you should definitley research programs that your school has a good reputation/relationship with and apply to plenty of those as well. If you have previous grads from your school there and they are impressing the staff, the programs are more likely to accept more students from your school.

In a perfect world you should just be able to apply to ONLY the places you want, but especially since you are an FMG, if Anesthesia is really want you want.....you have to be prepared to end up at Programs that may be way at the bottom of your list.

 

[lvspro]

Apply where you want to go. Maybe you'll get into a place where you want to go. Not just where you can go.

That being said, it's a good idea to hedge your bets. You could go to almost any programs web page where they'll have a list of the residents, and where they came from (school). Definitely apply to some of those programs jic.

 

[johankriek]

dont apply to anyplace in indiana.. your school is on the not accredited list in indiana..so you will never get a license in indiana nomatter how awesome you are. not a diss just a fact i happen to know

 

[urge]

dont apply to anyplace in indiana.. your school is on the not accredited list in indiana..so you will never get a license in indiana nomatter how awesome you are. not a diss just a fact i happen to know

True. St Matt is on the blacklist.

 

[InductionAgent]

hello, I am currently finishing up basic sciences here at St. Matthews on Grand Cayman.....I would love to eventually practice anesthesia. Just wondering if any of you guys could give me an idea of what programs traditionally take IMG's or D.O.'s, considering these will be the programs i will be applying for, thanks

You're not a DO, so all you need to worry about is which programs take IMGs. My program has taken several DOs over the past five years, but not a single IMG.

Good luck.

 

[timtye78]

Sorry but had to comment. DOs are not commonly lumped in with FMGs buddy. Maybe twenty years ago, but DOs from USA are actually quite competitive these days based on the match results from the past five or so years and just aren't very good yardsticks for lenient requirements for matching at ACGME residencies.

 

[mazinger]

Sorry but had to comment. DOs are not commonly lumped in with FMGs buddy. Maybe twenty years ago, but DOs from USA are actually quite competitive these days based on the match results from the past five or so years and just aren't very good yardsticks for lenient requirements for matching at ACGME residencies.

Timtye is absolutely right, DOs are considered first than fmgs, I have seen DOs getting up to 10+ ivs until now.. Meanwhile imgs are getting no more than 4 at best, I have seen a couple with good board scores 235+ and endin up with one iv.. Of course the iv season is not over yet and I still have some hope within me, that meanwhile all the people who are first on the list are canceling ivs we imgs can get some of the left overs...

 

[VentdependenT]

Well, whatever people thing about IMG's vs DO's vs ghostbusters vs professional wrestlers, you should still apply to places that interest you. Not places that are only jam paced with those lowly scum sucking DO's.

 

[timtye78]

Well, whatever people thing about IMG's vs DO's vs ghostbusters vs professional wrestlers, you should still apply to places that interest you. Not places that are only jam paced with those lowly scum sucking DO's.

 

[serenity]

hello, I am currently finishing up basic sciences here at St. Matthews on Grand Cayman.....I would love to eventually practice anesthesia. Just wondering if any of you guys could give me an idea of what programs traditionally take IMG's or D.O.'s, considering these will be the programs i will be applying for, thanks

Yale takes decent amounts of DOs and IMGs every year.For some reason they don't like carribean FMGs.

 

[epidural man]

Yale takes decent amounts of DOs and IMGs every year.For some reason they don't like carribean FMGs.

Maybe it is because a lot of them let the student essential pick were he does his 3rd and 4rth year, as long as the rotation has a name like "peds" or "OB/GYN", it seems to qualify.

I knew a guy that spent most of his 3rd and 4rth year golfing. Not that I wouldn't have minded not getting up at 3:30am on my pediatric surgery rotation, but I probably learned something doing it.

 

[miamidoc2b]

my advice to you is APPLY BROADLY!!! i'm a carribean FMG and that's what i did and i already have 9 interviews. i applied to about 100 programs and was hoping for only 6 interviews. don't let the stereotypes get you down. your medical school is only part of your application. do good on your boards, get good letters and apply broadly. good luck

 

[anesguy1012]

DOs and FMGs should not take the place of American school MDs. It's not fair. Everyone knows the former groups couldn't get in to allopathic US schools, yet they end up taking the spots of American allopathic MDs who may have a low board score or something like that.

 

[smgilles]

DOs and FMGs should not take the place of American school MDs. It's not fair. Everyone knows the former groups couldn't get in to allopathic US schools, yet they end up taking the spots of American allopathic MDs who may have a low board score or something like that.

LOL....maybe you should have studied harder for your boards.

 

[Trisomy13]

DOs and FMGs should not take the place of American school MDs. It's not fair. Everyone knows the former groups couldn't get in to allopathic US schools, yet they end up taking the spots of American allopathic MDs who may have a low board score or something like that.

this is funny. we have a CA-1 "fmg" who completed a surgery residency in a different country and scored >95 %ile on his anesthesia ITE a few months ago. as well as several DO residents who i'd let treat me before some MD attendings i know. you make some very broad assumptions about individuals motivations for choosing their paths to residency. a strong resident is a strong resident, regardless of their initials. and if someone "takes a spot" because they have a higher score on a standardized test, well... that's why the test is standardized, and they apparently are brighter and deserve that spot. 😴

 

[amyl]

Everyone knows the former groups couldn't get in to allopathic US schools, yet they end up taking the spots of American allopathic MDs who may have a low board score or something like that.

this is just plain not true. i only applied to one medical school (location/husband/financial) reasons. now he has to go with me where ever i get a residency. it was a deal we made. i am getting less interviews than a USMD with the same numbers on the usmle. there are USMDs here that are getting better interviews than me with worse numbers because i am a DO.
what i do agree with is opening up DO residencies to MDs. make them sit out a year and take an intensive osteopathic course or something if they need to be trained in OPP (plus DO schools could charge them for that year). everybody wins.

 

[Canrenone]

this is just plain not true. i only applied to one medical school (location/husband/financial) reasons. now he has to go with me where ever i get a residency. it was a deal we made. i am getting less interviews than a USMD with the same numbers on the usmle. there are USMDs here that are getting better interviews than me with worse numbers because i am a DO.
what i do agree with is opening up DO residencies to MDs. make them sit out a year and take an intensive osteopathic course or something if they need to be trained in OPP (plus DO schools could charge them for that year). everybody wins.

I think anesguy was trying to be funny/reactionary. Apparently this type of debate goes on in other forums and in MD schools. I found it amusing in a uppity sort of way.

 

[Planktonmd]

You're not a DO, so all you need to worry about is which programs take IMGs. My program has taken several DOs over the past five years, but not a single IMG.

Good luck.

I truly think that any program that does not take IMG's should be sued for discrimination and racism and I hope some one would do it so these bastards would stop being ignorant xenophobes and start acting like physicians and educators.
What a disgrace that in a country like the U.S. racism and bigotry are still practiced so openly.

 

[amyl]

I truly think that any program that does not take IMG's should be sued for discrimination and racism and I hope some one would do it so these bastards would stop being ignorant xenophobes and start acting like physicians and educators.
What a disgrace that in a country like the U.S. racism and bigotry are still practiced so openly.

i agree providing there is no language barrier. mastering english is key....for patients too btw.

 

[fakin' the funk]

I truly think that any program that does not take IMG's should be sued for discrimination and racism and I hope some one would do it so these bastards would stop being ignorant xenophobes and start acting like physicians and educators.
What a disgrace that in a country like the U.S. racism and bigotry are still practiced so openly.

Ohhhhhhhhh-kay...

I would like to hear more about what exactly your assumptions are in making these statements.

 

[Havelock]

not sure this person understands the definition of racism

 

[mazinger]

Ok, I am an img and I think there are a couple of things that we should consider at this time. I dont think it is a racist issue going on, because the US is multicultural country with a broad variety of ethnicities. So there are a lot of orginally non american US grads who are getting lots of ivs. So I dont think that ethnicity has a big impact on candidates selection process. What I think the big issue is that programs rather take their own grads than people of other countries. Why? Many reasons since their own people has gone through so many hassles to get to this point (prior selection process, loans, and stuff) why not give them a priority. What I dont think is right is that foreign MDs are totally neglected. Of course no one asked us to come here to US, but as history has been so far, most of the people who have migrated to the US did so because their countries did not provide all the resources to have a decent life. There are a lot of problems going on in the world right now and at many times people rather leave their countries and leave behind their most loved ones to search for a better life. In my case I am looking for a better life, and seeking for knowledge I am from a poor country and from my perspective we are a little behind in a few new techniques and technology. I want my country to evolve with the world and I want my people to gain knowledge. That is why I am traveling to the US, because I want to get trained and take this knowledge with me and start teaching what I learned to my people back home. So many reasons, so many lives, so many issues. I can assure you, its not easy for imgs to take the usmle, why? different type of questions, different language, sheer amount of information, no one at med school prepared us to take it. I studied very hard to get to this point, endless hours and nights behind a book. But, I think sometimes is very hard to be rejected and not considered for a position and keep a smile on my face after all my hard work.
I am grateful to this country who is giving me an opportunity to prove myself, and to possibly help others.
Bottom line is that I still consider US grads should get preference, but imgs should also get a chance to grow and to prove we are as good as local grads.
😀

 

[Planktonmd]

not sure this person understands the definition of racism

Racism is when you favor individuals of a certain genetic heritage over others and assume they are superior based on prefabricated profiles and stereotypes.
It is done behind closed doors in many residency programs, trust me on this one!

 

[Planktonmd]

Ohhhhhhhhh-kay...

I would like to hear more about what exactly your assumptions are in making these statements.

My assumptions are very obvious and stated clearly:
If you are not the typical all American medical student you have an up hill battle to prove your merit and you need to overcome many obstacles created by deeply rooted xenophobic and ******ed ideology.
This phenomenon is more predominant in programs that consider themselves "top programs" and it's going to take generations to fix it because as I said it comes from deeply established prejudice that ignores reality.

 

[Lonestar]

thats why residency evaluations should be taken with a grain of salt. Btw, the same racist mentality applies for places that have plenty of FMG attendings that favor certain IMGs over AMGs. just food for thought.

 

[mazinger]

 

[mazinger]

thats why residency evaluations should be taken with a grain of salt. Btw, the same racist mentality applies for places that have plenty of FMG attendings that favor certain IMGs over AMGs. just food for thought.

I think you are right, there should be at least a place like that, but I dont think there are that many places.. Vast majority of programs completely ignore img applicants.
Have many img friends with decent creds, have no ivs, at the same time amgs are cancelling ivs because they have 20+ ivs so far...
It is not a perfect world and it is not a perfect system, and no one asked imgs to come to USA in the first place right? Just because of that, is it fair for a lot of good foreign doctors to be completely left out in a blank? with no possible chance of getting into a program? I dont think so...
just my thoughts...

 

[Gern Blansten]

Medical schools are increasing class sizes to pump out more physicians, yet the government does not expand funding for more residency positions at the same pace. How can the system expect to absorb all of the US grads + all of the IMGs? Somewhere along the way, someone will be disappointed.

Should we all go to the Derm, Ortho, Ophth, and Plastics boards and demand that they take IMGs as well? They are clearly not pulling their weight in that department. While we're at it, we should demand that they take some of the candidates with low USMLE scores and low class ranks. Everybody would be happy then because that would be the fair thing to do.

Anesthesiology will eventually cycle around again, and there will be plenty of IMGs getting spots that US grads don't want. It is all a cycle. IMGs usually migrate to the least competitive specialties that are easier to get into. Anesthesiology has been there not too long ago and will be there again. It is hard to fault programs that have been flooded with stellar US grads for choosing to interview them. I suspect most programs have so many applicants, they wish they could interview twice as many as they are.

 

[titanjones]

boston university has a ton