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Pros and Cons list - INPUT!!

Discussion in 'Pre-Dental' started by RAK1987, Dec 13, 2008.

  1. RAK1987

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    just trying to make a list of pros and cons for these schools - - just wondering if anyone had something to add!!!

    UConn / Columbia / Penn w/ scholarship

    ready, set, go!!
     
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  3. somethinpositiv

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    Columbia should not be considered within those three. It is the most expensive, and in my opinion, the other two are light years better.
     
    #2 somethinpositiv, Dec 13, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2008
  4. tjdent

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    Says the predent who didn't interview at any of the three...
     
  5. somethinpositiv

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    Columbia
    - MOST EXPENSIVE OF THE THREE (most important point)
    - Classes with Med Students
    - Strong Didactics
    - Washington Heights among the worst locals in NYC
    - Weak Clinical Training (reputation on these boards)
    - Run down facilities
    - Medium class size
    - Excellent Specialization rate
    - rides Ivy name
    - EXPENSIVE & overrated

    Penn:
    - Dean's Scholarship (otherwise there would be no question, to choose UConn)
    - Great Clinics
    - Large Class Size
    - Excellent Didactics
    - Amazing campus
    - Philly is disgusting
    - Rides Ivy name
    - Classrooms = basement dungeons
    - Large Class Size (definitely a con)
    - Excellent Specialization rate

    UConn
    - Affordability
    - Great facilities
    - Small class size = individual attention & better education
    - Take Med classes, in addition to Dent classes
    - Challenging curriculum
    - Excellent Didactics
    - Boring college town
    - world-class Basketball (#2) & Football
    - Superb Clinics
    - Accredation
    - Excellent Specialization rate
    - bf, for support and relieve stress
     
  6. somethinpositiv

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    Says the predent who didn't apply to any of the three. I didn't think I had the stats for UConn or UPenn. I definitely have the stats for Columbia, but I'd rather go to even NYU or any of the 10 other schools I applied to.

    She asked for opinions here bud, why don't you share your opinions, rather than critique mine ;)
     
  7. Flipper405

    Flipper405 "Excessive" flosser
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    You listed large class size twice for Penn...
     
  8. somethinpositiv

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    It's so large that it had to be listed twice to accomodate the size ;)

    You got any opinions or advice for the OP, Flipper?
     
  9. somethinpositiv

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  10. nydds25

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    One interesting this about Columbia is the new curriculum. You will not learn about teeth, or start pre-clinical skills until mid year through the 2nd year. It is a radical change from what they have now... dental classes along with med classes and friday all day in pre-clinic.

    Unfortunately, since no one has experienced this curiculum, the current students their can not give feedback. Some seemed skeptical about it, while others said its a good idea.
     
  11. 206127

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    This is a no brainer IMO...

    YOU GOT A SCHOLARSHIP!!! + UPenn is a great school...

    I'm with somethinpositiv... Columbia should be at the bottom of the list (I interviewed there...)
     
  12. Flipper405

    Flipper405 "Excessive" flosser
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    I dunno... I'm facing a similar choice except without the scholarship at Penn. If I had that scholarship, I would pick Penn in a heartbeat. I haven't heard from my state school yet either =/
     
  13. Dentgirl09

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    I currently shadow a dentist who teaches at UPENN and is an alum as well.... he told me not to go there. I of course told him I didn't have the stats anyway!!

    But he said that he hired 4 dentists from UPENN in his practice over the past 2 years (mostly bc he felt proud to hire fellow alums) and has fired all 4 due to lack of clinical skills.. he said they had caused more harm than good in the office and he sent more $$ fixing their mistakes rather than doing it himself....

    But... these are individuals who have specialized.... and I'm not sure how it is related exactly?

    I have not done my research on UPENN so don't take my word for it, and don't criticize my input.... its just a thought..... but do some research, perhaps?

    Just pointing it out incase you want to look into it.
     
  14. tjdent

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    Given your username I would think you would have said "go to Uconn because...blah blah blah somethinpositiv". But you decided to give us "whatever you do don't go to Columbia", which is not somethinpositiv. :thumbdown:

    And whether you applied or not is irrelevant. You've never been there... so im just not sure why you singled Columbia out and passed such strong judgment based on your second-hand, through the grape-vine knowledge of the place. That being said, it was nice of you to go through all that trouble to make those lists so Im sure you're not that bad of a guy. Im just annoyed by all the Columbia resent on SDN. Its in Manhattan, has superb specialization rates, and is cheaper than many many other private schools. There are tons of reasons to go there. The haters are wack.

    Here's my opinion for the OP. You've been to all three schools. If you want real advice get in contact with current students at the schools. Don't listen to any of us, we don't know nearly as much as we pretend we do. Good luck!
     
  15. 206127

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    I applied to Columbia thinking it was the best school in the nation, and I came to that conclusion from reading SDN. It wasn't until I went on my interview that I decided applying to Columbia was a mistake (FOR ME). It's not that we are haters of Columbia, it's just not a good fit for many people. You bring up good reasons why people should go to Columbia but it's important to see things from all angles. I only read the pros to attending Columbia, I wish I would of read some of the cons...
     
  16. MiamiNole20

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    I'm trying to understand your post: You're saying that even AFTER specializing, these students were lacking clinically? I find that hard to believe. I mean, if they all specialized, they all probably went to 4 different specialty programs. Did all those programs suck that bad? Please clarify.
     
  17. dentite12345

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    To the OP, whats the scholarship amount (you don't need to outright tell me), meaning which is cheaper for four years:
    UCONN after switching residency for the second year? Or UPENN with the scholarship? By how much?
    Figure that out and if their is a major difference go with the cheaper.
    I interviewed at Columbia and was impressed, but not nearly enough to take out those extra loans, especially compared to what I would pay and get from UCONN.


    I'm assuming ( Dentgirl09 correct me) that since they specialized their gp skills were a little out of practice, im sure that whatever they specialized in they were on top of. But specialize or not you are not going to be private practice worthy at anything right out of school, just not enough practice.

    Im sure UPENN would not hae the reputation it does if many of their graduates were constantly being fired from jobs.

    Some of it depends on the person not the school they attend.
     
  18. tjdent

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    I totally agree with you that some schools are good for people and are bad for other people. And I apologize if I came off as saying that Columbia is the greatest school ever and that everyone should want to go there bc I don't beleive that. But it is getting a bad and undeserved rap on SDN. I understand that schools will and should get criticized in a This School vs. That School thread. But read the Columbia Acceptance thread, a thread that should be full of happy people excited to go to school there. But its not, its dominated by a few people bad-mouthing the school over and over again... on an Acceptance thread!! Thats hating.
     
  19. 206127

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    Hmmm... well it must be that Columbia picked the wrong people the first round (good news people waiting for an answer). I remember seeing a few threads people opened up asking about their chances at Columbia after dec 1st because it was their top choice, so there are Columbia supporters on here. As for the reason for all the "bad-mouthing"... I think this just goes back to one school being good for someone while bad for another. I feel Columbia is very different from other schools (in many aspects) and just not what most of us are looking for. Give it time I'm sure there'll be plenty of "happy people" and less bashing in there soon enough...

    And seriously 9 acceptances!!!?? Congrats! All great schools IMO. Looks like you need to open up a thread similar to this one, or have you decided already?
     
  20. klutzy1987

    klutzy1987 StudyingSucks Letsgo Mets
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    I would say to take Columbia out of the mix. The base your decision on finances. If Uconn is cheaper go there, if not go to Penn. Both are awesome schools and you cant go wrong with either one.
     
  21. klutzy1987

    klutzy1987 StudyingSucks Letsgo Mets
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    Thats cuz its very easily badmouthed. It is an Ivy league school that doesnt live up to its reputation. It isnt badmouthed for no reason. I am asuming tat youve been there?? Som then you know what a dump the place is.
     
  22. Aceofspades

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    No, because you are an admitted and avid Columbia hater. You started the official Columbia with a negative note (you claimed you got accepted but in all likelihood wouldn't go). Why even start the thread in the first place then? This is just you and a few other anonymous SDN internet keyboard warrior losers.

    Your opinions that Columbia is a dump/worthless/overrated is funny and holds no weight. If people (dentists, program directors, REAL people) really thought that then you wouldn't see Columbia grads rise to such a high level of success. The people who really want to go should start a new official thread so they can network or do whatever other ppl do on these "official" threads.

    Stony Brook? Haha, don't get me started. Bashing Columbia will NOT make Stony Brook look better. Still waiting for Harvard? In any case, I normally wouldn't quote myself but this must be repeated:

     
  23. klutzy1987

    klutzy1987 StudyingSucks Letsgo Mets
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    1. I have no problem stating my opinion of Columbia face to face with anybody. Anyone who went there for an interview can attest to how disgusting the school was. The place looked rundown and decrepit. I dont understand why people like yourself defend Columbia. It just isnt a nice facility. As for their curriculum, their grads have no clinical experience and are not prepared for the real world. When you are a clinician, research and didactics dont help you much. Those are Columbia's best selling points.

    2. I dont need to defend Stonybrook at all. Its reputation and high standards defend itself. Not to mention that it is my state school and is half the price of almost any other school. But please get started on Stonybrook, the only negative? i know is that its mixes medical and dental classes and the nieghborhood is boring.

    3. Im actually not waiting on Harvard, I couldnt care less if I got accepted there. I have no intentions or interest in going there.

    4. I started the Columbia thread cuz I was bored at work and it gave me something to do.

    There are a couple of schools that I havent heard back from that I would like to, namely Penn and Uconn, because those two are absolutely awesome schools and IMO just as good as Stonybrook. Otherwise I dont need to hear back from any more schools. Please enlighten me as to your seemingly high opinions of Columbia ad what you may know about Stonybrook that others don't. I'd love to know.
     
  24. Aceofspades

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    I defend Columbia because you and your small band of Columbia hating keyboard warriors keep bashing it. The level of criticism Columbia is taking on SDN is unrealistically high and is being perpetuated by a small group with an axe to grind. You claim you interviewed there, but many of your Columbia bashing cohorts have not even seen the school.

    The term nice facility means different things to different people but I wonder how many people interpret this to mean "nice shiny marble floors". That is not what defines a nice facility. As for your ask anyone who interviewed there comment... no offense but look at the pre-dents on this site. How many ABC vs. XYZ threads have we seen pop up lately. Anyone capable of independent thought, or simply looking at the 100 other posts just like theirs, would not be posting such rubbish. I bet they will just count up the votes from SDN predents (many who have no firsthand knowledge of the school(s) being discussed) and go with that. Does that sound smart to you? If I were to make a ABC vs. XYZ thread to the schools you interviewed at do you think Stony Brook would win the most pre-dent votes? Pre-dent votes don't mean much to me either.

    Out of respect for myself and Stony Brook I will not conduct myself in a manner in which you conduct yourself daily on SDN. It's funny, because many of the same feelings you have toward Columbia I have towards Stony Brook.

    A very small class size and classes with the med students yet they still have an ABC/F grading system. What's the point? The point is they don't have the rep to go P/F or H/P/F.

    You get to stick with your patients for life? Yea, you better because most of the Stony Brook students wind up living in that area for life. For those of you not familiar with NY, Stony Brook is no NYC. You can see farms out in the boondocks. Kids hang out at the local Wal-Mart. You get my drift?

    Specialty rate? Haha, Stony Brook's specialty rate is average and nowhere as high as Columbia.

    Great school? To some people maybe, but how many people have heard of Stony Brook outside of the NY/New England area? Guess that doesn't matter to you because you will be living there for the foreseeable rest of your life.

    Cheap? Yes, much cheaper than Columbia. I am all for students going to the cheapest school. I think dental school tuition/fees are outrageous and the payback will be a burden for many decades. However, it should be noted that Stony Brook is in Long Island. Long Island has some pretty high property taxes, sales tax, and many other forms of tax. If NY is your home state then I would suggest Buffalo. Buffalo has lower living expenses.

    I won't go on, bashing Stony Brook across multiple threads and trying to conjure up negative feelings against the school like you have with Columbia. I don't have an agenda against Stony Brook like you do with Columbia. More importantly, I have a life and more important things to do than to bash schools. I just created this post, and a few others defending Columbia because I just couldn't stand by idly while you and your cohorts ran a muck. I am done with this stupid petty banter.

    Pre-dents, BE INDEPENDENT. You went to the damm school to interview! Did you have the sense to speak to students and ask thoughtful questions? Did you talk to your dental field collagues (real life ones, not internet ones)? If you did then you should have a good idea about the school(s) you have been accepted to. If not, well then you are an idiot. Sorry, but that just needs to be said.
     
  25. somethinpositiv

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    Really? I've never been there? I did what a lot of people interviewing at NYU did, which was to also check out Columbia. And you know what? NYU blew me away. Columbia just blew.
     
  26. klutzy1987

    klutzy1987 StudyingSucks Letsgo Mets
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    I personally will do my time at in Long Island and move out after school. However that being said, NYC sucks, itys way too loud and te people there are very rude. I am from NYC so its not like I have anything against it. I am not going to debate whether or not Stonybrook is a bettern school than Columbia, obvio0usly you have your opinions and I have mine. However it definitely is not on the same level as Uconn or Penn. Both those schools are better in every aspect besides for location.(even though columbia isnt in the most happening neighborhood.) That is what my point was in the first place. Penn and Uconn are two of the top 4 schools on the east coast.
     
  27. Doh Boy Fresh

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    hahaha - you got powned!!!!
     
  28. 206127

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    Ok well you asked... and no I'm not one of those people who go around here talking crap about Columbia, I think I sort of defended it on this thread a little.
    I went to Columbia and hated it. Seriously the facilities were disgusting, and not just the floors. My mom is a dentists and we just renovated our office, the chairs at Columbia look like the chairs we got rid of (20 yr old chairs). The school was very dirty, not something you want to see in a dental clinic. The interview day was very unorganized, which gave me a very bad impression of the school. Then I found the students to be very arrogant, with the exception of one student that I spoke to (who btw did not like being there). The instructors moved around us like we were in the way, they didn't want to answer our questions. Yes Columbia has a great name, but the fact of the matter is they have to specialize because they aren't as skilled clinically. If you remember many of them went into the General Practice Residency, can you really call that a specialty. That residency is in place to get you up to par clinically. For someone who wants to be a general dentist, like myself, Columbia is horrible.
    Also at the interview Dr. McManus said, "... so who's going into dentistry for the money??.." no one raised their hands and he said, "... oh wow you guys are at the wrong school...." I think everyone in there was like wtf...
     
  29. Maregbe1

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    Honestly there is a lot of Columbia bashing on here (even though I was highly disappointed by it when I went to interview.) But honestly OP the decision is on you and nobody else. What I would do is this pretend that all these 3 schools were in the same city and choose from there. I feel that will honestly let you know which school was best suited for you without getting pulled in bc you want to be here or there. I too had to make the same decision as you and was pulled in bc i wanted to be in New York but when i did this I realized what school i liked the best. N please don't get suckered in by P/F, that doesn't mean its going to be easy or create a less cut throat atmosphere. Honestly if you were able to work hard and get into all three schools with your stats, I don't think you will have any trouble doing it with a grading scale of an A,B,C,.... Just think how impressive you would look if you go all A's in comparison with all P's applying to the same speciality program. Don't doubt yourself just pick the school which made the best impression on you. GOOD LUCK
     
    #28 Maregbe1, Dec 15, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2008
  30. somethinpositiv

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    LMAO! :laugh:
     
  31. pbrooks

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    this argument is probably being really helpful to the OP...
     
  32. caloriefree

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    But Columbia has H's, which I think would look just as impressive.

    BTW, does anybody know what % of class gets that H mark at Columbia?
    Any rough ideas?
     
  33. tjdent

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    Hahahaha you need a life man. You spent your free time during your trip to New York City traveling all the way uptown to check out a dental school you didn't even apply to? you're lamer than I thought
     
  34. somethinpositiv

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    I was born in New York and lived in the northeast for half of my life, I've been to NYC plenty of times and it's not some magical place for me, like it is for you.

    And you are so right. I'm also visiting friends at UConn this winter break and checking out the dental school facilities while I'm there, so I can get a broader perspective on dental schools in general, even though I didn't apply there. I am so lame... :rolleyes:
     
  35. tjdent

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    So you lived in upstate NY from ages 0-12, making you an NYC expert and completely jading you of Manhattan? Yep, makes perfect sense.

    NYC = Disneyland for me... so magical. :love: Ive been defending Columbia, not hyping NYC. You don't see me preaching about NYU at all, and its in a better part of NYC.

    The truth is that we are being ridiculous and not benefiting Mr. OP so Im done bickering with you. Although its been an entertaining distraction from finals.
     
  36. somethinpositiv

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    I lived in upstate NY? from ages 0-12? I'm an NYC expert? I'm completely jaded of Manhattan?

    I'm not sure where you got any of that, I never said any of those things, I never said or pretended I was the NYC expert, nor are any of those things you said of me true. I'm really not sure how you fabricate these things out of thin air, but I love you anyways TJ. :love:

    True, we are. Done bickering with me? That's a shame. It has been most entertaining. And it's Ms. OP by the way, not sure why everyone assumes any OP to be male on any given thread lol. I think she has enough info to make an educated decision.
     
  37. Columbia07

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    My warmest regards. :cool:
     

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