Puerto Rico Med school questions, need advice

[Paulz]

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Just wondering a few things about these schools?

1.What have people heard of them? I know international schools are "generally" looked down up on but an international option may be better for something in my future.

2.Do these schools speak English? My Spanish is really good but I'd feel more comfortable in English. I am hoping to visit Puerto Rico in August and set up a visit to the three schools they have down there and am wondering if I can call and set up everything in English or if it's all in Spanish.

3.Is the language of instruction English or Spanish?

Universidad Central del Caribe, Ponce School of Medicine, Univeristy oF Puerto Rico - San Juan are the three I am talking about.

Thank you

Paulz

 

[WinterLights]

Wasn't there a thread like this just a few days ago?

 

[notepreocupes]

yeah posted pretty much this same question a day or two ago. if you scroll down you'll find (or just click on me and see the threads i've started). towards the end of the thread, a med student from U of Puerto Rico (i think) comes on and seems like he knows his stuff, I'd look there

 

[Paulz]

Really my bad I typed it into the title bar and nothing recently came up, it's normally really good with that stuff. Let me go try to find it. Sorry for now. Hope I can find it.

 

[DieselD]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=540234

there you go.

 

[Dr Lyss]

1. correct me if I'm wrong, but the PR schools are not international schools since PR is not another country. If you look at their stats they are significantly lower than mainland US schools and I'm not sure of how a degree from these schools is looked at though

2 & 3. PR in general speaks both english & spanish (primarily spanish the farther you get from the city). The PR medical schools use both and require proficiency in both languages. They should speak English at the university offices

Look closely at the selection factors of these schools because I'm pretty sure they take very few OOS applicants. I know Uni of PR does not take any non-residents.

Good luck!

 

[HumidBeing]

Universidad Central del Caribe

Ponce School of Medicine

University of Puerto Rico - San Juan

Puerto Rico is a U.S. territory. As far as I know, graduates from those schools are not considered foreign medical school graduates.

Very few non-Puerto Rican resident students are accepted into the third school. I don't know about the other two. Students must be fluent in Spanish to the extent of being considered bi-lingual in order to gain admission to any of them.

 

[Dr Who]

Universidad Central del Caribe

Ponce School of Medicine

University of Puerto Rico - San Juan

Puerto Rico is a U.S. territory. As far as I know, graduates from those schools are considered foreign medical school graduates.

Very few non-Puerto Rican resident students are accepted into the third school. I don't know about the other two. Students must be fluent in Spanish to the extent of being considered bi-lingual in order to gain admission to any of them.

HumidBeing you were right as to PR being a US territory and so considered part of the US, but are wrong as to PR graduates being considered foreign medical graduates. All 4 med schools in PR are accredited by the LCME, and as such are considered US medical schools. When they graduate they compete as US graduates in the match. Read my post on the other thread in regards to PR schools.

 

[HumidBeing]

HumidBeing you were right as to PR being a US territory and so considered part of the US, but are wrong as to PR graduates being considered foreign medical graduates. All 4 med schools in PR are accredited by the LCME, and as such are considered US medical schools. When they graduate they compete as US graduates in the match. Read my post on the other thread in regards to PR schools.

I'm terribly sorry. That was unintentional on my part. I have a bad habit of skipping words when I'm typing. 😳 Unfortunately, one of my most frequently skipped words is, "not." That was supposed to say ". . . not considered foreign. . ." Doesn't make much sense to say PR is a U.S. territory, so it's foreign; does it? at myself.

 

[135892]

I'm terribly sorry. That was unintentional on my part. I have a bad habit of skipping words when I'm typing. 😳 Unfortunately, one of my most frequently skipped words is, "not." That was supposed to say ". . . not considered foreign. . ." Doesn't make much sense to say PR is a U.S. territory, so it's foreign; does it? at myself.

nice save

 

[HumidBeing]

nice save

Not so nice that it's also one of the words that I sometimes miss noticing when reading. It's especially aggravating when it's in a test question. 😡

 

[edwinvazquez]

Paulz:

No need to look down on P.R. medical schools since, contrary to what you think, they are not international schools. They are considered American schools and are accredited by the same associations as any other med school in the states. Remember that Puerto Rico is part of the U.S.A. In fact, the University of Puerto Rico Medical School is more competitive than many mainland schools and, unless you have close to a 4.0 GPA and an extremely good MCAT score, don't even bother to apply.

The other two are less competitive than U.P.R. but are also fully accredited so competition is stiff.

Regarding language both Spanish and English are used. It depends on the professor who teaches the course. All textbooks are in English.

Good luck.🙂

 

[Charles English]

Not so nice that it's also one of the words that I sometimes miss noticing when reading. It's especially aggravating when it's in a test question. 😡

yeah, 'not' definitely changes things. have you ever had a question (not standardized, but from a tricksy prof) that has double negatives? i have.
boo indeed.

 

[jackson1]

does anyone know how strict they are on the bilingual requirement? I know spanish fairly well after taking it for 5 years, but I wouldn't consider myself fluent. I'm sure I'd pick it up after a few months though. Thanks!

 

[WinterLights]

Paulz:

No need to look down on P.R. medical schools since, contrary to what you think, they are not international schools. They are considered American schools and are accredited by the same associations as any other med school in the states. Remember that Puerto Rico is part of the U.S.A. In fact, the University of Puerto Rico Medical School is more competitive than many mainland schools and, unless you have close to a 4.0 GPA and an extremely good MCAT score, don't even bother to apply.

The other two are less competitive than U.P.R. but are also fully accredited so competition is stiff.

Regarding language both Spanish and English are used. It depends on the professor who teaches the course. All textbooks are in English.

Good luck.🙂

I do not believe that this is true.

 

[Dr Who]

I do not believe that this is true.

Believe it or not it is. I attend UPR and as part of a seminar they give students before MS III they gave us official school statistics as to USMLE performance. For the last few years UPR has had at or above 90% passing rates for students who took the USMLE for the first time. The match list was pretty impressive, with students in the most well known and competitive residency programs.

My point is that for some reason many people here assume that the quality of education is somehow "inferior" to those at US mainland schools. As mentioned in an earlier post all 4 schools are accredited by exactly the same accrediting body that accredits all other med schools, the LCME. As such they have to achieve and MAINTAIN a quality of medical education as evidenced by standardized exams (USMLE steps 1, 2 and 3) and residency placements. Just last year one school achieved the maximum accreditation rating (number of years accreditation) while another was newly accredited. I believe that to be proof that they have met the standards of quality medical education demanded by the LCME.

As for GPA and MCAT scores, one of the most common misconceptions concerning PR schools is that anyone can enter with a low MCAT score. They base this on the scores reported on the MSAR, which state that students are accepted with scores as low as 20. This is both true and incorrect. Due to the social realities of PR, most students here speak english as a second language, as such they usually score much lower on the MCAT when compared to US mainland students. Just imagine taking one of the most difficult exams you have ever taken in french. Add to that that as part of the exam you have to write two essays in less than one hour and you have a verbal component which is fully one third of the exam that even native french speakers find difficult. PR med schools know this and scale their exams to reflect this, but ONLY for PR residents. As you can probably guess this totally skews the stats for the incoming class, hence the low numbers.

If you are a US mainland applicant then they use a standard scale where you are compared to and compete against all other US mainland applicants. So they have to have more competitive scores in order to get an interview, at least a 25 or 26 on their MCAT.

Another thing to keep in mind is that as more people find out bout PR schools more will apply. All three private med schools have class sizes of around 60 people, with more than half reserved for island residents, so that leaves around 20- 25 seats available for US mainland residents.
There was a time not too long ago when PR schools were not well known and not many people applied. In those days anyone with a decent application (3.4 GPA, 23 MCAT) had more than a decent chance to get an interview invite. These days the number of applicants to PR schools have skyrocketed, so it has gotten a little bit more difficult. on the other side there is good news, the LCME has recently accredited another med school in PR, San juan Bautista, so that means that many more seats available.

 

[speakingboricua]

I'm not a med student or anything even close, but somehow this got forwarded to me and I wanted to share my two cents.

From everything I've heard UPR is an EXCELLENT school. But even more than that, Puerto Rico is a great place to study medicine. The island is fascinated with all things medical. The biggest industry for quite a while has been pharmaceuticals, there are multiple pharmacies in every neighborhood (and most neighborhoods are a couple minutes away from the last), doctors and nurses, while certainly having some difficulties, are everywhere and generally prospering, and there are a lot of unique and different health conditions on the island as compared to the U.S. Plus, you get to live in a different culture (on a tropical island!) while studying medicine.

Here's a blog a friend of mine has... she went to PR to study a bit at the medical school this summer and is narrating her adventures (along with some med stuff): http://studentinsanjuan.blogspot.com/

If you have any questions about the island in general I'd be happy to help.

 

[tsunamiking]

UPR does not accept out of state, unless you just didn't want to mention that you have a connection to Puerto Rico. Also, there is San Juan Bautista which is US accredited!!! I applied and have an interview next month 🙂

Good luck!

 

[Organic20]

I just have a quick question. I am Puerto Rican and I used to live in the island up to 2006 where I relocate to US. So, I will like to apply to the University of Puerto Rico because I considered it a great institution since my parents both studied there. So my question is do I have a chance to get an interview even though I am not living in PR. I have good stats 3.7 cummulative and 3.65 science. No MCAT yet.

 

[anoncurious]

Paulz:

No need to look down on P.R. medical schools since, contrary to what you think, they are not international schools. They are considered American schools and are accredited by the same associations as any other med school in the states. Remember that Puerto Rico is part of the U.S.A. In fact, the University of Puerto Rico Medical School is more competitive than many mainland schools and, unless you have close to a 4.0 GPA and an extremely good MCAT score, don't even bother to apply.

The other two are less competitive than U.P.R. but are also fully accredited so competition is stiff.

Regarding language both Spanish and English are used. It depends on the professor who teaches the course. All textbooks are in English.

Good luck.🙂

HAHAHAHAHHAHA!! Are you ******ed or something? Why would you say something like that? The average mcat is a 22! (according to MSAR) Most can get a 22 by only completing 2 out of the 3 (numbered) sections on the mcat. OP, if you have ANY choices, don't go to Puerto Rico..you dont just learn from professors, you also learn from your peers..and your peers there aren't exactly the crem de la crem..

 

[Organic20]

HAHAHAHAHHAHA!! Are you ******ed or something? Why would you say something like that? The average mcat is a 22! (according to MSAR) Most can get a 22 by only completing 2 out of the 3 (numbered) sections on the mcat. OP, if you have ANY choices, don't go to Puerto Rico..you dont just learn from professors, you also learn from your peers..and your peers there aren't exactly the crem de la crem..

Can you imagine yourself taking the MCAT in Chinese, Urdu or Russian. So it is the same situation that face many puerto ricans that take the test. I have to admit that in Puerto Rico you have to take English in school. However, it is not a formal class where the professors teach you grammar, writing and verbal skills. It is basically a reading class where the students learn to read in English but the 75 percent does not understand what they are reading. Therefore, with this in mind HOW IN THE WORLD MAINLAND PUERTO RICANS WHO ARE NOT EXPOSED TO THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE EVERYDAY CAN EXCELL IN A TEST THAT IS IN ENGLISH. WORST OF ALL THIS TEST INCLUDES A SECTION CALLED "VERBAL" WHICH IS OBVIOUSLY TESTING STUDENTS THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE.

I can tell you that the University of Puerto Rico is a better school than most of the us low stats universities. If you look the msar book you will see that the school median Overall GPA is 3.7 and the science GPA 3.6 which are pretty similar to the Penn State University stats. Actually, Wright State University has the same GPA.

I don’t think that the University of Puerto Rico is the worst med school. The school has reasonable GPA stats and the MCAT median is a 23 which is reasonable because is a test in a foreign language.
I believe that it is worse a school like Morehouse which has a median MCAT OF 27. Because most of the students here(Morehouse) English is their first language and still get bad scores. What this means is that many Americans who English is their first language still do horrible in the MCAT.

To the OP consider the University of Puerto Rico because is a good University regardless of the median MCAT scores.

By the way this is not a troll. I am just explaining to anoncurious

 

[Dr Who]

HAHAHAHAHHAHA!! Are you ******ed or something? Why would you say something like that? The average mcat is a 22! (according to MSAR) Most can get a 22 by only completing 2 out of the 3 (numbered) sections on the mcat. OP, if you have ANY choices, don't go to Puerto Rico..you dont just learn from professors, you also learn from your peers..and your peers there aren't exactly the crem de la crem..

anoncurious, If you took the time to READ the previous posts then you would understand a few basic realities about med school in PR and why MSAR numbers appear lower than mainland schools.
There is a thing called analytical thinking, I suggest you use it. Otherwise you are just spewing misinformed opinions in these forums. I dont mean to offend, but these forums are meant to inform and present information in such a way as to help our peers make the best decisions for them. As such we should all try to give information as clear and precise as possible. Talking rubish about a school, and a place you know nothing about using only some number you read from the MSAR as yout "proof" only serves to reveal you for the misinformed troll you seem to be.

For those that truly want information there are quite a few here who actually go to PR or have been there. I am pretty sure they will be more than happy to answer any of your doubts.

Dr Who

 

[anoncurious]

Can you imagine yourself taking the MCAT in Chinese, Urdu or Russian. So it is the same situation that face many puerto ricans that take the test. I have to admit that in Puerto Rico you have to take English in school. However, it is not a formal class where the professors teach you grammar, writing and verbal skills. It is basically a reading class where the students learn to read in English but the 75 percent does not understand what they are reading. Therefore, with this in mind HOW IN THE WORLD MAINLAND PUERTO RICANS WHO ARE NOT EXPOSED TO THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE EVERYDAY CAN EXCELL IN A TEST THAT IS IN ENGLISH. WORST OF ALL THIS TEST INCLUDES A SECTION CALLED "VERBAL" WHICH IS OBVIOUSLY TESTING STUDENTS THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE.

I can tell you that the University of Puerto Rico is a better school than most of the us low stats universities. If you look the msar book you will see that the school median Overall GPA is 3.7 and the science GPA 3.6 which are pretty similar to the Penn State University stats. Actually, Wright State University has the same GPA.

I don't think that the University of Puerto Rico is the worst med school. The school has reasonable GPA stats and the MCAT median is a 23 which is reasonable because is a test in a foreign language.
I believe that it is worse a school like Morehouse which has a median MCAT OF 27. Because most of the students here(Morehouse) English is their first language and still get bad scores. What this means is that many Americans who English is their first language still do horrible in the MCAT.

To the OP consider the University of Puerto Rico because is a good University regardless of the median MCAT scores.

By the way this is not a troll. I am just explaining to anoncurious

You are complaining about the verbal section bringing down the mcat averages? Simply skip the verbal section. That's right - just skip it. Most people can STILL get over a 22 without doing the verbal at all. Don't blame the numbers on a low verbal score..having a score of 22 means you have to be pretty 'below-average' in ALL areas, not just verbal reasoning. You can succeed in the other sections with the english skills available to all puerto ricans.

 

[anoncurious]

anoncurious, If you took the time to READ the previous posts then you would understand a few basic realities about med school in PR and why MSAR numbers appear lower than mainland schools.
There is a thing called analytical thinking, I suggest you use it. Otherwise you are just spewing misinformed opinions in these forums. I dont mean to offend, but these forums are meant to inform and present information in such a way as to help our peers make the best decisions for them. As such we should all try to give information as clear and precise as possible. Talking rubish about a school, and a place you know nothing about using only some number you read from the MSAR as yout "proof" only serves to reveal you for the misinformed troll you seem to be.

For those that truly want information there are quite a few here who actually go to PR or have been there. I am pretty sure they will be more than happy to answer any of your doubts.

Dr Who

I read your earlier post and I stand by what I said. You can't blame scores in the very low 20s on verbal reasoning alone. As I mentioned earlier, you have to be lacking in several areas to get a score like that. I am not saying that puerto rico is a bad school because of it--I am simply telling people to be wary of a school with such low averages because that reflects the intellectual abilities of the peers in your community. One of the best aspects of college (and med school) is the availability of and access to talented, intelligent and motivated peers. All I am saying is don't underestimate the value of this aspect in your future medical education.

 

[TooMuchResearch]

You are complaining about the verbal section bringing down the mcat averages? Simply skip the verbal section. That's right - just skip it. Most people can STILL get over a 22 without doing the verbal at all. Don't blame the numbers on a low verbal score..having a score of 22 means you have to be pretty 'below-average' in ALL areas, not just verbal reasoning. You can succeed in the other sections with the english skills available to all puerto ricans.

The English skills available to all Puerto Ricans? I know Puerto Ricans that got their PhD's at American universities and could hardly speak enough broken English to interview for the programs...Yes, they received solid undergraduate science education, but it was in Spanish, not English. From what I can tell based on my conversations with a Puerto Rican professor and a cultural page from a Spanish language textbook, although most official documents in Puerto Rico are written in English, the majority (somewhere between 25-50%) do not speak English.

 

[anoncurious]

look, we're talking about practicing medicine in the united states. Frankly, the ability to articulate yourself in english SHOULD BE a prerequisite for becoming a doctor with a license to practice in the US. Communication is an essential facet of patient care. The fact that 25% of puerto ricans don't speak english simply means that those people shouldn't be applying to US medical schools. Verbal reasoning SHOULD be an important aspect of the mcat exam simply for that reason.

Bad communication = bad doctors. According to you, the Univ Puerto Rico has a low mcat average because their english skills are lacking--I don't dispute this. However, you say to place less weight on that score BECAUSE they have weak englihs skills..that's not right - you should place as much weight on that score since it is reflective of their abilities to articulate themselves as a physician.

 

[Dr Who]

look, we're talking about practicing medicine in the united states. Frankly, the ability to articulate yourself in english SHOULD BE a prerequisite for becoming a doctor with a license to practice in the US. Communication is an essential facet of patient care. The fact that 25% of puerto ricans don't speak english simply means that those people shouldn't be applying to US medical schools. Verbal reasoning SHOULD be an important aspect of the mcat exam simply for that reason.

Bad communication = bad doctors. According to you, the Univ Puerto Rico has a low mcat average because their english skills are lacking--I don't dispute this. However, you say to place less weight on that score BECAUSE they have weak englihs skills..that's not right - you should place as much weight on that score since it is reflective of their abilities to articulate themselves as a physician.

So you would discriminate against an intelligent and able person who is willing to sacrifice years of his or her life to serve his fellow man just because he or she happened to be born in a place where english is not the first language? You are seriously telling me that a person that does not speak english cannot be a good doctor? You must be kidding me!

Again you have shown an unwillingness or inability to read earlier posts, so I will repeat some facts to you. In PR ALL exams, text books, quizzes, presentations, etc. are in ENGLISH. Get that? In English. What I am trying to say to a person such as yourself is that if a person is not proficient in English he or she simply WILL NOT get through med school, it would be impossible.
I deeply regret your trying to paint med students in PR as inarticulate, foreigners who are unprepared for even the most basic communication in English. So what if 25% of puertorricans cannot speak English? I can garantee you that they are not in med school due to the way the system is structured which is unfortunate as it denies opportunities to otherwise qualified candidates.

Bad communication = bad doctors? maybe so, but let it be said that ignorance also makes for far worse doctors. I am an MS III at the University of Puerto Rico, would you dare call me inarticulate? I know of not one of my peers who do not dominate both English AND Spanish, including those that come from the US mainland. As a matter of fact I know of four MS IV's from this very same school who just matched. Two are going to Texas via the armed forces match and two matched in ophthalmology. There are more but those are the ones I know about at this moment. Does that say something to you about a school full of "inarticulate foreigners"?

What I write here is not meant to be taken personal. But I feel the need, the obligation, to right what I feel are wrongs. After reading anoncurious' post I feel that some people here, for some reason I cannot quite explain insist on giving opinions, and passing them on as "facts". As their only "proof" they always use the same tired arguments, MSAR numbers, "second hand" opinions and so forth. I cannot begin to say how many times in my four years on SDN I have had to refute people like this, and still they insist.

Like I said before, for those of you who are truly interested in applying to med school in PR as those of us who actually attend, and live on the island. Do not rely on those who's opinions are clouded by biases and/ or ignorance. Those same people who have never set one foot on the island yet are quick to "inform" about something they know nothing about.

Hopefully this will be the end of this little "misunderstanding" and subsequent posts are more about informing those interested in knowing more about med schools on the island. If any of you have any questions I will be more than happy to answer them as best as I can.

Dr Who

 

[anoncurious]

So you would discriminate against an intelligent and able person who is willing to sacrifice years of his or her life to serve his fellow man just because he or she happened to be born in a place where english is not the first language? You are seriously telling me that a person that does not speak english cannot be a good doctor? You must be kidding me!

No - I am telling you that a person who doesn't speak english cannot be a good doctor IN AMERICA (or in any primarily english-speaking country. Just as I cannot be a good doctor in Japan because I don't speak Japanese.) Please read my post before you start making wild accusations as to what I am saying-- (I am trying not to make this personal, but If I was, I might allude to your inability to read and understand the points in my post and relate that to the low verbal reasoning averages at the Univ of Puerto Rico..)

Again you have shown an unwillingness or inability to read earlier posts, so I will repeat some facts to you. In PR ALL exams, text books, quizzes, presentations, etc. are in ENGLISH. Get that? In English. What I am trying to say to a person such as yourself is that if a person is not proficient in English he or she simply WILL NOT get through med school, it would be impossible.

Then why did you say: "Due to the social realities of PR, most students here speak english as a second language, as such they usually score much lower on the MCAT when compared to US mainland students." and then use that as an excuse for the low mcat average? You can't have it both ways..either the students at UPR ARE proficient enough in english to do well on the mcat or the aren't..which is it? You don't need great english skills to do well on verbal reasoning..it is a REASONING section, not a reading comprehension section. From what it seems--all the students at UPR are proficient enough to do well..so you can't use their language skills as an excuse for their low mcat score--this, by the way, was the point I was trying to make in my previous post(s). I think you just helped me make it.

I deeply regret your trying to paint med students in PR as inarticulate, foreigners who are unprepared for even the most basic communication in English. So what if 25% of puertorricans cannot speak English? I can garantee you that they are not in med school due to the way the system is structured which is unfortunate as it denies opportunities to otherwise qualified candidates.

My stating that 25% number was in response to someone else who had said something about that statistic.. In any case, I am not trying to paint PR med students as inarticulate foreigners..I am simply not accepting your excuses for why their mcat are low (see above).

Bad communication = bad doctors? maybe so, but let it be said that ignorance also makes for far worse doctors. I am an MS III at the University of Puerto Rico, would you dare call me inarticulate? I know of not one of my peers who do not dominate both English AND Spanish, including those that come from the US mainland. As a matter of fact I know of four MS IV's from this very same school who just matched. Two are going to Texas via the armed forces match and two matched in ophthalmology. There are more but those are the ones I know about at this moment. Does that say something to you about a school full of "inarticulate foreigners"?

That's exactly my point--you can't use med student's lack of english skills as an excuse for the low mcat score because--as you said--they don't have inadequate english proficiencies.

Like I said before, for those of you who are truly interested in applying to med school in PR as those of us who actually attend, and live on the island. Do not rely on those who's opinions are clouded by biases and/ or ignorance. Those same people who have never set one foot on the island yet are quick to "inform" about something they know nothing about.

Hopefully this will be the end of this little "misunderstanding" and subsequent posts are more about informing those interested in knowing more about med schools on the island. If any of you have any questions I will be more than happy to answer them as best as I can.

Dr Who

I appreciate that and I urge those interested to contact Dr Who; I was simply parsing out what I felt was an inadequate explanation of the numbers. Subjectively, everyone thinks they go to the best school--as they should. But it is important for people to be informed and to have a 'BS detector' when reading these forums. Hopefully I helped someone parse out some of the 'BS' in the previous posts.

 

[Dr Who]

My last reply to anoncurious,
Who cares what the MCAT scores are? You? Then I strongly suggest that PR schools are not for you. I dont believe nor have I ever stated here nor anywhere else in these forums that my schools is the best, in anything. What I am saying though is that this particular school is the best FOR ME, which in the end is what really matters isnt it?

Now, for the rest of you who have genuine interest I would ask what is really important? I would say how the schools fare in regards to USMLE scores compared to US mainland schools and match lists are a much, much more precise measuring stick in regards to the quality of the schools and their graduates. Wouldnt you agree anoncurious?

Ok fine MCAT scores according to your holy writ, the MSAR are "low". So what?. In my school (UPR) the average first time passing rate for the USMLE is about 90%, which is ABOVE the percentage at many US mainland schools. Want more? As bilingual health care workers are in HUGE demand in the US, every year many residency programs actively recruit students at my school. Like I mentioned in my earlier post four of my classmates already matched early, two in ophthalmology. I know there are more, but I dont know where they matched yet. I would be so bold as to say my school's match list is as competitive as most US schools. I say again. MCAT scores, who cares? Obviously you do.

That is all I have to say on that, I really dont want to get into a pissing contest here, as it is not the purpose of these forums. If you want to believe that one simple number is all you need to judge 4 fully accredited medical schools then by all means. I use other, more meaningful criteria.

Good luck in your studies and I truly do hope that you find the right school for you.

Dr Who

 

[anoncurious]

Now, for the rest of you who have genuine interest I would ask what is really important? I would say how the schools fare in regards to USMLE scores compared to US mainland schools and match lists are a much, much more precise measuring stick in regards to the quality of the schools and their graduates. Wouldnt you agree anoncurious?

No, I wouldn't agree. The USMLE scores/match lists are very individual and vary greatly from year to year even within the same school. I think it would be a mistake to measure schools based on board scores because it is such an individual accomplishment that the school's curriculum, while important, doesn't drastically improve or reduce your eventual scores. The most selective schools generally have the best board scores not because they have great curriculums, but because they generally have the best students.

In any case, my point was that a much more substantive evaluation of a school is not in the board scores or other numbers, but in the quality of the peers who surround you. I was simply pointing out that the mcat average is one way to asses the intellectual quality of the people who will eventually become your peers. It's not the only measure of your peers, but it can certainly be useful in evaluating that aspect of one's future medical training experience.

 

[81586]

No, I wouldn't agree. The USMLE scores/match lists are very individual and vary greatly from year to year even within the same school. I think it would be a mistake to measure schools based on board scores because it is such an individual accomplishment that the school's curriculum, while important, doesn't drastically improve or reduce your eventual scores. The most selective schools generally have the best board scores not because they have great curriculums, but because they generally have the best students.

In any case, my point was that a much more substantive evaluation of a school is not in the board scores or other numbers, but in the quality of the peers who surround you. I was simply pointing out that the mcat average is one way to asses the intellectual quality of the people who will eventually become your peers. It's not the only measure of your peers, but it can certainly be useful in evaluating that aspect of one's future medical training experience.

this was disturbing to read.... not saying that your posts dont have some validity........OK.....yeah PR schools have low MCATs. so what dude. so you obviously prob scored well on the MCAT. congrats. here's a cookie big boy. yeah.....you're than man. now lets flip the script......here's some food for thought.........a spanish speaking individual walks into your office/ER/OR/whatever in ten years......who do you think could best serve this pt, especially in an emergent situation? a doc who only speaks english but has super-duper-awesome MCAT scores, or a bilingual doc who scored low on their MCAT (or didnt even take this exam b/c they are an FMG from a latin country)?????? pop quiz hotshot, fastest growing minority pop in US.......yeah, HISPANICS. i bet you are somebody who still talks about what they got on their PSAT/SAT or whatever.....prob pride themselves on only knowing english (typical american). whatever. anyways, you havent even started med school yet kid, your not even close to thinking about residency, and private practice is eons away from you. different ballgame with each step son. but one thing holds true.....MCATS DONT MEAN D**K, especially after you start med school. yeah i went to med school in PR. not one person i know had to submit their MCAT scores for residency apps (not even the boys applying for DERM). doesnt even sound like you are interested in attending PR schools, so why are you even posting in this forum? i hardly ever post, but i have always found dr. who's post to be accurate for the most part. i bet you have never set foot on PR...... so what makes you an expert on thinking that doctors who graduate from PR med schools are going to have trouble communicating with their patients. you probably have never even realized how many foreign trained physicians practice in US. these same guys could prob not even score a 20 on the MCAT, yet they make up a substantial percentage of healthcare providers in the US. one of them will more than likely even be your attending someday........so watch your step.

dr. who......tu eres muy calmado hombre. tenes que silenciar perritos como este persona. hay mucho gente en sdn que hablan pura mierda y no saben nada. no me podia quedar callado despues de leer estos comentarios....

 

[anoncurious]

wow - I forgot about this thread a long time ago..ok, here we go..

this was disturbing to read.... not saying that your posts dont have some validity........OK.....yeah PR schools have low MCATs. so what dude. so you obviously prob scored well on the MCAT. congrats. here's a cookie big boy. yeah.....you're than man.

wtf? When was this ever about me? For all you know I also got a 22 on the mcat..

now lets flip the script......here's some food for thought.........a spanish speaking individual walks into your office/ER/OR/whatever in ten years......who do you think could best serve this pt, especially in an emergent situation? a doc who only speaks english but has super-duper-awesome MCAT scores, or a bilingual doc who scored low on their MCAT (or didnt even take this exam b/c they are an FMG from a latin country)??????

Easy, I would pick someone who is both, bilingual and intelligent--that's like asking a medical school 'would you pick a student who did really well on his mcat or has a high gpa'? They would pick someone who did both. But that's not the point in my previous discussion. My point was simply that such a low mcat average surely has some correlation with the intellectual ability of the people in that school, and that being in an school surrounded by extremely smart people enhances one's training exponentially. I never said that a low mcat score means the person would be a bad doctor (nor am I saying that this is a false statement either..I'm sure theres some kind of relationship b between mcat score and being a 'good' doctor, but I certainly can't say that theres a direct correlation).

pop quiz hotshot, fastest growing minority pop in US.......yeah, HISPANICS. i bet you are somebody who still talks about what they got on their PSAT/SAT or whatever.....prob pride themselves on only knowing english (typical american). whatever. anyways, you havent even started med school yet kid, your not even close to thinking about residency, and private practice is eons away from you. different ballgame with each step son. but one thing holds true.....MCATS DONT MEAN D**K, especially after you start med school.

Look, I am not one who goes around flaunting my mcat score (when did this become about me?) Please notice that my mcat score is nowhere on this thread nor on sdn or mdapplicants. Don't tell me that I'm arrogant when you have no evidence. Secondly, I speak three languages (including your sacred Spanish) and was not born in this country, so again, don't make wildly inaccurate blanket assumptions simply to let off steam. As for your other comments, please see above.

yeah i went to med school in PR. not one person i know had to submit their MCAT scores for residency apps (not even the boys applying for DERM). doesnt even sound like you are interested in attending PR schools, so why are you even posting in this forum? i hardly ever post, but i have always found dr. who's post to be accurate for the most part. i bet you have never set foot on PR...... so what makes you an expert on thinking that doctors who graduate from PR med schools are going to have trouble communicating with their patients.

I never said that. Without looking at posts above, I believe that someone accused me of saying something like 'so you're saying that doctors who can't speak english can't be good doctors'..and my response was They can't be good doctors in a primarily english-speaking country (which is true..communication is important--not just with patients, but with other physicians, insurance companies, etc).

Btw I have been to PR..it's a lovely place.

you probably have never even realized how many foreign trained physicians practice in US. these same guys could prob not even score a 20 on the MCAT, yet they make up a substantial percentage of healthcare providers in the US. one of them will more than likely even be your attending someday........so watch your step.

First of all, let me say that there is no reason to say that foreign trained physicians would score a 20 on the mcat (remember, the two nonverbal sections add up to 30). The ONLY reason to think that a foreign trained physician would do any worse than an american physician is if they do badly on the verbal section. As I said before, doing badly on the verbal section is not a big deal, but doing EXTREMELY badly on the verbal section probably is due to bad communication skills / verbal reasoning / etc. Then, yes, I would say that if these docs had bad communication skills, that would likely translate into practicing medicine badly. Notice that I never once criticized foreign trained physicians simply for being that. My only point was that communication is essential in medicine.

btw pr_guy..levelheadedness is pretty important too.

 

[BrainBuff]

This is one of the most useless threads I have ever run across here. The raw emotions, poor grammar and lack of punctuation makes it extra painful to read. Even the Spanish is bad.

dr. who......tu eres muy calmado hombre. tenes que silenciar perritos como este persona. hay mucho gente en sdn que hablan pura mierda y no saben nada. no me podia quedar callado despues de leer estos comentarios....

This should read
tienes instead of tenes
esta persona instead of este persona
Hay mucha gente instead of hay mucho gente
Please, also note that podía and después have accents.

Conclusion: You may still come out of Puerto Rico with a very mediocre and vulgar Spanish, if you consider the referenced poster a reliable representative.

 

[81586]

got me on the spanish bro, its not perfect... but i dont take the time you prob do to check every sentence/word before i post. took me about 5 secconds to type that, prob took you an hour to find the flaws that you did...........brainbuff......name explains it all. you kind of remind me of that red-headed bully from thet movie a christmas story. i was addressing anoncurious and not you, so why did you even have to jump in f&gboy? you know what, this thread is useless. you know what, my spanish is vulgar, just the way i like it pen-day-hoe..... hey did i spell that right?????? hmmmmmmmmmm......
as for reliability, i consider myself a reliable poster.... i acll it as i see it.
do i care what you people on this site think. maybe. maybe not. maybe go F yourself.
now go ahead and criticize my grammer, misspellings, and other stuff.....b/c i want you to continue to feel like a BIG MAN!!! keep that BRAIN BUFFFFFF STUDDDD!!!!!

i'm done with this site permanently. too many brain buffs here and i could argue with anon for hours about his comments back and forth...........

 

[Medstudent85]

it really only takes 1 minute to correct a language you are perfectly fluent in, doubt it took him more than that

 

[mabesumday]

Does anyone else feel a bit jealous of Europeans who are exposed to multiple languages at much earlier ages? I have met many in my life who are fluent in 3-5 languages. I know this is probably the wrong thread, and this is my first post on sdn. I guess with everyone in the world learning English its easy to think, "how quaint? The whole world is uniting as one via the internet and the English language and America." I guess I feel that humanity would be better off if every country would emphasize the learning of multiple languages at an early age. But I guess there's only so much time in a human life and only so much television to watch. Furthermore, what is everyone's take on internets threads in general? I think they are quite the pinnacle of human endeavor. Lastly, what do you think a checklist of basic/essential human knowledge would look like? I ask because these things because I like to think that the future of humankind depends on us not being so shallow as to quarrel about numbers on aptitude tests and ability/inability to speak a second language. (yes I am aware of the beginning portion of my post... this is how my thoughts often meander.) I think I am getting way too philosophical here... just needed to blurt out a little bit. Let me know what you guys think (am interested in attending a PR med school in case anyone was wondering why I am posting in this thread).

 

[mabesumday]

and this thread is a year old..........

 

[MidAtlantic]

I am a mainland student who is attending school at the Universidad Central del Caribe. I would divide our class into 2 major groups. On-island Puerto Ricans who were not accepted at UPR and Mainland Latinos who's parents spoke Spanish. In my class, there were only 4 non-Latinos attending. The books and tests are all in English but about 3/4 of the lectures are in Spanish. My Spanish is decent but it has been a struggle at times to deal with the demands of medical school and listening to a lecture by someone who speaks pretty fast Spanish. All in all, the other students have been great and the faculty at the school is very supportive. I have also been impressed by the research that is being done within the school in areas like glial cells. The school has put together an incredible international research team. By the way my MCAT score was 31 and I can tell you my fellow students are sharp.

 

[MidAtlantic]

Some folks had some follow on questions about my reasons for attending UCC. I was an engineering undergraduate who had no thoughts about going to medical school so my GPA of 3.1 is not so competitive. I was told at two US schools that if I did 1 year of research that I would be a good candidate for acceptance. Instead, I decided to come to PR. One of the main reasons is the cost of insurance - $250 per month vs. $1500+ for a family on the mainland. I have a HPSP scholarship so I will almost definitely do my residency in the Army where the main thing that matters is USMLE Step 1 & 2 score and your rotation recommendations. As long as the school is LCAS approved the Army is good. Since the Army is paying tuition costs was not a factor. From a learning perspective, I think the first two years are going to be the same grind everywhere, the only difference is 80% of the lectures here will be in Spanish. My Spanish has improved but it still has a way to go, but I am doing fine. During rotations, I have heard that the training during rotations is better than the mainland. There is less of a lawyer mentality and students are given much more freedom to practice hands on.

 

[mynismo]

I am a mainland student who is attending school at the Universidad Central del Caribe. I would divide our class into 2 major groups. On-island Puerto Ricans who were not accepted at UPR and Mainland Latinos who's parents spoke Spanish. In my class, there were only 4 non-Latinos attending. The books and tests are all in English but about 3/4 of the lectures are in Spanish. My Spanish is decent but it has been a struggle at times to deal with the demands of medical school and listening to a lecture by someone who speaks pretty fast Spanish. All in all, the other students have been great and the faculty at the school is very supportive. I have also been impressed by the research that is being done within the school in areas like glial cells. The school has put together an incredible international research team. By the way my MCAT score was 31 and I can tell you my fellow students are sharp.

Hi I sent you a PM