Questions about HPSP/working in military

[hs2013]

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I just have some questions regarding doing the HPSP and how the 4 years of working as a dentist in the military would be.

1) So you are deployed to a base for your 4 years which will be your main area to work, other than when you are deployed, correct?

2) Are you able to pick up other temporary jobs like working a day or 2 on weekend to make extra cash working for someone else?

3) How long can a deployment be for? Also once you do a deployment, is there a certain time period for which they can't deploy you?

4) This one is probably a no, but I might as well ask, do you get any vacation time during your 4 year commitment?

5) Are deployments like mini vacations if in a nice place? Like are you able to go out and explore the place when not working?

6) Once out of dental school and you actually start working, are you actually able to do a variety of procedures and improve your skills? Like will I get the chance to do crowns, implants, tons of restorative, extractions, bridges, or no? Because if I am not regularly getting the opportunity to do those things, I feel it wouldn't be worth it do to military because once I am out in the civilian world, I wouldn't make a good dentist, and my main concern in doing the HPSP, is if I will actually be able to improve my speed and skills in a wide range of general dentistry.

7) Once done with the 4 years, is it easy to get a job in the civilian world as an associate somewhere making good money like in the 200k range because you will have 4 years experience so I feel the starting pay should be
good.

 

[AirborneDentist]

I just have some questions regarding doing the HPSP and how the 4 years of working as a dentist in the military would be.

1) So you are deployed to a base for your 4 years which will be your main area to work, other than when you are deployed, correct?

Yes, that is correct.

2) Are you able to pick up other temporary jobs like working a day or 2 on weekend to make extra cash working for someone else?

Yes, but you are limited in the number of hours you can work.

3) How long can a deployment be for? Also once you do a deployment, is there a certain time period for which they can't deploy you?

Deployments are typically 6 months. The odds of you being deployed a 2nd time is slim to none unless you want to deploy a second time.

4) This one is probably a no, but I might as well ask, do you get any vacation time during your 4 year commitment?

You get 30 paid days off per year. You accrue 2.5 days a month. You also get 4 day weekends for holidays like the 4th of July, Memorial Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving and even more over Christmas.

5) Are deployments like mini vacations if in a nice place? Like are you able to go out and explore the place when not working?

Deployments are to Afghanistan now...you do not go out and explore...as they are not safe areas.

6) Once out of dental school and you actually start working, are you actually able to do a variety of procedures and improve your skills? Like will I get the chance to do crowns, implants, tons of restorative, extractions, bridges, or no? Because if I am not regularly getting the opportunity to do those things, I feel it wouldn't be worth it do to military because once I am out in the civilian world, I wouldn't make a good dentist, and my main concern in doing the HPSP, is if I will actually be able to improve my speed and skills in a wide range of general dentistry.

You will be doing what the military needs in your area. You will probably doing mostly operative...but can also do extractions, crown and bridge, etc.

7) Once done with the 4 years, is it easy to get a job in the civilian world as an associate somewhere making good money like in the 200k range because you will have 4 years experience so I feel the starting pay should be
good.

I cannot think of any associates making that kind of money. Many people with a private practice are not clearing that much.

Answers above....

 

[hs2013]

Answers above....

Thank you for the response! Just a few more things.

1)So you are saying you are only deployed once, so it that only once in your entire 4 years working in the military?

2)So even the HPSP dentists during their 4 year service, get the 30 days paid off and long weekends on holidays while they are at their army base and not deployed? So could one take off for a whole month, get paid for it, and then work at a dentist clinic for 1 month and make even more money?

3)Then what exactly is the thing I have been reading about like being deployed for like 12-15 months and staying with a unit. Also I read something about TOE units or something or field units, what exactly are those, because I hear that you don't want to be in deployed in those units.

4) One last thing, do ones skills ever deteriorate as a military dentist? Like are there ever times where you don't even practice dentistry for a while? Like I heard of something called OBLC where you have to go for 6 weeks doing things completely unrelated to dentistry for 6 weeks, but moreso military training. What is the point of that stuff if you are going to the military to be a dentist, not a soldier? Also are there other trainings or courses you have to go through either during the 4 years of dental school, or your 4 year commitement unrelated to dentistry?

 

[Hedgy]

I just have some questions regarding doing the HPSP and how the 4 years of working as a dentist in the military would be.


1) So you are deployed to a base for your 4 years which will be your main area to work, other than when you are deployed, correct?

I can only speak for the Navy, but it depends on where you are stationed. If you do an AEGD/GPR you may only be at that base for a year, then off to a different base for the remainder of you time.

2) Are you able to pick up other temporary jobs like working a day or 2 on weekend to make extra cash working for someone else?

Depends, if you are overseas (OCONUS), then not likely. At a base in the US (CONUS), then you may be able to moonlight at the discretion of your CO. Generally, the max is like 16 hrs/week. Doesn't sound like much, but it could nearly double your pay. That's a lot of time working though. You work 5 days week, then add another 2 days of work on top of that....I'd rather enjoy my family.

3) How long can a deployment be for? Also once you do a deployment, is there a certain time period for which they can't deploy you?



Depends on the service, but anywhere from 6-12 mos. I believe the Navy is going to 9-month deployments.

4) This one is probably a no, but I might as well ask, do you get any vacation time during your 4 year commitment?

See Airborne's comments. One thing you should know is that if you take vacation and it involves a weekend, then the weekend counts as vacation time.

5) Are deployments like mini vacations if in a nice place? Like are you able to go out and explore the place when not working?

Depends on the service. Marines/Army tend to deploy to A-stan. When ships deploy they hit several ports when underway. They usually try to visit desirable places.

6) Once out of dental school and you actually start working, are you actually able to do a variety of procedures and improve your skills? Like will I get the chance to do crowns, implants, tons of restorative, extractions, bridges, or no? Because if I am not regularly getting the opportunity to do those things, I feel it wouldn't be worth it do to military because once I am out in the civilian world, I wouldn't make a good dentist, and my main concern in doing the HPSP, is if I will actually be able to improve my speed and skills in a wide range of general dentistry.

You will do mostly operative. However, depending on your command or deployment situation, you may be able to do many of the other procedures listed. Doubtful that you will place implants or likely restore many as that tends to be limited to specialists (OMFS/Perio to place and Prosth to restore).

Biggest thing you gain IMO is speed, confidence, and experience.

7) Once done with the 4 years, is it easy to get a job in the civilian world as an associate somewhere making good money like in the 200k range because you will have 4 years experience so I feel the starting pay should be
good.

I'm not sure what associate pay would be, but you better be producing large to expect to make $200k+. They don't know you from Adam even with military experience. Whether new out of dental school or 20 years out, you still have to negotiate a salary and benefits. I'd expect you would have lower salary with production bonuses (more common) that could put you nearer the $200k range. Remember only 30% of associateships work out. I worked as an associate for a year and made the same money I made in the Navy, so I bought my own practice. I easily clear $200k on a 4-day work week in a FFS practice.

 

[hs2013]

I'm not sure what associate pay would be, but you better be producing large to expect to make $200k+. They don't know you from Adam even with military experience. Whether new out of dental school or 20 years out, you still have to negotiate a salary and benefits. I'd expect you would have lower salary with production bonuses (more common) that could put you nearer the $200k range. Remember only 30% of associateships work out. I worked as an associate for a year and made the same money I made in the Navy, so I bought my own practice. I easily clear $200k on a 4-day work week in a FFS practice.

Thanks for the answers, definitely helpful! One thing with your last comment that makes me want to do military is that after 4 years of working as a dentist in the military, I could easily save over 200k which would be awesome to buy my own practice.

 

[hs2013]

Another question I have is, and please be honest even if it's not what I would want to hear, I'm Pakistani and Muslim, so based on your experiences in the military, would there be some discrimination in terms of me being forced to do more things I wouldn't want to, or not being able to do as much dentistry? Also like deployments and stuff, if I'm going to Afghan or somewhere like that, I would probably be associated with the people they're fighting there...

Now I don't mind terrorist jokes or stuff like that, I take that with ease and bring my own jokes out of it so I'm not uptight or anything about those kinds of things, just don't want to be b*tched around more or something just because i'm paki and muslim and America is fighting a lot of those kinds of people.

Also would it be hard for me to practice my religion while in the military, like praying 5 times a day?

 

[Hedgy]

Another question I have is, and please be honest even if it's not what I would want to hear, I'm Pakistani and Muslim, so based on your experiences in the military, would there be some discrimination in terms of me being forced to do more things I wouldn't want to, or not being able to do as much dentistry? Also like deployments and stuff, if I'm going to Afghan or somewhere like that, I would probably be associated with the people they're fighting there...

Now I don't mind terrorist jokes or stuff like that, I take that with ease and bring my own jokes out of it so I'm not uptight or anything about those kinds of things, just don't want to be b*tched around more or something just because i'm paki and muslim and America is fighting a lot of those kinds of people.

Also would it be hard for me to practice my religion while in the military, like praying 5 times a day?

The military probably is one of the most diverse communities you can join. I can't speak for others, but I certainly wouldn't have a problem you being Paki or Muslim. Do I think there are those in the military who will be put your faith and race into question? Absolutely, but I don't think any more so than you'd experience in the private sector. People usually don't see race or religion in the dental chair. We all should know the 2 things you don't talk about in the operatory; 1)Politics and 2)Religion. Leave those out of the conversation and you win half the psychology battle. Remember you will be a United States Officer before anything else.

Probably one of the best things I could see is having a Muslim in a command. People fear the unknown. People don't know many Muslims outside of what they see on TV. I think this would be a great opportunity to represent the Muslim community in the way they should be seen. I don't think many commands have too many Muslims in the ranks. The military must allow you to practice your religion as such. Just make the prayers short 😉.

 

[hs2013]

The military probably is one of the most diverse communities you can join. I can't speak for others, but I certainly wouldn't have a problem you being Paki or Muslim. Do I think there are those in the military who will be put your faith and race into question? Absolutely, but I don't think any more so than you'd experience in the private sector. People usually don't see race or religion in the dental chair. We all should know the 2 things you don't talk about in the operatory; 1)Politics and 2)Religion. Leave those out of the conversation and you win half the psychology battle. Remember you will be a United States Officer before anything else.

Probably one of the best things I could see is having a Muslim in a command. People fear the unknown. People don't know many Muslims outside of what they see on TV. I think this would be a great opportunity to represent the Muslim community in the way they should be seen. I don't think many commands have too many Muslims in the ranks. The military must allow you to practice your religion as such. Just make the prayers short 😉.

Yea I definitely get what you're saying and most people are cool about it nowadays, and yea it would be a good way to represent.

 

[AirborneDentist]

Thank you for the response! Just a few more things.

1)So you are saying you are only deployed once, so it that only once in your entire 4 years working in the military?

I am saying the likelihood of you deploying a second time is very, very low. I deployed twice because I wanted to. Honestly, deploying was a very rewarding experience and I know MANY people that were trying to avoid it, and once they did it, wanted to do it again.

2)So even the HPSP dentists during their 4 year service, get the 30 days paid off and long weekends on holidays while they are at their army base and not deployed? So could one take off for a whole month, get paid for it, and then work at a dentist clinic for 1 month and make even more money?

Yes, you get the 30 days a year. You could not take off a whole month and work, as you are limited to the number of hours you can work in private practice per week.

3)Then what exactly is the thing I have been reading about like being deployed for like 12-15 months and staying with a unit. Also I read something about TOE units or something or field units, what exactly are those, because I hear that you don't want to be in deployed in those units.

That is possible, but the number of dentists in those units are small. Please do not worry about deploying, as that should not be a deterrent and huge concern coming into the military. I deployed for 14 months with the 82nd Airborne and loved the entire thing.

4) One last thing, do ones skills ever deteriorate as a military dentist? Like are there ever times where you don't even practice dentistry for a while? Like I heard of something called OBLC where you have to go for 6 weeks doing things completely unrelated to dentistry for 6 weeks, but moreso military training. What is the point of that stuff if you are going to the military to be a dentist, not a soldier? Also are there other trainings or courses you have to go through either during the 4 years of dental school, or your 4 year commitement unrelated to dentistry?

Please keep in mind you are a Soldier FIRST and a dentist SECOND. If you remember that, you will not have any issues. There is military training you are highly encouraged to attend, such as BOLC (OBLC). You will not do any dentistry there....none...zero...zilch. If this does not sound enjoyable to you, then I do not think the military would be a good fit for you and you should just consider private practice. One of the beautiful things about the military is you are not doing dentistry every single day.

Answered above...

 

[hs2013]

Answered above...

Again, thank you for the answers, extremely helpful and I'm really leaning the military route.

1 more question for now, is it true that there is something called Active Duty for Training(ADT) that you have to do for 45 days a year while in dental school if you are doing the HPSP? If so, then basically all of your time off while in dental school is taken up by doing that each year?

 

[LFA20]

Again, thank you for the answers, extremely helpful and I'm really leaning the military route.

1 more question for now, is it true that there is something called Active Duty for Training(ADT) that you have to do for 45 days a year while in dental school if you are doing the HPSP? If so, then basically all of your time off while in dental school is taken up by doing that each year?

Yes if you are in HPSP.. However for navy HSCP you don't have this requirement 🙂

 

[hs2013]

Yes if you are in HPSP.. However for navy HSCP you don't have this requirement 🙂

I see, but I think if I read it correctly, if you don't have 45 day breaks during dental school, you don't have to do ADT but you still get paid for it? That'd be sweet, just go to a dental school without long breaks.

Also another question that popped up was about the IRR. I just wanted clarification on this. Is it true that in addition to your 4 year commitment to practice as a dentist, you also are required to do IRR for 4 more years? What exactly is IRR? Do I have any military obligations during this time or is it like me completely severing ties after my 4 year commitment? Because for me, after the 4 year commitment, I want to completely sever ties with the military.

 

[LFA20]

I believe you can get school orders during your summer break and you will continue to receive pay. What I was saying is that you won't be able to travel..(go on vacation) under HPSP(I think)...

And yes your commitment is 4
Years of active duty and 4 years of IRR. During IRR, you pretty much live a civilian life.. No dentist in the history of military has ever been activated from IRR. If you were to be activated, you probably wouldn't be doing dentistry anymore(full out war:WWIII)

Just additional advice,:
you should at least have some passion for serving your country.. The fact that you already want to get out as soon as your commitment is up before you even begin is a concern. Think about the good experience you will get by being the military 🙂


A lot of people want the scholarships but aren't fortunate enough due to medical, academic reasons..

 

[hs2013]

I believe you can get school orders during your summer break and you will continue to receive pay. What I was saying is that you won't be able to travel..(go on vacation) under HPSP(I think)...

And yes your commitment is 4
Years of active duty and 4 years of IRR. During IRR, you pretty much live a civilian life.. No dentist in the history of military has ever been activated from IRR. If you were to be activated, you probably wouldn't be doing dentistry anymore(full out war:WWIII)

Just additional advice,:
you should at least have some passion for serving your country.. The fact that you already want to get out as soon as your commitment is up before you even begin is a concern. Think about the good experience you will get by being the military 🙂


A lot of people want the scholarships but aren't fortunate enough due to medical, academic reasons..

I'll be honest, the first and primary reason for this is the HUGE financial benefit, and I am sure it is for many others. You're are also right, I don't really have a passion for serving my country. And I wouldn't do it if I didn't want to practice in the military for 4 years. And for sure I want to get out as soon as my commitment is up. BUT the experience like you said is what I am looking for. I haven't done anything like it, being a military dentist would be pretty sweet, being Paki and in the military also brings some more individuality/distinction since not many if any people like that. Being out of the military and practicing in the real world also brings it's benefits as I feel like I'd be a more desirable dentist than just some fresh grad.

Mainly the experience and the financial benefits are why I want to do it.

 

[ramborhino]

I'll be honest, the first and primary reason for this is the HUGE financial benefit, and I am sure it is for many others. You're are also right, I don't really have a passion for serving my country. And I wouldn't do it if I didn't want to practice in the military for 4 years. And for sure I want to get out as soon as my commitment is up. BUT the experience like you said is what I am looking for. I haven't done anything like it, being a military dentist would be pretty sweet, being Paki and in the military also brings some more individuality/distinction since not many if any people like that. Being out of the military and practicing in the real world also brings it's benefits as I feel like I'd be a more desirable dentist than just some fresh grad.

Mainly the experience and the financial benefits are why I want to do it.

Make sure you write this in your motivational statement if you apply.

 

[Hedgy]

I'm not sure what the current retention rate is for new dentists in the military, but I bet around 65-70% get out of the service. Most come in knowing they don't want to stay. Of my group of 10 residents in my AEGD, only 1 stayed in. One did a perio residency (he was stationed on my ship with me) and got out after 11 years AD. As with most of us, paying for school is a huge concern. The military offers a great benefit to paying off school and getting experience. Whether you decide to stay in will depend on your experiences in the service, whether you want to specialize (the military has some of the best programs out there and pays better), and your family situation. With all respect to AVB, passion for service IMO comes after you commit. You don't really know what service to country is until you put on the uniform and IMO until you deploy, then you appreciate what those who serve have sacrificed. If you decide to join, plan on a deployment of some type. I guarantee you will be a better person and soldier/sailor/Marine/whatever the Air Force calls themselves 😛 when you return from that deployment.