Questions about Matching and Pre-Matching

[ksmajmudar]

---

Members do not see this ad.

Hey guys!

I have a few questions. I tried to search for similar threads, as I'm sure they already exist, but I couldn't find anything to answer my questions. I figure this would be good information for a lot of pre-meds to know, so I posted it here, with the assumption that lots of non pre-meds stalk these forums. Just a heads up - these are a lot of questions.

1) What exactly is the pre-match? Which specialties participate in the pre-match? How does one go about participating in the pre-match?

2) When matching, what factors are involved in deciding who to accept?

3) Once you match, is it more likely that you will get a job offer with that position? Or is getting a permanent job not linked to where you do your residency? To clarify: If I did an EM residency in Chicago, could I work as an EM doctor in NY? (I understand there's a state exam involved - could someone explain this? How hard is this state exam?)

4) How do you go about determining the quality of the residency? How do you find out information about these residencies?

5) What is the difference in applying to ACGME vs. AOA residencies, from a practical standpoint?

I have been trying to piece together an understanding of this process based on bits of information from all over SDN and the internet, but I figure the answer will be more concise from an SDNer. Plus, the information can be shared with everyone. So, thanks in advance! 🙂

 

[gatorfann14]

Hey guys!

I have a few questions. I tried to search for similar threads, as I'm sure they already exist, but I couldn't find anything to answer my questions. I figure this would be good information for a lot of pre-meds to know, so I posted it here, with the assumption that lots of non pre-meds stalk these forums. Just a heads up - these are a lot of questions.

1) What exactly is the pre-match? Which specialties participate in the pre-match? How does one go about participating in the pre-match?

2) When matching, what factors are involved in deciding who to accept?

3) Once you match, is it more likely that you will get a job offer with that position? Or is getting a permanent job not linked to where you do your residency? To clarify: If I did an EM residency in Chicago, could I work as an EM doctor in NY? (I understand there's a state exam involved - could someone explain this? How hard is this state exam?)

4) How do you go about determining the quality of the residency? How do you find out information about these residencies?

5) What is the difference in applying to ACGME vs. AOA residencies, from a practical standpoint?

I have been trying to piece together an understanding of this process based on bits of information from all over SDN and the internet, but I figure the answer will be more concise from an SDNer. Plus, the information can be shared with everyone. So, thanks in advance! 🙂

1) for your purposes there is no pre-match so don't even worry about it. I believe this years graduating class is the last one that can do it.

I can't speak to the actual logistics of applying to the match, but when it comes to how they accept people you are going to get a million different answers. Some people are going to tell you that its all about auditions and making a good impression, some will tell you that boards are the biggest factor. Pretty much the only advice that I have gotten from the students ahead of me is to be perfect. Make sure that there isnt a reason for them not to want you. Be a good student, work hard, have a good attitude, and be a good guy in general. You are going to spend more time with these people than your family, they are not going to rank you if you don't fit in.

 

[pianoman511]

Hey guys!

I have a few questions. I tried to search for similar threads, as I'm sure they already exist, but I couldn't find anything to answer my questions. I figure this would be good information for a lot of pre-meds to know, so I posted it here, with the assumption that lots of non pre-meds stalk these forums. Just a heads up - these are a lot of questions.

1) What exactly is the pre-match? Which specialties participate in the pre-match? How does one go about participating in the pre-match?

2) When matching, what factors are involved in deciding who to accept?

3) Once you match, is it more likely that you will get a job offer with that position? Or is getting a permanent job not linked to where you do your residency? To clarify: If I did an EM residency in Chicago, could I work as an EM doctor in NY? (I understand there's a state exam involved - could someone explain this? How hard is this state exam?)

4) How do you go about determining the quality of the residency? How do you find out information about these residencies?

5) What is the difference in applying to ACGME vs. AOA residencies, from a practical standpoint?

I have been trying to piece together an understanding of this process based on bits of information from all over SDN and the internet, but I figure the answer will be more concise from an SDNer. Plus, the information can be shared with everyone. So, thanks in advance! 🙂

1) As previously stated - no more pre-match.

2) In general, the most important is whether the applicant is a good fit for the program. Other important factors are grades in the desired field's rotation, letters of recommendation, step 2 scores, step 1 scores, GPA, class rank (in order from most important to least important).

3) It all depends on the program - if they have attending spots open then it would likely be easier to get the job but remember...you don't have any experience. As for across state lines you have to get a license in that state but most employers would handle most of that for you. The important thing would be board certification which you do in your last year of residency or just after you graduate.

4) Online research, board pass rates, talking to residents/other students. There's no real guide to the best residencies. Generally, you want to try and go to a residency that will prepare you for where you would like to practice (i.e. don't do a residency at a small comm. hospital if you want to practice at large academic trauma center...doesn't exclude you but prob would not be as good to prepare you).

5) It depends on the residency, some AOA residencies are one year longer than their ACGME counterparts and some aren't. Speaking broadly, many of the AOA residencies are at smaller community type hospitals while many of the ACGME residencies are at larger/university type hospitals. You can apply to both types of residencies but bottom line you need to pick one to apply to - the AOA match is first (Feb. 14th ish) and the MD match is second (Marchish). If you match in the AOA match then you're dropped out of the MD match. If you skip the AOA match or don't match then you can still enter the MD match.

 

[ShyRem]

1) What exactly is the pre-match? Which specialties participate in the pre-match? How does one go about participating in the pre-match?

As stated, you won't be able to. No more pre-match allowed. So, you don't go about pre-matching.

2) When matching, what factors are involved in deciding who to accept?

it's not who to accept, it's more of your rank list. See, you make a rank list of your #1 down to the "well, if I don't match anywhere else" list and the program makes a similar list. Ultimately, you both hope you end up happy. From the program perspective, different programs have different requirements - some are really into board scores, research, publications, etc. Others are more into "will you fit into our program, our residents, our faculty?" Still others only want to match folks who will stick around for a job. And then there are those who will take darn near anyone who interviews.

From the applicant perspective, you rank where you want to go first. You try to get the best picture you can of the program - research is key here. Ask around, poke around the internet, look at prior graduates if you can find them. See if there is a graduate from their residency program around and go talk to them. Best yet is if someone from your school matched there previously - email them and pick their brain. The interview day gives you another clue as to the "feel" of the program. The residents, the space, the support you can expect from the administration. Look at benefits carefully - some programs pay for all your health insurance, some pay for you and your family, and some want you to pay hundreds every month for insurance. Vacation, days off, rotations, call schedule all can vary widely. Find a program that ultimately will serve your needs whether that is a high end name where you may end up working like a dog and lying about your hours, or whether it is a small community program that allows you to have a life. There are certainly large programs you can have a life and small programs you work like a dog as well - do your research carefully and rank wisely.

3) Once you match, is it more likely that you will get a job offer with that position? Or is getting a permanent job not linked to where you do your residency? To clarify: If I did an EM residency in Chicago, could I work as an EM doctor in NY? (I understand there's a state exam involved - could someone explain this? How hard is this state exam?)

Not necessarily. Lots of people look for jobs away from residency. State exams are more of a paperwork, money, and time issue. Some state certifications can take up to 9 months, others only 6 weeks or so. Your main board certification is the biggie and that allows you the most freedom. Before you pass your specialty boards, you are "board eligible" after residency. While many places will take folks "BE", there are also plenty that want "only BC physicians".

4) How do you go about determining the quality of the residency? How do you find out information about these residencies?

See above. Also, if you're doing EM, make sure you know where your outlying rotations will be if the program has those. Trauma at Denver Health is a lot different than doing trauma in Pittsfield, Mass. If you're at a large university program you'll be doing most if not all your rotations at your home institution. Also see what the availability for doing away rotations is. If you fall in love with toxicology you want to be able to do some away rotations in tox (which is a rotation few programs have available).

5) What is the difference in applying to ACGME vs. AOA residencies, from a practical standpoint?

The boards you take afterwards. If you are in an AOA residency, you take AOA boards. If you are in an ACGME residency, you take ACGME boards. The requirements may be a little different too. For EM, most AOA programs are a year longer because you have to fulfill the intern year requirements. There are, however, many 4 year ACGME EM residencies.

Finally, you're putting the cart in front of the horse here. You have LOTS of time before you have to worry about matching. By then lots of things can change. Worry about getting into school first, then worry about doing well your first two years. Then you have to work on doing well in step 1, surviving and learning in clinical year 3, figuring out what you want to do (yeah, right now you want to do EM - 80% of all med students change their minds), THEN worry about applying for residency. You're 3 years out. One step at a time my friend.

 

[DrMaximus]

One step at a time my friend.

After I got accepted to LMU-DCOM, I instantly started worrying about going to a good residency... Lol. Why is it so hard to focus on the present?!

 

[ShyRem]

😆 it can be difficult when you're so excited about finally getting in. You'll be stressing, buried in work and books, and living one exam to the next soon enough.

 

[ksmajmudar]

Thank you very much, ShyRem, pianoman511, and gatorfann14! That really helped in clarifying information...I agree it's probably still too early to be worrying about the next step, but I can't help but wonder about some of these things 😳