Recommending a friend to your program?

[psymed]

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I stuck in a rather tricky situation. I'm a PGY-1 in a psych program and one of my very good friends wants me to recomend her to my program for a position.

I'm really uncomfortable when it comes to these things. First of all I'm only a lowly intern. Who am I to recomend anyone?

My friend is a hard worker and would make a great resident but maybe not at a Psychiatry program. She is more of an Internal Medicine candidate and I know that she is only applying for Psychiatry as a second choice. She has little to no experience in Psychiatry. Even if I do talk to my Program Director, what am I going to tell him when he asks me about her background in Psychiatry?

When I was applying last year, just the thought of asking for LORs from my supervisors made me extremely anxious. I felt so vulnerable. I didn't ask any of my letter writers to call programs for me (was too chicken) and landed my position on my own with just average scores. I'm not exactly a social butterfly. I have never had many friends or contacts. I've just worked extra hard to get where I am because I could never muster up the courage to ask anyone to do anything for me.

If I decline to talk to my program for her I risk ruining our friendship. I know that the match is one of the most trying times in a physician's life. I want to be a good friend. Please tell me that I'm being overly paranoid and I should get over my issues and help out a friend in need.

 

[kugel]

I don't see what you have to lose by writing your friend a LOR regarding the good things you do know about your friend. Everyone knows that every LOR is one-sided - it's supposed to be. If your friend turns out to not be a top candidate, that's between the PD and your friend, and you'll probably never discuss it with your PD. Your PD will know to never talk to you about the reasons your friend was not chosen.

So, write a LOR for your friend and let the chips fall where they may.

 

[psychattending]

I stuck in a rather tricky situation. I'm a PGY-1 in a psych program and one of my very good friends wants me to recomend her to my program for a position.

I'm really uncomfortable when it comes to these things. First of all I'm only a lowly intern. Who am I to recomend anyone?

My friend is a hard worker and would make a great resident but maybe not at a Psychiatry program. She is more of an Internal Medicine candidate and I know that she is only applying for Psychiatry as a second choice. She has little to no experience in Psychiatry. Even if I do talk to my Program Director, what am I going to tell him when he asks me about her background in Psychiatry?

When I was applying last year, just the thought of asking for LORs from my supervisors made me extremely anxious. I felt so vulnerable. I didn't ask any of my letter writers to call programs for me (was too chicken) and landed my position on my own with just average scores. I'm not exactly a social butterfly. I have never had many friends or contacts. I've just worked extra hard to get where I am because I could never muster up the courage to ask anyone to do anything for me.

If I decline to talk to my program for her I risk ruining our friendship. I know that the match is one of the most trying times in a physician's life. I want to be a good friend. Please tell me that I'm being overly paranoid and I should get over my issues and help out a friend in need.

I would not write a LOR for your friend. That would look bad for your friend. LORs need to come from faculty/attendings. If your friend is asking you to put a good word in for her, then comment only on those things for which you have a good feeling, e.g. personality, character. For sure I would not provide false information about her. If the PD asks you about something that you are uncomfortable about just say that you do not really have a good idea. As a PD I would not be expecting an intern friend to be a good source of information about somebody's desire to do psychiatry or their aptitude for it.

 

[whopper]

I would have no problem with a friend recommending a friend so long as the person's description of the friend was accurate, not exaggerated and the person took no offense to the person not getting in.

While I was chief I knew quite a few people who tried to get their friends or relatives in. My attitude was I'd only give some credence to it if the person in the program was reliable because that gave some credibility that the candidate would be good. If the person in the program was not reliable, then their recommendation was not worth anything, and I would not hold that for or against the candidate.

I've also seen situations where someone got ticked when their friend or relative didn't get in. IMHO that's just more reason to believe the decision to not let them in was right, especially if the person was an attending in the program. Reason being is that an attending is in a position where they probably had to judge the person. If they can't be objective about someone not getting in, they most likely would not be objective in grading the person, or listening to other's possible criticisms of that potential resident--> which in turn would make it uncomfortable to voice criticisms if that situation were to arise.

If you want a friend in the program, you need to proceed on it in a manner where there's no conflict of interest or even an appearance of it. If you do talk to the PD, PC or Chief about it, to be fair state that you want the process to be objective and you won't take it personally if the person didn't get in. Also ask them if there's anything you need to do to make sure the process goes fairly and does not make them feel uncomfortable during the process.

I would not write a LOR for your friend.

Agree. A LOR from a friend, and a resident at that won't help your friend IMHO.

 

[hippiedoc13]

I think it's especially tricky when you yourself know that your friend is not passionate about psychiatry, and views it as a "second choice." I would not go overboard in putting yourself out there vouching for this friend. I think it's fine to comment that he/she is a nice person, hard worker, whatever is true. But if it feels uncomfortable to really go to bat for this person, there's probably a good reason you feel that way and you shouldn't ignore it.

Also, your word alone won't get the person a spot. Last year one of my good friends from medical school was trying to switch into psychiatry. I happened to know that my program had an off-cycle opening, so I emailed the PD, told him that I had a friend who was interested and would be great for the spot, and could I tell her about the spot. PD said yes, have her send in her materials right away. I had pretty glowing things to say about this person--I honestly think she is a fabulous doctor and was SO happy that she decided to change to psychiatry. But I am under no illusions that I got her the spot...she got that on her own, based on what the PD, faculty interviewers, and other residents thought of her. I think my contact with the PD probably got them to take a closer look at her application than they otherwise would have, and might have helped her get the interview--but the rest was all her, and if she had been a poor candidate, there was nothing I could have said to change anyone's mind. Happily, she ended up getting the spot which has been awesome so far.

The other thing to think about is, do you want to stake your own (still-forming) reputation on recommending someone who you think is less than stellar? What if you were to say glowing things about him/her, and she were to end up at your program, and then she was clinically weak or had a poor attitude? I would be afraid that it might reflect negatively on my own judgment. (Maybe I am paranoid too?)

 

[psymed]

Thanks everyone for your generous advice. I pretty much agree with everything that has been said. hippiedoc13 pretty much sums up my fears about this situation. I take work very seriously and am hesitant to recommend someone who would not be a great candidate.

Nevertheless for the sake of our friendship I am going to speak to my PD about my friend when the time comes. I plan on being objective and sticking to the facts i.e. talk about her character and work ethics in general.

 

[GATORANALYST]

I stuck in a rather tricky situation. I'm a PGY-1 in a psych program and one of my very good friends wants me to recomend her to my program for a position.

I'm really uncomfortable when it comes to these things. First of all I'm only a lowly intern. Who am I to recomend anyone?

My friend is a hard worker and would make a great resident but maybe not at a Psychiatry program. She is more of an Internal Medicine candidate and I know that she is only applying for Psychiatry as a second choice. She has little to no experience in Psychiatry. Even if I do talk to my Program Director, what am I going to tell him when he asks me about her background in Psychiatry?

When I was applying last year, just the thought of asking for LORs from my supervisors made me extremely anxious. I felt so vulnerable. I didn't ask any of my letter writers to call programs for me (was too chicken) and landed my position on my own with just average scores. I'm not exactly a social butterfly. I have never had many friends or contacts. I've just worked extra hard to get where I am because I could never muster up the courage to ask anyone to do anything for me.

If I decline to talk to my program for her I risk ruining our friendship. I know that the match is one of the most trying times in a physician's life. I want to be a good friend. Please tell me that I'm being overly paranoid and I should get over my issues and help out a friend in need.

Are you sure this has anything to do with your friends lack of desire to go into psychiatry or your fear of speaking to your director, since this was an issue for you when you were applying. Regardless, if it were me and this was a "really close friend" I would try to convince him/her not to go into psych if it is not something they really want because they will just end up being miserable and if they are still persistent I would just put in a good word with the director. What more could you do than that. No harm no foul...

 

[psymed]

Thanks GATORANALYST. Its both. Apart from my own fear of approaching my PD, I don't really feel good about recommending someone for a psych position for who has said on multiple occasions that she would rather go into IM if she had her way.

When I was applying, the one thing I was told by Psychiatry residents and attendings was that Psych programs look for people who are genuinely interested.

When I go to my PD and brag about her character, don't you he's going to ask me if my friend (being an older grad) has any Psych experience.......i.e done any observerships, externships or research?

I haven't discouraged her from applying but I did encourage her to get any hands on Psychiatry experience that she can if she seriously plans on applying for psych positions.