Regenexx

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Iamnew2

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Pain peeps - can someone give me a non-biased review/view on Regenexx? I take it they are stem cells. Is this the Centeno company?
Can someone give me a non-political, objective review of this and how it works? Thanks!
 
I don't think there are any non-biased views of Regenexx on this forum. yes, Dr. Centeno is involved.

you either love it, (and its business model cough $$$) or you decry it for being snake oil. at present, in full disclosure, I lean towards the latter.



but... to be as non-biased as possible, there is insufficient quality data to suggest that it should be standard of care. that may change.
 
Ducttape said:
I don't think there are any non-biased views of Regenexx on this forum. yes, Dr. Centeno is involved.

you either love it, (and its business model cough $$$) or you decry it for being snake oil. at present, in full disclosure, I lean towards the latter.



but... to be as non-biased as possible, there is insufficient quality data to suggest that it should be standard of care. that may change.
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How does it work? Not the stem cell part, but business set up.
 
@Ducttape is on fire!

The deal is basically a franchise license, you get their expensive equipment, marketing, implanted chip.

I believe they actually own some of the clinics and have employed docs. Others are private docs with franchise rights.

There are some docs on here involved, but listen to Duct.
 
Ducttape said:
I don't think there are any non-biased views of Regenexx on this forum. yes, Dr. Centeno is involved.

you either love it, (and its business model cough $$$) or you decry it for being snake oil. at present, in full disclosure, I lean towards the latter.



but... to be as non-biased as possible, there is insufficient quality data to suggest that it should be standard of care. that may change.
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What part of regen do you think is snake oil? You can't just make statements without backing them up with facts.

Platelet-Rich Plasma versus Corticosteroid Injection for the Treatment of Lateral Epicondylitis: A Systematic Review of Systematic Reviews​

Jordyn A Kemp 1, Megan A Olson 1, Matthew A Tao 2, Christopher J Burcal 1
Affiliations expand

Free PMC article

Abstract​

Background: Lateral epicondylitis (LE) is one of the most commonly reported musculoskeletal disorders in the upper extremity. The mechanism of LE is repetitive motion that causes a strain of the extensor tendons. This consequently causes pain and tendinosis at the tendinous attachment site on the lateral epicondyle. Most cases of LE are treated nonoperatively with a variety of interventions, such as injections.
Purpose: The aim of this systematic review (SR) is to synthesize the current evidence on the efficacy of platelet rich plasma (PRP) injections versus corticosteroid (CS) injections as treatment interventions for LE.
Study design: Systematic Review.
Methods: Online databases were searched from database inception to February 24th, 2020 for relevant SR's evaluating PRP vs. CS injections as treatment methods for LE. Two independent researchers searched and screened for articles that were systematic reviews that directly compared PRP to CS injections for LE.
Results: A total of five SR's were included in this review that were published between 2016 and 2020. CS injections were more efficacious for short-term pain relief, and PRP injections were more efficacious for long-term pain relief and improved function.
Conclusion: PRP injections appear to be a more effective long-term treatment option than CS injections for those with LE who did not respond to conservative management.
Level of evidence: 1.
Keywords: corticosteroid injection; elbow epicondylitis; lateral epicondylitis; platelet rich plasma injection; tennis elbow.
 
i will not let you live down the fact that you yourself labelled systematic reviews, as, well, mu shu medicine. however, i have agreed that there may be a valid role of using PRP for musculoskeletal conditions.



my comments were specifically about Regenexx.
 
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Ducttape said:
i will not let you live down the fact that you yourself labelled systematic reviews, as, well, mu shu medicine. however, i have agreed that there may be a valid role of using PRP for musculoskeletal conditions.



my comments were specifically about Regenexx.
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Systematic reviews that show "no effect" are different than systematic reviews that show an effect. It's a version of proving the null hypothesis.

But, I'm curious what your beef is with Regenexx per se?
 
my "beef" is that organizations are primarily focused on financial remuneration, to the disservice of patients and appropriate patient care.

that includes Big Pharma, drug reps, device reps, equipment reps.
 
Ducttape said:
my "beef" is that organizations are primarily focused on financial remuneration, to the disservice of patients and appropriate patient care.

that includes Big Pharma, drug reps, device reps, equipment reps.
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What about hospitals and insurance companies? There's never been more "coverage" for regen than now and that is no accident.
 
yes to both of those are biased and primarily concerned with financial well being.


i dont have issues with doctors who vet any medication or procedure to the best to their ability and offer treatments irrespective of how much money goes in to their pockets.



ive been called an idealist by pretty much everyone.
 
Ducttape said:
yes to both of those are biased and primarily concerned with financial well being.


i dont have issues with doctors who vet any medication or procedure to the best to their ability and offer treatments irrespective of how much money goes in to their pockets.



ive been called an idealist by pretty much everyone.
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Ok. So strong opinions on Regenexx - what experience does anyone have with PRP into the subscapular area? Any good results? I do PRP, and thinking of injecting myself (with assistance of course) to see if it would help. * Yes I realize that this is not medical advice*
 
Iamnew2 said:
Ok. So strong opinions on Regenexx - what experience does anyone have with PRP into the subscapular area? Any good results? I do PRP, and thinking of injecting myself (with assistance of course) to see if it would help. * Yes I realize that this is not medical advice*
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What are you treating?
 
Ducttape said:
my "beef" is that organizations are primarily focused on financial remuneration, to the disservice of patients and appropriate patient care.

that includes Big Pharma, drug reps, device reps, equipment reps.
Click to expand...
success and financial remuneration go hand in hand. A procedure that doesnt work wont be profitable and would not be taught at major univeristy training facilities.
 
Dr. Ice said:
What are you treating?
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Maybe myofascial pain? Trigger points? Subscapular bursal inflammation? Hard to say. All I can say is it hurts a lot! I have had trigger point injections with steroids and much pain relief for like 3 months and used salon pas. also helped. I don't want to take meds, and don't want to do steroids long term. I have my own centrifuge so figure it can't hurt. just was wondering if othershad experience with injecting prp into the subscapular bursa or traps area.
 
Regenexx does good medicine and I appreciate what they do to further the field, but if you want to be part of the "brand", expect to pay a hefty franchise fee and sign agreements that will inhibit your ability to escape.

I never suggest injecting yourself, get one of your trustworthy colleagues to do it. Especially if you're going to try to reach behind yourself and may puncture a lung. wtf.

Regarding the "subscapular area", that is not a diagnosis. All regen works much better if you actually have a real diagnosis and know what you're treating. Are you treating muscle? Ligaments/tendons? One of the bursas? Are things too tight or lax? What's the injury? These are all important to have a good outcome.
 
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Ferrismonk said:
Regenexx does good medicine and I appreciate what they do to further the field, but if you want to be part of the "brand", expect to pay a hefty franchise fee and sign agreements that will inhibit your ability to escape.

I never suggest injecting yourself, get one of your trustworthy colleagues to do it. Especially if you're going to try to reach behind yourself and may puncture a lung. wtf.

Regarding the "subscapular area", that is not a diagnosis. All regen works much better if you actually have a real diagnosis and know what you're treating. Are you treating muscle? Ligaments/tendons? One of the bursas? Are things too tight or lax? What's the injury? These are all important to have a good outcome.
Click to expand...
Yeah well I was kind of talking in general not so much about regenex in this regards. Yes I'm not planning on sticking myself in the back. I'm just curious if anyone currently does PRP -it's likely subacrominal bursitis.
 
Doctodd said:
success and financial remuneration go hand in hand. A procedure that doesnt work wont be profitable and would not be taught at major univeristy training facilities.
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that is a false correlation. success of an injection has nothing to do with money. it has to do with proper patient selection, proper medication, proper technique, and proper follow up.

with regards to your example, why are trigger point injections being taught at major teaching universities when the data shows that they don't work? in fact, one could go so far as to argue why epidurals are still being taught if some of the data (albeit biased imo) is to be believed.

a lot of procedures "work" - because "I paid a lot of money for it, so of course it works". or the status of said procedure or proceduralist.

tons of people buy a Cadillac even though it is the least reliable car brand.
 
ill pass on going down that rabbit hole
 
Iamnew2 said:
Maybe myofascial pain? Trigger points? Subscapular bursal inflammation? Hard to say. All I can say is it hurts a lot! I have had trigger point injections with steroids and much pain relief for like 3 months and used salon pas. also helped. I don't want to take meds, and don't want to do steroids long term. I have my own centrifuge so figure it can't hurt. just was wondering if othershad experience with injecting prp into the subscapular bursa or traps area.
Click to expand...
make sure whoever does it doesnt pop a lung
 
Iamnew2 said:
Yeah well I was kind of talking in general not so much about regenex in this regards. Yes I'm not planning on sticking myself in the back. I'm just curious if anyone currently does PRP -it's likely subacrominal bursitis.
Click to expand...
the subacromial bursa and subscapular bursa are really not that close. get a good diagnosis before you go sticking yourself any more
 
SSdoc33 said:
the subacromial bursa and subscapular bursa are really not that close. get a good diagnosis before you go sticking yourself any more
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subscapular sorry not subacromial. i have yet to stick myself! i guess i can say though that if something goes wrong i certainly won't be suing myself!
 
Iamnew2 said:
Yeah well I was kind of talking in general not so much about regenex in this regards. Yes I'm not planning on sticking myself in the back. I'm just curious if anyone currently does PRP -it's likely subacrominal bursitis.
Click to expand...

there are a lot of patients that do well with plane blocks (hydro-release) in this area.
 
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ragnathor said:
This sounds interesting. Can you elaborate?

Erector spinae block comes to mind, but maybe more superficial above rhomboid?
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If someone needs the practice, I am a willing candidate! 😀
 
I know some good, ethical doctors in the Regenexx network. I don't like how they seem cult-ish and are anti anything traditional as if nothing but regenerative works.
 
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