jeff2005

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Now that the interview process and ranking is over, I have a few things i wish I had done differently:

1. Cancelling too many interviews. I should have visited Duke, UVA, and Dartmouth to name a few. If I don't match at Iowa, I'm going to be very annoyed with myself.

2. Listening to hearsay. This has some relation to regret #1.

3. Speaking too soon. I liked one program so much I immediatly said, "I'm ranking you #1." The PD was super positive about me matching there, until I had to retract my statement. I was then taken off the rank list entirely.

4. Being obsessive about the whole process. I wasn't the only one with this problem!

Anybody got anything to add?
 

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kinda to go with jeff2005's regret #3...one of my regrets is not STFU and talking too much. i also regret having that beer at that one interview lunch...think i made some negative impressions there.
 

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thanks for sharing... I can't believe it'll be a whole year for me until I'm in your shoes. It seems so far away. Is it ever wise at any point to tell your number 1 that they are number 1?
 
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jeff2005

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AnnaLee said:
thanks for sharing... I can't believe it'll be a whole year for me until I'm in your shoes. It seems so far away. Is it ever wise at any point to tell your number 1 that they are number 1?

Yes, once you have been to all your interviews AND have had time to ruminate about it.
 

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Hi everyone...first time posting on this forum (I'm applying to rad-onc), but this is such an active and fun forum...

Anyway, kinda on the lines of point number 3 of the original poster...While most programs in rad-onc were very tight lipped, one of my top choices did call me and tell me that I was a top candidate there. Now this really is a great program, so I told them that they too were "a program at the top of my list" I'm just hoping that they didn't think I'll rank them number 1 (they were #2 though). I know they probably meant what they said because no one else that I know got that phone call...

Anyway, being that rad-onc is as small a field as it is, I probably should've clarified better...

Good luck all you future pathologists!!! :thumbup:

:
jeff2005 said:
Now that the interview process and ranking is over, I have a few things i wish I had done differently:

1. Cancelling too many interviews. I should have visited Duke, UVA, and Dartmouth to name a few. If I don't match at Iowa, I'm going to be very annoyed with myself.

2. Listening to hearsay. This has some relation to regret #1.

3. Speaking too soon. I liked one program so much I immediatly said, "I'm ranking you #1." The PD was super positive about me matching there, until I had to retract my statement. I was then taken off the rank list entirely.

4. Being obsessive about the whole process. I wasn't the only one with this problem!

Anybody got anything to add?
 

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jeff2005 said:
3. Speaking too soon. I liked one program so much I immediatly said, "I'm ranking you #1." The PD was super positive about me matching there, until I had to retract my statement. I was then taken off the rank list entirely.
I am sorry if this is a dumb question, but why exactly do you HAVE to retract to them about saying they were #1, if for example you are planning no ranking them #2....

Is it an ethics issue or what?

Thanks
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
kinda to go with jeff2005's regret #3...one of my regrets is not STFU and talking too much. i also regret having that beer at that one interview lunch...think i made some negative impressions there.
If having a beer makes a negative impression F--- that program!

When interviewing for jobs never eschew alcohol thats offered, I dont care if you are LDS prophet or an Islamic mullah, how you hold your liquor is the most important part of the interview.
 
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jeff2005

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UHS05 said:
Now this really is a great program, so I told them that they too were "a program at the top of my list" I'm just hoping that they didn't think I'll rank them number 1 (they were #2 though). I know they probably meant what they said because no one else that I know got that phone call...

Anyway, being that rad-onc is as small a field as it is, I probably should've clarified better...

:
I wouldn't worry about it. You didn't say they were first. In my case I not only said they were first, I followed up with a letter that said they were first, and then the PD and I emailed a couple of times back and forth. They were understanding about why I changed my mind, but they mistakenly thought I wouldn't rank them at all. I didn't correct them because I found out AFTER the selection committee made their rank list.

I noticed that you're at the University of Iowa. How do you like it there?
 
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jeff2005

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vanelo said:
I am sorry if this is a dumb question, but why exactly do you HAVE to retract to them about saying they were #1, if for example you are planning no ranking them #2....

Is it an ethics issue or what?

Thanks

I'm sure a lot of people wouldn't have retracted it - but that's not my style. Plus it's a program I have a lot of respect for and might consider for fellowship. I had the added complication that a family friend who practices at the same hospital was putting in a good word for me. Didn't want her to look like an ass.
 

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vanelo said:
I am sorry if this is a dumb question, but why exactly do you HAVE to retract to them about saying they were #1, if for example you are planning no ranking them #2....

Is it an ethics issue or what?

Thanks
Be careful about using the "#1" comment loosely - not ethics, but practicality. Path sesms to be a pretty small world (at least academic path is), and you don't want to piss anyone off. Let's say you tell program X that you are ranking them #1, and they rank you to match. Then, if you don't end up there, they might remember it. Maybe not a huge deal, but no reason to run the risk. Of course, if you are certain who your number 1 will be, it can be useful to tell them this explicitly, once you are absolutely sure. Otherwise, it's best to develop a list of positive phrases like "one of my top choices", "ranked very highly", etc.
 

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LADoc00 said:
If having a beer makes a negative impression F--- that program!

When interviewing for jobs never eschew alcohol thats offered, I dont care if you are LDS prophet or an Islamic mullah, how you hold your liquor is the most important part of the interview.
I have to say...I am getting better. I remember interviewing for Hopkins MSTP. Me and two other applicants were out at dinner at the Cheesecake Factory. Now of course, I didn't give a F--- all about getting into Hopkins med since I didn't really care to stay there for the next 7+ years of my life (having gone to undergrad there). Anyways the MSTP fellows at dinner all order water or soda. The applicants also ordered water. I ordered two beers at the same time. Let it suffice to say, I was rejected within a week. The rejection letter was signed by the MSTP director and some other dude the day after my 2nd interview day. Now that's what I call efficiency!

This time, 7 years later, I didn't give a F--- all about getting into this program either. Great program...just didn't wanna stay in the midwest for residency. But I only ordered ONE beer. I think of it as improvement :) Perhaps I shall be completely sober during all of my job interviews...but you're saying now that I should drink like a fish? :laugh: What are you, nuts? :laugh:
 

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geddy said:
Be careful about using the "#1" comment loosely - not ethics, but practicality. Path sesms to be a pretty small world (at least academic path is), and you don't want to piss anyone off. Let's say you tell program X that you are ranking them #1, and they rank you to match. Then, if you don't end up there, they might remember it. Maybe not a huge deal, but no reason to run the risk. Of course, if you are certain who your number 1 will be, it can be useful to tell them this explicitly, once you are absolutely sure. Otherwise, it's best to develop a list of positive phrases like "one of my top choices", "ranked very highly", etc.
I have to echo geddy here. It's not an issue of strict ethics, it's a matter of professional courtesy and practicality. No need to start off your career having pissed off some of the people in your field. They probably won't remember the offense but you never know when this kind of stuff will bite you in the rear end.
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
I have to say...I am getting better. I remember interviewing for Hopkins MSTP. Me and two other applicants were out at dinner at the Cheesecake Factory. Now of course, I didn't give a F--- all about getting into Hopkins med since I didn't really care to stay there for the next 7+ years of my life (having gone to undergrad there). Anyways the MSTP fellows at dinner all order water or soda. The applicants also ordered water. I ordered two beers at the same time. Let it suffice to say, I was rejected within a week. The rejection letter was signed by the MSTP director and some other dude the day after my 2nd interview day. Now that's what I call efficiency!

This time, 7 years later, I didn't give a F--- all about getting into this program either. Great program...just didn't wanna stay in the midwest for residency. But I only ordered ONE beer. I think of it as improvement :) Perhaps I shall be completely sober during all of my job interviews...but you're saying now that I should drink like a fish? :laugh: What are you, nuts? :laugh:
There are tons of groups out there that if you showed up to an interview dinner and ordered hard liquor 2 at time you wouldnt just get an offer, that sh!t would get you labelled "partner" material. Throw on a mink coat and some bling-bling and I would give you a job any day of the week. True story of an applicant at my old residency program shows up at a lunch, orders 2 drinks and hits on waitress and gets the number! The chief resident was so taken aback he went on personal crusade to get that guy ranked 1.
 

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LADoc00 said:
There are tons of groups out there that if you showed up to an interview dinner and ordered hard liquor 2 at time you wouldnt just get an offer, that sh!t would get you labelled "partner" material. Throw on a mink coat and some bling-bling and I would give you a job any day of the week. True story of an applicant at my old residency program shows up at a lunch, orders 2 drinks and hits on waitress and gets the number! The chief resident was so taken aback he went on personal crusade to get that guy ranked 1.
Aight dude, keep in touch then...you know who I am...I just might be givin' you a call a several years if academics don't work out :laugh:
 

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My regret is only interviewing at six programs. I'm now afraid that I seriously overestimated how strong an applicant I am (I figured "it's not derm or rads"). I'm worried that if I don't match at one of my top three I'll be really beating myself up for not applying to more places. I just hope LADoc is right about what he said on the "Real Life" thread.

[Banging head against wall à la Rainman]
 

yaah

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I think the most important thing to remember about the application process is that it is LONG. First impressions are important but they aren't everything. The first 3 programs I visited ended up being below #5 on my rank list, but at the time I was very excited after the interviews. I didn't say anything though because it was early and I knew my main choices were coming up. There is no need to rush your decision, declare your first choice right away. If you find you have a first choice after your interviews are completed, by all means tell them if you want.

The other advice: Relax. Interviews should not be stressful. Occasionally you will have an interview with someone who rubs you the wrong way but don't stress about it. Have fun, be yourself, and try to figure out if the program is for you. If you be yourself during the interview, it will be a lot easier to tell if you are a good fit than if you are "acting."
 

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My regret is that my significant other couldn't afford to come with me on some of the interviews in cities we've never been to before. When it came down ROL time, location/quality of life issues became very important in distinguishing a couple of programs from each other, and it felt like a heavy burden on my shoulders because I was the only one who had been to these cities, and was trying to guess what we would both like best.
 

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cytoborg said:
My regret is that my significant other couldn't afford to come with me on some of the interviews in cities we've never been to before. When it came down ROL time, location/quality of life issues became very important in distinguishing a couple of programs from each other, and it felt like a heavy burden on my shoulders because I was the only one who had been to these cities, and was trying to guess what we would both like best.
I had a similar problem. It's tough to pick a spot for your family to move to. But just remember one important thing... you're going to be the one making the big bucks, so you can always make it up later ;)
 

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LADoc00 said:
If having a beer makes a negative impression F--- that program!

My sentiments exactly. During lunch with the residents at one interview they told me "you are not allowed to order alcohol". I responded "oh, of course not, I don't even drink ;) ". Then they told me about how one of their previous applicants had TWO BEERS at lunch :eek: , so they made the rule of no alcohol. Well, needless to say that program didn't make the list :thumbdown:.
 

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trent05 said:
LADoc00 said:
If having a beer makes a negative impression F--- that program!

My sentiments exactly. During lunch with the residents at one interview they told me "you are not allowed to order alcohol". I responded "oh, of course not, I don't even drink ;) ". Then they told me about how one of their previous applicants had TWO BEERS at lunch :eek: , so they made the rule of no alcohol. Well, needless to say that program didn't make the list :thumbdown:.
wow! i thought i was a bad boy for ordering ONE BEER at lunch. uh oh! :eek:
 

yaah

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Yeah, we get told we can't order alcohol when we take residents out to lunch. It is the middle of the day though, and we are at work, so I guess that's appropriate. Tell you what though, anyone who comes here for an interview next year let me know and I will take you out for a beer the night before.
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
i regret not studying hard enough for step 1 and step 2. if i would have put forth a big effort, my scores may approach that of yaah's. :laugh:
Hey, did your setp 2 scores make in time?
 

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geddy said:
Hey, did your setp 2 scores make in time?
the scores were sent out the day before yesterday. and i did NOT click automatic send. muahahahaha!

you know? i was supposed to take step 2 before christmas. then i paid fitty bucks to push that thing off until the last possible day in january. looks like smooth sailing from here. c'mon 183...show some 183-style love to andy.

P = MD

thank you
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
the scores were sent out the day before yesterday. and i did NOT click automatic send. muahahahaha!

you know? i was supposed to take step 2 before christmas. then i paid fitty bucks to push that thing off until the last possible day in january. looks like smooth sailing from here. c'mon 183...show some 183-style love to andy.

P = MD

thank you
Nice! I wish I had done that. I nearly broke myself studying for step 2... I so regretted clicking that stupid automatic send button, I was upset for like a week after taking it. And yaah still beat me by one point! But, it's all in the past now. :clap:
 

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geddy said:
Nice! I wish I had done that. I nearly broke myself studying for step 2... I so regretted clicking that stupid automatic send button, I was upset for like a week after taking it. And yaah still beat me by one point! But, it's all in the past now. :clap:
wow...you got a 284? that's totally awesome! nice work geddy. if we both match at brigham, i'm gonna call you daddy.
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
wow...you got a 284? that's totally awesome! nice work geddy. if we both match at brigham, i'm gonna call you daddy.
:D :D :D No, I did not come close to that score - but I finally found out what yaah's famous score was... bows low in homage to the great and powerful moderator.
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
yaah's still my b.......
Now it's in this thread, too? We're still waiting. So many possibilities, many of which are deeply disturbing
 

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jeff2005 said:
I noticed that you're at the University of Iowa. How do you like it there?
I actually am from Iowa City and went to UIHC for grad school (Go Hawkeyes!). Great place, great people and a hospital that just keeps expanding. They're building a brand new cancer facility right now and its supposed to be state of the art. Also, it is a great place to party on the weekends if you're single, but is also one of the best places to raise a family (one of the best public school systems). Its actually very high on my list for rad-onc.
I also worked with Dr. Cohen, the chair of pathology, for my thesis project, and also with several other pathologists...so feel free to PM me if you have any questions about the city or the University. Good luck on the match!
 

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LADoc00 said:
There are tons of groups out there that if you showed up to an interview dinner and ordered hard liquor 2 at time you wouldnt just get an offer, that sh!t would get you labelled "partner" material. Throw on a mink coat and some bling-bling and I would give you a job any day of the week. True story of an applicant at my old residency program shows up at a lunch, orders 2 drinks and hits on waitress and gets the number! The chief resident was so taken aback he went on personal crusade to get that guy ranked 1.

True story, but I didn't end up matching there :)
 

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Whoa. Regrets, so soon?

The process wasn't perfect, but I'm happy.

What's the worst-case scenario? I don't match. In which case I will just grit my teeth and do it again.
 

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One slight regret is that I could have been more diligent about corresponding with programs and expressing my enthusiasm. I was kinda lazy about this during the interview season. I feel bad about not sending all the programs thank you notes either. Oh well...c'est la vie.
 

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You could go to USCAP and thank them in person.... it would be perfect timing! :)
 

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deschutes said:
You could go to USCAP and thank them in person.... it would be perfect timing! :)
I am jealous that I will not be able to go to USCAP this year. I did ponder putting in an abstract of one of my grad school projects; however, I didn't think my research would cater well to an audience of pathologists.

Have fun at USCAP! :thumbup:
 

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i made the mistake of asking two residents about good places to grab a beer after the interview. it was an awkward moment in the elevator- one stared at me, speechless, while the other was in deep thought for a moment. he then said, "the people i know that drink like to go to..." the people i know that drink??? :eek: i was worried that they were mormon or something and that i had offended them. luckily wasn't my #1 program.
 

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roach said:
i made the mistake of asking two residents about good places to grab a beer after the interview. it was an awkward moment in the elevator- one stared at me, speechless, while the other was in deep thought for a moment. he then said, "the people i know that drink like to go to..." the people i know that drink??? :eek: i was worried that they were mormon or something and that i had offended them. luckily wasn't my #1 program.
I can't believe someone would be offended by that. What do they expect? Sheesh if an applicant asked me that I would say wait until the end of the day I'll go with you. :cool:
 

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I have a similar story.

One of my favourite questions on the interview trail was, "What should I eat, do or see before I leave here?"

One senior interviewer scratched his head for the longest time and said, "....Pizza?"

FWIW I didn't consider that an awkward moment. And I still think it's a great question to ask! :cool:

(I had the "Museum of Natural History" as a response a few times, so I decided I would go see. I spent more time looking for it than I spent in it. And I actually like museums.)
 

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deschutes said:
Whoa. Regrets, so soon?

The process wasn't perfect, but I'm happy.
I totally agree. To be honest, I can't think of a regret - things went pretty much the way I hoped they would. Granted, my final rank list was different from the one I composed a priori, but I think I made an informed decision about programs at which I have a reasonable chance of being accepted. Most importantly, I think I'll be happy at any of the programs I ranked.

Now, we'll see if I feel the same way on March 17 :)
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
Have fun at USCAP! :thumbup:
Thank you. I will - now. As recently as this morning, the poster was non-existent.

I'm currently making feeble attempts at packing.
 

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My biggest regret is changing my ROL at 8:59 PM. I had my list in all week. Finally gave myself permission to change it at 6:59 PM. Then we went out to dinner. Didn't stay out quite long enough. Got home early enough to change it back. Now am having serious issues with anxiety. I want to call my # 1 program to find out if they ranked me high enough to match. Ahhhhhhhhhh!
Will St. Patrick's Day ever get here? :barf:
 

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geddy said:
I totally agree. To be honest, I can't think of a regret - things went pretty much the way I hoped they would. Granted, my final rank list was different from the one I composed a priori, but I think I made an informed decision about programs at which I have a reasonable chance of being accepted. Most importantly, I think I'll be happy at any of the programs I ranked.

Now, we'll see if I feel the same way on March 17 :)
dude we gots to match at our #1. if that is the case, we shall go out for a drink ourselves!

*fingers crossed*
 

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I guess I do have one regret, which is that I didn't apply to UNC.

But given the nature of the competition, and the odd wording of the terms of engagement for the visa.... *shrugs* It's not keeping me awake at night.
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
dude we gots to match at our #1. if that is the case, we shall go out for a drink ourselves!

*fingers crossed*
I gotta teel you, I have a good feeling, man... I hate to run the risk of jinxing anything, but my gut tells me it just might happen. If so, first round is on me.
 

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AndyMilonakis said:
dude we gots to match at our #1. if that is the case, we shall go out for a drink ourselves!

*fingers crossed*
By the way, my school has just decided that passage of step2 BS is not required to graduate. There have been some people who failed it, and it's impossible to reschedule what with the ridiculous way this has been managed. Now if they'll just refund the money for the exam... just think of the fun that could provide the night of match day! :barf:
 

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geddy said:
I gotta teel you, I have a good feeling, man... I hate to run the risk of jinxing anything, but my gut tells me it just might happen. If so, first round is on me.
i am cautiously optimistic. second round is on me.
geddy said:
By the way, my school has just decided that passage of step2 BS is not required to graduate. There have been some people who failed it, and it's impossible to reschedule what with the ridiculous way this has been managed. Now if they'll just refund the money for the exam... just think of the fun that could provide the night of match day!
wow...i wonder if my school will do the same thing. i haven't heard of anyone failing CS here but then again, i'm not in the whole med school gossip loop anyway (and i never was considering that i don't know 80% of my classmates at all :laugh: ). i won't be surprised if some folks in my class failed though--six or seven of these people DID fail step 1 and got yanked outta clinical rotations early in 3rd year.

i remember when the dean of students held a meeting to tell all of us that we would be the guinea pig class for the step 2 BS and that we would each have to pass the BS in order to graduate...there was so much anger in the room. chairs and tables being hurled across the room, gunfire, screaming, etc. i wonder if our school, like yours, will change its stance on the step 2 BS with respect to passing it to graduate. in fact, i don't even know for sure if they will offer it next year. being the guinea pig class, if they find that this experiment is a failure and no longer administer step BS in the future (fat chance!), i want my $1000 back! :laugh:
 

b&ierstiefel

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yaah said:
I can't believe someone would be offended by that. What do they expect? Sheesh if an applicant asked me that I would say wait until the end of the day I'll go with you. :cool:
Yes. You could take the applicant to Metzger's :thumbup: and drink to your hearts content. Then after imbibing a sufficient amount of your german drink of choice, you could do your german dance:

I will do the German dance for you, it's fun and gay and tra-la-la. I hope you will enjoy my dance, fiddle-ey-aye, fiddle-ey-aye. Would you like some sauerkraut, German boy, German boy? Yes, i'd like some sauerkraut, boy i'm hungry!
 

SLUsagar

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geddy said:
By the way, my school has just decided that passage of step2 BS is not required to graduate. There have been some people who failed it, and it's impossible to reschedule what with the ridiculous way this has been managed. Now if they'll just refund the money for the exam... just think of the fun that could provide the night of match day! :barf:

interesting...my home school did the same "oh NOW you just need to pass step 2 CS (cash scheme) in order to graduate..., this only applies to YOUR class " -- wow, jeeythanks! i feel so honored to be the one class that's gotta dish out a grand! :laugh: :mad:
 

cytoborg

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SLUsagar said:
interesting...my home school did the same "oh NOW you just need to pass step 2 CS (cash scheme) in order to graduate..., this only applies to YOUR class " -- wow, jeeythanks! i feel so honored to be the one class that's gotta dish out a grand! :laugh: :mad:
Yeah, gotta love how schools jumped on the "you must pass step 2 CS to graduate" bandwagon even though the merits of the test are unknown, the logistics are a nightmare and god help you if you actually want to see a score report before the next presidential election. So many of my classmates had difficulty scheduling the test prior to graduation and were in a panic about it, that the admin changed their minds and said we'll all still graduate. :cool:

I like the boycott idea.