Rejected

[neuro14]

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Hey. Rejected from Vanderbilt today. Do not know how competitive they are and I was wondering if anyone had insight into if this is a bad sign as to how the rest of the match is going to go for me, considering I got a rejection 2 days after applying. I see that a good amount of people are getting interviews so:

My questions for the masses:
1. Why do you think I was rejected so quickly--board scores? 209/231
2. Should I revise my list of programs--currently at 15. (well 14 since vandy is out).

 

[Thama]

Hey. Rejected from Vanderbilt today. Do not know how competitive they are and I was wondering if anyone had insight into if this is a bad sign as to how the rest of the match is going to go for me, considering I got a rejection 2 days after applying. I see that a good amount of people are getting interviews so:

My questions for the masses:
1. Why do you think I was rejected so quickly--board scores? 209/231
2. Should I revise my list of programs--currently at 15. (well 14 since vandy is out).

Was Vandy typical for your list, or do you have a lot of less-known programs on there too?

What kind of clinical grades did you get and where did you go to school?

 

[neuro14]

I have a few lesser known places but with only 15, I stuck with a whole bunch of the big names. Vandy was typical for about 12 of them.
I passed everything (some honors third year), usmd student from an upper/mid-tier med school. I think I might be the only one here going into Neurology, even though our neuro program is one of the best in the country. I did well on my Sub-I earlier this year and think I can interview well here, I just want to have more than 1 program on my rank list.

 

[cerebral edema]

You made a 209 on Step I and are wondering why you got rejected at vanderbilt?

I think you need to set your sights a lot lower.

 

[omelette1230]

Yes this may be true but no reason to be an a**hole about it. I've seen people get into those caliber of places with those scores. Id say just add more schools to your list (I think this would be wise), and I'm sure you will end up in a decent place.If you can do some research and add more to your CV between now and then that would help too.

 

[Thama]

Some places are more willing to overlook poor step scores for other things on the resume than others. Maybe Vandy just uses the step scores aggressively as filters or places a lot of weight on them. I don't think that's universal among good programs by any means.

 

[Hellothere111]

I agree with Thama and omelette. Different programs have different screening criteria and then ranking criteria. Perhaps adding a buffer layer of programs is a good idea. If you don't like them at all and get IVs from places you like, you can always choose to not rank them.

 

[TUGM]

On a similar note, I haven't received interviews at any of the locations that people have been getting them at yet - Vandy, Colorado, MUSC, etc...

Should I be worried?... Does anyone know how they decide to send out applications to some but not others. People with exceptionally strong/stronger applications first?

The match process sure is stressful, and I thought I was a fairly decent applicant this year, so I'm just being Type A/anxious.

 

[curlygirlie106]

I think the rapidity of replies from programs certainly speaks to the system they use for interview invites. For a program like Vandy, one could extrapolate that all applicants with a Step 1 score above a certain cut off point are invited to interview, plus or minus maybe a few easily "sortable" criteria (e.g. it wouldn't surprise me if programs screen out FMGs right off the bat).

There's no way that the PD is getting through 300 or more applications so quickly to really use anything else as basis for an interview invite. Maybe folks that haven't heard yet are more likely to have a mid-range score and might be interviewed on a case-by-case basis as interview slots become available when "top" candidates cancel. I'm truly just guessing here, but it would certainly make sense.

 

[Elipsis]

I think adding a couple of programs just in case like some others have mentioned isn't a bad idea, but I wouldn't worry too much about it. I think you posted something about scores a while back and mentioned that you had a pretty strong research background; I bet a lot of the more academic programs would be pretty stoked to get you in their program and most of those places haven't started sending invites at all yet. If you don't have enough interviews by mid October you could add a bunch of applications then. I think the deadline for most programs was Oct. 31.

 

[cerebral edema]

Yes this may be true but no reason to be an a**hole about it.

Neurology is getting more and more competitive every year. Scoring a 209 on Step I is a huge red flag. A ~230 on Step II is not much better. I doubt he'll get passed the initial screening to display his research background.

 

[neuro14]

Neurology is getting more and more competitive every year. Scoring a 209 on Step I is a huge red flag. A ~230 on Step II is not much better. I doubt he'll get passed the initial screening to display his research background.

Like the person above said, there is no reason to be an a**hole about it. Match is stressful enough and I really do not need useless advice like yours. Neurology is not Derm. Neurology is not Orthopedic Surgery. Neurology is not even OBGYN. I know that you are an IMG and the requirements for you guys are a little higher and I thank you for responding, but you need to back off a bit and stop trying to stress me out.

Congratulations on matching last year, I'm sure you are crushing it at whatever program you are in.

 

[neuro14]

I think adding a couple of programs just in case like some others have mentioned isn't a bad idea, but I wouldn't worry too much about it. I think you posted something about scores a while back and mentioned that you had a pretty strong research background; I bet a lot of the more academic programs would be pretty stoked to get you in their program and most of those places haven't started sending invites at all yet. If you don't have enough interviews by mid October you could add a bunch of applications then. I think the deadline for most programs was Oct. 31.

I think I will do this. I've gotten 4 interviews (plus my home school) so far, so I'm not as worried as I was when I posted this. I'm just waiting for the bigger name places to send invites out to decide if I should apply to any more or not. I keep feeling like Vandy was a fluke or something.

 

[Elipsis]

The comment above about a 209 step 1 being a red flag made me laugh. I've been tutoring 2nd years in path for the medical school lately and the amount of stuff I remember from 2nd year is... really kind of sad. I have a feeling if someone ever found a way to do a study correlating step 1 scores with resident performance the results would be pretty hilarious. Good luck. I suspect your thought about Vandy being a fluke will turn out to be on target.

 

[Hellothere111]

Perhaps the PD/ resident selection committee at Vanderbilt think step 1 scores correlate best with residency outcomes (whatever their measures are) but I know there are other programs (perhaps better, definitely better ranked) which are more concerned with what you bring to the table. A 260 in step 1 with minimal research experience means you leave out your best skill set the moment you enter the interview. A 200 with solid research background means you can be golden to the program. I'm sure there are enough programs out there that are itching to capitalize on what you have to offer.

 

[Hellothere111]

Of course, this doesn't take anything away at all from people who got a call from Vandy. Good luck to all.

 

[mrcmedman]

Perhaps the PD/ resident selection committee at Vanderbilt think step 1 scores correlate best with residency outcomes (whatever their measures are) but I know there are other programs (perhaps better, definitely better ranked) which are more concerned with what you bring to the table. A 260 in step 1 with minimal research experience means you leave out your best skill set the moment you enter the interview. A 200 with solid research background means you can be golden to the program. I'm sure there are enough programs out there that are itching to capitalize on what you have to offer.

Except there are plenty of candidates with above average board scores who also have some decent research experience and great clinical grades. This is especially the case when applying to top 15 programs.

I am not saying the OP will not get interviews from top 15 programs. But I do think that adding more schools would be a good idea.

 

[Hellothere111]

Except there are plenty of candidates with above average board scores who also have some decent research experience and great clinical grades. This is especially the case when applying to top 15 programs.

I am not saying the OP will not get interviews from top 15 programs. But I do think that adding more schools would be a good idea.

No question about that. Adding a few programs can only help.

 

[omelette1230]

My own personal opinion about all this is that for us going into neurology, it takes a certain kind of person to choose this field. Maybe not in terms of grades, step, etc, but a kind of person who is rare in our society. Many people I talk to say there's a need for it that is not being met. Because of this, I know there is a place for all of us somewhere and feel that we should be supportive of each others efforts. I've seen enough backstabbing just in medical school and am sometimes disappointed who our future doctors will be. Neurology definitely seems more collegial, and the way the residents here worked together was inspiring. Yes, some of us will go to UCSF and Mass Gen, and others will go to Southwest River Valley State Technical Institute Memorial Hospital. However, we're all part of the same community and should try to lift each other up.

 

[bustbones26]

My own personal opinion about all this is that for us going into neurology, it takes a certain kind of person to choose this field. Maybe not in terms of grades, step, etc, but a kind of person who is rare in our society. Many people I talk to say there's a need for it that is not being met. Because of this, I know there is a place for all of us somewhere and feel that we should be supportive of each others efforts. I've seen enough backstabbing just in medical school and am sometimes disappointed who our future doctors will be. Neurology definitely seems more collegial, and the way the residents here worked together was inspiring. Yes, some of us will go to UCSF and Mass Gen, and others will go to Southwest River Valley State Technical Institute Memorial Hospital. However, we're all part of the same community and should try to lift each other up.

----and all of use eventually end up with the same ABPN certificate on the wall, no matter where we trained and that is all that matters!!

Trust me, the demand for neurologists in the community right now is VERY high, they don't care if you went to Vanderbilt or St. Elsewhere. All they care about is if you are board certified, up to date on your CME, stayed out of trouble (no malpractice, etc), and do your job.

 

[TUGM]

I agree with the above statements. Medicine is a demanding field, and I suppose I never understood all the unnecessary backstabbing and under-the-bus-throwing... It has randomly happened to me... LOL (funny story). From what I hear, Neurology is a very friendly community in general, and the majority of the people that go into this field actually love the subject matter (since we don't get compensated 😉!).

On another note... I got my first rejection: OHSU! Guess I won't get to see Portland, OR this interview season.

 

[Thama]

What do these rejections say? I always imagined that they wouldn't send that until later in the season when they were sure that they wouldn't need extra people to fill cancellations.

 

[neuro14]

I think that these random rejections mean very little in the long run. They most likely received 500-1000 applications already and have a good idea of who they are going to interview, and whether they need more information from the MSPE to determine if you are in their first choice of dates or later. Or maybe they even take other factors like location--maybe you simply lived too far from Portland for them to give you a ring.

 

[caelum7]

I have a few lesser known places but with only 15, I stuck with a whole bunch of the big names.

another reason to expand your search is that there are a lot of great lesser known programs out there. even though i interviewed at several "top 10" programs, i ended up highly ranking and matching at a program that rarely even gets mentioned in the neuro residency ranking threads, and i've loved my time here. i honestly can't imagine being happier anywhere else. plus... i was not a very competitive applicant (good scores but zero research) and there is something to be said about being a big fish in a small pond- like getting the chance to shine and eventually becoming chief resident and getting my first choice in fellowships.

best of luck! i had an enormous amount of fun on the interview trail.

 

[TUGM]

What do these rejections say? I always imagined that they wouldn't send that until later in the season when they were sure that they wouldn't need extra people to fill cancellations.

Mine said, thanks for applying, but since we have so many awesome applicants like you, we are not able to offer an interview to you... SUCK IT #youfailn00b

jk about that last part.

 

[Hellothere111]

Mine said, thanks for applying, but since we have so many awesome applicants like you, we are not able to offer an interview to you... SUCK IT #youfailn00b

jk about that last part.

I got that too. At 1950 EST!! So much for the evening beer to deal with the stress.

 

[Neophrenologic]

My own personal opinion about all this is that for us going into neurology, it takes a certain kind of person to choose this field. Maybe not in terms of grades, step, etc, but a kind of person who is rare in our society. Many people I talk to say there's a need for it that is not being met. Because of this, I know there is a place for all of us somewhere and feel that we should be supportive of each others efforts. I've seen enough backstabbing just in medical school and am sometimes disappointed who our future doctors will be. Neurology definitely seems more collegial, and the way the residents here worked together was inspiring. Yes, some of us will go to UCSF and Mass Gen, and others will go to Southwest River Valley State Technical Institute Memorial Hospital. However, we're all part of the same community and should try to lift each other up.

I've come across this post a couple of times, and I just wanted to say that I appreciate it. There is so much that is regrettable about medicine and medical education, much of which is simply outside our control. But I think that's all the more reason for us to focus on what we can control - to not forget ourselves in the throes of our own frustrations, and to treat others with the respect, consideration, and kindness that we would want shown to us. Wherever I end up matching, I hope to work with people like yourself and the residents you describe. Thanks again, and best of luck to you (and to all of you) on the interview trail.

 

[neuro14]

Hey. Rejected from Vanderbilt today. Do not know how competitive they are and I was wondering if anyone had insight into if this is a bad sign as to how the rest of the match is going to go for me, considering I got a rejection 2 days after applying. I see that a good amount of people are getting interviews so:

My questions for the masses:
1. Why do you think I was rejected so quickly--board scores? 209/231
2. Should I revise my list of programs--currently at 15. (well 14 since vandy is out).

Rejected from UTSW Dallas today, but getting interviews elsewhere. Glad I added a few more! Just curious, what is the average number that people have around now?

 

[Elipsis]

I have 4 (+ my home prelim)

 

[NeuroAP86]

Rejected from UTSW Dallas today, but getting interviews elsewhere. Glad I added a few more! Just curious, what is the average number that people have around now?

I also got rejected from UTSW Dallas even before all my LOR were in. No interview invites yet so starting to get worried

 

[1synapse]

I've gotten 8 so far, but only one from a program in my preliminary top 5 list. Still anxious to hear back from some programs and starting to worry because I have heard some other people have gotten IVs there.

 

[smmypnts]

I've gotten 5 Neuro invites, however surprisingly few are from programs in the northeast. However, I haven't heard back from a single prelim year program

Anyone else having the same problem with prelim year programs?

I did well on Step 1 but haven't taken Step 2 yet. Do you think that's why?

 

[Thama]

I've gotten 5 Neuro invites, however surprisingly few are from programs in the northeast. However, I haven't heard back from a single prelim year program

Anyone else having the same problem with prelim year programs?

I did well on Step 1 but haven't taken Step 2 yet. Do you think that's why?

I just don't think many good northeastern programs are sending invites yet.

 

[Jubears09]

Same as Thama. The midwest seems to have a jump on the game.

How widely did you apply for prelim? The academic prelims seem to be waiting to see if you get invited to an neuro interview before considering you (three of the places I applied to said this straight up). I've heard from a few places across the country, but I don't think most places have invited yet. There is a prelim interview thread in the Internship forum though, checking that might help you see if your specific programs have invited.

 

[smmypnts]

Same as Thama. The midwest seems to have a jump on the game.

How widely did you apply for prelim? The academic prelims seem to be waiting to see if you get invited to an neuro interview before considering you (three of the places I applied to said this straight up). I've heard from a few places across the country, but I don't think most places have invited yet. There is a prelim interview thread in the Internship forum though, checking that might help you see if your specific programs have invited.

I applied to mostly academic prelims affiliated with the advanced neuro programs I applied to. I was hoping that even if I don't get a Neuro invite I could still get a Prelim Year invite. Do you think I should add more programs, or call the prelim programs to emphasize this?

 

[drzing]

6 so far (7 including home). Expecting to hear yes/no from most places this week considering they have had a full week to review applications.

 

[smmypnts]

For those of you who applied to Mount Sinai in NYC, did they download all your documents on ADTS yet? They still haven't downloaded my MSPE yet which I'm wondering if thats a bad sign.

 

[pietachok]

For those of you who applied to Mount Sinai in NYC, did they download all your documents on ADTS yet? They still haven't downloaded my MSPE yet which I'm wondering if thats a bad sign.

They have still not retrieved my LORs or MSPE.

 

[Elipsis]

I don't know about it being a bad sign; I think the northeast programs just take their time.

 

[NeuroAP86]

Does anyone know what it means when a program emails you saying you have been placed on a wait list and if there any cancelations they will contact me?

 

[drzing]

Does anyone know what it means when a program emails you saying you have been placed on a wait list and if there any cancelations they will contact me?

It means that you are on a wait list waiting for some cancellations-->meaning they filled up all of their interview spots but will inevitably offer you one because every program gets cancellations. What program was it, if you do not mind me asking?

 

[NeuroAP86]

It means that you are on a wait list waiting for some cancellations-->meaning they filled up all of their interview spots but will inevitably offer you one because every program gets cancellations. What program was it, if you do not mind me asking?

That is exactly what I thought it was, sort of dumb asking get that now in hindsight lol. It was Ohio state