Residency Interview Suits and Watches

[VisionaryTics]

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I think everything on it is too high. Button point is high, coat length doesn't cover this guy's skinny ass, inseam rise is too high, pant hem is too high. This is too close to Thom Browne:

Although I think even Thom's coat is more conservatively cut. That is going to look bad in anything other than anatomical position.

 

[duckie99]

Too fashion forward? This seems like way too aggressive of a cut for a medicine interview, although I'm very much in favor of the color/contour -- I just worry that crotchety, old interviews will have other opinions...

lol at that suit! Jacket is cut way too small and pants too short. This is medicine we are talking about. You are going to have the lives of real people in your hands. It is a conservative attire field and patients don't want some trendy guy with a suit that is too small taking care of them. Gotta look the part bro. Wear that type of suit for nights out on the town if you really want it.

 

[darkelven29]

Lol, radicalradon was referring to the other suit, not the one posted by visionary, that's definitely not appropriate.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Too fashion forward? This seems like way too aggressive of a cut for a medicine interview, although I'm very much in favor of the color/contour -- I just worry that crotchety, old interviews will have other opinions...

As someone who is relatively fashion forward in the field of surgery, I like that suit and wouldn't mind seeing it in a social situation.

However in my opinion, the cut simply strays too far from the norm and therefore becomes distracting (and that's assuming you have the physique to pull it off. Believe me I've seen plenty of sausage legged men wearing skinny jeans to realize that some would benefit from a touch more body awareness)..

You don't have to stray too far from this to fit in. No one is suggesting you wear a wide lapel, double-breasted flare leg suit. But I think particularly for men, there is some risk in looking too much like a fashionista and having people assume that you arent serious about your future profession.

Save the European cut suits for when you become a Scottsdale plastic surgeon. LOL.

 

[airplanes]

Too fashion forward? This seems like way too aggressive of a cut for a medicine interview, although I'm very much in favor of the color/contour -- I just worry that crotchety, old interviews will have other opinions...

There is nothing wrong with wearing this suit for an interview. Given the option, why on earth would you want to wear a baggier one?

Fit is important.

 

[duckie99]

Fit is important.

uh... the suit is too small... at least by today's fashion sense. And you're not James Bond.

 

[ijn]

There is nothing wrong with wearing this suit for an interview. Given the option, why on earth would you want to wear a baggier one?

Fit is important.

Because it makes you look like a girly European. He's applying to radiation oncology, so he's far more likely to be interviewed by a red blooded (and odds are Republican) American. They don't take too kindly to effeminate girly men.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Because it makes you look like a girly European. He's applying to radiation oncology, so he's far more likely to be interviewed by a red blooded (and odds are Republican) American. They don't take too kindly to effeminate girly men.

And let's also admit that while Rad Oncs are not Neurologists, they certainly aren't *generally* as stylish as Plastics or Derm usually are (at least once in practice).

Non-European cut =/= "baggy".

 

[Lunasly]

Hey drizzt, can you recommend me a suit/shirt/tie combo? The three colors I am considering for each piece are..

Suit – either blue or charcol
Shirt – either light/powder blue or white
Tie – either a nice blue or maroon/burgundy.

What is your opinion? I've always heard that blue shirts go better with charcoal suits.

Here are some examples of what I was thinking:

OR

 

[airplanes]

Because it makes you look like a girly European. He's applying to radiation oncology, so he's far more likely to be interviewed by a red blooded (and odds are Republican) American. They don't take too kindly to effeminate girly men.

If you think wearing a tailored suit that actually fits is "european" or "girly" then you are beyond saving. Good day, sir.

uh... the suit is too small... at least by today's fashion sense. And you're not James Bond.

It's a skinny dude, what do you expect? Since you brought it up, are you an authority on today's fashion sense? And what does James Bond have to do with anything? What any man should want is a suit that actually fits, without excessive fabric in places where it doesn't belong.

PS no one actually cares. Plenty of interviewers don't know anything about clothes so you can wear the baggiest, ugliest, poorest fitting suit and mismatch your belt and shoes and they won't bat an eyelash. How you dress/look will rank as the 900th factor they consider when they make their rank list. So you guys can stop overanalyzing and making up BS about the political leanings of radiation oncologists. How on earth does being a republican have ANYTHING to do with knowing how to dress? You guys are ridiculous.

 

[airplanes]

Hey drizzt, can you recommend me a suit/shirt/tie combo? The three colors I am considering for each piece are..

Suit – either blue or charcol
Shirt – either light/powder blue or white
Tie – either a nice blue or maroon/burgundy.

What is your opinion? I've always heard that blue shirts go better with charcoal suits.

Here are some examples of what I was thinking:

Light blue shirt will go with either charcoal or navy. White is somewhat more formal, but also more boring. A burgundy tie is a solid choice, a deep purple also works. Stay away from colors like bright red, your tie should be a darker color to clash less against your suit.

 

[RadicalRadon]

Haha, I'm not sure people are noticing the differences between the 4 suits I've posted.

The first 2 are E Zegna, and have a somewhat more conservative cut (relative to RLBL and Burberry), but are still the most tailored cut they make (Milano line). They definitely fit the models well but aren't fasion forward. They're more "timeless" in that they will still be wearable for years to come

The third suit (brown pinstripe) is a Ralph Lauren Black Label. It has the most distinctive cut, IMO. It is definitely the slimmest suit that still looks completely professional in all settings.

The gray mohair suit is a Burberry London, and it's definitely a fashion suit. The lapels are very narrow and the suit has a higher stance overall with a short jacket length. It looks nice IMO, but it's definitely a little polarizing. It's also unlikely this will be stylish in 4-5 years, as the trends will ultimately move away from super slim fits.

For the money, the first three suits are actually a much better value proposition. I was just curious as to where people drew the line for interviews in medicine. It's unfortunate but people in medicine are notoriously bad at dressing themselves...

Also, fwiw... brown suits are in.
http://www.gq.com/style/wear-it-now/201212/top-10-menswear-trends-2012#slide=4

If you think wearing a tailored suit that actually fits is "european" or "girly" then you are beyond saving. Good day, sir.



It's a skinny dude, what do you expect? Since you brought it up, are you an authority on today's fashion sense? And what does James Bond have to do with anything? What any man should want is a suit that actually fits, without excessive fabric in places where it doesn't belong.

PS no one actually cares. Plenty of interviewers don't know anything about clothes so you can wear the baggiest, ugliest, poorest fitting suit and mismatch your belt and shoes and they won't bat an eyelash. How you dress/look will rank as the 900th factor they consider when they make their rank list. So you guys can stop overanalyzing and making up BS about the political leanings of radiation oncologists. How on earth does being a republican have ANYTHING to do with knowing how to dress? You guys are ridiculous.

 

[VisionaryTics]

If you think wearing a tailored suit that actually fits is "european" or "girly" then you are beyond saving. Good day, sir.

There's a middle ground between baggy, prom-style suits and the one than RadicalRadon posted. It's called a well-fitted suit that complements and flatters a silhouette without being constricting.

If you think that a suit cut too short and too tight in every conceivable dimension "actually fits", you are beyond saving. Good day, sir.

 

[airplanes]

There's a middle ground between baggy, prom-style suits and the one than RadicalRadon posted. It's called a well-fitted suit that complements and flatters a silhouette without being constricting.

If you think that a suit cut too short and too tight in every conceivable dimension "actually fits", you are beyond saving. Good day, sir.

lol nice comeback, sounds familiar. Why don't you tell us a little more about the political leanings of radiation oncologists and how that has anything to do with the suit you wear, since you're obviously an expert in that regard as well.

 

[RadicalRadon]

There's a middle ground between baggy, prom-style suits and the one than RadicalRadon posted. It's called a well-fitted suit that complements and flatters a silhouette without being constricting.

If you think that a suit cut too short and too tight in every conceivable dimension "actually fits", you are beyond saving. Good day, sir.

FWIW, that's the burberry mainline suit you're trashing. They also have a slim fit suit. It's not as bad as you're making it out to be. I don't think you're seeing past the BMI 17 model and seeing the actual details of the suit. That Thom Browne suit has nothing on the suit I posted....

Honestly, I might pick up that burberry suit. It's eye catching for sure. I might wear it out to west coast interviews while I wear more reserved suits for some east coast and all southern programs. Definitely wouldn't mind wearing it anywhere in NY, LA, or Chicago.

 

[VisionaryTics]

FWIW, that's the burberry mainline suit you're trashing. They also have a slim fit suit. It's not as bad as you're making it out to be. I don't think you're seeing past the BMI 17 model and seeing the actual details of the suit.

I don't care that it's Burberry. There's lots I like about the suit. I like the lapels, shoulders have good structure without being too artificial. It's a nice versatile color.

I just don't like the cut, at all. I think it will look even worse on somebody with a BMI above 20.

Just my opinion.

 

[VisionaryTics]

That Thom Browne suit has nothing on the suit I posted....

Yes, aside from the pant hem, the Thom Browne suit actually fits.

 

[RadicalRadon]

I don't care that it's Burberry. There's lots I like about the suit. I like the lapels, shoulders have good structure without being too artificial. It's a nice versatile color.

I just don't like the cut, at all. I think it will look even worse on somebody with a BMI above 20.

Just my opinion.

Yeah, I don't know what you mean that you "don't like the cut at all." The lapels are ultra-narrow on the Burberry suit. You can't wear anything but a skinny tie with this suit. That's what primarily makes it a fashion forward suit compared with the RLBL, along with the shorter jacket length. Both of those things are features I would consider part of the "cut." of the suit.

The suit would look fine on a bigger person too because they would have a larger size. That's a 38 or 40 (Italian size) suit in the pic. It's obviously going to look way different than a 50, which is what most 20-someting Americans would wear...

 

[VisionaryTics]

Yeah, I don't know what you mean that you "don't like the cut at all." The lapels are ultra-narrow on the Burberry suit. You can't wear anything but a skinny tie with this suit. That's what primarily makes it a fashion forward suit compared with the RLBL, along with the shorter jacket length. Both of those things are features I would consider part of the "cut." of the suit.

I like the roll and notch of the lapels. You're right about the width and it requiring a skinny tie. Narrow lapels, skinny ties, and short jacket length are all things I don't like in suits. I think there's a reason that classic cuts have remained the same for the last 80 years while "fashion forward" changes every few years. That seems like a suit you'd look back on in 15 years and think, "Wow, what was I thinking."

Just my opinion. You clearly like the suit while I clearly don't. Let us know if you end up buying it -- I'd like to see how it looks on another frame.

 

[RadicalRadon]

I like the roll and notch of the lapels. You're right about the width and it requiring a skinny tie. Narrow lapels, skinny ties, and short jacket length are all things I don't like in suits. I think there's a reason that classic cuts have remained the same for the last 80 years while "fashion forward" changes every few years. That seems like a suit you'd look back on in 15 years and think, "Wow, what was I thinking."

Just my opinion. You clearly like the suit while I clearly don't. Let us know if you end up buying it -- I'd like to see how it looks on another frame.

I actually think there is a place for both types of suits. I already bought a ralph lauren black label and an E Zegna. I decided to return the Zegna because it would require too much tailoring (narrowing sleeves, etc) to fit well enough to justify the $2k price. The RLBL fits almost perfectly OTR. It's awesome. I'm flirting with getting another RLBL or something like the Burberry Modern Fit. I'd have to try the Burberry on in person though because the model is too thin to make accurate choices for an online purchase.

Also, the Zegna has the timeless aspect to it, but they've modernized their lines as well and have equally aggressive cuts to the Burberry mainline in their Z Zegna line. Fashion (like everything in life) is cyclical. Very few things are timeless, so I don't have an all-or-nothing stance on anything.

 

[RadicalRadon]

#1. Classic Fit

#2. Modern Fit (originally posted)

#3. Slim Fit

For me, Modern>=Slim>>>Classic. Visionary, it sounds like you emphatically prefer Classic?

 

[VisionaryTics]

For me, Modern>=Slim>>>Classic. Visionary, it sounds like you emphatically prefer Classic?

Not Burberry's Classic fit. For those three suits, I would agree with your ranking.

I think Burberry's "Classic Fit" is going for "Borrowed-From-Dad Chic".

 

[RadicalRadon]

Not Burberry's Classic fit. For those three suits, I would agree with your ranking.

I think Burberry's "Classic Fit" is going for "Borrowed-From-Dad Chic".

I wouldn't say that. I'd say it's very traditional but still stylish suit. The classic resembles the E Zegna I posted earlier with regard to jacket length and shoulder stance. It's not as fitted though, but bear in mind the Zegna I posted is the slimmest cut they make (Milano).

For Comparison:

 

[username456789]

Not Burberry's Classic fit. For those three suits, I would agree with your ranking.

I think Burberry's "Classic Fit" is going for "Borrowed-From-Dad Chic".

Man I hope you're joking.

Some of it is because of the model's ridiculously absurd frame, but the picture of the "slim fit" is entirely unacceptable and just plain terrible; the "modern fit" is only barely passable (again, at least on his frame).

The "classic fit" is clearly an intentionally sized up, as is the shirt (you can tell by the obviously loose neck, which should not at all be influenced by the "cut" [slim/modern/classic] of the suit or shirt). And even still, it only looks slightly boxy (as opposed to most "classic fit" suits you'll find at any given store.

In less than 5 years (and most likely much sooner than that), you will look back at that "slim fit" suit and cringe at the idea that you ever said it looked anything else than "ridiculous."

 

[fahimaz7]

Man, you guys get way too into what you are wearing. Who really cares. Buy a suit and show up to the interview.

 

[username456789]

Man, you guys get way too into what you are wearing. Who really cares. Buy a suit and show up to the interview.

Perhaps you don't get into it enough?

Bottom line is, some people care about their appearance, and others care very little. Dressing in proper suiting attire is unfortunately a dying practice, largely due to attitudes such as yours.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Man, you guys get way too into what you are wearing. Who really cares. Buy a suit and show up to the interview.

I can tell you for our fellowship interviews, we *did* pay attention to how well someone was dressed. It didn't have to be fashion forward or expensive but if your suit was obviously too big/too small, cuffs or hems frayed, shoes dingy, it counted against you.

Besides, some people just like to look nice.

 

[username456789]

I can tell you for our fellowship interviews, we *did* pay attention to how well someone was dressed. It didn't have to be fashion forward or expensive but if your suit was obviously too big/too small, cuffs or hems frayed, shoes dingy, it counted against you.

Besides, some people just like to look nice.

But c'mooooooonnnnnnn, I'm a nice guy and I hold the door for women and I brush my teeth at least twice a day! Why should how I present myself to others influence your impression of me? That's not fairrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

 

[RadicalRadon]

I can tell you for our fellowship interviews, we *did* pay attention to how well someone was dressed. It didn't have to be fashion forward or expensive but if your suit was obviously too big/too small, cuffs or hems frayed, shoes dingy, it counted against you.

Besides, some people just like to look nice.

That's awesome. The attitude that physicians don't need to care about their appearance needs to change dramatically. Yes, intelligence/clinical skills/etc are most important... but in life you are often judged within the first 30 seconds of meeting someone. Physicians need to have this burned into their brain. I don't understand why so many of us are so oblivious to this fact relative to peer professions.

 

[ijn]

I hope radonc ends up at a program where you have to wear scrubs and a white coat everyday.

And the scrubs will be BAGGY.😱

 

[Winged Scapula]

That's awesome. The attitude that physicians don't need to care about their appearance needs to change dramatically. Yes, intelligence/clinical skills/etc are most important... but in life you are often judged within the first 30 seconds of meeting someone. Physicians need to have this burned into their brain. I don't understand why so many of us are so oblivious to this fact relative to peer professions.

Because they were students for so long and allowed to dress in hoodies and baggy khakis or cargo shorts during a very very long delayed adolescence.

Peer professions (of which there are really very few with as extended of a student life) have been out in the workforce for a few years by the time physicians get there and learned that "clothes do make the man" and that first impressions are important. One of our brightest residents was a mess - he was a short guy and the scrub pants were always too long (as he was a former football player, so he was a broad/big guy). He cut them off...with PINKING SHEARS. The Fred Flintstone impression just didn't wear well with many patients and staff.

If you look sloppy, patients will think your medical care is sloppy. If you look poor, they will think you aren't successful. You don't need to go overboard (and as a matter of fact, too much display of wealth isn't advisable either except in certain segments of the country). I find that my clothing helps the patients relax; they like spending a few minutes talking about my shoes or dresses as a way to offset the ensuing emotionally painful discussion about cancer.

We are currently looking for another surgeon to join our practice and although there's been some teasing that he/she needs to have a good shoe wardrobe, it is important that they represent us well by being neat and presentable EVERY DAY (not just during interviews).

 

[fahimaz7]

Perhaps you don't get into it enough?

Bottom line is, some people care about their appearance, and others care very little. Dressing in proper suiting attire is unfortunately a dying practice, largely due to attitudes such as yours.

That's awesome. The attitude that physicians don't need to care about their appearance needs to change dramatically. Yes, intelligence/clinical skills/etc are most important... but in life you are often judged within the first 30 seconds of meeting someone. Physicians need to have this burned into their brain. I don't understand why so many of us are so oblivious to this fact relative to peer professions.

There's a big ass difference between "dressing appropriately" and going over the top with $5000 watches, $2000 suits, and $600 imported Italian loafers - that is unless you are interviewing for partnership at a walstreet investment firm or something of the sort. BTW, I never said that I buy a "medium" sized suit from Walmart and a pair of velcro-closure black shoes. Give me a break.

However, I do like the guys that show up to interview in a light grey, three-piece suit with 1/2 cm stripes (think NFL draft suit). Quite hilarious tbh.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Good Lord that suit is shudderingly awful.

 

[RadicalRadon]

Well said, many if not most in medical school still think like adolescents. Honestly, you in fact can fairly accurately judge someone if they present themselves poorly.

To the last poster, no you don't need expensive things to look nice. Fit is most important. However, dressing well is a skill that requires educating yourself and trial/error. Only a fool would think they know how to "dress well" when they never have before. Also note, most of the suits I've posted can be purchased for 500-1000 when on clearance. About the same as that crappy full price express or banana suit that falls apart after a few months of use.

Because they were students for so long and allowed to dress in hoodies and baggy khakis or cargo shorts during a very very long delayed adolescence.

Peer professions (of which there are really very few with as extended of a student life) have been out in the workforce for a few years by the time physicians get there and learned that "clothes do make the man" and that first impressions are important. One of our brightest residents was a mess - he was a short guy and the scrub pants were always too long (as he was a former football player, so he was a broad/big guy). He cut them off...with PINKING SHEARS. The Fred Flintstone impression just didn't wear well with many patients and staff.

If you look sloppy, patients will think your medical care is sloppy. If you look poor, they will think you aren't successful. You don't need to go overboard (and as a matter of fact, too much display of wealth isn't advisable either except in certain segments of the country). I find that my clothing helps the patients relax; they like spending a few minutes talking about my shoes or dresses as a way to offset the ensuing emotionally painful discussion about cancer.

We are currently looking for another surgeon to join our practice and although there's been some teasing that he/she needs to have a good shoe wardrobe, it is important that they represent us well by being neat and presentable EVERY DAY (not just during interviews).

 

[Lunasly]

Light blue shirt will go with either charcoal or navy. White is somewhat more formal, but also more boring. A burgundy tie is a solid choice, a deep purple also works. Stay away from colors like bright red, your tie should be a darker color to clash less against your suit.

Thanks for the reply, airplanes. Just looking for your opinion, but which of the two Obama photos that I posted would you prefer?

Also, when you talk about a purple tie, are you saying something that resembles this? Would you recommend this combination?

 

[airplanes]

Thanks for the reply, airplanes. Just looking for your opinion, but which of the two Obama photos that I posted would you prefer?

Also, when you talk about a purple tie, are you saying something that resembles this? Would you recommend this combination?

That seems more like a lavender, which is fine with his white shirt. You have a lot of possibilities with a white shirt, and it the most formal, if that's what you want. That tie would melt into a light blue shirt. If wearing light blue, I would go with something like:

tie 1

tie 2

 

[Lunasly]

Ah ok. So of the three Obama pictures I posted, which would you go with?

 

[RadicalRadon]

Ah ok. So of the three Obama pictures I posted, which would you go with?

I'd recommend a tie <3in wide unless you're relatively wide yourself and can pull off the 3.5in.

 

[Lunasly]

I'd recommend a tie <3in wide unless you're relatively wide yourself and can pull off the 3.5in.

I'm not very wide. In fact, I'm short and fairly fit. I was speaking more in terms of which combination of suit, tie, and shirt I should go for. I personally like the navy suit, white shirt, and lavender tie. I'm just not sure if its appropriate for an interview.

 

[armybound]

It would be appropriate. Saw it or something similar at a lot of my interviews.

 

[loveoforganic2]

New watch, no quite the same budget as drizzt 😛

 

[Old Style Nanny]

Holycow, there are a lot of nice watches on this thread. FWIW, I suggest a Stowa Antea. It is the perfect dress watch, superior quality and pretty much none of the pretentious jacks know about it.

Anyway, with the obligatory input out of the way, here's my question. What do you guys think of a dark brown (chocolatey) suit for the interview?

 

[RadicalRadon]

Holycow, there are a lot of nice watches on this thread. FWIW, I suggest a Stowa Antea. It is the perfect dress watch, superior quality and pretty much none of the pretentious jacks know about it.

Anyway, with the obligatory input out of the way, here's my question. What do you guys think of a dark brown (chocolatey) suit for the interview?

Like the RLBL one I posted? I approve haha.

 

[Staradmiral]

Holy crap, the amount of money some people spend on suits...
I would not consider spending $3000 of BORROWED money on clothing to be a good character trait.

I wouldn't spend four figures on a suit, shoes, or watch, even if i made a 7 figure salary. You can get perfectly looking suits for $300.

Serious question though, how many suits should a man have in his closet?

 

[darkelven29]

At least 1 black (weddings/funerals/formal) and 1 navy (use as sports jacket, but also job interview). But would be nice to have a light grey for parties/less formal events. So 2-3, but there is no upper limit. Suit up!

 

[valkener]

If you're a skinny guy, of course you want to wear a European (preferably Italian) cut. The Slim Fit picture above doesn't do a real European cut any justice btw. looks like the guy is wearing 2-3 sizes too short.

IMO, skinny people look bad in classic cuts. If you're not skinny you can wear whatever you want. I consider Obama's suits, which always look great, to be European cut.

 

[DoctwoB]

If you're a skinny guy, of course you want to wear a European (preferably Italian) cut. The Slim Fit picture above doesn't do a real European cut any justice btw. looks like the guy is wearing 2-3 sizes too short.

IMO, skinny people look bad in classic cuts. If you're not skinny you can wear whatever you want. I consider Obama's suits, which always look great, to be European cut.

I find just the opposite to be true. Really skinny people dressing in super slim cut jackets and tight pants only serves to emphasize their super skinnyness in an unattractive way. They certainly shouldn't wear a baggy suit, but a mild slim to classic that fits well is the best option.

For myself on the other hand, I have a bit of a linebacker build (relatively short, wide shoulders, reasonably slim waist despite 3rd years best efforts), so I find a more modern, tapered cut helps keep me from looking like a box. To each his own though.

For another topic: Tie knots. Full windsor or Full windsor? Discuss.

 

[DreamingTheLive]

full windsor makes you look like a douche. Simple as that. You'll see lots of applicants/med students doing it though. You want to shoot for understated elegance, unless you're Michael Irvin or Deion Sanders and you're on NFL network.

 

[Old Style Nanny]

full windsor makes you look like a douche. Simple as that. You'll see lots of applicants/med students doing it though. You want to shoot for understated elegance, unless you're Michael Irvin or Deion Sanders and you're on NFL network.

Will this one work?

 

[loveoforganic2]

Interviews aren't the time to bust out nontraditional tie knots